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It's time to play.... Pick That Nose!


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The 6th grade photo is not the point here Greg.

The measurements were from May and Sept 1953.

Livingstone you keep envoking is 4th grade - also not related.

Robert also has nothing to do with this discussion.

Nice of you to look up Standard Deviation - maybe could of done that first?

This discussion has to do with the size of Lee in NYC, the Zoo photo, what you said about Carro and Youth House.

Lee was not the same size as Harvey who was small, sickly, skinny and truant, defiant and in no way resembled Lee.

It's okay though Greg. John's coattails are long enough for you to hitch a ride out of obscurity...

Just keep writing faith-based lies and speculation - your readers will figure it out..

:up

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This discussion has to do with the size of Lee in NYC, the Zoo photo,

Actually this discussion is about the size of his NOSE in that zoo photo. But you would rather talk about anything BUT that.

One thing I will say for those plotters -- they sure did think of everything... including dressing "Harvey" like a Southern fried boy in that photo - not as a kid from Europe who'd probably never seen a pair of jeans before... let alone a good ol' boy sleeveless shirt!

In fact... he looks just like a Southern kid who might get teased at school in NY.... hmmmm... just to fool skeptics like me 50 + years later...

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This discussion has to do with the size of Lee in NYC, the Zoo photo,

Actually this discussion is about the size of his NOSE in that zoo photo. But you would rather talk about anything BUT that.

One thing I will say for those plotters -- they sure did think of everything... including dressing "Harvey" like a Southern fried boy in that photo - not as a kid from Europe who'd probably never seen a pair of jeans before... let alone a good ol' boy sleeveless shirt!

In fact... he looks just like a Southern kid who might get teased at school in NY.... hmmmm... just to fool skeptics like me 50 + years later...

No insult please. Soooooooooooooooooo silly. He ( the Harvey you don't think existed) was Americanized by said plotters, that's the whole point. // gaal

" he looks just like a Southern kid who might get teased at school in NY.... hmmmm... just to fool skeptics like me 50 + years later..." // Parker Quote

He is to blend in and that's what an asset is supposed to do. Everybody knows that. Mr. Josephs called the Zoo and got the height of the fence.

That is not in dispute. ,gaal

Edited by Steven Gaal
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He is to blend in and that's what an asset is supposed to do. Everybody knows that. Mr.

So... he blended into NEW YORK by dressing... like a Southerner... in the VERY CLOTHES that caused the REAL LIFE Lee Oswald to get teased at school in New York?

No insults? Then stop insulting everyone's intelligence.

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He is to blend in and that's what an asset is supposed to do. Everybody knows that. Mr.

So... he blended into NEW YORK by dressing... like a Southerner... in the VERY CLOTHES that caused the REAL LIFE Lee Oswald to get teased at school in New York?

No insults? Then stop insulting everyone's intelligence.

He is being a southerner yes. Would it be better if his classmates saw a very intelligent bookish lad that had superior foreign language abilities ??

Would that blend him in on his role to assume another (southern) identity)? Jeans for him at this stage is actually a intel training exercise ....the art of disguise.

He is blending into the role. That does not take that much intelligence to understand , now does it ??

" No insults? Then stop insulting everyone's intelligence." / PARKER QUOTE

Is there a cure for insults ??. , gaal

Then he changes a little. Harvey (who you think does not exist) is being monitored and teasing might toughen up this possible future asset. gaal

=============

This just in Parker concedes fence height,,,,, gaal

Edited by Steven Gaal
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He is to blend in and that's what an asset is supposed to do. Everybody knows that. Mr.

So... he blended into NEW YORK by dressing... like a Southerner... in the VERY CLOTHES that caused the REAL LIFE Lee Oswald to get teased at school in New York?

No insults? Then stop insulting everyone's intelligence.

He is being a southerner yes. Would it be better if his classmates saw a very intelligent bookish lad that had superior foreign language abilities ??

Would that blend him in on his role to assume another (southern) identity)? Jeans for him at this stage is actually a intel training exercise ....the art of disguise.

He is blending into the role. That does not take that much intelligence to understand , now does it ??

" No insults? Then stop insulting everyone's intelligence." / PARKER QUOTE

Is there a cure for insults ??. , gaal

Then he changes a little. Harvey (who you think does not exist) is being monitored and teasing might toughen up this possible future asset. gaal

=============

This just in Parker concedes fence height,,,,, gaal

Like he "blended" into the role by insisting that Ms Darouse call him "Harvey"? :idea

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"Jeans for him at this stage is actually a intel training exercise ....the art of disguise."

Ha ha ha!! Are you a night club Comic Steven?

For the 100th time of asking...Where was 'Lee' and what did he tell his friends and family while 'Harvey' was in Russia?

LEE ??

Posted 16 August 2015 - 02:23 PM , (Gaal) Gee you probably didn't understand. gaal

Bill Simpich

====================

Banister was good at this kind of thing -- he had people such as his associate Don Campbell and staffer Tommy Baumler working to infiltrate left-wing college groups. [31] Someone had to spy on the New Orleans Council for Peaceful Alternatives, who invited troublemakers like Father Phil Berrigan to speak on the immorality of nuclear weapons.

In May, Oswald started off by leaving FPCC fliers at the Tulane Library, a good way to flush out pro-Castro types that might try to infiltrate anti-communist groups. [32] In June, he was leafleting sailors at the USS Wasp. Using the waterfront was second nature for an ex-Marine like Oswald. No surprise that FPCC agitation at the harbor resulted in the circulation of the Oswald legend throughout military intelligence.

The DRE had been thoroughly penetrated by Carlos Bringuier's relative Jorge, and was considered totally insecure by the CIA

The DRE took the CIA's money but were difficult to work with. This group was young, motivated, and very dangerous. In August 1962, they shelled government buildings in Havana and then bragged about it, while Castro was infuriated at this latest act of terrorism and attempted assassination. They attracted the attention of the Cuban's government's DGI. The role of the DGI in Cuba was to penetrate counter-revolutionary organizations. Counterintelligence analyst Ray Rocca made it very clear years later that he agreed that the DRE was heavily infiltrated by Cuban government DGI agents by 1962.

Several CIA officers had also concluded that the DRE was totally insecure. Officer Calvin Thomas was concerned that the DRE might have even played a role in killing Kennedy.

Jorge Bringuier was the brother-in-law of New Orleans DRE leader Carlos Bringuier. (While DRE official Juan Salvat describes him as nephew, Carlos says brother-in-law.) Jorge Bringuier disgraced the family by becoming a Castro agent and betraying the Cuban wing of the DRE. After he became national coordinator in Cuba in 1962, just about all of the Cuban DRE members were arrested. There's a contemporaneous memo about this betrayal in early 1963. Jorge was pitched to defect on 12/6/63, and he sent a telegram to his mother on 12/13 saying that he was "out" and with the Americans. Jorge was a CIA agent by 1968.

In late July, ten Cuban exiles traveled from Miami to New Orleans and joined an anti-Castro training camp north of New Orleans. This training camp was on the land of Michael McLaney, a friend of "gamblers in Cuba", and the new arrivals at the camp had obtained some dynamite and were planning to bomb Cuban oil refineries. The leader of the dynamite procurement was Victor Espinosa Hernandez. Espinosa's group asked New Orleans DRE leader Carlos Bringuier to assist them. Bringuier had worked for some time in the same building as Banister, serving as the press and propaganda secretary of the aforementioned CRC.

On July 31, the FBI swooped into a home in the New Orleans area and seized a ton of dynamite, bomb casings, napalm material and other devices. Eleven people were arrested. Bringuier escaped arrest. Why? It looks like US intelligence forces wanted a more subtle approach to test Bringuier's loyalties.

Oswald Came to Center Stage After the Arms Seizure As An Asset

This arms seizure by the FBI triggered Oswald to go public, who had been working with Banister doing some quiet leafleting on behalf of the FPCC. At a minimum, Oswald was being used as an asset, defined by the House Select Committe on Assassinations as "anyone used in an operation or project, whether or not that (person) is aware that he is being used". The CIA referred to a person who did not know that he had done anything to help the CIA as an "unwilling co-optee". Whether he knew it or not, Oswald was being used as a counter-intelligence asset.

1. The main goal was to make the FPCC look bad.

2. Incidentally, an anti-FPCC operation would divert public attention from the recent terrorist plans of the anti-Castro underground. This vigilante plan to napalm Cuba did not look good.

3. Along the way, it made sense to try to determine if Carlos Bringuier might be pro-Castro, or if Jorge Bringuier could be brought back into the anti-Castro fold. Carlos may have been used by those using Oswald.

===

OH yeah WINK ;) ,gaal

================

The CIA examined Celso Hernandez as a Castro penetration agent

There is an intriguing report of FPCC member Oswald being arrested with Celso Hernandez in New Orleans in late 1962 (see pp. 6-7, (follow-up at pp. 16-18) The ID of Hernandez was made years later and is admittedly shaky. The ID of Oswald is more substantive, as he id'd himself to the police as an FPCC member - but he was living in the Dallas area. The story is that the two men were picked up at the lakefront in Celso's work truck, owned by an electronics firm that was Celso's employer.

The most important thing is that right about this time, Bill Harvey - who worked both the wiretapping side and the Cuban beat for the CIA during 1962 - was tipped off on 10/1/62 that Celso Hernandez might be a communist. This kicked off an investigation that revealed in the autumn of 1963 that there was a left-wing Celso and a right-wing Celso, and a brother and sister who couldn't agree on who was who. [33] Oswald and Celso Hernandez were arrested together again in August 1963. What we do know is that throughout this era, Hernandez was under close scrutiny as a possible pro-Castro infiltrator. Below, we see Oswald's interactions with Carlos and Celso.

==

[33] Bill Harvey - who worked both the wiretapping side and the Cuban beat for the CIA during 1962 - was tipped off on 10/1/62 that Celso Hernandez might be a communist: For the 1962 Oswald-Hernandez arrest, see memo from investigator John Volz to DA Jim Garrison, 3/1/67, pp. 6-7, (follow-up at pp. 16-18) RIF# 180-10085-10407. http://digitalcollections.baylor.edu/cdm/compoundobject/collection/po-arm/id/41827/rec/3 =======

Edited by Steven Gaal
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"Jeans for him at this stage is actually a intel training exercise ....the art of disguise."

Ha ha ha!! Are you a night club Comic Steven?

For the 100th time of asking...Where was 'Lee' and what did he tell his friends and family while 'Harvey' was in Russia?

To his friends and family "Lee" was in Russia played by a small eastern European man

When Anna Lewis says repeatedly she met Lee Oswald in New Orleans in Feb 1962 - the same month Harvey is with Marina while giving birth to June in Russia. She says this twice with Baker sitting right behind her. The film stops a number of times yet not once in that interview does Judy's cooroboration place her with Oswald in the summer of 1963.

Any ideas?

LEE entered the Marines ahead of Harvey

LEE left the Marines in March 1959.

The last photo we have of Lee Oswald is his 1959 Passport photo. When Harvey came back from Russia - NONE of his relatives recognized him and could not believe it was the same man.

Good thing it was 1960 when the speed of news and info traveled slowly.

portion%20of%20Oswald%20poster%20-%20195

Edited by David Josephs
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"Jeans for him at this stage is actually a intel training exercise ....the art of disguise."

Ha ha ha!! Are you a night club Comic Steven?

For the 100th time of asking...Where was 'Lee' and what did he tell his friends and family while 'Harvey' was in Russia?

To his friends and family "Lee" was in Russia played by a small eastern European man

When Anna Lewis says repeatedly she met Lee Oswald in New Orleans in Feb 1962 - the same month Harvey is with Marina while giving birth to June in Russia. She says this twice with Baker sitting right behind her. The film stops a number of times yet not once in that interview does Judy's cooroboration place her with Oswald in the summer of 1963.

Any ideas?

LEE entered the Marines ahead of Harvey

LEE left the Marines in March 1959.

The last photo we have of Lee Oswald is his 1959 Passport photo. When Harvey came back from Russia - NONE of his relatives recognized him and could not believe it was the same man.

Good thing it was 1960 when the speed of news and info traveled slowly.

portion%20of%20Oswald%20poster%20-%20195

So where was he? What address did 'Lee' live at during the time 'Harvey' was in Russia?

Can you prove that 'Lee' was definitely somewhere in the USA during that period? And the onus is on you to do that, not the other way round. You're the one trying to sell this dud, so let's see some proof for once.

Presumably 'Lee' would have been ordered underground because the very fact of his existence would blow the whole scheme wouldn't it?

So let's see your chops, and quit with the tittle-tattle already...

Golly gosh, this H&L lingo is contagious

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He is to blend in and that's what an asset is supposed to do. Everybody knows that. Mr.

So... he blended into NEW YORK by dressing... like a Southerner... in the VERY CLOTHES that caused the REAL LIFE Lee Oswald to get teased at school in New York?

No insults? Then stop insulting everyone's intelligence.

He is being a southerner yes. Would it be better if his classmates saw a very intelligent bookish lad that had superior foreign language abilities ??

Would that blend him in on his role to assume another (southern) identity)? Jeans for him at this stage is actually a intel training exercise ....the art of disguise.

He is blending into the role. That does not take that much intelligence to understand , now does it ??

" No insults? Then stop insulting everyone's intelligence." / PARKER QUOTE

Is there a cure for insults ??. , gaal

Then he changes a little. Harvey (who you think does not exist) is being monitored and teasing might toughen up this possible future asset. gaal

=============

This just in Parker concedes fence height,,,,, gaal

Like he "blended" into the role by insisting that Ms Darouse call him "Harvey"? :idea

BELOW QUOTE Harvey and Lee website http://harveyandlee.net/Early/Early.html

" In the spring of 1954, while HARVEY was in Myra DaRouse's eighth grade homeroom class in the basement cafeteria, LEE Oswald was in homeroom 303 on the 3rd floor of Beauregard, according to school records. On each and every one of LEE Oswald's eighth grade report cards is the notation "303" and a student progress report that read, "Lee Oswald, grade 8, homeroom 303." These records show that tall, husky LEE Oswald was in homeroom 303 in the eighth grade at Beauregard (spring semester of 1954), while at the same time the short, thin, quiet HARVEY Oswald was in Myra DaRouse's homeroom class in the basement cafeteria. When I told Myra that "Oswald's" school report cards listed his homeroom as "303" she said, "That's impossible. He was in my homeroom in the basement cafeteria." I then showed Myra the photo of HARVEY Oswald, taken at the Bronx Zoo in 1953 in New York. She said, "That's him, just like I remember him." And then I showed Myra the classroom photo of the tall, husky LEE Oswald taken at Beauregard that appeared in Life Magazine. She looked at the photo a long time and then said, "That's not HARVEY. That's not the boy from my homeroom. Look at this boy. He looks like a football player and HARVEY was skinny." Myra saw HARVEY Oswald every day at Beauregard, before school, in her homeroom, in the school library, and after school, during the spring semester of 1954. Ed Voebel and HARVEY were good friends, and were always riding their bicycles together after school. Voebel was with HARVEY when the piano fell on his legs. But after school ended in early June, neither Myra nor Voebel ever saw HARVEY again."

==============================================================

" Like he "blended" into the role by insisting that Ms Darouse call him "Harvey"? " / PARKER QUOTE

===========================================================================================================

Oh my you mean he just accepted his role conversion without any childhood rebellion ? He would later use that name in the future as a proclamation of his individuality while living in an environment beyond his control. ,gaal

Edited by Steven Gaal
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He is to blend in and that's what an asset is supposed to do. Everybody knows that. Mr.

So... he blended into NEW YORK by dressing... like a Southerner... in the VERY CLOTHES that caused the REAL LIFE Lee Oswald to get teased at school in New York?

No insults? Then stop insulting everyone's intelligence.

He is being a southerner yes. Would it be better if his classmates saw a very intelligent bookish lad that had superior foreign language abilities ??

Would that blend him in on his role to assume another (southern) identity)? Jeans for him at this stage is actually a intel training exercise ....the art of disguise.

He is blending into the role. That does not take that much intelligence to understand , now does it ??

" No insults? Then stop insulting everyone's intelligence." / PARKER QUOTE

Is there a cure for insults ??. , gaal

Then he changes a little. Harvey (who you think does not exist) is being monitored and teasing might toughen up this possible future asset. gaal

=============

This just in Parker concedes fence height,,,,, gaal

Like he "blended" into the role by insisting that Ms Darouse call him "Harvey"? :idea

BELOW QUOTE Harvey and Lee website http://harveyandlee.net/Early/Early.html

" In the spring of 1954, while HARVEY was in Myra DaRouse's eighth grade homeroom class in the basement cafeteria, LEE Oswald was in homeroom 303 on the 3rd floor of Beauregard, according to school records. On each and every one of LEE Oswald's eighth grade report cards is the notation "303" and a student progress report that read, "Lee Oswald, grade 8, homeroom 303." These records show that tall, husky LEE Oswald was in homeroom 303 in the eighth grade at Beauregard (spring semester of 1954), while at the same time the short, thin, quiet HARVEY Oswald was in Myra DaRouse's homeroom class in the basement cafeteria. When I told Myra that "Oswald's" school report cards listed his homeroom as "303" she said, "That's impossible. He was in my homeroom in the basement cafeteria." I then showed Myra the photo of HARVEY Oswald, taken at the Bronx Zoo in 1953 in New York. She said, "That's him, just like I remember him." And then I showed Myra the classroom photo of the tall, husky LEE Oswald taken at Beauregard that appeared in Life Magazine. She looked at the photo a long time and then said, "That's not HARVEY. That's not the boy from my homeroom. Look at this boy. He looks like a football player and HARVEY was skinny." Myra saw HARVEY Oswald every day at Beauregard, before school, in her homeroom, in the school library, and after school, during the spring semester of 1954. Ed Voebel and HARVEY were good friends, and were always riding their bicycles together after school. Voebel was with HARVEY when the piano fell on his legs. But after school ended in early June, neither Myra nor Voebel ever saw HARVEY again."

==============================================================

" Like he "blended" into the role by insisting that Ms Darouse call him "Harvey"? " / PARKER QUOTE

===========================================================================================================

Oh my you mean he just accepted his role conversion without any childhood rebellion ? He would later use that name in the future as a proclamation of his individuality while living in an environment beyond his control. ,gaal

He would later use that name in the future as a proclamation of his individuality while living in an environment beyond his control. ,gaal

Any proof of that?

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Any proof of that?

I'm sure it's "in the book", just like his wearing southern clothes as part of his duties as an "asset" to blend. Not.

Funny but I could have sworn I was told before that the zoo photo was taken because the fake Marguerite was told to fake being a "normal" mother and do "normal" things. No. Apparently not. Apparently not. Apparently it was part of the planning all along.

His "rebellion" is kinda weird though. Seems the only person at Beauregard who he told to call him "Harvey" was Darouse.

That's not a rebellion: that an identity crisis.

And all of the proof is as imaginary as "Harvey" is.

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"Jeans for him at this stage is actually a intel training exercise ....the art of disguise."

Ha ha ha!! Are you a night club Comic Steven?

For the 100th time of asking...Where was 'Lee' and what did he tell his friends and family while 'Harvey' was in Russia?

To his friends and family "Lee" was in Russia played by a small eastern European man

When Anna Lewis says repeatedly she met Lee Oswald in New Orleans in Feb 1962 - the same month Harvey is with Marina while giving birth to June in Russia. She says this twice with Baker sitting right behind her. The film stops a number of times yet not once in that interview does Judy's cooroboration place her with Oswald in the summer of 1963.

Any ideas?

LEE entered the Marines ahead of Harvey

LEE left the Marines in March 1959.

The last photo we have of Lee Oswald is his 1959 Passport photo. When Harvey came back from Russia - NONE of his relatives recognized him and could not believe it was the same man.

Good thing it was 1960 when the speed of news and info traveled slowly.

portion%20of%20Oswald%20poster%20-%20195

So where was he? What address did 'Lee' live at during the time 'Harvey' was in Russia?

Can you prove that 'Lee' was definitely somewhere in the USA during that period? And the onus is on you to do that, not the other way round. You're the one trying to sell this dud, so let's see some proof for once.

Presumably 'Lee' would have been ordered underground because the very fact of his existence would blow the whole scheme wouldn't it?

So let's see your chops, and quit with the tittle-tattle already...

Golly gosh, this H&L lingo is contagious

Bernie,

You gotta realize the bad guys moved "Lee" around under the cover of darkness and in disguise, to different safe houses, so none of his friends, family, or acquaintances would see him while "Harvey" was in Russia.

--Tommy :sun

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Any proof of that?

I'm sure it's "in the book", just like his wearing southern clothes as part of his duties as an "asset" to blend. Not.

Funny but I could have sworn I was told before that the zoo photo was taken because the fake Marguerite was told to fake being a "normal" mother and do "normal" things. No. Apparently not. Apparently not. Apparently it was part of the planning all along.

His "rebellion" is kinda weird though. Seems the only person at Beauregard who he told to call him "Harvey" was Darouse.

That's not a rebellion: that an identity crisis.

And all of the proof is as imaginary as "Harvey" is.

Below in green not responded too. I am sure he was asked to say Lee. ,gaal

BELOW QUOTE Harvey and Lee website http://harveyandlee.net/Early/Early.html

" In the spring of 1954, while HARVEY was in Myra DaRouse's eighth grade homeroom class in the basement cafeteria, LEE Oswald was in homeroom 303 on the 3rd floor of Beauregard, according to school records. On each and every one of LEE Oswald's eighth grade report cards is the notation "303" and a student progress report that read, "Lee Oswald, grade 8, homeroom 303." These records show that tall, husky LEE Oswald was in homeroom 303 in the eighth grade at Beauregard (spring semester of 1954), while at the same time the short, thin, quiet HARVEY Oswald was in Myra DaRouse's homeroom class in the basement cafeteria. When I told Myra that "Oswald's" school report cards listed his homeroom as "303" she said, "That's impossible. He was in my homeroom in the basement cafeteria." I then showed Myra the photo of HARVEY Oswald, taken at the Bronx Zoo in 1953 in New York. She said, "That's him, just like I remember him." And then I showed Myra the classroom photo of the tall, husky LEE Oswald taken at Beauregard that appeared in Life Magazine. She looked at the photo a long time and then said, "That's not HARVEY. That's not the boy from my homeroom. Look at this boy. He looks like a football player and HARVEY was skinny." Myra saw HARVEY Oswald every day at Beauregard, before school, in her homeroom, in the school library, and after school, during the spring semester of 1954. Ed Voebel and HARVEY were good friends, and were always riding their bicycles together after school. Voebel was with HARVEY when the piano fell on his legs. But after school ended in early June, neither Myra nor Voebel ever saw HARVEY again."

==============================================================

" Like he "blended" into the role by insisting that Ms Darouse call him "Harvey"? " / PARKER QUOTE

===========================================================================================================

Oh my you mean he just accepted his role conversion without any childhood rebellion ? He would later use that name in the future as a proclamation of his individuality while living in an environment beyond his control. ,gaal

Edited by Steven Gaal
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