Ruth Paine

[Chris Newton]

Yes, Chris, you're right -- Michael Paine was rich in 1963, just as he remains rich today.

So what?

Does this, ipso facto, make him guilty of murdering JFK and blaming LHO for the murder?

It seems to me that Carol Hewett and her followers are trying to play upon the politics of those who hate the rich -- and little else.

I realize that there's a large grass-roots movement in the USA today about the so-called 1% versus the so-called 99%. I agree with that movement to this degree -- that the top 1% wealthiest of American citizens don't pay their fair share of taxes. So the issue can be taken to task here and there.

Yet it is simply poor legal language -- trying to use this as an argument to blame Michael and Ruth Paine for a central role in the JFK murder. It's pitiful logic.

I feel like I'm stuck at a long traffic signal and theres this guy shouting nonsense to himself over on the corner. Nothing you wrote makes any sense nor does it have any bearing on the Paines, or their possible witting or unwitting use as intelligence assets. If you can't make a coherent argument do you just post nonsense? Am I missing something?

[James DiEugenio]

LOL

Good one Chris.

[Paul Trejo]

I feel like I'm stuck at a long traffic signal and theres this guy shouting nonsense to himself over on the corner. Nothing you wrote makes any sense nor does it have any bearing on the Paines, or their possible witting or unwitting use as intelligence assets. If you can't make a coherent argument do you just post nonsense? Am I missing something?

Yes, Chris, you're missing how this discussion of the super-rich in America has anything to do with the theme of this thread, namely, the Paines.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

[Chris Newton]

Yes, Chris, you're missing how this discussion of the super-rich in America has anything to do with the theme of this thread, namely, the Paines.

We are on to your game Paul.

You know how I'm always harping on how amazing it is that you know what every one is thinking (or at least what all the people around LHO are thinking), now I'm going to explain what it is that Paul Trejo is thinking.

According to my new Trejo-matic-mind-meter...

...there MUST be an innocent explanation for all the crazy Paine questions...

...because it's really inconvenient for my Walker-did-it pet theory if those darn people are handling LHO.

Edited January 13, 2016 by Chris Newton

[Paul Trejo]

Yes, Chris, you're missing how this discussion of the super-rich in America has anything to do with the theme of this thread, namely, the Paines.

...According to my new Trejo-matic-mind-meter...

...there MUST be an innocent explanation for all the crazy Paine questions...

...because it's really inconvenient for my Walker-did-it pet theory if those darn people are handling LHO.

Well, Chris, let's stick to business, shall we, and review your list of all these alleged "crazy Paine questions."

I say that the Paine's testimony is straight-forward and easy to understand. I see no major questions except one -- namely -- why did Michael Paine tell the WC that he never saw any weapons belonging to LHO until after the JFK murder -- but in 1993 he told Dan Rather on CBS that he saw a BYP in April of 1963.

That, to me, is a glaring fact of history. It suggests, to me, that Michael Paine was more involved with the General Walker shooting than he wanted to discuss in 1963.

In my current theory, Michael Paine was part of a group that consisted of George DeMohrenschildt and Volkmar Schmidt that worked on LHO to get him to hate and despise General Walker. Volkmar Schmidt admitted this to PBS Frontline, and George DeM admitted this in his 1978 manuscript, I'm A Patsy! I'm A Patsy!

So, my theory isn't based on guesswork. These two guys admitted it. But Michael Paine hasn't admitted anything about this -- though Marina Oswald told the WC that she thought LHO and Michael spoke about politics a lot, including about General Walker, and that they went to political meetings together, and even that LHO told her that Michael Paine knew that LHO had shot at Walker.

So -- given all that -- and given that Michael Paine knew about the BYP back in April -- I think we have a situation that Michael Paine wanted to keep quiet in 1963.

Now -- did Michael Paine perjure himself? Not necessarily -- because the questions asked by the WC, IIRC, were whether Michael had seen any weapons that belonged to LHO. Technically, just seeing a BYP didn't qualify, because Michael could not be certain that the weapons in the BYP belonged to LHO, or even if the BYP was real, and not some studio FAKE.

So, technically one could say that Michael Paine didn't perjure himself by denying any knowledge of LHO weapons before the JFK murder.

But why would Michael Paine neglect to raise the issue about the BYP, which LHO allegedly showed him on April 2nd, only 8 days before the General Walker shooting? The easiest explanation is that the connection between the BYP and the General Walker issue would have raised lots more questions about LHO and General Walker, and possibly about the Big Secret that LHO didn't act *alone* in the Walker shooting, but various yuppie engineers in Dallas were also involved -- at least at the verbal level.

That's all I have about Michael Paine, Chris.

What are "all the crazy Paine questions" that you cited? Are you speaking about the Carol Hewett nonsense? Because I've been showing lots of flaws in her Probe magazine articles of the 1990's.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

<edit typos>

Edited January 16, 2016 by Paul Trejo

[Paul Brancato]

Michael Paine - what were his measurements ?

Paul T - just because you call him Dubya doesn't mean that George Bush wasn't east coast blue blood.

Naming presidents who are clearly not east coast old money means nothing. You can't disprove the concept of power elite by finding millionaires, or billionaires, or presidents who are not east coast blue blood.

[Paul Brancato]

And Paul T - there is no excuse for allowing your own theory so much leeway and supposition and mind reading, and then demand that others 'stick to the facts'.

[Paul Trejo]

And Paul T - there is no excuse for allowing your own theory so much leeway and supposition and mind reading, and then demand that others 'stick to the facts'.

I don't do "mind-reading" Paul B. If I say that a given WC witness "thought" or "imagined" something, it's always because that WC witness TESTIFIED that he "thought" or "imagined" something.

If you can find an exception to my rule, then kindly point it out to me.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

[William Kelly]

Lee Oswald's brother Robert - in his book Lee - says that "if Lee did not practice with that rifle in the days and weeks before the assassination"- as the WC attests. "he didn't take the shots that killed the president and wounded the governor."

He is also very suspicious of Michael and Ruth Paine and quotes their WC testimony and points out where it is contradictory.

Anthony Summers also says that after interviewing Ruth Paine extensively he came away suspicious and still holds that view.

In addition, I have a letter from a Quaker women who worked with Ruth Paine in Nicaragua and believes she was keeping tabs on the other Quakers during the Contra war.

BK

[Paul Trejo]

Lee Oswald's brother Robert - in his book Lee - says that "if Lee did not practice with that rifle in the days and weeks before the assassination"- as the WC attests. "he didn't take the shots that killed the president and wounded the governor."

He is also very suspicious of Michael and Ruth Paine and quotes their WC testimony and points out where it is contradictory.

Anthony Summers also says that after interviewing Ruth Paine extensively he came away suspicious and still holds that view.

In addition, I have a letter from a Quaker women who worked with Ruth Paine in Nicaragua and believes she was keeping tabs on the other Quakers during the Contra war.

BK

Thanks for your remarks, Bill -- I'm a big fan of your work. Your work on Volkmar Schmidt is classic, IMHO.

BTW, I agree with Robert Oswald -- the fact that LHO didn't practice for that remarkable feat of marksmanship cancels him as a shooter. Yet even Robert Oswald ended his book with nine questions he must answer before he can let LHO off the hook for the JFK murder. These tend to agree with Ruth Paine -- the CIRCUMSTANTIAL EVIDENCE was overwhelming, even to Robert Oswald.

Putting two and two together, it suggests strongly that Robert Oswald believed that LHO was over his head in some intrigue or other, as part of a group.

Now -- as for Robert's suspicions about Michael Paine -- no not his suspicions, but his deep feeling of hatred for Michael Paine -- it's my reading that reporters asked Robert Oswald the reasons for his hatred of Michael, year after year, but Robert went to his grave never telling the reasons why.

Did Robert fear that Michael Paine was part of that group? I'd like to know. Any clues?

Finally, as for Ruth Paine, perhaps most of us here have read the Probe magazine articles in the 1990's portraying Ruth Paine as a CIA Agent who was down in Guatemala killing Contras under the umbrella of Quaker Charity. Other spy fiction has her making deals with the Soviets to kill JFK and blame LHO.

It's all about making money off fiction at some point. If anybody has anything solid, they haven't shown it yet. Carol Hewett and her followers speculate up a storm, but it's almost 100% guess-work.

The book, "Mrs. Paine's Garage" (2002) by Tom Mallon answers the fiction well, I thought. Any clues other than rumors, Bill?

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited January 15, 2016 by Paul Trejo

[Paul Trejo]

OK, I'll continue my review of Carol Hewett's the 1997 article, The Paines Know – Lurking in the Shadows of the Walker Shooting (Probe, Vol. 5, No. 1, November-December, 1997, p. 11)

We've seen many errors and weak points in Carol Hewett's argumentation. Let's find some more.

10.0. COME LIVE WITH ME ON APRIL 7th

10.1. On Sunday, April 7th, Ruth Paine composed a letter to Marina Oswald asking Marina to live with her; never sending it to Marina.

10.1.1. Ruth explained that she had a desire to ask Marina to live with her early in March, when Marina confided with Ruth that she was pregnant, and that LHO was threatening to send her back to Russia without him. Marina emphasized that she didn't want to go back to Russia, but she earnestly wanted to stay in the USA.

10.1.2. This made Ruth angry, and concerned for Marina. Ruth got an impression from Marina that LHO was a poor provider, and didn't want the burden of supporting a family. Ruth had not spoken to LHO personally at this point, and she knew that it was quite forward, socially, to ask a married woman to come live with her. So, Ruth took things slowly.

10.1.3. Furthermore, Ruth's conversational Russian vocabulary was poor. Ruth was qualified to teach young boys from a Russian grammar book, but holding down a conversation with a native speaker is far more challenging. So, Ruth decided to write down her thoughts about Marina in a letter to Marina, to clarify the vocabulary and sentence structure for herself.

10.1.4. Carol Hewett refuses to believe Ruth Paine that the letter was never sent. But what's the importance of that? Not much. Then Carol Hewett writes:

Counsel Jenner thought this was a most presumptuous act on Ruth’s part, considering that the Paines hardly knew the Oswalds and there was no indication that the Oswalds were desirous of separating. But Ruth claimed that she feared that Marina might be forced back to Russia by her inconsiderate husband, and so she extended this invitation out of kindliness and concern. Since she had had no occasion to personally witness any serious inconsiderateness of Marina on Oswald’s part, we do not know how Ruth formed this notion in her mind or why any observed rudeness by Oswald would be tantamount to deportation efforts. (The Paines Know, Carol Hewett, Probe, vol. 5 no. 1, 1997)

10.1.4.1. Carol Hewett tries to minimize the testimony of both Marina and Ruth, that Marina had complained to Ruth that LHO wanted to send her back to Russia without him, and Marina didn't want to go. Carol says, "we do not know how Ruth formed this notion in her mind." So, clearly, Carol deliberately conceals known facts that we have from Marina herself.

10.3. What Marina did not know at this time was that on Monday, April 1st, LHO was fired from his job at Jaggars-Chiles-Stovall. LHO didn't tell Marina for several days.

10.4. Ruth visited Marina in early April, and Carol Hewett believes that Ruth shared her letter with Marina at that time. Again, it's bare guesswork. Ruth wrote that letter to help her form her sentences to discuss the matter with Marina -- only if Marina wanted it. It was supposed to be an option for Marina Oswald, just in case this educated, pregnant lady wanted to stay in the USA, but was being forced back to Russia by her deadbeat husband.

11.0. THE WALKER SHOOTING ON APRIL 10, 1963

11.1. Ruth’s calendar has two entries for April 10th and 11th naming Marina – with an arrow between them. Carol Hewett guesses that Ruth was supposed to visit Marina during those two days. Ruth vaguely recalls trying to see Marina on those two days, but Ruth became too busy.

11.2. Yet this is fairly critical, says Carol Hewett, since on the evening of April 10th General Walker reported a shooting at his house at 9pm.

11.3. At this point, Carol increases her guesswork. If LHO was really the author of the Walker Letter, then he obviously anticipated being arrested. Therefore, what if Ruth Paine knew all about it? What if Ruth Paine planned to take Marina under her wing just in case LHO was arrested? Carol writes:

If Oswald was indeed the culprit (or the patsy), was Ruth to take Marina under her wing come the 10^th or the 11^th in the event of Oswald’s arrest? Ruth’s assertion that on April 7^th she feared Marina was to be forced back to Russia showed amazing foresight, considering that Oswald apparently feared that he would be arrested on April 10th or shortly thereafter. (The Paines Know, Carol Hewett, Probe, vol. 5 no. 1, 1997)

11.4. Again, Carol's guesswork is clearly based on her neglect of Marina's testimony that she confided to Ruth Paine in March 1963 that she was pregnant, and that LHO was threatening to send her back to Russia without him. Ruth confirms this. Their testimony makes the most sense of the events, and Carol's guesswork really has no motive force.

11.5. Carol again neglects Marina's and Ruth's testimony about their March confidences, and cites the fact that Ruth told the FBI during a Thu28Nov63 interview that Marina told her again on April 11th that LHO asked Marina to return to Russia without him.

11.6. Only by pretending that this was the first time that Marina told this to Ruth could Carol Hewett complain, "But this is four days after Ruth’s April 7^th undelivered invitation to Marina!"

11.7. Carol Hewett cites the fact that Marina Oswald had begun a regular correspondence with the USSR Embassy in D.C. since February 17, 1963, regarding a visa to return to Russia. Carol Hewett conceals Marina's repeated testimony that LHO was forcing her to write those letters. This is a serious flaw in the work of Carol Hewett.

11.8. Carol Hewett steps up her guesswork: the FBI intercepted this mail to the USSR Embassy, so possibly the FBI asked Ruth Paine to try to keep Marina Oswald in the USA. Is that the real reason, asks Carol Hewett, that Ruth Paine met Marina Oswald on February 22nd at the Dallas engineer's party at Everett Glover's apartment?

11.9. Carol's guesswork puts gilding on a lily. There is no reason to insert the FBI into Ruth Paine's simple motives -- she testified repeatedly that Marina Oswald was complaining to her that LHO was pushing her to return to Russia without him, and she sincerely wanted to stay in the USA. Ruth Paine's heart went out to her. This is a rational and sufficient motive.

11.9.1. Also, Ruth Paine insists that she met Marina Oswald for the first time in her life on February 22nd, at Everett Glover's party, because Everett and his room-mate, Volkmar Schmidt, wanted to show off their liberal politics by showing off the Oswalds at this party.

11.9.2. George DeMohrenschildt (who was indeed a CIA asset) was also putting on liberal airs in those days, and he was the escort of the Oswalds. Ruth Paine testified that she never met George or Jeanne DeMohrenschildt in her life before that party, but Carol Hewett and her followers prefer to invent the fiction that Ruth was working secretly with the CIA for a "handoff" of the Oswalds at that party. It's just making stuff up.

11.10. On Easter Sunday April 14th, says Carol Hewett, the Oswalds were visited by both George and Jeanne DeMohrenschildt at their apartment. This is another of Carol's errors. If Carol had read the WC testimony carefully, she would have known that they visited at 10pm on Saturday April 13th.

11.10.1. Then Carol claims that the testimony that Jeanne DeMohrenschildt found Oswald's rifle in their apartment "conflicts with Marina’s statement that as of Easter Sunday the rifle was still buried." Actually, Marina's testimony agreed with Jeane DeMohrenschildt. Marina admitted that Jeanne found LHO's rifle in their apartment on that night. So Carol was plain wrong there.

Further, it doesn't occur to Carol that the Russian word for "buried" also means "hidden". So, Carol's research is just weak there. In short, every page of Carol Hewett's article, The Paines Know, is riddled with errors.

(to be continued)

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

<edit typos>

Edited January 27, 2016 by Paul Trejo

[Paul Trejo]

OK, I'll continue my review of Carol Hewett's the 1997 article, The Paines Know – Lurking in the Shadows of the Walker Shooting (Probe, Vol. 5, No. 1, November-December, 1997, p. 11)

We've seen several weak points in Carol Hewett's arguments. Let's see what else we might find.

12.0. SATURDAY IN THE PARK -- APRIL 20th

12.1. The next contact that Ruth Paine had with the Oswalds was on Saturday, April 20th, when she arrived early at their home to take them both to a park with a fishing lake. LHO was anti-social this day, spending his time “way over” fishing – not even visible most of the time. When LHO returned, he had a fish.

12.1.1. Carol Hewett complains that Ruth Paine cannot prove that LHO was even in the park before he came back with a fish. Because, either LHO was sulking because he failed to kill General Walker, or he meet a CIA Agent in the park (or elsewhere) away from the women.

12.2. During April 1963, the Oswalds’ social life was mixed between the Paines and the DeMohrenschildts.

12.2.1. Carol Hewett refuses to believe that the Paines and the DeMohrenschildts never knew each other or interacted. If the Paines and the DeMohrenshildts secretly met, she claims, then they were probably plotting with the FBI/CIA (which is what Jim Garrison at one time proposed). Sadly for her theory, Carol Hewett can find no material evidence to support her suspicions.

13.0. A SATURDAY GUN TRANSACTION

13.1. Carol Hewett wishes to make a big deal out of another case of mistaken identity. Here's the story.

13.1.1. Possibly Sat20Apr1963, Robert Taylor, a mechanic at the Shell station a few blocks from Ruth Paine’s house, traded a repair of a 1959 Chevy (costing $11.50) with two distinct men for a .30 caliber Springfield military rifle (worth $12).

13.1.2. Eight months later, on Fri22Nov63, Taylor thought LHO was one of the men in that trade, so he called the FBI.

13.1.3. To the FBI, Taylor failed to recall the exact Saturday of March or April of 1963.

13.1.4. Other workers there said it had to have been before Wed25Apr63 when Glenn Smith started work there, replacing Curtis Crowder, because Crowder also saw the gun trade – but not Smith.

13.1.5. Crowder, however, told the FBI that he doubted that the man was LHO, though he could see some resemblance.

13.1.6. Oddly, Glenn Smith was the one called to testify before the WC, which promptly dismissed the alleged sighting.

13.1.7. Carol Hewett, however, sees a connection between the General Walker shooting and this gun trade with Robert Taylor.

13.1.8. Witnesses and police said the Walker shooting involved a steel-jacketed bullet from a .30 caliber military rifle, plus a black and white Chevy get-away car.

13.1.9. So, a gun-trade a few blocks from Ruth’s Irving house, with two men, one of whom resembled LHO, in a 1959 Chevy, this for Carol should have been aggressively pursued. WHO WAS WITH LHO, she asks?

14.0. SEPARATION AGAIN -- APRIL 24th

14.1. Ruth then visited the Oswalds again on Wed24Apr63, four days later, and in her calendar, the names of both Marina and Lee are entered for this date. When she appeared at their home, much to her surprise, the Oswalds are all packed for moving to New Orleans, hoping Ruth to transport LHO's luggage to the bus station.

14.1.1. Carol Hewett doubts that Ruth was really surprised.

14.2. LHO's packed possessions did not include any home furnishings. Carol wonders what happened to LHO's alleged weapons -- but it's a moot point here -- LHO packed everything in his two big Marine duffel bags and three suitcases, and Ruth never peeked inside any of them.

14.3. The bus station scene occupied ten pages of WC testimony, and Carol thinks Attorney Jenner seems to be skeptical that Ruth was truly surprised by this fact.

14.4. Ruth Paine then claims that while at the bus station, dropping off LHO's luggage with LHO buying tickets, she persuaded LHO to allow her to take Marina and June to Irving with her.

14.4.1. Actually, it happened like this, according to Ruth's testimony. LHO was going to give Marina her own ticket, and Marina was going to stay at the Neely Street address until LHO got a job, WITHOUT RENT MONEY, and he would eventually send her a letter that he was settled in New Orleans, and she could use her bus ticket to join him.

14.4.2. This angered Ruth Paine. Marina was pregnant! Marina had a baby, and didn't speak English! LHO was clearly just a selfish slob!

14.4.3. So, even though it was none of her business, Ruth Paine finally offered LHO a plan. Ruth would take Marina into her house, and let Marina wait as long as necessary until LHO got a job and a place.

14.4.4. Also, Marina wouldn't need a letter, Marina could get a phone call from LHO.

14.4.5. Also, when the time came for Marina to take the bus, instead of that, Ruth herself would drive Marina to New Orleans!

14.4.6. LHO, to Ruth's surprise, was delighted by this offer. It really took the pressure off of him.

14.4.7. LHO then took Marina's ticket back, and got cash for it. He kept some of the cash for himself, and gave Marina some of the cash.

14.4.8. Carol Hewett suspects Ruth Paine of some ulterior motive here. First, Marina was only 3 months pregnant, and lots of women have no problem traveling when only 3 months pregnant.

14.4.9. Again, Carol Hewett fails to recognize how much Marina Oswald complained to Ruth.

14.4.10. Carol Hewett suspects that attorney Jenner disbelieves Ruth's testimony. Carol gives no explanation for her suspicion.

14.5. Anyway, Marina and June went to Irving with Ruth on April 24, 1963, and LHO took the bus early the next morning.

14.5.1. Carol Hewett notes that if Michael Paine was still living with Ruth, that Ruth would not have had room to accommodate Marina and June.

14.5.2. Yet Carol suspects that Michael's separation was "no coincidence" and so Ruth's motives were "not charitable." Again, she doesn't back up her suspicions with anything material.

14.6. Carol asks -- if Michael was really separated, why did he visit twice a week? One wonders if Carol Hewett, the attorney, knows anything about marriage and divorce law. Separated and divorced couples often have visitation routines.

14.6.1. Carol wonders why Ruth and Michael had more dates after their separation than ever before. Again, it seems that Carol doesn't know much about the diversity of human relationships.

14.7. Ruth liked Marina a great deal. and she still believed that Marina didn't trust LHO, and enjoyed living in Irving. So Ruth sort of hoped that LHO would take his time finding a job in New Orleans. Yet she knew it was only a matter of time.

14.8. Less than three weeks later LHO called to say he found a job and an apartment, so Ruth promptly drove Marina and baby June to New Orleans on May 11, 1963.

14.9. Carol Hewett mocks Ruth Paine's claims that she needed Russian lessons from Marina Oswald, because after this point, Ruth got a job teaching Russian at St. Marks, a private school in Dallas.

14.9.1. But Carol's argument is weak - the alleged job was teaching small boys Russian grammar out of a textbook -- part-time for one semester only. Carol Hewett fails to see that teaching grammar out of a book is easy compared to conversational Russian, which is what Ruth Paine still needed to learn.

14.10. In mid-June, Ruth began a two-month car trip through the mid-west and north-east visiting friends and relatives. Ruth told them all about Marina Oswald, and how Marina had been complaining about LHO, and about how important Marina's welfare was to her.

14.10.1. During this time, Ruth and Marina still shared letters, and Marina still complained about LHO.

14.11. Ruth drove to New Orleans in late September on her way back home to Dallas. By this time Marina Oswald was very pregnant and waddling.

14.11.1. During that trip, Ruth learned that LHO had once again lost his job. Once again, Ruth's heart went out to Marina Oswald.

14.11.2. So, once again, Ruth Paine offered to take Marina Oswald back to Dallas with her, so that Marina could have her baby in safety at Parkland

Hospital, while Oswald was traveling around, allegedly looking for work.

14.11.3. Common sense can see that this was obviously an act of charity. But Carol Hewett refuses to believe it was true Charity -- she wants to make up an FBI or CIA plot, but she's unclear about details.

14.12. Carol Hewett complains that in all those letters Ruth and Marina shared during Ruth's vacation, they never discussed Marina staying Ruth. But Carol neglects the fact that Marina still complained about LHO in her letters.

14.13. Carol claims that Ruth's friends and relatives back east told the FBI that Ruth was planning to take Marina to Texas with her all along. Carol never gives their actual words, however, and they don't actually say that. They only agree that Ruth was making plans for Marina to live alone as a single mother in the USA, perhaps even New York, if she wanted to, if (and only if) LHO abandoned her.

14.14. However, when Ruth Paine arrived in New Orleans in September, 1963, she noticed that Marina nd LHO were getting along just great!

14.15. Ruth wasn't going to say anything about taking Marina to Texas with her, until she learned the LHO had again lost his job.

14.16. That was when Ruth told LHO about her offer to take Marina so that she could have her baby at Parkland Hospital.

14.17. To Ruth's pleasant surprise, LHO loved the idea! Again, it really took the pressure off him.

14.18. LHO and Marina were very pleasant for the rest of Ruth's September visit.

14.19. LHO was extra nice to Ruth starting at that point. He did all the shopping, all the packing, and he was gentle to Marina.

14.20. When Ruth invited another Church lady and her two daughters to visit the Oswalds, because one of the daughters spoke Russian, and had recently been to Russia and had a photo-album, LHO was extra polite to them, and admired the photographs, and served his guests coffee and snacks.

14.21. At this point, for the first time, Ruth Paine thought that LHO could be a gentleman if he really wanted to be. She began to warm up to LHO at this point.

14.22. Carol Hewett refuses to accept any of this -- for Carol Hewett, Ruth Paine is still plotting something with the FBI and CIA, and the Oswalds are her hapless victims.

14.23. As Ruth and Marina rode to Irving, LHO told the Dutz family that Marina went to Dallas to have their baby. This makes Carol Hewett suspect that perhaps LHO was also part of Ruth Paine's "plot". Again, Carol is very vague about the reasons for her suspicions. Carol seems to be merely raising every possible suspicion she can think of -- hoping that something will stick. Nothing does.

(to be continued)

Regards,
--Paul Trejo

Edited January 23, 2016 by Paul Trejo

[Tom Wilson]

Paul T

I never post on the forum anymore, at least since I complemented James D on Destiny Betrayed but you are not listening. No one agrees with you on the Paines, just give it up will you!

You made your point months ago.

If you love Ruth Paine then we get it.

Enough is enough!!!!

[Tom Wilson]

Paul T

After thinking about this more, I apologize. Your opinion is as valuable as is those of others.

[Paul Trejo]

Paul T

I never post on the forum anymore, at least since I complemented James D on Destiny Betrayed but you are not listening. No one agrees with you on the Paines, just give it up will you!

You made your point months ago.

If you love Ruth Paine then we get it.

Enough is enough!!!!

------

Paul T

After thinking about this more, I apologize. Your opinion is as valuable as is those of others.

Thanks, Tom, for taking back your original harsh words.

I realize I haven't got many fans on this thread -- but I do have 20,000 hits, so I'm confident that some people are reading it.

It's not that I love Ruth Paine, it's just that I hate to see anybody get trashed on such weak evidence as Carol Hewett and her followers have published.

Ruth Paine's mother-in-law had a childhood friend who was the lover of Allen Dulles -- therefore Ruth Paine must be a CIA Agent who plotted to kill JFK and blame LHO for it?! It's offensive to common sense to see that sort of pseudo-reasoning!

The only reason people would push such nonsense so hard is because their minds are made up that the CIA killed JFK, and so they try to "prove" it by making stuff up, and any little tidbit sets them off.

Well, I believe in a JFK conspiracy, Tom, but I don't believe the CIA did it. So, I'm free from the nonsense that it spawns. I can back away from the Carol Hewett baloney -- which is obvious baloney when you review it objectively -- and I can begin a real focus on General Walker and Robert Allen Surrey, on Roscoe White and Joseph Milteer.

The Carol Hewett nonsense is a DISTRACTION from the real culprits, IMHO. I'm a CTer. But I realize I disagree with 95% of CTers.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited January 23, 2016 by Paul Trejo