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The Real Ruth and Michael Paine


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Paul Trejo,

Are you certain you can describe in detail the nature of Ruth Paine's relationship with Marina's husband?

I can't. And I wonder what they thought about each other while both were living.

Well, Jon, I believe that if you did what I did, that you would be certain that you could describe in detail the nature of Ruth Paine's relationship with LHO.

Here's what I did:

(1) Read every word of Ruth Paine's WC testimony.

(2) Read every word of Ruth Paine's public interviews.

(3) Read every word of Ruth Paine's Grand Jury testimony before Jim Garrison.

(4) Read Tom Mallon's book, Mrs. Paine's Garage (2002)

(5) Watched all of Ruth Paine's interviews on YouTube and on the internet.

What you'll see there, Jon, is a remarkable consistency of evidence for the past half-century. Then you'll see the ambivalence that Ruth Paine bore towards LHO. Her first impressions of LHO were derived from Marina Oswald's cries for help. So, those were negative first impressions.

Her later impressions, starting in late September, were of a more cooperative and serious husband and father, who was willing to pick himself up by the bootstraps. This encouraged Ruth. Her final impressions were of a man who was sought by the FBI, and who was hostile toward the FBI -- rather irresponsible, according to Ruth.

It was a complicated relationship -- but she offers tens of thousands of words to explain herself. She succeeds admirably, I believe. Yet what I've found is a general laziness on the part of her critics to actually read all of her testimony.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo
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"Well, all you have is guesswork, Ed,"
And here I was being accused of 'guessing', when all Trejo had were guesses.

Want to discuss furnishings of Lee's and Marina's, since your 'baby' got thrown out with the bath water?

Of interest is the Furniture Mart sighting of Lee And Marina, even at the questioning not once did Marina say they had furniture, for the baby, themselves, the apt. or otherwise and as such would not need to be in that store. They were looking at a kids bed.

And this just makes your claims questionable,

Oswald attempted to get his wife to come back and, over Bouhe's protest, De Mohrenschildt finally told him where she was. De Mohrenschildt admitted that:

if somebody did that to me, a lousy trick like that, to take my wife away,
and all the furniture
, I would be mad as hell, too. I am surprised that he didn't do something worse.253

Paul , that's from Chapter Seven of your favorite book the warren-commission-report.

And that crib theory you had...

Mrs. OSWALD. After we arrived, I tried to put the bed, the child's crib together, the metallic parts, and I looked for a certain part, and I came upon something wrapped in a blanket. I thought that was part of the bed, but it turned out to be the rifle.

So crib did break down? It could fit in a trunk or on a roof of a car.
Hmm, seems you were mistaken no matter which way you fold it.

Cheerio Trejo

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"Well, all you have is guesswork, Ed,"

And here I was being accused of 'guessing', when all Trejo had were guesses.

Want to discuss furnishings of Lee's and Marina's, since your 'baby' got thrown out with the bath water?

Of interest is the Furniture Mart sighting of Lee And Marina, even at the questioning not once did Marina say they had furniture, for the baby, themselves, the apt. or otherwise and as such would not need to be in that store. They were looking at a kids bed.

And this just makes your claims questionable,

Oswald attempted to get his wife to come back and, over Bouhe's protest, De Mohrenschildt finally told him where she was. De Mohrenschildt admitted that:

if somebody did that to me, a lousy trick like that, to take my wife away,
and all the furniture
, I would be mad as hell, too. I am surprised that he didn't do something worse.253

Paul , that's from Chapter Seven of your favorite book the warren-commission-report.

And that crib theory you had...

Mrs. OSWALD. After we arrived, I tried to put the bed, the child's crib together, the metallic parts, and I looked for a certain part, and I came upon something wrapped in a blanket. I thought that was part of the bed, but it turned out to be the rifle.

So crib did break down? It could fit in a trunk or on a roof of a car.

Hmm, seems you were mistaken no matter which way you fold it.

Cheerio Trejo

Well, Ed, you're still trying to be clever -- but the information you provide is still very skinny.

You seize upon somebody's random use of the word "furniture", but when you look closer, all they describe is a baby crib.

But that was my whole point. The largest "furnishings" that the Oswalds ever had was a "baby crib" which some people call a "baby bed."

NO OTHER FURNITURE of the Oswalds was EVER DESCRIBED -- EVER.

And all the evidence that you scrape up, from anywhere, Ed, only serves to make my case stronger.

You've got NOTHING, NADA, ZIP to contradict my material observations.

The Oswalds had a baby crib. George Bouhe bought it for Marina Oswald. LHO threatened to smash it.

That's it!

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo
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Paul Trejo,

Are you certain you can describe in detail the nature of Ruth Paine's relationship with Marina's husband?

I can't. And I wonder what they thought about each other while both were living.

We find Oswald in Will Fritz's interrogation notes defending Ruth Paine prematurely when a station wagon similar to hers is brought up in questioning - but Oswald's verbosity suggests he was actually trying to inculpate her, or at least drag her name in as some kind of character reference for his intelligence work: "Now everybody will know who I am."

Actually, David, it wasn't Captain Will Fritz's notes that said that, but the WC testimony of Dallas Deputy Sheriff Roger Craig. Here's a rough sketch.

Sadly, Captain Fritz said that Roger Craig was making stuff up.

What Roger Craig said was that he personally saw LHO escaping from the TSBD in a light green Rambler station wagon driven by a colored man.

Then, Roger Craig said that later that afternoon he saw LHO inside Captain Fritz's office, with Fritz sitting right there, and he told LHO, "I saw you get into a car outside the TSBD!"

Roger Craig testified that LHO raised his voice and exclaimed, 'That station wagon belongs to Ruth Paine, and you leave her out of this!"

Then Captain Fritz sent Roger Craig away, but Roger Craig said to himself (as he testified) "I never said station wagon, but LHO just admitted it was a station wagon!"

So, Roger Craig told this to the WC, but Captain Will Fritz told the WC that Roger Craig was never even on his floor that day, and he never spoke with LHO at all -- and to just ignore Roger Craig. That's just what the WC did, and this depressed Roger Craig.

Years later, however, photographs of the hallway outside of Captain Fritz's office show LHO there, and Roger Craig in the hallway!

So, what gives? The key story is about the light green Rambler station wagon. There are two issues:

( A ) The WC testimony printed that Roger Craig called it a WHITE station wagon (which he always denied)

( B ) Ruth Paine owned a light green CHEVY station wagon.

So, there may be a lot going on here. My theory -- which is just a theory for now -- is this:

(1) Roger Craig told the truth.

(2) LHO lied.

(3) Will Fritz lied.

(4) The WC lied.

(1) Roger Craig told the truth because actually LHO always had Accomplices for everything he did. Even when LHO was the Patsy, he still believed fully in his Accomplices.

(2) LHO lied because there was an eye-witness to his Accomplices, and LHO protected his Accomplices every minute that he was in DPD custody (with one possible slip, when he panicked and exclaimed, "I'm just a Patsy!")

(2.1) LHO lied to shift the attention onto Ruth Paine, knowing that such an investigation would lead nowhere, but would waste a ton of bureaucratic time. It was a red herring.

(3) Will Fritz lied because he was one of the key JFK plotters inside the DPD. Only the Communists could be blamed for the JFK shooting in Will Fritz's plot -- but certainly the REAL ACCOMPLICES of LHO, who were also his FRAMERS, must be allowed to escape.

(4) The WC lied because they were loyal to J. Edgar Hoover who insisted on a "Lone Nut" theory of LHO. To say that LHO escaped in a station wagon was the same as saying that LHO had Accomplices -- but it was mandatory for Hoover (and for LBJ, Allen Dulles and Earl Warren) that LHO must never have "any accomplices who are still at large."

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo
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" So, what gives? The key story is about the light green Rambler station wagon. There are two issues:

( A ) The WC testimony printed that Roger Craig called it a WHITE station wagon (which he always denied)

( B ) Ruth Paine owned a light green CHEVY station wagon. "

Well, Paul.

It looks light blue to me.

ruth-paine.jpg

See also:

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/504614333224648831/

--Tommy :sun

Edited by Thomas Graves
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Sure looks blue.

Add to the long list of things leading to suspicions about the Paines the fact that their tax records are still being withheld.

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Trejo - your response to me about the TEC phone calls almost implies that Ruth never spoke to anyone. What does 'didn't take a message' mean? Since when do you not pass on such a phone call? Your explanations are insane - excusing her forgetting of such a phone call, caring enough to find LHO a job but not caring enough how much it paid or to give him a message. I'll say it again, supposing that she helped place him at the tsbd does not suppose she knew what was coming. There is nothing in the idea that she helped place him there that implies anything uncharitable. She was a loyal patriotic citizen helping the FBI or whoever.

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Statement of Richard Randolph Carr, a steelworker, who said he saw a Rambler in Dealey Plaza.

Carr was on an upper floor of a building that was under construction on November 22. From his position he could see into the sixth floor of the TSBD, where just before the motorcade arrived he saw a stocky man wearing a hat, sportcoat, and glasses. When the shooting stopped Carr descended to ground level, where he again saw the man in the sportcoat. Carr said he followed him for about a block and saw him get into a Nash Rambler driven by a dark-complected man.

Soon after the shooting, Marvin C. Robinson was driving west along Elm Street in heavy traffic. According to an FBI report dated the next day, just as Robinson crossed the Elm and Houston intersection, he saw a "light-colored Nash station wagon" stop in front of the Book Depository. A white man walked down the grassy incline from the building, got into the Nash, and the car moved off in the direction of Oak Cliff. Robinson was unable to provide any additional information.[14]

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" So, what gives? The key story is about the light green Rambler station wagon. There are two issues:

( A ) The WC testimony printed that Roger Craig called it a WHITE station wagon (which he always denied)

( B ) Ruth Paine owned a light green CHEVY station wagon. "

Well, Paul.

It looks light blue to me.

ruth-paine.jpg

See also:

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/504614333224648831/

--Tommy :sun

Paul,

What is it about the light blue color in particular adds to the suspiciousness of Ruth's car, in your humble opinion?

I believe Roger Craig said the getaway station wagon had a luggage rack at the back of the roof, and that it was light green in color, not light blue.

--Tommy :sun

Edited by Thomas Graves
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Warren Testimony

Mr. CRAIG - I saw a light-colored station wagon, driving real slow, coming west on Elm Street from Houston. Uh-- actually, it was nearly in line with him. And the driver was leaning to his right looking up the hill at the man running down.

Clay Shaw trial testimony

Q Can you describe the station wagon in any great detail?

Craig "It was a light green Rambler station wagon with the luggage rack on the back portion, and it had out of state plates on it, and the reason I know this is they were not the same colour as ours and I couldn't read them because of the angle of the car and the traffic movement."

So it seems he didn't see Mrs Paine's light blue Chevy.

Q: Can you describe the station wagon in any great detail?

A: It was a light green Rambler station wagon with the luggage rack on the back portion and it had out-of-state plates on it and the reason I know this is they were not the same color as ours and I couldn't read them because of the angle of the car and the traffic movement.

Edited by Ray Mitcham
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Warren Testimony

Mr. CRAIG - I saw a light-colored station wagon, driving real slow, coming west on Elm Street from Houston. Uh-- actually, it was nearly in line with him. And the driver was leaning to his right looking up the hill at the man running down.

Clay Shaw trial testimony

Q Can you describe the station wagon in any great detail?

Craig "It was a light green Rambler station wagon with the luggage rack on the back portion, and it had out of state plates on it, and the reason I know this is they were not the same color as ours and I couldn't read them because of the angle of the car and the traffic movement."

So it seems he didn't see Mrs Paine's light blue Chevy.

Q: Can you describe the station wagon in any great detail?

A: It was a light green Rambler station wagon with the luggage rack on the back portion and it had out-of-state plates on it and the reason I know this is they were not the same color as ours and I couldn't read them because of the angle of the car and the traffic movement.

Ray,

That's what I'm thinking, unless Craig's memory played a little trick on him.

Something else to consider:

Ruth's car was a 1955 Chevrolet "Bel Air" station wagon.

While a luggage rack for that year and model vehicle may have been available as an "after market" option for the owner, that car didn't come from the factory with a luggage rack, unlike Rambler station wagons, which did.

--Tommy :sun

Edited by Thomas Graves
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Sure looks blue.

Add to the long list of things leading to suspicions about the Paines the fact that their tax records are still being withheld.

Umm, you guys really don't want to jump to conclusions based on a Photoshop image -- do you?

We haven't sunk that low.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

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Trejo - your response to me about the TEC phone calls almost implies that Ruth never spoke to anyone. What does 'didn't take a message' mean? Since when do you not pass on such a phone call? Your explanations are insane - excusing her forgetting of such a phone call, caring enough to find LHO a job but not caring enough how much it paid or to give him a message. I'll say it again, supposing that she helped place him at the tsbd does not suppose she knew what was coming. There is nothing in the idea that she helped place him there that implies anything uncharitable. She was a loyal patriotic citizen helping the FBI or whoever.

Well, Paul B., when you use words like "insane" in a debate, it only shows how weak your argument has truly become.

"Since when do you not pass on such a phone call?" Since anytime you believe it's IRRELEVANT.

Also, remember that it wasn't Ruth Paine who "cared enough to find LHO a job." You should read the WC testimony more carefully.

It was Marina Oswald, who pushed and pushed at Ruth Paine -- "Please call! Please call!" -- that is what motivated Ruth Paine to call. Whatever Ruth Paine did for the Oswalds, it was always for Marina Oswald.

We must remember that Ruth Paine was drawn into charity for Marina Oswald mainly because Marina begged her for it, and that was on the basis that LHO was threatening to send her back to the USSR without him.

So, as Ruth Paine readily admitted, at the very start she didn't like LHO.

When Ruth Paine offered to take Marina back to Texas with her on September 20th, it was for two URGENT reasons: (1) Marina was waddling pregnant, and would give birth in a matter of weeks; and (2) LHO had once again been fired from his job.

LHO was not looking very good to Ruth Paine at that time. The only thing that LHO did right on September 20th, in the eyes of Ruth Paine, was that he stepped aside and let Ruth take care of Marina Oswald.

One might ask (as many have already asked) why didn't Ruth Paine leave it to LHO's mother and brother (Marguerite and Robert Oswald) to take care of Marina Oswald in her hour of great need? The answer is given by the personality of LHO himself. He never called his mother, and he didn't want his mother in his life, and he told Marina this. Also, LHO rarely contacted his brother, and he kept his distance. Marina truly felt alone and afraid, and here she was, pregnant, with no health-care, and now no money.

Ruth Paine felt pity for Marina Oswald, as most normal people would do. Marina needed help, and she made sure that Ruth Paine knew it.

Ruth Paine only began to feel better about LHO in October, when he got his own room in which to live, and then a job (which Linnie Mae Randle suggested, and Marina insisted upon) and then began to come over on weekends and behave like a gentleman for a change. He actually helped around the house. Ruth Paine wrote to her mother in mid-October, remarking on the promising change in LHO.

So -- you, like Roy, want to demand more from Ruth Paine than she intended to give. Ruth wanted to care for Marina Oswald, AND NOT FOR LEE HARVEY OSWALD. LHO was something of a pest to Ruth Paine, and he only slowly was getting into the positive column in mid-October, when she wrote to her mother -- because her mother was worried that this guy who was so cruel to Marina was now coming around Ruth's place. Ruth partially wanted to calm her mother down. Ruth felt more confident in those days.

But as November began, LHO began to be a pest again, because the FBI started to visit Ruth's home, and ask about LHO. They asked about Marina, too, but Ruth was happy to talk about Marina. But LHO was another matter. Then with the famous "Embassy Letter" of early November, Ruth hit the roof -- here was LHO insulting the FBI, using her typewriter!

No, Ruth Paine didn't owe LHO anything. On the contrary...LHO owed Ruth Paine a debt of gratitude that he had only begun to repay

This isn't "insane" as you put it, Paul B., on the contrary, it's quite normal.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo
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The word 'insane' was characterizing your explanations, and in no way indicate a weak argument.

Marina would most certainly have wanted her husband to get the highest paying job he could, and Ruth had no excuse, no matter how hard you try to spin this, not conveying the job offer from the TEC, where Oswald had personally asked for help, to him personally and in a timely manner, and especially if as you say she was only doing this for Marina.

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