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The Real Ruth and Michael Paine


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You call it wrong, Paul. A ponytail hairstyle is where the hair is gathered and trapped with a hairband, or similar them, and let to fall down the back of the head. A bun is where the hair is gathered together and shaped into a bun. The clue is in the name.

ponytail_zpso9stlbqk.jpg

Bun%20hairstyle_zpsdzxcmb3a.jpeg

Did you ask your daughters?

Edited by Ray Mitcham
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OK, OK, Ray, in any case, as we saw in the testimony, when Marina said, "I don't wear ponytails", Mrs. WHITWORTH said, "Well, you just had your hair pulled back and tied."

So, it doesn't matter which style it was -- it was hair pulled up in back. Some people call it a pony tail, others think a pony tail has to be higher up in the back of the head than those photos you showed of Marina.

BUT WHAT MATTERS IS THE TESTIMONY:

So it seems now that Marina Oswald, who was new to the English Language, wasn't sure how the term "pony tail" was being used.

Look at her testimony again:

------- BEGIN EXTRACT -- WC Testimony of Edith Whitworth, Gertrude Hunter and Marina Oswald (7/24/1964) -----

Mrs. WHITWORTH. ...She may not remember it, but if I was to see her today and seeing her that day and I was to meet her on the street, it would be hard for me to identify her. You know, she still has the features, but her face was round and she had her hair pulled back [indicating].

Mr. GREGORY. You mean in a pony tail?

Mrs. WHITWORTH. In a pony tail.

**Mrs. OSWALD. No; it wasn't that.

Mrs. WHITWORTH. Well, there was something tied around it--you had something tied around it, I mean, slicked back from her face.

**Mrs. OSWALD. I didn't wear this.

Mrs. WHITWORTH. I called it a pony tail, but it was kind of pulled back to the back.

**Mrs. OSWALD. I had two pigtails.

Mrs. WHITWORTH. Well, she might have it was tied back and whipped back from her face. Her face was round then and she was pretty then--I'd say she was pretty.

**Mrs. OSWALD. Thank you.

------- END EXTRACT -- WC Testimony of Edith Whitworth, Gertrude Hunter and Marina Oswald (7/24/1964) -----

Since Marina DID wear her hair tied down in the back -- (and I never saw her in "pig tails") -- does that make Marina a L-I-A-R??

IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING?

Marina said she didn't wear a pony tail. Did she just misunderstand the English meaning of the term?

Actually -- Marina's whole point was that this was a case of MISTAKEN IDENTITY. She didn't recognize Mrs. WHITWORTH!

But the most important question is this: WHAT IN HECK DOES THIS HAVE TO DO WITH THE JFK MURDER?

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo
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Edith Whitworth And Gertrude Hunter also did not see a rifle.

They claimed a short paper wrapped package, and the man said he needed a plunger.

I think the guy clogged his toilet but others claim that he saw an old gunsmith sign and Edith thought the guy wanted a gunsmith.

Here we can see that a customer had a broken tool, too short to be any MC rifle part, yet we get this exchange.

<snip>

Well, Ed, I think this testimony shows that Mrs. Whitworth and Mrs. Hunter had a case of mistaken identity.

They thought they saw the Oswald family in their local Furniture Store, but Marina Oswald said she was never there.

They go back and forth for pages of WC testimony, and Marina still says she was never there.

So, this is IMHO a case of mistaken identity -- like the people on the bus to Mexico who said they saw LHO on that bus, but they can't keep their stories straight. MISTAKEN IDENTITY.

Or the guy who said Lee Oswald came into his gun shop to get a scope attached -- but who couldn't keep his story straight. MISTAKEN IDENTITY.

It seems to me that the WC entertained lots of these cases -- just to waste time. Their minds were already made up.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

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The testimony goes on and on like this, as Mr. LIEBELER tries to convince Marina that she really was in a furniture store, and that she really did speak with Mrs. Whitworth. Marina consistently said she never saw this woman before in her life.

Mrs. Whitworth continued to insist. She said Marina wore a pony tail. Marina said she didn't wear pony tails. It just went on and on.

That settles it for me. Mrs. Whitworth was one dizzy broad.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Paul, it seemed to matter in this post of yours.

"That settles it for me"

You were prepared to accept that because Marina said she never wore her jar own a pony tail, then Whitworth must have been lying.

When shown that she possibly didn't lie, then it becomes inconsequential.

What does it have to matter with the JFK murder? If what happened was as Mrs Whitworth said, and if Marina was right, then somebody was impersonating Oswald and his wife. IMO

Edited by Ray Mitcham
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The testimony goes on and on like this, as Mr. LIEBELER tries to convince Marina that she really was in a furniture store, and that she really did speak with Mrs. Whitworth. Marina consistently said she never saw this woman before in her life.

Mrs. Whitworth continued to insist. She said Marina wore a pony tail. Marina said she didn't wear pony tails. It just went on and on.

That settles it for me. Mrs. Whitworth was one dizzy broad.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Paul, it seemed to matter in this post of yours.

"That settles it for me"

You were prepared to accept that because Marina said she never wore her hair in a pony tail, then Whitworth must have been lying.

When shown that she possibly didn't lie, then it becomes inconsequential.

What does it have to matter with the JFK murder? If what happened was as Mrs Whitworth said, and if Marina was right, then somebody was impersonating Oswald and his wife. IMO

OK, Ray, I see your point now. Yet I wasn't saying that Mrs. Whitworth was LYING, only that she was testifying a MISTAKEN IDENTITY.

I don't think that Mrs. Whitworth was LYING, as such, only that the only thing she had to report to the FBI was that she had seen LHO and Marina in her furniture store, and that she showed them some furniture, and talked to them for about 20-30 minutes.

First point -- why did the WC bother to take her deposition? What would the Oswalds shopping for furniture POSSIBLY have to do with the JFK murder?

Answer: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.

Now, you say this might be interesting in a theory of somebody Impersonating LHO. Maybe -- but maybe not. This wasn't at a gun range, and it wasn't in a gun shop. LHO wasn't shopping for bullets for rifle. So why would anybody bother to impersonate LHO at a furniture store?

Isn't is simply more reasonable to conclude that this was a case of MISTAKEN IDENTITY?

The question arises: why did Mrs. Whitworth, and her friend, Mrs. Hunter believe it was important to tell the FBI and the WC that the Oswald's came into this furniture store? What was the point?

The only plausible point was that the FBI and WC had asked all citizens of Dallas to come forward with any information AT ALL that they might have about Lee Harvey Oswald.

Mrs. Whitworth and Mrs. Hunter talked to each other about this at length, and they decided that this family they saw in that furniture store, shopping for furniture, was PROBABLY Marina and LHO and their offspring. So, they reported it, out of a sense of civic duty. Maybe it would be important to the FBI to establish LHO's whereabouts on a certain date.

OK, so I don't think these two elderly ladies were LYING, or seeking publicity or anything else than trying to do their civic duty.

But I simply have no idea in the world why the FBI and the WC would think that their "sighting" of Marina and LHO at this furniture store would have ANY RELEVANCE to the assassination of JFK.

Surely the FBI and the WC were not looking for LHO Impersonators. So what was the REASON for this testimony in the first place? I don't see it; except that it wasted time, and the WC already had their mind made up, and they wanted more "filler" for their 26 volumes.

Now, Marina Oswald was asked if she remembered these ladies, and she said flatly, NO. Now, what possible reason would Marina Oswald have to lie about the fact that she had gone shopping for furniture? NONE! I can't see any possible reason for lying about furniture shopping!

So, Marina Oswald under oath told the truth, IMHO, that she didn't remember seeing Mrs. Whitworth at any time, and she would have remembered a 20-30 minute conversation with ANYBODY, and she doesn't remember being in any furniture store at any time, ever, there in Irving, Texas.

There is no valid reason to doubt Marina's testimony here. Why bother?

There is no reason to accuse Mrs. Whitworth and Mrs. Hunter of LYING, but there is clearly reason to suspect them of MISTAKEN IDENTITY. Mrs. Whitworth even said that Marina's face looked less "round" than she remembered it.

There were plenty of young couples in the Dallas region, with wives who spoke a foreign language, and with a baby in arms, and wearing a pony tail. Mrs. Whitworth and Mrs. Hunter thought that they saw LHO at this furniture store, so they reported it to the FBI. That's fair enough.

But what is the hubbub about? Impersonating LHO at a furniture store is a stretch, because WHAT would be the REASON for that effort?

BTW, this question gives me an opportunity to voice my opinion -- that EVERY questioned sighting of LHO in the WC was a MISTAKEN IDENTITY case, and a careful reading of the WC testimony shows it.

The Bradfords at Morgan's Gun Shop in Fort Worth THOUGHT they saw LHO, but had no material evidence, and would not even stand by their stories.

Pamela Mumford and Patricia Winston THOUGHT they saw LHO on the bus to Mexico City, but this person never told them his name, nor did they look at his same when he showed them his passport showing he'd been to Russia. LOTS of people lived in Dallas, became Marines, and at some point visited Russia. There are many other weak points in her testimony.

Again MISTAKEN IDENTITY makes the most sense of those witnesses, too. There were many other cases. Now, John Armstrong runs with all these cases of MISTAKEN IDENTITY, and many others, to create a science fiction CIA plot of Two Oswalds -- but that's pulp fiction, IMHO.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

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What about the "Oswald" who made nuisance of himself at the rifle range?

What about the "Oswald" (who couldn't even drive!) at the car dealership making sure he was noticed?

What about the "Oswald" who turned up at the Selective Service Office when he was supposedly in Mexico?

If these were all correct who was the "Oswald" who was there?

I'm afraid as far as I am concerned, there were too many "mistaken" identities for it to be a coincidence.

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What about the "Oswald" who made nuisance of himself at the rifle range?

What about the "Oswald" (who couldn't even drive!) at the car dealership making sure he was noticed?

What about the "Oswald" who turned up at the Selective Service Office when he was supposedly in Mexico?

If these were all correct who was the "Oswald" who was there?

I'm afraid as far as I am concerned, there were too many "mistaken" identities for it to be a coincidence.

It's a good question, Ray, I'm sure many people ask this question.

  • The main problem is that LHO was not the only Texan with the name "Lee Oswald". It wasn't that rare.
  • Another problem is that LHO wasn't the only bad-tempered youth in Texas.
  • Since LHO was the world's most infamous name in 1963-1964, we should expect "sightings" reports from the public.
  • So, the possibility of MISTAKEN IDENTITY should be considered first, IMHO.

For example, at the Morgan gun shop, there was surely a guy named Lee Oswald who asked for a scope to be added to his rifle. The problem was that this guy (1) didn't look like Oswald; and (2) didn't bring a Mannlicher-Carcano rifle to the store. Just admit it's MISTAKEN IDENTITY.

But the case of Mexico City is a special case -- and it has been confused for 50 years by the CIA, the FBI, the WC, Jim Garrison, John Armstrong and many more.

We finally get the truth about LHO in Mexico, IMHO, from the Lopez-Hardway Report (2003), plus the Bill Simpich brainchild, "State Secret: Wiretapping in Mexico City" (2014).

The problem with Mexico City is that LHO really was there, and yet LHO was also Impersonated.

LHO really did bring Fake ID to Mexico City, pretending he was a Communist Party member, and a Secretary of the FPCC -- when in reality he was neither one -- and he knew it, and the FBI knew it, and the Mexico City Consulates knew it when they took one look at his Fake Resume.

HOWEVER, it was immediately AFTER LHO left Mexico City that an Impersonator called from the Cuban Consulate telephone, to the USSR Embassy telephone, claiming to be LHO and asking to speak with KGB Agent Valerie Kostikov -- the most wanted KGB Agent by the CIA.

Bill Simpich explains -- since this was the most wire-tapped phone line in the world at the time, the call was transcribed and placed on the CIA Director's desk WITHIN 15 MINUTES. The transcript came with a report -- This wasn't LHO at all, but an Imposter.

But WHO? The CIA wondered who would want to Impersonate LHO in this way, asking for a wanted KGB Agent. Whoever did this had to know that this was the world's most wire-tapped phone, and that Kostikov was the most wanted KGB Agent; and so they concluded it had to be somebody inside the CIA. So, the CIA high-command started a secret MOLE-HUNT to find the Impersonator.

This is fully documented with the latest CIA FOIA releases by Bill Simpich (2014). His book, "State Secret," is indispensable reading for today's fully-informed CTer.

So -- what makes Mexico City so complicated is that LHO was both present in Mexico City, and also Impersonated there.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo
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Pony tail vs two pig tails can be a very slight distinction depending on how they are presented.
Marina1_zpsdjfa5gvd.jpg

Do they appear to be pig tails or a pony tail?

LHO32.jpg

What does it have to matter with the JFK murder?

If what happened was as Mrs Whitworth said, and if Marina was right, then somebody was impersonating Oswald and his wife. IMO



Or confusing Oswald/Marina, with some other couple, after the fact.
Perhaps a Czech couple.

Did Lee lock Marina in during the day?
One could suspect it was Marina, but she was driven there by a friend with a 57 Ford, while Ossie was at work.

Mrs. HUNTER. It was a 1957--I think it was a 1957 Ford instead of a 1958.
Mr. McKENZIE. Blue and white?
Mrs. HUNTER. Blue and white yes, sir.
Mr. McKENZIE. Blue on the bottom and white on the top?
Mrs. HUNTER. Yes, sir; I think I've got a picture of the car that my friends--the one that I was waiting for. Could I ask her a question?
[Addressing Marina Oswald.] Don't you have a rinse on your hair now?
*Mrs. OSWALD. A rinse yes. My hair is dark--not too dark.
Mrs. HUNTER. A dirty blonde.
*Mrs. OSWALD. Well, thank you.

Marina dyed her hair dark, coincidentally, for this testimony and .

Marina's responses and how this store resembles closely what Marina recalled the store looked like only add suspicion it was her.

(At this point the proceedings of this deposition were adjourned and Messrs. Liebeler and McKenzie, Marina Oswald, the Reporter, Odell Oliver, and Secret Service Agents John Joe Howlett and Forrest Sorrels in charge of the Dallas Secret Service office traveled to Irving, walked through the store heretofore referred to, departed the same and while Standing in front of the store the following proceedings were had:)


Mr. LIEBELER. Let the record show that we are resuming the deposition in front of 149 East Irving Boulevard, Irving, Tex., and the record will indicate that Mr. McKenzie and Mrs. Oswald, Mr. Sorrels and Mr. Howlett, the Court Reporter and I walked inside of the building here at 149 East Irving Boulevard and walked around inside and outside, and this is at 3:45 p.m., in an effort to refresh Mrs. Oswald's recollection as to whether or not she has ever been in this store.
Mr. LIEBELER. Have you had a chance to go through the store, Marina?
*Mrs. OSWALD. No; this is the first time.
Mr. LIEBELER. This is the first time you have been here?
*Mrs. OSWALD. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. And you have now looked at the outside of the store and looked through the inside?
*Mrs. OSWALD. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. And you are quite sure you have never been here before?
*Mrs. OSWALD. I'm sure I never was here before I am quite sure.
Mr. LIEBELER. You are sure of that in spite of the testimony that you heard this morning from Mrs. Whitworth and Mrs. Hunter; is that right?
*Mrs. OSWALD. Yes; that's-right. She told how I was dressed with a rose jacket--that's true I had a rose jacket.
Mr. LIEBELER. She may have seen you somewhere?
*Mrs. OSWALD. Yes; but I never was here maybe she saw me on the street somewhere. She said it looked like she saw me someplace else and that's the reason why I wanted to see rifts store, but maybe I have forgotten by now--

This is less than supportive of Marina never having been in the store. From the used clothing to the old cafe and bus depot accouterments it seems a match like the baby's birth date.
Both Edith and Gertrude had trouble identifying Lee.
Edith thought maybe it was him in a couple pictures.
Gertrude could not say it was Lee from looking at photos.

The missing tooth could be something Marina may of hid. (self conscience) or simply did not speak to her?

Mr. McKENZIE. Did you hear them talking together?
Mrs. WHITWORTH. I never did hear her utter one word.

Mrs. HUNTER. Well, yes; I guess so, and she walked on around and I just sat back down and I didn't pay her any attention or anything and they had gone back into the back here and she walked on along right along in here and the little girl was pulling, hanging on to her dress tail and she either told her to be quiet or said "shhh" or something like that, and that is the only thing that I heard the woman say.


Kinda hard to see into a closed mouth, yes?

Other details like the jacket are of interest,

Mrs. OSWALD. Excuse me, do you remember how I was dressed and was I pregnant at that time?
Mrs. HUNTER. Yes.
*Mrs. OSWALD. And what did I have on?
Mrs. HUNTER. All I know is you had on a jacket.
*Mrs. OSWALD. What color?
Mrs. HUNTER. It was pretty chilly--it was a rose or more of a--it wasn't red.
Mrs. OSWALD. Was it blue?
Mrs. HUNTER. It was more of a rose.
*Mrs. OSWALD. I had a rose short one.


Oswald and a gun...I'd say no. That includes the Dial Ryder repair ticket which was to bolster this "plunger" incident.
Marina is always a possibility if not then as Ray said somebody was impersonating Oswald and his wife.

Anyways the "plunger" on C2766 worked fine, and did not need replacement. And it sure wasn't replaced the first week of Nov 1963 ... or at anytime.

CE 2974 is a letter from J. Edgar Hoover to Dr. Lee Rankin, Warren Commission general counsel, which contains information about the examination of CE 139. Mr. Rankin inquired what the term “plunger” meant, whether the firing pin had been replaced, and did the FBI have information on where replacement parts could be found. Hoover informed Rankin that “plunger” was a synonym for firing pin and that because the firing pin on CE 139 had “been used extensively” and that there was “rust on the firing pin and its spring” the pin had not been replaced. Finally, Hoover says the pin was “well oiled” and that the oil had to have been applied after the rust formed.

Capper is according to Dial' ticket a plunger was not fixed but a sight was yet C2766' telescopic sight mount was not installed by Irving Sports Shop.

The guns and Oswald stuff is so dead in the water it needs flushed. (Plunger not included.)

Cheers, Ed

Edited by Ed LeDoux
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2017 is approaching. Many documents will be released.

It does not take a rocket scientist to ASSUME, there are some here who are taking the JFK assassination research community temperature.

Trial balloons, rehashing research past, claimed alphabet agency participants-operatives... what better place for that kind of digging-rooting, than here.... what-a-game!

The 1964 Warren Commission Report is trash... get over it.

Well, David, IMHO this is the sort of Either/Or thinking that gets in the way of clear thinking.

The Warren Commission is indeed warped because of the FBI bending evidence to enforce the "Lone Nut" LHO mythology.

Nevertheless -- the vast inventory of First-Hand Witnesses of LHO, and of Dealey Plaza and the Tippit scenario -- ARE PRICELESS.

The HSCA could never match the authenticity of those 1964 Witnesses. For example, the HSCA recalled Marina Oswald -- and GOT NOTHING NEW!

The HSCA had no idea who to call -- they would have got MUCH MORE if they had pushed General Walker's buttons -- but they had no VISION.

They pushed on the Mafia and they pushed on the CIA -- which only wasted US Taxpayer money. The HSCA botched a two-year run.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

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Anyways, back to the subject, here is Mike Paine in 1947 Horace Mann-Lincoln school.

MrPaine_zpswozn7k9d.png

His senior year photo and quote, an ROKC exclusive scan.

Anyone else sensing a Bates Motel - Anthony Perkins vibe?



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Anyways, back to the subject, here is Mike Paine in 1947 Horace Mann-Lincoln school.

<snip>

His senior year photo and quote, an ROKC exclusive scan.

Anyone else sensing a Bates Motel - Anthony Perkins vibe?

Thanks for bringing us back to the topic, Ed.

By the way, that's a GREAT photo of Michael Paine -- I've never seen it before.

And no, there's no Bates Motel vibe there -- there's a rich, ivy-league Prep School there. That boy will become an engineer at Bell Helicopter Corp. I predict.

As for Anthony Perkins -- what a handsome actor he was. I still remember his 1960 comedy with Jane Fonda, Tall Story. Sadly, Perkins was type-cast by Alfred Hitchcock and made most of his money doing Psycho 1, 2 and 3 over the decades.

Maybe Michael Paine isn't quite as handsome as Anthony Perkins, but I do see a mild resemblance.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo
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[...]

And no, there's no Bates Motel vibe there -- there's a rich, ivy-league Prep School there. That boy will become an engineer at Bell Helicopter Corp. I predict.

[...]

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Is that the same Bell Helicopter Company that was going bankrupt prior to JFK's assassination? Only to be resurrected by LBJ gaining the Whitehouse? Not to mention the Vietnam War? One-in-the-same?

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Anyways, back to the subject, here is Mike Paine in 1947 Horace Mann-Lincoln school.

MrPaine_zpswozn7k9d.png

His senior year photo and quote, an ROKC exclusive scan.

Anyone else sensing a Bates Motel - Anthony Perkins vibe?

Thanks for bringing us back to the topic, Ed.

By the way, that's a GREAT photo of Michael Paine -- I've never seen it before.

And no, there's no Bates Motel vibe there -- there's a rich, ivy-league Prep School there. That boy will become an engineer at Bell Helicopter Corp. I predict.

As for Anthony Perkins -- what a handsome actor he was. I still remember his 1960 comedy with Jane Fonda, Tall Story. Sadly, Perkins was type-cast by Alfred Hitchcock and made most of his money doing Psycho 1, 2 and 3 over the decades.

Maybe Michael Paine isn't quite as handsome as Anthony Perkins, but I do see a mild resemblance.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

No worries Paul,

There were no Horace Mann- Lincoln yearbooks with Mike in them available online so I found a 1947 book to purchase .

Lincoln school, 1917, was a special school based on an article by Dr Abraham Flexner called The Modern School based on urging by Dr Charles Eliot, President of Harvard.

Dr Flexner's work caused establishment of the Institute For Advanced Study at Princeton.

It was established to improve education not just in the US but throughout the world. (world peace would not be too far from a goal too)

Students choose their course study and instructors show the relation between the course of study and life itself.

Instead of chemistry being a bunch of memorized symbols and definitions, they would apply the study to their environment.

Flexner dropped classic languages of Greek and Latin, saying their relative importance had declined. Plus they were poorly taught, he noted students scores whom had studied the subject. :)

The school had no bells between classes, this was called 'progressive education' based on philosophy of change.

The way to find the best way to change education methods and teaching was to experiment.

Lincoln was an experiment.

The progressive schools were allowed a flexibility. free from certain static curriculum requirements. Under the the Aiken Plan, Professor @ Ohio St., students would be admitted to college without taking College Board Exams

In order to prove the methods tried at Lincoln were sound and adaptable the school was conducted in connection with an older school, the Horace Mann school.

Horace Mann school was the demonstration.

In 1940 the schools mergered.

Now an experiment school was one with its demonstration school. This was not what was optimum, and in 1946 trustees of Teachers College decided to close it.

Teachers College said it could experiment in public schools more effectively and economically. TC offered the parents the choice to administer the school themselves...if not the school would close.

Parents, teachers, and students and outside interest groups opposed the closure.

This is from the 1947 yearbook... of course the school continued, but the most interesting connection is this about the school.

A Long Tradition

Horace Mann School was founded by Nicholas Murray Butler in 1887 as a coeducational experimental and developmental unit of Teachers College, Columbia University. In 1947, it became an independent day school for boys in grades seven through twelve. The reestablishment of coeducation was accomplished through mergers with the New York School for Nursery Years in 1968, the Barnard School in 1972, and the enrollment of girls in the high school beginning in 1975. In 1887, a full year's tuition for a high school senior was $150.

The School’s founding fathers named the school after Horace Mann (1796-1859). Horace Mann was a lawyer who served in the Massachusetts State Legislature. He was the first Secretary of the Massachusetts Board of Education, a Member of the United States House of Representatives, and President of Antioch College. He used each of his positions to proclaim that every person, regardless of their background, should receive a public education based on the principles and practices of a free society. He also proclaimed that slaves should be free, women should vote and the mentally ill should be cared for. Although Horace Mann’s ideas were revolutionary, he did play a leading role in establishing the elementary school system in the United States.

Ruth Paine's Alma Mater!

Chronology: A Sampling of Important Dates9_university_place_building.jpg

1886 The Barnard School was founded

1887 Teachers College and Model School founded at No. 9 University Place

1891 Nicholas Murray Butler leaves the Presidency of Teachers College. Dr. William Hervey becomes President

1894 Horace Mann School and Teachers College move into a single building on 120th Street.

1894 Virgil Prettyman becomes Principal of Horace Mann School

1901 Horace Mann School moved into its own building at 120th Street and Broadway in Morningside Heights. The School was across the street from the former Bloomingdale Insane Asylum which was being used as a students’ dormitory at Teachers College. 120th_street_building.jpgBy this time, however, Horace Mann was becoming less of an experimental school for the students of Teachers College to try out their new ideas, and more of a well-recognized school in its own right. Teachers College eventually created the Lincoln School as a new co-educational school in which to practice their experimental teaching methods, leaving Horace Mann more and more independent.

1909 Teachers College purchased lots on 246th Street in the Fieldston section of the Bronx. Alumni Field opened there as an athletic facility. The property is reported to have cost $20,001 which was paid for by Mr. Prettyman.

1914 Horace Mann School for Boys opened on 246th Street. Henry Carr Pearson became the Headmaster of the Horace Mann High School for Girls, still on 120th Street.

charles_c_tillinghast.jpg1920 Charles Carpenter Tillinghast was appointed Headmaster

1924 Prettyman Gymnasium and Pool opened

1940Horace Mann High School for Girls merged with the Lincoln School

1946 Horace Mann-Lincoln School closed

1947 Horace Mann School for Boys obtained complete financial and administrative independence from Teachers College. The new Board of Trustees received a provisional charter changing the School's name back to Horace Mann School

1950 Dr. Mitchell Gratwick becomes the third Headmaster

1951 Horace Mann's permanent charter from the New York Board of Regents was granted

1954 The New York School for Nursery Years was founded

1956 Pforzheimer Hall was built, named after Mr. Carl H. Pforzheimer, who was chairman of the Board of Trustees

1962 Alfred Gross Hall, housing the Van Alstyne Auditorium and new cafeteria, opened. The old auditorium became the Theresa H. Loeb Library. The fourth floor of the newly-renamed Tillinghast Hall was converted from a gymnasium into classroom space pforzheimer_groundbreaking.jpg

1965 The John Dorr Nature Laboratory, 85 acres of land in rural Washington Depot, Connecticut, was left to the school by John Dorr, an inventor and a neighbor of Headmaster Gratwick

1968 Horace Mann established the Horace Mann School for Nursery Years through a merger with the New York School for Nursery Years (which had been founded in 1954 and housed in Andrew Carnegie's old carriage house on 90th Street)

1968 Harry Williams named Acting Headmaster

..............

Bell Helicopter and world peace, makes for an modern dichotomy. But Mike was free to live as he chooses.

Edited by Ed LeDoux
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[...]

And no, there's no Bates Motel vibe there -- there's a rich, ivy-league Prep School there. That boy will become an engineer at Bell Helicopter Corp. I predict.

[...]

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Is that the same Bell Helicopter Company that was going bankrupt prior to JFK's assassination? Only to be resurrected by LBJ gaining the Whitehouse? Not to mention the Vietnam War? One-in-the-same?

Yes, David, we've all heard that story for 50 years now, starting with Jim Garrison. Bell Helicopter executives alleged murdered JFK so that LBJ would fire up the Vietnam war so that Bell Helicopter could sell thousands of helicopters to the US Army and Air Force.

Millions of people heard that accusation in Oliver Stone's 1991 movie, JFK.

Well -- it's naked speculation. To make it work, one must convince oneself that JFK was against any Vietnam war -- but in fact JFK said both negative AND POSITIVE things about a Vietnam war. So, it's ambiguous.

IMHO, if JFK had lived, and if he did get pulled into the Vietnam War, he would have handled it far more intelligently than LBJ did. LBJ had Domestic policy as his focus -- and internationally he was a dunce.

JFK was brilliant, and he knew that FDR had befriended Ho Chi Minh and had actually sent Ho Chi Minh weapons with which to kick the French out of Vietnam. In the politics of FDR, all Colonialism worldwide must CEASE.

Sadly, FDR died before he could enact his policy, and Harry Truman took over, and like LBJ, Harry Truman had Domestic policy as his focus. Truman's attention was captured by the Marshall Plan for Europe, and the French begged Truman to keep Vietnam "in the interest of the Marshall Plan," and simple old Truman said, "Duh...OK."

And there were the seeds of the Vietnam war. But JFK was smarter. JFK could see that the South Vietnamese ban on Buddhists was a STUPID policy, simply because the ruling class in South Vietnam was Catholic. If JFK had entered Vietnam, he would have fixed the Anti-Buddhist policy FIRST, and would have concluded the War in two years maximum -- I predict.

It's simple-Simon to blame Bell Helicopter for the JFK assassination and the Vietnam War. Such simplistic CT's ignore the vast complexity of world history.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

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