Allen Dulles and his secret behind Kennedy's assassintion

[Scott Kaiser]

Here's a bit of information most folks don't even know, so many researchers are too quick to blame Allen Dulles as being at the top of the suspect list in his involvement in Kennedy's assassination, and I'll be the first to tell you it's all hogwash!

What most folks don't know is, had the Bay of Pigs been a successful mission rather than a failure, Dulles was already planning his retirement from the CIA shortly thereafter, in fact, his release of his position by his Commander in Chief allowed Dulles to muster out with a pension.

Dulles was the longest standing DCI at the CIA before his release and [oversaw] the topple and coup of the 1954 Guatemalan, Operation Ajax, the overthrow of Iran's government, sounds familiar? LSD experiments on homeless people without relatives to report and the Bay of Pigs.

Just six years later, after serving on the Warren Commission, Dulles would die of complications he had already contracted early on, and it was because of his failing health that his service to the United States would come to an end after serving on the commission.

Year after year Mr. Dulles would contract the flu, and on top of that he smoked, a recipe for disaster, it was during his final years of his life that he contracted Influenza which was the corporate for his death.

So, when I hear from researchers tell me they believe Dulles was at the forefront of Kennedy's assassination, I always ask them, is it because Dulles was fired, and he didn't want to lose his job that made Dulles want to kill Kennedy? Get real.... smh....

Edited January 23, 2016 by Scott Kaiser

[Terry Martin]

I had also heard that Dulles was friends with JFK before he was still a Senator.

And IIRC when the BOP blew up, Dulles offered to resign but Kennedy refused to accept the resignation. Several months later, he was allowed to leave after an awards ceremony.

I never thought he was behind the assassination but I would bet the farm he was behind the cover-up. (Yes, I keep the two conspiracies separated.)

[Jon G. Tidd]

Scott, I agree.

[David Andrews]

I think that, as Jim DiEugenio, David Talbot, and others have pointed out, it was Dulles' longtime relations with the interests that supported big steel, big oil, the Federal Reserve, and corporate-backed military actions in Southeast Asia and Indonesia that would motivate Dulles to be point man in the assassination for CIA and Wall Street.

Also, the circumstances of an enforced resignation of Dulles, Bissell and Cabell in the year of the BOP and the attempted coup in France were a bit more humiliating than any planned retirement Dulles envisioned. (We can throw in that JFK had even Dulles' sister Eleanor removed from her innocuous bureaucratic job at State, so deep was the animus against the family.) These circumstances, and the money interests' opposition to Kennedy, may have combined to cause Dulles to stay on in an unacknowledged leadership role at CIA as David Talbot describes, and to place him on the Warren Commission.

"Who's being naïve here, Kay?" -- Michael Corleone in The Godfather

Edited January 23, 2016 by David Andrews

[Scott Kaiser]

I can say, with certainty, that without a difference of opinions, conversations would be boring.

"I never thought he was behind the assassination but I would bet the farm he was behind the cover-up." YES!

[Paul Brancato]

Scott - what is your source that Dulles was retiring anyway?

[Tom Neal]

...had the Bay of Pigs been a successful mission rather than a failure, Dulles was already planning his retirement from the CIA shortly thereafter

Scott,

What is your source for Dulles' planned retirement following a successful BOP invasion?

As David states, Dulles' future changed, so his motivations may have changed as well.

Tom

[Scott Kaiser]

...had the Bay of Pigs been a successful mission rather than a failure, Dulles was already planning his retirement from the CIA shortly thereafter

Scott,

What is your source for Dulles' planned retirement following a successful BOP invasion?

As David states, Dulles' future changed, so his motivations may have changed as well.

Tom

A personal friend whom I've known for 40 plus years, and has since lived in Michigan who has been friends with Richard Bissell's son.

[Brian Schmidt]

He was planning on retiring at age 70, which would have been in 1963. I think this is discussed in A Cruel and Shocking Act, but I'm not sure the original source. I'll look later today and report back.

Who knows if he would have followed through though, as it was his dream job. Also, Dulles reportedly fell into a depression after being fired from the CIA.

[Scott Kaiser]

Who knows if he would have followed through though, as it was his dream job.

All good things come to an end, even those who are smart, 70 and sick realize that.

[James DiEugenio]

This whole line of argument is so sophomoric, I really wonder how many people have read Talbot's book?

The whole clash between Kennedy and Dulles WAS NOT JUST OVER THE BAY OF PIGS!

Although that was a very important aspect of why Kennedy got rid of Dulles, it was not the only reason.

By April of 1961, Dulles had subverted Kennedy's foreign policy three times.

1. In Congo, where Kennedy had supported Lumumba and Dag Hammaskjold, and a unified Congo against the British and Belgian forces who wanted Lumumba dead and Katanga split off. Dulles knew that Kennedy was an anti-colonialist, especially in Africa, so he actually speeded up the assassination of Lumumba so it took place BEFORE Kennedy was inaugurated. And then he kept the murder secret from him for weeks, even though JFK officially changed policy in Congo six days after he took power.

It is shocking to me that the people on this board are unaware of the famous photo taken by Jacques Lowe when Kennedy finally found out that Lumumba was dead. If ever a picture was worth a thousand words, that one is.

Its very simple: Dulles had Lumumba killed because he knew Kennedy opposed Dulles' policy in Congo. Which supported European imperialism there.

2. Dulles also supported the revolt of the French generals against DeGaulle over Algeria in April of 1961. And, in fact, as Talbot shows, Dulles duped the generals into thinking Kennedy supported their revolt and attempt to overthrow the government. Again, this was primarily over an anti-imperialist policy, this time in north Africa. Kennedy had opposed the French attempt to keep colonial control of Algeria since way back in 1957. Then he made a truly inspiring speech on the floor of the senate saying it was wrong for France not to grant Algeria its freedom, and it was worse for the USA to support France in its folly in Africa. The Dulles brothers, Ike, and Nixon were furious over this speech.

But it was this speech that made Kennedy the hope of the Third World and of those in France who realized the same thing was going to happen in Algeria that happened in Vietnam. Which, by the way, is just what Kennedy predicted would happen in his speech. He also warned if the USA and Europe persisted in this policy it would radicalize the then dormant strain of Islamic religious fanaticism left over from the Ottoman Empire's conquest of North Africa. Pretty far sighted eh?

DeGaulle agreed with Kennedy. So when the coup began, Kennedy called the French ambassador and offered any help he could to France, including the Sixth Fleet. This, of course, put him in direct confrontation with Dulles, who urged on the coup and French occupation of Algeria.

3. Through two investigations, the Kirkpatrick Report and the Taylor Report, Kennedy discovered that Dulles, Bissell and the CIA had lied to him repeatedly about Operation Zapata. Especially important was RFK's presence on the Taylor Commission. RFK did not at all buy Dulles' explanation as to how the assault would succeed in the face of overwhelming opposing numbers and no defections--which Dulles and the CIA had promised would happen.

Dulles made for a very bad witness and RFK was furious when it was over. He was so angry that not only did he urge his brother to fire Dulles, but he then asked Dean Rusk if there was any other member of the Dulles family at work in the government. Rusk said yes, Allen's sister Eleanor, who was just two years short of retirement. RFK demanded she be fired also since he wanted no more trace of that family around anymore.

Now, what is amazing about this record of treachery and perfidy is this:

IT TOOK PLACE OVER JUST FOUR MONTHS!

Can you imagine if Kennedy would have kept Dulles around over four years? The point is this: schooled at the feet of Edmund Gullion, Kennedy's comprehensive approach to the foreign policy paradoxes and complexities of the time were entirely opposed to Mr. CFR Allen Dulles. Kennedy was opposed to using the Cold War as a fig leaf for American Imperialism replacing European imperialism in the Third World. And this confrontation started in 1961--actually before Kennedy took office.

There was no way in the world that Kennedy could have kept Dulles around and at the same time initiated his revolutionary foreign policy e.g. in places like Indonesia. In fact, when Kennedy asked Dulles for the CIA internal report on the attempted overthrow of Sukarno by the Dulles brothers in 1958, Dulles gave him a redacted copy! That is how little respect he had for JFK. But even in that form, Kennedy remarked, "No wonder Sukarno doesn't like us, we tried to overthrow his government."

So this veil of sentimental apologia for a man as evil as Allen Dulles, who actually wanted to keep the Third Reich intact, except with Himmler in charge instead of Hitler, this will simply not stand up to the facts of his odious career. Dulles represented everything that was bad about American foreign policy, especially in the Third World, and this helps explain why we were hated there after Kennedy's murder.

And anyone who does not think Dulles was involved in the murder, please explain to me his visit and conversation with Truman in April of 1964. Especially the part where he lies to the former president about Kennedy and Vietnam. (See Destiny Betrayed second edition, pgs.378-81)

If that is not consciousness of guilt then I don't know what is.

Edited January 23, 2016 by James DiEugenio

[Tom Neal]

This whole line of argument is so sophomoric, I really wonder ho many people have read Talbot's book?

I have. It's absolutely MANDATORY to understand Dulles. He made a career out of ignoring orders and doing his own thing. Multiple incidents in the book illustrate that Dulles was a sociopath. Devoid of conscience with delusions that he knew better than anyone what was the right thing to do. His wife and mistress referred to him as "shark." What more do we need to hear?

Tom

[James DiEugenio]

Thanks Tom.

Here is the picture I was talking about above, JFK getting the news of Lumumba's death which Dulles orchestrated. Dulles even moved Bissell to Rome to be in closer contact with Devlin who was running the operation on the ground.

http://www.orwelltoday.com/jfkcongophone.jpg

Edited January 23, 2016 by James DiEugenio

[Scott Kaiser]

Not to jump off track here, but someone looks like Tom Selleck!

[James DiEugenio]

I don't have a mustache, so it must be Tom or Dave.