Who was Jack Ruby?

[David Andrews]

Is this an adequate two-horns version?

Remember Ruby's comment about, "When the horns blow for me..."

 

[James DiEugenio]

Yes, but the one Ray sent to me was better.

BTW, that is some good reporting by Tom Pettet is it not: Oswald has definitely been shot.  Kind of thing that wins an Emmy.

 

[James DiEugenio]

David:

That is funny that you should mention Ruby writing about "when the horns blow for me".

When Ray sent me that recording, he enclosed an article that mentioned Ruby using that phrase.  And he wrote a note saying words to the effect, Jim, did Ruby strike you as being that religious, and recall he was a Jew.

[Steve Thomas]

14 hours ago, Andrej Stancak said:

Mr. CABELL. The first call from Curry, or only the starting of any conversations with Chief Curry were relative to this torchlight parade on that night. I had called him and told him that I would recommend the cancellation of that parade. He had granted it, but then I had recommended the cancellation, and I would assume full responsibility for having given that instruction. 

 

Andrej,

I read a little of Cabell's WC testimony.

The eight-member Dallas City Council did not meet between November 22nd and November 24th. The City Manager, Elgin Crull was out of town and did not return until after Oswald had been shot and Curry had to call him and ask him to please come back to town.

That's just kind of mind boggling.

 

What do you think were the chances that this "torchlight parade" would have turned into a good old-fashioned wild-west lynch mob?

My bet would have been even odds.

Cabell Exhibit 1. (19H243)

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1136#relPageId=261&tab=page

FBI interview with Mayor, Earl Cabell December 12, 1963.

https://www.dignitymemorial.com/obituaries/dallas-tx/william-smith-5347137

William Lancaster “Lank” Smith, III passed away peacefully on Monday, December 17, 2012, in Dallas, Texas. He was born in Lebanon, Kentucky on June 14, 1923. He was a beloved husband, father, grandfather, great-grandfather and friend. He attended high school in Lebanon, Kentucky at St. Augustine. He joined the U. S. Army Air Force and played tailback on the Third Air Force football team. He received his undergraduate degree from the University of Notre Dame in 1946. He graduated from the University of Notre Dame Law School in 1950. While at Notre Dame, he played football as a defensive halfback under the coaching of Frank Leahy and was part of Notre Dame’s legendary undefeated and national championship teams in 1946, 1947 and 1948. While in law school, he served as the coach of the Notre Dame Freshman football team. In 1950, he became the coach of the Jesuit High School football team in Dallas eventually guiding them to their first T.C.I.L. State Championship. He served as an Assistant District Attorney in Dallas from 1954 through 1957 and later became a partner in the law firm of Turner, White, Atwood, Meer & Francis. In 1961, he formed his own law firm which eventually became known as Smith, Smith & Smith, LLP. He spent decades practicing law with his sons in Dallas County. His love of Notre Dame and its football team never faded. He was voted Notre Dame Man of the Year, Dallas Club, in 1954. He was elected National President of the Notre Dame Alumni Association 1965 to 1967, then served seven years as a Board Member. He served as President of the N. D. Monogram Club 1986 through 1988 then served seventeen years on its Board. He served as President of the Dallas Citizens Council for Decent Literature, Vice-President of the Cincinnati National Citizens for Decent Literature and was cited by the National Conference of Christians and Jews as a speaker on brotherhood.

 

Steve Thomas

[James DiEugenio]

Steve:

Is Cabell lying his head off?  About  not making any orders to Curry, and not having any contact with department heads and the reason he contacted Curry?

Was Crull really out of town?

[Ron Ecker]

I haven't read this whole thread, so I don't know if the theory or notion has already been mentioned that Ruby was hypnotized to kill Oswald. With post-hypnotic suggestion ("when the horns blow for you"), the horns would be perfect cues for Ruby to act.

 

 

[Joe Bauer]

Watching this video over and over I am amazed at how close Ruby is to and absolutely right behind his police officer buddy big William "Blackie" Harrison even before Oswald appears into the basement walkway and then while Oswald approaches him.

I mean Ruby is mere inches behind the hulking Harrison. Close enough to bump shoulders. There is no one up against Harrison's body like that except Ruby.

And it's also sickening to see Oswald's guard team leading Oswald to a mere two to three feet from the press crowd.

They could reach out and touch Oswald as he comes by. Reporter Ike Pappas is so close like this. No security conscious room between them at all.

It's one thing to give the press crowd some room to see and film Oswald. It's another to allow them to get so close to him they could hit him over the head with their microphones if they had wanted to. Crazy crowd control logistics to the point of suspicion.

Ruby has the perfect position to burst forth and immediately get within a foot or even inches in front of Oswald. Being right behind and then even with Harrison, Ruby only has to take two to three short steps to cover that distance.

And lightly guarded Oswald was a wide open sitting duck target.

Notice both Leavelle and Oswald's other guard/escort L.C. Graves are looking away from Ruby at the rolling down car on the ramp at the exact moment Ruby pounces.

As Ruby moves in they do see and look at him, but their initial visual distraction just before gave Ruby an extra split second advantage to get so close into Oswald's gut imo.

The whole scene as depicted in the video above screams an unbelievably worst case plan of security for Oswald in that crowded flash bulb blinding, too close and rushing in press packed basement.

I remember feeling outrage when I saw the shooting live on TV.

I was only 12. But even at that young age I could see the shoddiness of Oswald's security with only two escort guards walking along his side and practically pushing Oswald slightly in front of them versus behind them.

Check again Ruby literally butting up against his Dallas policeman buddy William Harrison to get into the perfect close up position to get to Oswald in his splint second burst.

Edited March 23, 2020 by Joe Bauer

[James DiEugenio]

In the valuable film Evidence of Revision, you can see Ruby hiding behind Harrison even more clearly.

Again, I have a hard time buying that the FBI, the WC and the HSCA did not see that.

If I recall correctly, in Kantor's book didn't Harrison take some kind of medication before his polygraph test?

The other reason this is all so  provocative is:  why did Ruby do what he did in front of all those cameras and cops?

Even he admitted that the whole Jackie and the trial thing was BS.  And even the WC admitted that the nexus for Oswald knowing Ruby was most likely through the anti Castro Cuban underworld.

PS I have to add, the way that Ruby was pictured in that mini series based on Stephen King's book was a joke.

 

Edited March 21, 2020 by James DiEugenio

[Steve Thomas]

On 3/21/2020 at 2:42 PM, James DiEugenio said:

Steve:

Is Cabell lying his head off?  About  not making any orders to Curry, and not having any contact with department heads and the reason he contacted Curry?

Was Crull really out of town?

Jim,

I've had some experience working in the council/city manager environment, and Cabell's description sounds about right.

Crull told the FBI that he went to the lake that weekend. Why he chose that particular weekend to go to the lake is another matter altogether.

 

FBI interview with Elgin Crull December 12, 1963

(19H394

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=1136#relPageId=412&tab=page

 

 

 

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/crull.htm

 

Mr. CRULL. I believe that says simply that I went to the lake, to a cabin. The only change is that there is no cabin. I have a boat on the lake.
Mr. HUBERT. Other than that?
Mr. CRULL. Other than that, it is accurate.
Mr. HUBERT. Now in the next paragraph, which is the third paragraph on page 1, you have put a little mark next to the statement that you heard over the radio of Oswald having been shot.
Mr. CRULL I did not hear it over the radio. I was called by the operator of the marina, or one of his people, I do not remember which, who had heard it over the radio.

 

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/cabell_e.htm

Mr. HUBERT - Did you have any contact with, City Manager Crull during that time?
Mr. CABELL - The Sunday morning, I knew that the city manager was out of town, and in my conversation with Chief Curry subsequent to the shooting of Oswald, I asked him if he had made contact with Mr. Crull, and suggested that if he had not, that he do make immediate contact and ask for his return to the city.
Mr. HUBERT - That was after the shooting of Oswald?
Mr. CABELL - This was after the shooting of Oswald. And he told me at that time that Mr. Crull had been contacted and was on his way back.

 

Steve Thomas

Edited July 13, 2021 by Steve Thomas

[James DiEugenio]

He left AFTER Kennedy was killed and Oswald was in detention!

That is unbelievable if he was supposed to be the guy managing city government..

Edited March 22, 2020 by James DiEugenio

[Ron Bulman]

7 hours ago, David Andrews said:

Is this an adequate two-horns version?

Remember Ruby's comment about, "When the horns blow for me..."

 

I don't remember reading about "when the horn blows for me".  When/to who did he say this.  It's quite interesting even not considering Gabriel.  IF the first honk Might have been a signal of he's here, out of the elevator/office, in the garage.  Then the second one being a command to go, shoot now.  This would mean a coordination of his efforts by others.  Did someone tell him something like, when you get in there go crouch down a little beside Blackie?  At the second honk, shoot?  Spaghetti on the wall.

What other reasons are there for the horn blowing twice in those few seconds in the garage?  Your in my way, move on?  Move up a few feet?   

[Joe Bauer]

6 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

He left AFTER Kennedy was killed and Oswald was in detention!

That is unbelievable is he was supposed to be the guy managing city government..

Absolutely.

You don't leave the city you are manager of for a pleasure trip one day after the most shocking criminally violent, world changing event has just happened in it.

Our entire military went to high alert for some time starting 11,22,1963.

Dallas's entire political and law enforcement structure would have been in a similar state of emergency reaction.

Come on Hon, get the kids and pack the snacks ... we're goin' to the lake.

Uh...really?

 

Edited March 22, 2020 by Joe Bauer

[Andrej Stancak]

Steve:

you raised some good points.

The City Manager leaving his office in the time of crisis is difficult to understand but it could happen. If it did happen, Crull had his reasons - recall, David Ferrie also had reasons to be be on a geese hunting trip just hours after assassination. If he had left the town on the 23rd, he still may have advised Chief Curry, via phone call to Earle Cabell or someone else, to transfer Oswald in the presence of cameras and newsmen, and he left to wash his hands from what would follow. However, I believe it was Cabell who suggested to Chief Curry the public transfer of Lee Oswald. 

Interestingly, Elgin Crull suggested that the officer who was supposed to provide protection for Earle Cabell during his trip to Washington, DC to attend the funeral, was ...  Lt. Jack Revill, the most conspiratorial officer according to Sylvia Meagher. Cabell and Crull clearly trusted Jack Revill and had plenty opportunities to be informed by Revill about what was going on in the Department. Crull did not ask Chief Curry whom Curry would recommend for Cabell's protection, Crull picked up an officer beforehand. Later, it was Jack Revill who supervised the Police Department investigation in Ruby's killing of Oswald. 

It is highly unlikely that a phone call between Cabell and Curry during the 48 hours of assassination would not mention Lee Oswald and/or his transfer at all, but there you have it, Cabell denied it.

 

 

 

[Steve Thomas]

11 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

He left AFTER Kennedy was killed and Oswald was in detention!

That is unbelievable is he was supposed to be the guy managing city government..

"Oh, the President of the United States has been assassinated in my City?"
"Yawn, I think I'll go to the lake".

"Call me if you need me."

Steve Thomas

[James DiEugenio]

Ron:

If I recall, the whole Gabriel and the horns blowing was in an article that someone wrote for the St Louis Post Dispatch.  Ray Marcus sent it to me.

It was in one of those weird letters Ruby wrote while he was on death row. 

The two horns may have been for some reason to signal the position of the car.  And it may be a coincidence.

But that timing is just uncanny.

Edited March 22, 2020 by James DiEugenio