Jump to content
The Education Forum

Yes, Oswald was an Intelligence agent


Recommended Posts

  • Replies 358
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

No, Lee Harvey Oswald was not a CIA Agent.

The Harvey and Lee theory by John Armstrong (2003), claiming that the CIA raised from childhood two children, Lee Oswald, and Harvey Oswald, and prepared them for years to use in the JFK assassination -- is the sheerest science fiction.

John Armstrong at first relied upon a worthy source -- the photographer Jack White, whose early analysis of the famous backyard photographs (BYP's) of Lee Harvey Oswald (LHO) and brilliantly demonstrated that they were FAKE (1990), and that Roscoe White was the body-double in those BYP's.

I admire Jack White's work on the BYP's very much.

But in 1991 Jack White went too far -- he used USSR photographs of LHO there in Moscow, in which for plausible deniability they composed a mug shot of LHO by using only the right-side of his face doubled-over...

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/2oswalds.htm

...and then composed a mug shot of LHO by using only the left-wide of his face doubled over.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Harvey_Oswald

The two photographs look like two different people -- and yet one can easily see that they resemble LHO very closely. But it's a photographic trick. Try it yourself on your own photograph sometime. It's surprising, because we tend to think that our faces are perfectly symmetrical, and the two photographs of the left-sides doubled and the right-sides doubled should match -- they hardly ever do. Try it yourself and see.

Anyway, based on these USSR photographs, Jack White himself began this silly theory that there were two different men -- Lee Oswald and Harvey Oswald. White started that theory way back in the 1990's, when Jack White became converted to the all-too-easy doctrine that the CIA killed JFK.

It was all downhill from there.

John Armstrong in 2003 picked up on this mythology, and he greatly expanded it.

There is another photographic fact -- that young people's looks change very much from year to year -- and John Armstrong used that fact to pretend that the different photographs of the young Oswald and the older Oswald were different people.

John Armstrong then exploited every case of mistaken identity of LHO and twisted it into his "Harvey and Lee" theory. Almost every murder case has its cases of mistaken identity -- and the cases of famous people have many times more. So John Armstrong enriches his science fiction by using every case of mistaken identity about LHO ever heard.

The core theme of the Harvey and Lee mythology is that the CIA created Harvey and Lee, and controlled every sighting, and every record, and that LHO was really and truly a CIA Agent.

Actually -- LHO was a high-school dropout, and had just turned 24 years old when he died. Before he died he lived in dire poverty.

This simply isn't the profile of a CIA Agent.

While it is true that LHO truly wanted to be a super-spy, and worked very hard toward that goal -- he failed to do so. Instead, he became exploited by criminals, first, with his eyes open, to try to assassinate Fidel Castro, and then, without his knowledge, in the plot to kill JFK.

Genuine CIA Agents don't get made into Patsies. The Harvey and Lee CT is an elaborate science fiction. That's all it is. Please be aware.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo
Link to comment
Share on other sites

No proof, not even close, that LHO was involved in a plot to kill Castro. You cannot state that as fact and be taken seriously.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


TESTIMONY OF JAMES B. WILCOTT, A FORMER EMPLOYEE

OF THE CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE AGENCY:


Mr. Goldsmith. For the record, would you please state your name and address and occupation?


Mr. Wilcott. My name is James B. Wilcott. My address is 2761 Atlantic Street, in Concord, and my occupation is electronic technician.


[ . . . . ]


Mr. Goldsmith. And, Mr. Wilcott, is it true that you are a former employee with the CIA and that you are here today testifying voluntarily without a subpoena?


Mr. Wilcott. Yes.


Mr. Goldsmith. During what years did you work for the CIA?


Mr. Wilcott. I worked from the years, May, of 1957 to, April, of 1966.


Mr. Goldsmith. And in what general capacity did you work with the CIA?


Mr. Wilcott. All in the finance--in accounting all of the time.


[. . . .]


Mr. Goldsmith. Drawing your attention to the period immediately after the assassination of President Kennedy, at that time, did you come across any information concerning Lee Harvey Oswald's relationship with the CIA?


Mr. Wilcott. Yes, I did.


Mr. Goldsmith. And will you tell the Committee what that relationship was?


Mr. Wilcott. Well, it was my understanding that Lee Harvey Oswald was an employee of the agency and was an agent of the agency.


Mr. Goldsmith. What do you mean by the term "agent?"


Mr. Wilcott. That he was a regular employee, receiving a full-time salary for agent work for doing CIA operational work.


Mr. Goldsmith. How did this information concerning Oswald first come to your attention?


Mr. Wilcott. The first time I heard about Oswald being connected in any way with CIA was the day after the Kennedy assassination.


Mr. Goldsmith. And how did that come to your attention?


Mr. Wilcott. Well, I was on day duty for the station. It was a guard-type function at the station, which I worked for overtime. There was a lot of excitement going on at the station after the Kennedy assassination. Towards the end of my tour of duty, I heard certain things about Oswald somehow being connected with the agency, and I didn't really believe this when I heard it, and I thought it was absurd. Then, as time went on, I began to hear more things in that line.


Mr. Goldsmith. I think we had better go over that one more time. When, exactly, was the very first time that you heard or came across information that Oswald was an agent?


Mr. Wilcott. I heard references to it the day after the assassination.


Mr. Goldsmith. And who made these references to Oswald being an agent of the CIA?


Mr. Wilcott. I can't remember the exact persons. There was talk about it going on at the station, and several months following at the station.


Mr. Goldsmith. How many people made this reference to Oswald being an agent of the CIA?


Mr. Wilcott. At least--there was at least six or seven people, specifically, who said that they either knew or believed Oswald to be an agent of the CIA.


Mr. Goldsmith. Was Jerry Fox one of the people that made this allegation?


Mr. Wilcott. To the best of my recollection, yes.


Mr. Goldsmith. And who is Jerry Fox?


Mr. Wilcott. Jerry Fox was a Case Officer for his branch, the Soviet Russia Branch, [REDACTED] Station, who purchased information from the Soviets.


Mr. Goldsmith. Mr. Wilcott, did I ask you to prepare a list of CIA Case Officers working at the [REDACTED] Station in 1963?


Mr. Wilcott. Yes, you did. [Witness then recites a lengthy list of case officers and station names, quite a few redacted in this document--jh]


[. . . .]


Mr. Goldsmith. At the time that this allegation first came to your attention, did you discuss it with anyone?


Mr. Wilcott. Oh, yes. I discussed it with my friends and the people that I was associating with socially.


Mr. Goldsmith. Who were your friends that you discussed this with?


Mr. Wilcott. [REDACTED] George Breen, Ed Luck, and [REDACTED].


Mr. Goldsmith. Who was George Breen?


Mr. Wilcott. George Breen was a person in Registry, who was my closest friend while I was in [REDACTED].


Mr. Goldsmith. Was he a CIA employee?


Mr. Wilcott. Yes, he was.


Mr. Goldsmith. And would he corroborate your observation that Oswald was an agent?


Mr. Wilcott. I don't know.


Mr. Goldsmith. At the time that this allegation first came to your attention, did you learn the name of Oswald's Case Officer at the CIA?


Mr. Wilcott. No.


Mr. Goldsmith. Were there any other times during your stay with the CIA at [REDACTED] Station that you came across information that Oswald had been a CIA agent?


Mr. Wilcott. Yes.


Mr. Goldsmith. When was that?


Mr. Wilcott. The specific incident was soon after the Kennedy assassination, where an agent, a Case Officer--I am sure it was a Case Officer--came up to my window to draw money, and he specifically said in the conversation that ensued, he specifically said, "Well, Jim, the money that I drew the last couple of weeks ago or so was money" either for the Oswald project or for Oswald.


Mr. Goldsmith. Do you remember the name of this Case Officer?


Mr. Wilcott. No, I don't.


Mr Goldsmith. Do you remember when specifically this conversation took place?


Mr. Wilcott. Not specifically, only generally.


Mr. Goldsmith. How many months after the assassination was this?


Mr. Wilcott. I think it must have been two or three omths [sic] after the assassination.


Mr. Goldsmith. And do you remember were this conversation took place?


Mr. Wilcott. It was right at my window, my disbursing cage window.


Mr. Goldsmith. Did you discuss this information with anyone?


Mr. Wilcott. Oh, yes.


Mr. Goldsmith. With whom?


Mr. Wilcott. Certainly with George Breen, [REDACTED] the circle of social friends that we had.


Mr. Goldsmith. How do you spell [REDACTED] last name?


Mr. Wilcott. [REDACTED] (spelling).


[. . . .]


Mr. Goldsmith. Did this Case Officer tell you what Oswald's cryptonym was?


Mr. Wilcott. Yes, he mentioned the cryptonym specifically under which the money was drawn.


Mr. Goldsmith. And what did he tell you the cryptonym was?


Mr. Wilcott. I cannot remember.


Mr. Goldsmith. What was your response to this revelation as to what Oswald's cryptonym was? Did you write it down or do anything?


Mr. Wilcott. No; I think that I looked through my advance book--and I had a book where the advances on project were run, and I leafed through them, and I must have at least leafed through them to see if what he said was true.


[Three pages of discussion about Wilcott's "Request for Advance" book follows but is omitted here. --jh]


Mr. Goldsmith. And for purposes of clarification, now, if Oswald was already dead at the time that you went to this book, why did you go back and examine the book?


Mr. Wilcott. Well, I am sorry--if Oswald was what?


Mr. Goldsmith. At the time you went to look at the book, Oswald was already dead, is that correct?


Mr. Wilcott. That is right.


Mr. Goldsmith. Why did you go back to look at the book?


Mr. Wilcott. Well, the payments that were made especially to substations like Oswald's was operated--it was a substation of the [REDACTED] Station, and they had one in [REDACTED] and they had one in [REDACTED]--and it may be six months or even a year after the initial allocation that the final accounting for those funds were submitted, and they would operate out of revolving funds or out of their own personal funds in many cases.


Mr. Goldsmith. So, is your testimony then that even though Oswald was already dead at the time, the book might have contained a reference to either Oswald or the Oswald project and that that reference would have been to a period six months or even a year earlier, is that correct?


Mr. Wilcott. That is correct.


[As far as I can determine from this 54-page typed document, HSCA Counsel Michael Goldsmith never asks Wilcott the essential question, which would be: "Was the Oswald cryptonym you no longer recall in your "Request for Advance" book?" Strange. The most relevant testimony is found on pages 18-19, as follows. --jh]


Mr. Goldsmith. But as a matter of routine, would the CIA cash disbursement files refer to the cryptonym of either the person or the project that is receiving funds?


Mr. Wilcott. Yes, I am sure somewhere.


Mr. Goldsmith. As a matter of routine, there would be that reference? Do you believe that there was such a reference to Oswald?


[Mr. Wilcott.] Yes, I do, and I believe there was such a reference.


[. . . .]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

* Richard Sprague, chief counsel to the U.S. House Select Committee on Assassinations said, "If he had it to do over again, he would begin his investigation of the Kennedy assassination by probing 'Oswald's ties to the Central Intelligence Agency."


* Sen. Richard Schweiker said, "We do know Oswald had intelligence connections. Everywhere you look with him, there're fingerprints of intelligence."


* CIA Agent Donald Norton said, "Oswald was with the CIA, and if he did it then you better believe the whole CIA was involved."


* Former CIA agent Joseph Newbrough said, "Oswald was an agent for the CIA and acting under orders."


* CIA Agent John Garrett Underhill told friends, just before he died, "Oswald is a patsy. They set him up. They've killed the President. I've been listening and hearing things. I couldn't believe they'd get away with it, but they did."


* CIA Agent William Gaudet said, "The man who probably knows as much as anybody alive on all of this... is... I still think is Howard Hunt"----CIA Agent and Watergate burglar E. Howard Hunt.


* CIA employee Donald Deneslya read reports of a CIA agent who had worked at a radio factory in Minsk and returned to the US with a Russian wife and child--that agent could only have been Oswald.


* CIA officer David Phillips provided the Warren Commission with information that Oswald was at the Russian and Cuban embassies in Mexico City, then later admitted that the information he had provided was false.


* CIA accountant James Wilcott said that Oswald "was a regular employee, receiving a full-time salary for agent work for doing CIA operational work."


* Marvin Watson, an adviser to President Lyndon Johnson, said that Johnson had told him that he was convinced that there was a plot in connection with the assassination. Watson said the President felt the CIA had something to do with this plot.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

* Richard Sprague, chief counsel to the U.S. House Select Committee on Assassinations said, "If he had it to do over again, he would begin his investigation of the Kennedy assassination by probing 'Oswald's ties to the Central Intelligence Agency."

* Sen. Richard Schweiker said, "We do know Oswald had intelligence connections. Everywhere you look with him, there're fingerprints of intelligence."
* CIA Agent Donald Norton said, "Oswald was with the CIA, and if he did it then you better believe the whole CIA was involved."
* Former CIA agent Joseph Newbrough said, "Oswald was an agent for the CIA and acting under orders."
* CIA Agent John Garrett Underhill told friends, just before he died, "Oswald is a patsy. They set him up. They've killed the President. I've been listening and hearing things. I couldn't believe they'd get away with it, but they did."
* CIA Agent William Gaudet said, "The man who probably knows as much as anybody alive on all of this... is... I still think is Howard Hunt"----CIA Agent and Watergate burglar E. Howard Hunt.
* CIA employee Donald Deneslya read reports of a CIA agent who had worked at a radio factory in Minsk and returned to the US with a Russian wife and child--that agent could only have been Oswald.
* CIA officer David Phillips provided the Warren Commission with information that Oswald was at the Russian and Cuban embassies in Mexico City, then later admitted that the information he had provided was false.
* CIA accountant James Wilcott said that Oswald "was a regular employee, receiving a full-time salary for agent work for doing CIA operational work."
* Marvin Watson, an adviser to President Lyndon Johnson, said that Johnson had told him that he was convinced that there was a plot in connection with the assassination. Watson said the President felt the CIA had something to do with this plot.
Jim,
By the numbers:
(1) Richard Sprague, HSCA, was not alone in suspecting the CIA of the JFK assassination. That was nothing new. But he had no proof. Jim Garrison, ten years earlier, made the same accusation, and failed to provide proof. Then Mark Lane. It's one of the oldest CT's out there.
(2) Senator Richard Schweiker also suspected CIA connections -- but also had no proof. What the good Senator saw was all the evidence that Oswald was trying like a madman to get hired by the CIA -- trying to prove he had the right stuff by making Fake ID's, and infiltrating the Communists through the FPCC, and so forth. But he failed to get in. The CIA doesn't typically hire high-school dropouts.
(3) Donald Norton turned whistleblower, that is, another opinions-for-money tour speaker. Opinions without proofs. There's money to be made out there on the speaking circuit, and the more sizzle, the more money. Mere opinions and no solid proof.
(4) Same with former CIA agent Joseph Newbrough.
(5) CIA Agent John Garrett Underhill correctly said that Oswald was a patsy -- but he didn't say the CIA did it. He said "they" did it. Yes, they did.
(6) CIA Agent William Gaudet finally identified E. Howard Hunt -- but after all, E. Howard Hunt has already confessed in his famous deathbed confession. But he said: "I was only on the sidelines." The only others in the CIA whom he mentioned were David Morales (who also confessed to his friend, Ruben Carbajal) and Frank Sturgis (who wasn't really a CIA Agent, but he also confessed and even boasted about it). So, there were CIA rogues involved in this Civilian plot among the Radical Right in the USA. But Gaudet himself told us very little, and that's because he knew very little.
(7) As for CIA employee Donald Deneslya, what's the big deal if he read a report about Oswald's period of living in the USSR? That's common knowledge.
(8) As for CIA officer David Atlee Phillips, who can be surprised that the CIA tells lies when they believe their open cases are at stake? It should be expected. But after he retired, David Atlee Phillips wrote a manuscript, The AMLASH Legacy (1988) in which he admitted he was trying to use Oswald to assassinate Fidel Castro, by pushing him through Mexico City. That doesn't make Oswald a paid CIA Agent -- only one more mercenary -- only one more soldier of fortune along with a long list we already have, including Gerry Patrick Hemming, Frank Sturgis, Loran Hall, and so on. We really need to distinguish between a genuine CIA Agent and all these low-level mercenaries at these Cuban Expatriate Paramilitary Training Camps. That's what Jim Garrison and Joan Mellon failed to do.
(9) CIA accountant James Wilcott took a wild guess, based on a rumor that he heard from another CIA Agent who was pulling his chain -- and not actual paperwork. That's an old story.
(10) So many reporters have talked with LBJ and received different stories; from Fidel to anybody. LBJ said the secret was a matter of "National Security" and he meant it. It's so hard to get reporters just to leave. It means nothing.
Regards,
--Paul Trejo
Edited by Paul Trejo
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Proof ? Trejo, you have no proof either. If it's your Walker theory you claim facts. If it's a CIA theory you claim no facts to support it. You don't apply the same standards when viewing your own pet theories as you do when critiquing anothers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Proof ? Trejo, you have no proof either. If it's your Walker theory you claim facts. If it's a CIA theory you claim no facts to support it. You don't apply the same standards when viewing your own pet theories as you do when critiquing anothers.

The point, Paul B., is that the CIA-did-it CTers have had 50 years to prove their case. Fifty years and literally hundreds of researchers -- if not thousands.

My Walker-did-it CT is relatively new and untested -- with only a tiny handful of people who are interested in it at all. It's going to be a shock to the CT community when the Walker-did-it CT is revealed as the actual solution to the JFK assassination, once the JFK Records Act is fulfilled on Thursday 26 October 2017.

Only one more year.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's going to be a shock to the CT community when the Walker-did-it CT is revealed as the actual solution to the JFK assassination, once the JFK Records Act is fulfilled on Thursday 26 October 2017.

Only one more year.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Should we hold our collective breath?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's going to be a shock to the CT community when the Walker-did-it CT is revealed as the actual solution to the JFK assassination, once the JFK Records Act is fulfilled on Thursday 26 October 2017.

Only one more year.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Should we hold our collective breath?

Mark,

Would you mind holding mine for me?

-- Tommy :sun

Link to comment
Share on other sites

(9) CIA accountant James Wilcott took a wild guess, based on a rumor that he heard from another CIA Agent who was pulling his chain -- and not actual paperwork. That's an old story.
Wilcott said there were at least “six or seven” CIA people who, according to your excuse, were “pulling his chain.” It’s hard for me to make jokes about the Kennedy assassination more than half a century later, and yet, according to you, those half dozen or so CIA employees could joke about his murder starting the very next day!
You defend them so loyally, those people who made jokes about the murder of their commander-in-chief immediately after his death. They must have been really funny guys . . . or they must have really hated Kennedy.
Thanks for sharing this bit of CIA humor. It's really funny!
Link to comment
Share on other sites

(9) CIA accountant James Wilcott took a wild guess, based on a rumor that he heard from another CIA Agent who was pulling his chain -- and not actual paperwork. That's an old story.
Wilcott said there were at least “six or seven” CIA people who, according to your excuse, were “pulling his chain.” It’s hard for me to make jokes about the Kennedy assassination more than half a century later, and yet, according to you, those half dozen or so CIA employees could joke about his murder starting the very next day!
You defend them so loyally, those people who made jokes about the murder of their commander-in-chief immediately after his death. They must have been really funny guys . . . or they must have really hated Kennedy.
Thanks for sharing this bit of CIA humor. It's really funny!

Jim,

The weakness in your argument is that people exaggerate. Wilcott did not name these "six or seven" people.

I'm reminded of Dallas Sheriff Deputy Buddy Walthers who said that in Ruth Paine's garage he found "six or seven metal file cabinets full of names of Communists."

But that was naked exaggeration. Nobody else saw these "metal file cabinets," or photographed them, registered them, cataloged them or documented them in any way -- whatsoever.

People exaggerate. And about the JFK assassination, they exaggerate wildly.

If you want me to accept Wilcott's claim, then please show some detail -- but hints and winks don't cut the mustard anymore.

It's been 50 years, man. The CIA-did-it CT is old and tired.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Edited by Paul Trejo
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Proof ? Trejo, you have no proof either. If it's your Walker theory you claim facts. If it's a CIA theory you claim no facts to support it. You don't apply the same standards when viewing your own pet theories as you do when critiquing anothers.

The point, Paul B., is that the CIA-did-it CTers have had 50 years to prove their case. Fifty years and literally hundreds of researchers -- if not thousands.

My Walker-did-it CT is relatively new and untested -- with only a tiny handful of people who are interested in it at all. It's going to be a shock to the CT community when the Walker-did-it CT is revealed as the actual solution to the JFK assassination, once the JFK Records Act is fulfilled on Thursday 26 October 2017.

Only one more year.

Regards,

--Paul Trejo

Paul,

If the Far Right and Walker killed Kennedy, then why has the CIA in particular and US Government in general been hiding the facts for more than 50 years? It makes no sense for the government to spend so much effort protecting a dead general. Or a live one for that matter.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Paul,

If the Far Right and Walker killed Kennedy, then why has the CIA in particular and US Government in general been hiding the facts for more than 50 years? It makes no sense for the government to spend so much effort protecting a dead general. Or a live one for that matter.

Excellent question, Sandy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...