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Trump?


Robert Prudhomme

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IMO we had no good choice.  Our choice was between a tyrant and a crook.  One way or another we will be lucky if we do not end up in a civil war.  I have never felt more strongly that our nation has come under judgment.  This election is evidence of that...

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2 hours ago, Larry Hancock said:

In order to shift this thread back towards a bit more relevance to the JFK assassination, lets consider the foreign relations and military side of the coin again.

Its not uncommon to hear the proposition that the goal of the assassination was to essentially "give the generals the war they wanted" in Vietnam.  You even see quotes attributed to Johnson in that regard.  Personally I've suggested that the war the generals (and admirals) wanted was really with Cuba...that was one they could win and win quickly.  I've also suggested reading some of the great studies that actually explore Johnson's terrible relationship over time with his Joint Chiefs and his rejection of many of the military requests on SE Asia.

But that aside, we do have a pretty clear picture of who was talking to Johnson, who was pushing him on Laos and Vietnam and the influence they had.  Given that history what can we predict about the military course to be followed by our new President. Its pretty clear from the campaign that there is no majority military view pushing him or at least one that he respects - his remarks on the military have been extremely dismissive and critical. However there is one voice that seems to influence him and that voice leads back to the neocon roots of our current conflict across SW Asia. The following article gives us some insight into the officer who might become the key influence on the new President....

http://www.cnn.com/2016/11/11/opinions/trumps-national-security-guru-general-flynn-bergen/index.html

So who really convinced LBJ to fully jump into the muck of SE Asia, was it a host of people, a few, or his own personal political desire to look hard nosed for the 64 election (as the Tonken Gulf incidents might suggest).

GWB swore there would be no nation building in Afghanistan or Iraq after 2001...he got his mind changed.  Trump has sworn against nation building...but will someone or some few of the same ilk change his mind as well?  In some ways Trump is very much like Johnson, does that give us any grip on projecting what Trump will do at yet another military tipping point?

 

IMO the rest of the truth of what happened to JFK lies in areas that have not been fully researched and that some do not wish to discuss -- one is our involvement and inclusion of those who had been Nazis in our intelligence agency and in the space race, and the other is the response of the relatively new, at that time, nation of Israel.  I hope to fill that gap. 

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24 minutes ago, Douglas Caddy said:

we are now entering stage one of a national police state under a Trump Adminstration.

Douglas, I'm sure you're aware (regarding the "alien presence" that you believe relates to the JFK assassination) that now we're not going to learn about the UFOs. Hillary promised to inform us (though of course we know what a xxxx she is).

 

 

Edited by Ron Ecker
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21 hours ago, Douglas Caddy said:

Posted by me on my Facebook page today:

Trump is fighting back against the rising mass demonstrations against his being inaugurated as president in January. The national police union endorsed his candidacy. The FBI helped rig his election. Now these pro-trump law enforcement entities are infiltrating the mass protest demontrations using paid skilled persons who purposely cause violence. This leads to arrests of innocents and ultimately to an attempt to ban all demonstrations. The process is called COINTELPRO and America has seen it before. The difference this time is that we are now entering stage one of a national police state under a Trump Adminstration.

 

safe_image.php?d=AQDA7Px8CyLwgBsp&w=158&
COINTELPRO (a portmanteau derived from COunter INTELligence PROgram) was a series of covert, and at times illegal,[1][2] projects conducted by the United States Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) aimed at surveilling, infiltrating, discrediting and disrupting domestic political organizations.[3]
en.wikipedia.org
 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichstag_Fire_Decree

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2 hours ago, Pamela Brown said:

IMO the rest of the truth of what happened to JFK lies in areas that have not been fully researched and that some do not wish to discuss -- one is our involvement and inclusion of those who had been Nazis in our intelligence agency and in the space race, and the other is the response of the relatively new, at that time, nation of Israel.  I hope to fill that gap. 

I'm quoting you Pamela for a second reason. You recall Bonnie Franklin and her KPFA show Guns and Butter. Two weeks ago she had a guest on - Michele Chussodovsky, a man with controversial ideas that are sometimes interesting - and he said that the most dangerous candidate was Hilary Clinton, because she was the most likely to use nuclear weapons. And of course the statement went unchallenged. I flipped and called the station. They have now lost my support.

i agree completely about the Nazis. Not sure about the Israelis.

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1 hour ago, Robert Prudhomme said:

So damn true, and no one ever believes me when I mention agent provocateurs. Amazing, considering that the practice goes back at least as far as the Roman Empire. It's especially the peaceful protesters that need to understand this, because it only takes a few agents to cause others who are not thinking clearly and are angry to follow them. But we have seen all this before. Recall the 1968 Chicago Convention.

Edited by Paul Brancato
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BTW, referring to this Flynn guy who Larry says is a top military foreign policy advisor for Trump:  he wrote one book.

Know who the co-author of that book was?

Michael Ledeen.  If you don't know who he is, look him up.

 

PS: Only a rightwing zealot like Cheney could say deficits do not matter.  They do matter, and they matter more over time as they accumulate.  Any person who has taken say three semesters of economics knows that.  JFK was a deficit hawk.

 

 

Edited by James DiEugenio
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Michael Ledeen - the names floating around Trump are all the same damn neocons.

Republicans like large deficits, despite their noise, because concern over deficits is used as leverage to defund social programs. And Capitalism runs on debt. What I think will be interesting is whether interest rates on longer term bonds really go up, the way they have since the election. Because the national debt is much harder to finance if we have to pay more interest to the global investors that are buying our debt. It's been my contention that for over 30 years the rates have declined because if they hadn't debt servicing as a percentage of GDP would be too high for even Republicans to get behind because their pet spending programs - corporate welfare - would be adversely impacted. Of course how that long term decline in rates, so convenient to our nation, was enabled I am not expert enough to figure out. But it has happened that way, and without it we would be screwed. For the global elite, buying US debt is a mainstay. As rates came down here, they have collapsed elsewhere. Maybe someone here can help me understand why we have to pay out the rates we do on 2,5,10,30 year debt when alternative investments in other country's bonds yield so much less, or even negative rates. Is the dollar considered more risky long term despite its elevated status relative to other currencies?

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http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/10/politics/mitt-romney-donald-trump-racism/index.html

Also this from Sen. Harry Reid:

Senate minority-leader Reid did not mince his words: "White nationalists, Vladimir Putin and ISIS are celebrating Donald Trump's victory, while innocent, law-abiding Americans are wracked with fear -- especially African Americans, Hispanic Americans, Muslim Americans, LGBT Americans and Asian Americans," Reid continued. "Watching white nationalists celebrate while innocent Americans cry tears of fear does not feel like America."
“If this is going to be a time of healing, we m...ust first put the responsibility for healing where it belongs: at the feet of Donald Trump, a sexual predator who lost the popular vote and fueled his campaign with bigotry and hate. Winning the electoral college does not absolve Trump of the grave sins he committed against millions of Americans. Donald Trump may not possess the capacity to assuage those fears, but he owes it to this nation to try.
“If Trump wants to roll back the tide of hate he unleashed, he has a tremendous amount of work to do and he must begin immediately.”

Edited by Douglas Caddy
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"I don't watch much TV."

I see that a lot.

Here's what you missed by not watching TV:  On June, 16, 2015, Donald Trump turned "the news" into a reality TV show.

If you weren't paying attention to this reality TV show you have no clue how the 2016 election was stolen.

It's akin to the difference between being a close proximity witness to a car wreck -- or reading about it in the papers.

The corporate news media made a ton of money on The Donald J. Trump Show (starring Donald J Trump!) and hoped he'd win so the reality TV show would get a 4 year run.

The election was stolen not only by rigging the amount of exposure Trump got, but by rigging the language itself.

For instance, Trump supporters promote themselves as "liberty proponents."

Liberty proponents?

That's the fascist branding exercise!

Where is there liberty in State ownership of a woman's reproductive organs?

Where is there liberty in "job lock" -- the pre-Obamacare predicament where people had to stay on jobs they hated just to get health insurance.

Where is there liberty in being denied the right to vote?

Where is there liberty in denying someone entrance into the country simply on the basis of religious belief?

Where is there liberty in American citizens getting rounded up with their undocumented parents and deported?

Where is there liberty in drinking lead-filled water because of non-enforcement of environmental regulations?

Where is the liberty of minority males getting continuously hassled under "stop and frisk" laws?

Where is the liberty in needing to work 3 minimum wage jobs just to earn a living?

Where is there liberty in the "indefinite detention clause" in the National Defense Authorization Act -- insisted upon by Republicans -- which allows the US military to seize any individual and detain them indefinitely without telling anyone about it?

Where is there liberty in for-profit prisons?

Where is there liberty in predatory lending practices, which Trump will allow again?

This notion that the fascists are liberty lovers is pure propaganda.

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1 hour ago, Douglas Caddy said:

Also this from Sen. Harry Reid:

Senate minority-leader Reid did not mince his words: "White nationalists, Vladimir Putin and ISIS are celebrating Donald Trump's victory, while innocent, law-abiding Americans are wracked with fear -- especially African Americans, Hispanic Americans, Muslim Americans, LGBT Americans and Asian Americans," Reid continued. "Watching white nationalists celebrate while innocent Americans cry tears of fear does not feel like America."
“If this is going to be a time of healing, we m...ust first put the responsibility for healing where it belongs: at the feet of Donald Trump, a sexual predator who lost the popular vote and fueled his campaign with bigotry and hate. Winning the electoral college does not absolve Trump of the grave sins he committed against millions of Americans. Donald Trump may not possess the capacity to assuage those fears, but he owes it to this nation to try.
“If Trump wants to roll back the tide of hate he unleashed, he has a tremendous amount of work to do and he must begin immediately.”

That a way to help with the healing, Senator Reid, Senate Minority Slimeball.

 

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I've been reading up on the Electoral College and Alexander Hamilton's Federalist 68.

 

It seems to me that it has never been more appropriate than it is to us right now.

 

"Talents for low intrigue, and the little arts of popularity, may alone suffice to elevate a man to the first honors in a single State; but it will require other talents, and a different kind of merit, to establish him in the esteem and confidence of the whole Union, or of so considerable a portion of it as would be necessary to make him a successful candidate for the distinguished office of President of the United States"

 

Steve Thomas

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7 minutes ago, Cliff Varnell said:

There is no healing until a legitimate President is elected in 2020.

That may be true as long as "leaders" like Harry Reid are around.

 

 

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4 hours ago, Pamela Brown said:

IMO we had no good choice.  Our choice was between a tyrant and a crook.  One way or another we will be lucky if we do not end up in a civil war.  I have never felt more strongly that our nation has come under judgment.  This election is evidence of that...

Yeah, we heard that Hillary was a crook.

Over and over and over.

Thing is, all her e-mails have been reviewed by the FBI and the public has heard about them.

All of the DNC e-mails are public.

All of her campaign manager's e-mails are public.

All of her top aide's e-mails have been reviewed by the FBI.

Her Goldman Sachs speeches are public.

The FBI notes on her interview with them is public.

In all of that there is, near as I can tell, only one example of Hillary and Bill being crooked.

Dow Chemical paid them a lot of money for a sit-down with Sec of State Clinton.

Are the Clintons guilty of peddling access?

Yes!

But all politicians peddle access (except for Bernie).

When someone donates big money to a campaign they're buying access.

But buying access isn't the same thing as buying influence.

There's no evidence Hillary Clinton did anything for Dow Chemical.

The mainstream news media also indulges politicians when they trade access for silence when the politicians lie.

Trump lied for a year and a half and "journalists" wouldn't challenge him on TV because they wanted him to keep coming on.

The Republican Party conducted a witch hunt on Hillary Clinton and effectively assassinated her in concert with Julian Assange, Vladimir Putin, James Comey, CNN, MSNBC, and Fox.

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