TWO MARGUERITE OSWALDS -- NEW DETAILS

[Thomas Graves]

59 minutes ago, Michael Walton said:

Tom keep  in  mind SL actually  used his keen analytical  powers to try to convince  me that one  of  the  guys  standing  on  the  steps down in Dealey as Kennedy  got his head blown  off that he actually  was holding  a  pistol.

These  are  the  kind  of keen researchers  we're  dealing  with  here.

Michael,

Well, did he convince you?

(lol)

--  Tommy

[W. Tracy Parnell]

2 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:

2 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:

School records indicate that Oswald attended two schools simultaneously in the fall of 1953. In New York City he attended Public School 44 full-time. And in New Orleans he attended Beauregard Junior High part-time -- he took two classes and passed both.

 

Sandy,

Let's see if we can work this out. What is it about the New Orleans record presented here (CE 1413, p. 817) that makes you think an Oswald was attending school at Beauregard before January, 1954? I assume the number of days?

[Michael Walton]

Tom

Of course. It was old guy with the pistol in the plaza.

[Thomas Graves]

11 hours ago, Michael Walton said:

Tom

Of course. It was old guy with the pistol in the plaza.

Michael,

Actually, there were three of them and they all looked alike.  

They were chosen by the CIA when they were young boys.

To confuse everyone.

Especially JFK assassination students and "researchers".

--  Tommy

Edited March 10, 2017 by Thomas Graves

[Sandy Larsen]

1 hour ago, W. Tracy Parnell said:

Sandy,

Let's see if we can work this out. What is it about the New Orleans record presented here (CE 1413, p. 817) that makes you think an Oswald was attending school at Beauregard before January, 1954? I assume the number of days?

Number of days? No, that is what you and David Josephs argued about.

Oswald took two classes at Beauregard Junior High (New Orleans) in the first semester of the 1953/54 school year. That would be the fall of 1953.

At the same time he was taking classes full-time at Public School 44 (New York City).

That is what the cumulative records show. As I've said numerous times.

 

Edited March 9, 2017 by Sandy Larsen

[W. Tracy Parnell]

Quote

Oswald took two classes at Beauregard Junior High (New Orleans) in the first semester of the 1953/54 school year. That would be the fall of 1953.

Which Oswald, Harvey or Lee?

[Jim Hargrove]

4 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:

Dear readers,

School records indicate that Oswald attended two schools simultaneously in the fall of 1953. In New York City he attended Public School 44 full-time. And in New Orleans he attended Beauregard Junior High part-time -- he took two classes and passed both.

Don't be fooled by Tracy's insistence that he and Greg Parker have explained away this contradiction. The haven't.

Earlier in the thread Tracy Parnell had a feud with David Josephs regarding the number of school days available and the number attended by Oswald. Tracy also linked to Greg Parker's number explanation. All three came up with lots of numbers and calculations. Not surprisingly their final answers differed.

That number-of-days thing has nothing to do with the contradiction I described in my first paragraph. So far the only person who has given an reasonable explanation for the contradiction is Jim Hargrove. His explanation is that there are two TWO different students sharing the same name... one living in New Orleans and one living in New York City.

The reason Tracy and others don't like that explanation is only because they reject that the two Oswald students could have the highly unusual working relationship that they do. Well, okay, I totally get that. So I ask them once again, come up with some other reasonable explanation for the contradiction. A Hypothesis.

 

Thanks for keeping an open mind about the Harvey and Lee evidence, Sandy. The clarity of your thinking and writing is what is ticking people off, because they can’t just tap dance away from the evidence.  It is remarkable how many attacks we have to endure from jokers who say they’re better researchers than we are, and yet they don’t even know enough to debate the evidence.  The exception is Mr. Parnell, who knows quite a bit but, even though he is devoting a huge portion of his life to trying to debunk Harvey and Lee, can’t even make a coherent rebuttal to the conflicting school records.  He claims he doesn't even know which Oswald arrived first at Beauregard.
 

[Jim Hargrove]

On 3/8/2017 at 11:13 AM, Jim Hargrove said:

J. Edgar Hoover's Treachery

A few years after the assassination, Atty. Mark Lane interviewed three Dealey Plaza witnesses to the assassination of JFK and showed how the FBI dramatically altered their statements. These Mark Lane interviews recently were uploaded to YouTube by JFK researcher Gil Jesus.

See the proof of FBI report falsifications right here.

In the wee hours of the night of Nov 22-23, 1963, the FBI secretly took “Oswald's Possessions” from the Dallas Police Department, transported them to Washington, D.C. altered them, and then secretly returned them to Dallas, only to publicly send them to Washington. D.C. a few days later. Among a great many other alterations, a Minox “spy camera” became a Minox “light meter.” FBI agent James Cadigan inadvertently spilled the bean about the secret transfer during his sworn WC testimony, which was altered by the WC.

 

 

By mid-1964, the FBI had a procedure in place to materially alter the testimony of its own agents, even over the objections of Warren Commission attorneys.

 

In his otherwise uninspiring book called Portrait of the Assassin, former U.S. President and Warren Commission member Gerald R. Ford wrote that the first emergency meeting of the Warren Commission was convened to discuss information that Lee Harvey Oswald was a paid informant of the FBI up until the day he was arrested at the Texas Theater. Ford indicated that the information came from Texas Attorney General Waggoner Carr, District Attorney Henry Wade, and counsel to the Attorny General Leon Jaworsky. In Portrait of the Assassin, p. 14, President Ford described the information as follows (President Ford never attempted to deny it):

The Texas officials slipped into the nation's capital with complete anonymity. The met with Lee Rankin and other member of the staff and told what they knew. The information was that Lee Harvey Oswald was actually hired by the FBI; that he was assigned the undercover-agent number 179; that he was on the FBI payroll at two hundred dollars a month starting in September 1962 and that he was still on their payroll the day he was apprehended in the Texas Theatre after having gunned down Officer J.D. Tippit! The officials returned to Dallas after their visit on Friday, January 24. Their presence in Washington was unknown to the press or the public.

It should be noted, again, that Pres. Ford, never denied the claim, although the Warren Commission accepted J. Edgar Hoover's emphatic denial.

Of course, the FBI’s malfeasance is hardly limited to the Kennedy assassination.  Remember the Frederick Whitehurst scandal?  Another example is a 2015 Slate article entitled: Pseudoscience in the Witness Box: The FBI faked an entire field of forensic science.  READ IT HERE!

The Warren Commission relied on the FBI to do its detective work.  Nothing the FBI produced can be trusted. 
 

Bumped for Tracy Parnell.

Tracy, time and time again you say or imply that witnesses interviewed by John Armstrong are being untrue,  but you have not responded to the clear proof above that the FBI utterly buried the truth.

Why do you accuse others of  ly1ing and ignore FBI’s perfidy?

This is the investigation you say you believe in?  Really?  This is the government you say can investigate itself and make us all believe the Lone Nut saga?  Sheesh!  What a fantastic double standard you employ!

[Sandy Larsen]

4 minutes ago, W. Tracy Parnell said:

Which Oswald, Harvey or Lee?

I don't know. All I know is that both school records say the name is Lee Harvey Oswald, and they both give the same birth date, and both say the mother's name is Marguerite. (I'm going by memory as to whether they give the middle name.)

At first glance most people would conclude they are two different boys who happen to have the same name. And the same birth date. And same mother's name. And they'd say something like, "Oh my gosh, what a colossal coincidence!"

[W. Tracy Parnell]

13 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

I don't know. All I know is that both school records say the name is Lee Harvey Oswald, and they both give the same birth date, and both say the mother's name is Marguerite. (I'm going by memory as to whether they give the middle name.)

At first glance most people would conclude they are two different boys who happen to have the same name. And the same birth date. And same mother's name. And they'd say something like, "Oh my gosh, what a colossal coincidence!"

OK, I'll help out. This is from page 77 of H&L:

Page 817 of Warren Commission Volume 22 is a copy of Lee Harvey Oswald's cumulative school record in New Orleans which shows that Harvey attended the 8th
grade at Beauregard Junior High for 89 days in the fall of 1953, with no absences. One "Lee Harvey Oswald" could not possibly have attended schools in both New York City and New Orleans at the same time.

So, this is "Harvey's" school record according to Armstrong. On page 82, Armstrong says:

After arriving in New Orleans [in January, 1954], Lee and Marguerite moved in with her sister, Lillian Murret, at 809 French Street in the Lakeview area.

The question is, why do "Harvey's" school records show an "originally admitted" date of January 14, 1954 when his records (according to the H&L believers) show him starting school in September, 1953?

[Sandy Larsen]

On 3/9/2017 at 2:35 PM, W. Tracy Parnell said:

The question is, why do "Harvey's" school records show an "originally admitted" date of January 14, 1954 when his records (according to the H&L believers) show him starting school in September, 1953?

No Tracy, that is not according to H&L believers. That is according to the school records.

I already asked this question pages ago. I thought you would take the opportunity to say something, but you remained silent IIRC.

I believe that Jim's explanation was that January 14, 1954 was the day that Harvey was admitted full-time. David Josephs said something like the date was added (or altered?) by the WC in order to eliminate the discrepancy.

I don't know what to make of it. What do you think? (And don't pretend the "January 14, 1954" discrepancy somehow erases the other, larger discrepancy of Oswald taking the two classes prior to that date and getting grades for them.)

Edited March 11, 2017 by Sandy Larsen

[W. Tracy Parnell]

1 hour ago, Sandy Larsen said:

I already asked this question pages ago. I thought you would take the opportunity to say something, but you remained silent IIRC.

I believe that Jim's explanation was that January 14, 1954 was the day that Harvey was admitted full-time. David Josephs said something like the date was added (or altered?) by the WC in order to eliminate the discrepancy.

I don't know what to make of it. What do you think? (And don't pretend the "January 14, 1954" discrepancy somehow erases the other, larger discrepancy of Oswald taking the two classes prior to that date and getting grades for them.

He is only taking classes in two different places if you accept their explanation. Note that in order for their theory to work, you have to explain the January 14 "originally admitted" date by alteration or the convenient excuse that "Harvey" was admitted full time then. And then you have to explain how the alteration was done, who was involved and also where are "Lee's" records? To believe Parker you only have to reconsider the reading of the days.

Now, the address for "Harvey" on this document is 809 French. But that is where "Lee" went in January, 1954 by Armstrong's admission. Where did "Harvey" live in September, 1953?

Edited March 9, 2017 by W. Tracy Parnell

[Sandy Larsen]

2 hours ago, W. Tracy Parnell said:

[Oswald] is only taking classes in two different places if you accept [H&L followers'] explanation.

Not true. That problem disappears if one accepts that there are two Oswalds. Because then each school has its own student taking the classes. This problem remains for people like you and Greg.

Note that in order for [H&L followers'] theory to work, you have to explain the January 14 "originally admitted" date by alteration or the convenient excuse that "Harvey" was admitted full time then.

That's true.

And then you have to explain how the alteration was done, who was involved....

Alteration of a date is trivial.

....and also where are "Lee's" records?

Huh? They are in PS44, NYC. This is not a problem for H&L followers.

To believe Parker you only have to reconsider the reading of the days.

Not true. Parker doesn't solve the main problem at all! That being Oswald in two places at once.

Now, the address for "Harvey" on this document is 809 French. But that is where "Lee" went in January, 1954 by Armstrong's admission. Where did "Harvey" live in September, 1953?

I don't know. That is a different issue that I'm not dealing with right now. It is independent of the problem at hand.

Tracy,

You really need to study and understand the Beauregard record. It's clear to me that you're not getting this.

The bottom line is this:

Your and Greg's solution (and I'm not talking about all those number-of-days figures) results in the January 14 date making sense. But it doesn't solve the problem of Oswald attending the two schools at the same time.

In contrast, H&L follower's solution does the opposite. It solves the problem of one Oswald attending both schools simultaneously (because each school get's its own Oswald). But it doesn't result in the January 14 date making sense.

So you guys are left with the more daunting problem, which is one Oswald attending both schools. Jim and John are left with a simple date problem. And guess what... the date problem can be explained away as a simple writing mistake.

[Jim Hargrove]

January 14, 1954 is right around the start date of the second semester of the 1953-54 school year at Beauregard.   The January 14 start date could represent the time LEE Harvey Oswald first entered Beauregard, or the time Lee HARVEY Oswald first became a full time student there, or both.

The identical or similar names would have potential for record-keeping errors by the school, and the complexities of making one student disappear were apparently too difficult for the FBI to finesse for someone who looked at this as closely as John Armstrong. 

Edited March 10, 2017 by Jim Hargrove

[Thomas Graves]

11 hours ago, Thomas Graves said:

Michael,

Actually, there were three of them and they all looked alike.  

They were chosen by the CIA when they were young boys.

To confuse everyone.

Especially JFK assassination students and "researchers".

--  Tommy

edited and bumped