Roger Craig's ID inside 317

[Ron Bulman]

3 hours ago, Bart Kamp said:

Funny that.

I checked Curry's book and could not find it, even though I remembered reading about Craig pointing himself out w that book.

Thanks for the info Ron.

 

From what I know some pix of our mystery guy were taken on the 22nd (inside 317)  and 23rd.

That's perplexing Bart.  The only reason I looked and found what I did was I too "thought I remembered reading about Craig pointing himself out w that book."  I don't have the book.  I was surprised at the price on amazon.  I thought it was a collectors item with limited copies available.  That it only had one run and didn't sell well in part because of poor promotion/publisher and poor reviews (former Police Chief in the city where JFK was killed, where Oswald was murdered in his jail basement).   Was there maybe a edited second version? 

[Ron Bulman]

10 hours ago, Don Jeffries said:

So we can now add Roger Craig- the only Dallas law enforcement officer who was trying to do his job that day- to the list of discredited witnesses? All of whom, of course, just happen to buttress the case for conspiracy? 

Not necessarily.  We don't know the quality of the picture Craig identified himself in.  If it was say a half page in a book in 1969 it well may have been poor.  He may have honestly thought it was from the 22nd of him in the office he said he was in. 

[Guest]

After reading the following from The Girl On The Stairs by Barry Ernest I checked my PDF copy, and it is not in there.

Strange.

"One day I received a package from Craig. Inside was a book written by Dallas Police Chief Jesse Curry. On an attached note, Craig had written, “Recognize the man on pg. 72?” The picture I turned to showed Fritz’s outer office, under heavy guard while Oswald sat inside. Standing in that office was Roger Craig."

[Joe Bauer]

Why would Fritz adamantly state in his WC testimony that Roger Craig never sat in his office while he was interrogating Oswald?

However, he wouldn't rule out Craig being perhaps there...right outside his office and looking in the door or through the window.

Craig's claim about his presence in Fritz's office with Oswald and quoting multiple full sentence questions and statements made by Fritz to Oswald while Craig was there seems too specific and elaborate for something made up IMO .  And those Fritz questions and statements to Oswald did seem to fit Fritz's style of speaking ( "now take it easy son. We're just trying to find out what happened here.")

And quoting Oswald, who was asked about the car Craig saw him get into on Elm street. as saying that "that station wagon belonged to Mrs. Paine, don't try and drag her into this" is so far out of left field...why would Craig even come up with something so easily suggestive of a wild made up story? He risked his credibility with that statement but stuck to it.

Discrediting Roger Craig in any way was a very important part of any cover up because of what Craig had told the media regarding everything from the rifle ID to Fritz's questions to Oswald and Oswald's answers back. Specific points that threw the official story out the window.

Fritz was a case. Hanging on to his position well beyond his prime abilities.

When Fritz shouted "this case is cinched" to the crush of reporters just hours after the JFK assassination, even I as a 12 year old knew that something was very wrong and illogical with this statement.

It seemed to me that even ordinary murders with a suspect never admitting guilt, no one able to identify the suspect as the killer, and with many contradictions in the crime scene and crime lab findings and with the evidence shipped off to Washington, would never elicit such a certain verdict of guilt in such a ridiculously short period of investigation time.

Then when you see Fritz's bizarre, doddering,  slow motion behavior while he walked ahead of Oswald in the DPD building basement seconds before Oswald was whacked by Jack Ruby, it just adds to the suspicion that Will Fritz had some nefarious intentions in this whole affair.

Fritz's over-the-top treatment of Buell Wesley Frazier in his interrogation of him is just another crazy part of Fritz's behavior.

I'll always believe Roger Craig over good ole boy Will Fritz.

Edited April 25, 2018 by Joe Bauer

[Robert Harper]

19 minutes ago, Joe Bauer said:

Discrediting Roger Craig in any way was a very important part of any cover up because of what Craig had told the media regarding everything from the rifle ID to Fritz's questions to Oswald and Oswald's answers back. Specific points that threw the official story out the window

I tend to think this also. Even if the note was shown to be from Craig, maybe he was suggesting it's worth looking into Kunkel?

Edited April 24, 2018 by Robert Harper

[Rick McTague]

1 hour ago, Joe Bauer said:

And quoting Oswald, who was asked about the car Craig saw him get into on Elm street. as saying that "that station wagon belonged to Mrs. Paine, don't try and drag her into this" is so far out of left field...why would Craig even come up with something so easily suggestive of a wild made up story? He risked his credibility with that statement but stuck to it.

 

Joe,

Two things in this interview about Craig's presence in Fritz's office that really solidifies his account for me:

1. At ~25:26 of this video, he says "... went right into Captain Fritz's office" followed by "and we went into Captain Fritz's inner office" - very clearly, Craig was inside the office.

2. At 26:00 Oswald's response was due to Fritz asking Craig about Oswald "Was this the man you saw?" "Yes.  And it was." then Fritz telling Oswald "Now this man saw you leave.". Now how could Fritz say "this man" (Craig) if Craig wasn't even present?

 

Edited April 24, 2018 by Rick McTague
embed video

[Joe Bauer]

1 hour ago, Rick McTague said:

Joe,

Two things in this interview about Craig's presence in Fritz's office that really solidifies his account for me:

1. At ~25:26 of this video, he says "... went right into Captain Fritz's office" followed by "and we went into Captain Fritz's inner office" - very clearly, Craig was inside the office.

2. At 26:00 Oswald's response was due to Fritz asking Craig about Oswald "Was this the man you saw?" "Yes.  And it was." then Fritz telling Oswald "Now this man saw you leave.". Now how could Fritz say "this man" (Craig) if Craig wasn't even present?

 

Rick, exactly.

[Guest]

To me it's this.

Ft. Worth Star Telegram Nov 23rd. Front page of the morning edition.

[Guest]

Possible candidate for Roger Craig, behind Will Fritz.

[Ron Bulman]

6 hours ago, Bart Kamp said:

After reading the following from The Girl On The Stairs by Barry Ernest I checked my PDF copy, and it is not in there.

Strange.

"One day I received a package from Craig. Inside was a book written by Dallas Police Chief Jesse Curry. On an attached note, Craig had written, “Recognize the man on pg. 72?” The picture I turned to showed Fritz’s outer office, under heavy guard while Oswald sat inside. Standing in that office was Roger Craig."

This is from the April - December section of the Girl on the Stairs.  So Ernst is saying he recognized Craig in the book at that time?  I know Ernst was working for/with Weisberg and Penn Jones at the time, did he actually meet Craig at some point?  I also know Craig and family were living in Midlothian somewhere around this time courtesy of Jones xxxistance.  I'm beginning to wonder if there might not be another picture from the 22nd might not still be available elsewhere than the book or just how grainy and small it was in the hard copy of the book. I wonder if Robin Unger might remember.  He posted a few months back.  He's got So many pictures, it's like looking for a needle in a haystack.  

The Girl on the Stairs end notes say (Dallas: American Poster and Printing, 1969) regarding the publisher.  Amazon says Privately Printed; Limited collectors edition (1969).  I guess there was no second edition.  I just ordered it (the Curry book).  So I'll have another historical artifact to pass on someday if nothing else.  Maybe the grandkids will learn to appreciate it. 

[Ron Bulman]

7 hours ago, Bart Kamp said:

To me it's this.

Ft. Worth Star Telegram Nov 23rd. Front page of the morning edition.

Roger Craig, on 11/22/63 in an interview published the next day "Craig told the Star Telegram...Craig came to police headquarters later in the afternoon and identified Oswald.  "There's no doubt in my mind he's the one I saw over there", he said.  Craig viewed the suspect in the office of Detective Capt. Fritz."

He was there that day and saw Oswald in Fritz's office.  Before any chance of influence of his thoughts or statements or his words might be twisted misinterpreted or replaced.  

Edited April 25, 2018 by Ron Bulman

[Guest]

8 hours ago, Ron Bulman said:

This is from the April - December section of the Girl on the Stairs.  So Ernst is saying he recognized Craig in the book at that time?  I know Ernst was working for/with Weisberg and Penn Jones at the time, did he actually meet Craig at some point?  I also know Craig and family were living in Midlothian somewhere around this time courtesy of Jones xxxistance.  I'm beginning to wonder if there might not be another picture from the 22nd might not still be available elsewhere than the book or just how grainy and small it was in the hard copy of the book. I wonder if Robin Unger might remember.  He posted a few months back.  He's got So many pictures, it's like looking for a needle in a haystack.  

The Girl on the Stairs end notes say (Dallas: American Poster and Printing, 1969) regarding the publisher.  Amazon says Privately Printed; Limited collectors edition (1969).  I guess there was no second edition.  I just ordered it (the Curry book).  So I'll have another historical artifact to pass on someday if nothing else.  Maybe the grandkids will learn to appreciate it. 

Barry Ernest did meet w  Craig at Penn Jones' and also drove with him to do a 3 hour interview after which they drove off and got pulled over. This book is a very good read.

[Joe Bauer]

Bart, that posted copy of the 11,23,1963 Fort Worth Star "front page" article regards Craig's 11,22,1963 statements which echo and IMO verify his later claims about his Oswald sighting in front of the TSBD and his ( Craig's ) presence in the DPD building ( obviously homicide division ) later that same day to ID Oswald compel me to shout out a Will Fritz type yell..."Roger Craig's Story Is Cinched!"

That FWS article is "truth shining gold" here Bart. Thank you so much for posting.

Edited April 25, 2018 by Joe Bauer

[Rick McTague]

In the context of this thread, I thought I'd post a link to Roger Craig's unpublished manuscript posted here by Michael Clark.  I bookmarked that link - it contains Mr. Craig's detailed account of 11/22/63 and everything that happened to him after that, including his time in Midlothian.  It's a very good read and makes my blood boil at the treatment this fine young man (and many others who witnessed and spoke out about events contrary to the official story) received at the hands of the powers that be (such as Decker, Fritz, etc.), ultimately taking his life after several attempts at destroying him financially, in his career, mentally, and physically. 

 

 

[Guest]

On 4/25/2018 at 3:49 PM, Joe Bauer said:

Bart, that posted copy of the 11,23,1963 Fort Worth Star "front page" article regards Craig's 11,22,1963 statements which echo and IMO verify his later claims about his Oswald sighting in front of the TSBD and his ( Craig's ) presence in the DPD building ( obviously homicide division ) later that same day to ID Oswald compel me to shout out a Will Fritz type yell..."Roger Craig's Story Is Cinched!"

That FWS article is "truth shining gold" here Bart. Thank you so much for posting.

You are most welcome Joe, and yes it strengthens his side of the story for sure.