“The lights all went out,” and the elevators stopped while JFK was murdered. Shelley and Lovelady were near the bottom of the back staircase, by the electrical panel... and Vickie Adams saw them ... until everyone's story changed...

[Andrej Stancak]

Jim:

sticking with the untenable lift escape theory discredits the whole of John Armstrong's work. Calling off this incredible theory may salvage the rest of John's work. 

 

 

Edited April 26, 2019 by Andrej Stancak

[David Josephs]

On 2/27/2019 at 11:19 PM, Tony Krome said:

Below is the south/east corner of the sixth floor as per the Sixth Floor Museum's description

How do you explain the joists running the opposite way and the different windows?

Look through the arched window and you will see a building across the road. The road is Houston and the arched window faces EAST.

 

When was this taken Tony?  Who's image is it?  Dallas Archive?

Thanks...  if you can find the 3rd 4th and 5th floor interior images....  I've never seen this one... with the completed floor

Would love to know it that same block is out of the 2nd set of windows... the elevator ventilation has to escape out somewhere at the top and the bottom....

Thx

DJ

[Tony Krome]

10 minutes ago, David Josephs said:

When was this taken Tony?  Who's image is it?  Dallas Archive?

Thanks...  if you can find the 3rd 4th and 5th floor interior images....  I've never seen this one... with the completed floor

Would love to know it that same block is out of the 2nd set of windows... the elevator ventilation has to escape out somewhere at the top and the bottom....

Thx

DJ

It's over at the Sixth Floor Museum;

https://emuseum.jfk.org/objects/2895/image-of-the-sixth-floor-of-the-former-book-depository-befor?ctx=9ef5b771-736e-4eee-8c6c-cfcd670e2c86&idx=0

No info other than what's at the link

[David Josephs]

12 minutes ago, Tony Krome said:

It's over at the Sixth Floor Museum;

https://emuseum.jfk.org/objects/2895/image-of-the-sixth-floor-of-the-former-book-depository-befor?ctx=9ef5b771-736e-4eee-8c6c-cfcd670e2c86&idx=0

No info other than what's at the link

Thanks Buddy.. I'm going thru the 84 pages of photos now in fact...

[Jim Hargrove]

2 hours ago, Andrej Stancak said:

Jim:

sticking with the untenable lift escape theory discredits the whole of John Armstrong's work. Calling off this incredible theory may salvage the rest of John's work. 

Still sticking with the opinions, eh?  Why don't you share with us your theory of how the sixth floor assassins came down unseen and unheard.  

And, by the way, this is just a theory, as John has been clear about from the beginning:  From the article:

Passenger elevator

The purpose of this essay is not to "prove" how two men vanished from the 6th floor. My purpose is to show researchers that there is at least one alternative "escape route." By using one plausible "escape route," which I will explain, we may be able to understand the reason why the electricity was briefly turned off, why the 3 men on the 5th floor heard nobody run across the 6th floor to the stairway, why neither the 3 men on the 5th floor (Jarman, Williams, Norman) or the lady office workers on the 4th floor (Styles, Adams) saw anybody running down the stairway or riding the freight elevators, and why Officer Baker and Roy Truly saw nobody on the freight elevators or stairway. What follows is an alternate, and very discreet and secret way by which to go from the 6th floor to the 1st floor. I BELIEVE THE 2 MEN ON THE 6TH FLOOR USED THE PASSENGER ELEVATOR.

[Jim Hargrove]

 

Three Depository employees shown in the picture taken by Dillard
were on the fifth floor of the building when the shots were fired:
James Jarman, Jr., age 34, a wrapper in the shipping department;
Bonnie Ray Williams, age 20, a warehouseman temporarily assigned
to laying a plywood floor on the sixth floor and Harold Norman, age
26, an "order filler."

--Warren Commission Report, p. 68 (emphasis added)

Roy Truly would have been in charge of the flooring work.  Astounding coincidence, eh?

Edited April 26, 2019 by Jim Hargrove

[Andrej Stancak]

17 minutes ago, Jim Hargrove said:

Still sticking with the opinions, eh?  Why don't you share with us your theory of how the sixth floor assassins came down unseen and unheard.  

And, by the way, this is just a theory, as John has been clear about from the beginning:  From the article:

Passenger elevator

The purpose of this essay is not to "prove" how two men vanished from the 6th floor. My purpose is to show researchers that there is at least one alternative "escape route." By using one plausible "escape route," which I will explain, we may be able to understand the reason why the electricity was briefly turned off, why the 3 men on the 5th floor heard nobody run across the 6th floor to the stairway, why neither the 3 men on the 5th floor (Jarman, Williams, Norman) or the lady office workers on the 4th floor (Styles, Adams) saw anybody running down the stairway or riding the freight elevators, and why Officer Baker and Roy Truly saw nobody on the freight elevators or stairway. What follows is an alternate, and very discreet and secret way by which to go from the 6th floor to the 1st floor. I BELIEVE THE 2 MEN ON THE 6TH FLOOR USED THE PASSENGER ELEVATOR.

Jim:

I also take John's article as a theory, and I take it seriously and believe John has also meant it seriously. If it is a serious theory of how assassins escaped from the sixth floor, it needs to be examined and checked from every angle to see if it holds or not. This is what we are doing in this thread because you presented and defended this theory on John's behalf. My analysis, and I spent time both reading John's article and testing various aspects of his theory, says that this theory is not plausible. I gave you my reasons. 

As far as my explanation of the escape is concerned, I do not have any at the moment but will present it here once I have any. 

[David Josephs]

8 minutes ago, Jim Hargrove said:

 

Three Depository employees shown in the picture taken by Dillard
were on the fifth floor of the building when the shots were fired:
James Jarman, Jr., age 34, a wrapper in the shipping department;
Bonnie Ray Williams, age 20, a warehouseman temporarily assigned
to laying a plywood floor on the sixth floor and Harold Norman, age
26, an "order filler."

--Warren Commission Report, p. 68 (emphasis added)

Roy Truly would have been in charge of the flooring work.  Astounding coincidence, eh?

 

 

Photographer:Eugene George

Date:01/06/1983

[Jim Hargrove]

Correction to the above: It was Bill Shelley who was in direct charge of the flooring work on the sixth floor.

Thanks, DJ, for the date and photographer info.

[Tony Krome]

On 4/22/2019 at 10:28 PM, Jim Hargrove said:

Let’s all make it absolutely clear that this shirt—call it brown or red or whatever--was NOT the arrest shirt!  Any findings that fibers from the arrest shirt were on the Magic Rifle® is proof of yet more treachery from the FBI.

Marina seems sure the arrest shirt was the one he wore to work that morning;

Mr. RANKIN. Do you recall whether or not he was wearing Exhibit-the shirt that I point to now, the morning of the 22d of November-- Exhibit 150?
Mrs. OSWALD. Yes, it was a dark shirt.
Mr. RANKIN. You think that was the one?
Mrs. OSWALD. Yes.

[Jim Hargrove]

Tony,

Sure, but even the HSCA recognized Marina's difficult position in front of the WC juggernaut when it wrote that her "testimony has all the weight of a handful of chicken feathers...."  This was in the context of the Walker shooting, but it strikes me as quite an admission from the government.

[Tony Krome]

16 minutes ago, Jim Hargrove said:

Tony,

Sure, but even the HSCA recognized Marina's difficult position in front of the WC juggernaut when it wrote that her "testimony has all the weight of a handful of chicken feathers...."  This was in the context of the Walker shooting, but it strikes me as quite an admission from the government.

If Marina's recollection was incorrect, was Bledsoe's ID of the same shirt was incorrect too?

[Jim Hargrove]

To me, both shirts look brown.  Mrs. Bledsoe said "Oswald" wore a brown shirt on the bus.

[Sandy Larsen]

43 minutes ago, Jim Hargrove said:

To me, both shirts look brown.  Mrs. Bledsoe said "Oswald" wore a brown shirt on the bus.

 

Yeah, I was about to say that from memory the two shirts look similar. (And brown, not red. )

 

[Tony Krome]

52 minutes ago, Jim Hargrove said:

To me, both shirts look brown.  Mrs. Bledsoe said "Oswald" wore a brown shirt on the bus.

Colour aside, Marina and Bledsoe still testify to the same shirt CE150

Bledsoe even describes the hole from the arrest scuffle;

Mr. BALL - In order to convince me that you did see it before you've got to tell me what there is about it that is the same, you see. Now, you try to convince me, or tell me why it is that you believe that this is the shirt that Oswald had on when you saw him on the bus? 
Mrs. BLEDSOE - Well, I would say it was. That hole--- 
Mr. BALL - Mostly the hole in the right sleeve? 
Mrs. BLEDSOE - Yes. 

In order to believe Oswald changed shirts before his arrest, you have to dismiss both Marina's and Bledsoe's account. 

Going further, if Bledsoe was talked into describing the Oswald bus shirt by the actions of the Secret Service who displayed the shirt to her at her home, it calls into question the whole convenient bus sighting, which ridiculously returns the assassin to the scene of the crime.

Mr. BALL - Had you ever seen the shirt before that? 
Mrs. BLEDSOE - Well--- 
Mr. BALL - Have you? 
Mrs. BLEDSOE - No; he had it on, though.

Edited May 2, 2019 by Tony Krome