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Temple Logic?

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If Chaney said "struck in the face", and he was on JFK's right side, then would one think he means the right side of JFK's face?  JFK was not turned back far to his right looking behind him.  This would imply, logically I think, a shot from the right front.

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21 minutes ago, Ron Bulman said:

This would imply, logically I think, a shot from the right front.

To me, when he says "face", he's saying the shot came from in front of the President.

To work out the direction of where that shot came from, look at the previous gif clip to see how Kennedy is looking down and left.

Refer to the Parkland right rear occipital sketches for the exit wound.

Now, lift up your imaginary rifle, and circle around the front of the limo to find your ballpark trajectory

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Oh No!!

Say it isn't so!!

Not another one or two!!

1.  A shot to the left temple

2.  A  shot to the right temple

3.  A shot to the upper right forehead (frontal bone rather than temporal bone)

4.  A shot from the front which makes a massive occipital wound as seen by Parkland doctors

5.  A shot from the Sniper's Nest blowing out the top and right side of the skull

6.  A shot to the base of the rear skull- an entrance wound

7.  A shot to the top / rear of the skull about midway center of the school .  There is a picture of this wound or is it a scab or bloodspot.

Which ones are real and which ones are imaginary in that alternate reality we call Dealey Plaza.

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21 hours ago, Tony Krome said:

To me, when he says "face", he's saying the shot came from in front of the President.

To work out the direction of where that shot came from, look at the previous gif clip to see how Kennedy is looking down and left.

Refer to the Parkland right rear occipital sketches for the exit wound.

Now, lift up your imaginary rifle, and circle around the front of the limo to find your ballpark trajectory

I've been thinking about my reading of Doug Horne's expert opinion, affirmed as such previously in this thread by Micah, that there was an entrance in both the right temple hairline and the forehead hair line above the right eye toward the center of the head (I think on the last part).  There is evidence to support such.

First, these would have to have been precise shots by experts (trained, experienced, practiced snipers), coordinated in timing by the same radio command "GO" source.

Second, in relation to back and to the left, I don't think they would have come from the same location.  By the time of the head shot(s?) JFK is already leaning Slightly to the left  and his head is tilting slightly towards Jackie.  I've stood behind the corner of the picket fence on the grassy knoll several times and looked at the second x.  Not to trivialize the matter but as a deer hunter in my youth, fish in a bowl.  What, thirty yards if that?  A shot from there would certainly account for the further to the left part.  Footprints in the mud, cigarette butts, Lee Bowers testimony, smoke, smell of gunpowder, people diving to the ground, shots coming shots over their heads and shoulders, people rushing up the knoll, 51 people saying shots from there.  Back and to the Left.  There was a shot from there.

But not so much the back part from the same location IMHO.  That's perplexing.  The forehead shot would have had to come from way further up the fence line, close to the railroad overpass/triple underpass itself.  I still can't fathom a head shot from the south knoll complementing back and to the left.  It would have meant back and to the right.

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1 hour ago, Ron Bulman said:

I still can't fathom a head shot from the south knoll complementing back and to the left.

Watch that clip again I posted at the very start of this thread. This time, keep in mind that Kennedy has already slumped down and to the left, towards Jackie. He's actually supported by Jackie just prior to the head shot, which prevents him from falling further left as he deals with the shock of a strike to the throat.

The key here is that, unsupported, he would have fallen to the left, just as he did after Jackie let go.

I see the impact of the head shot moving his head back, BUT, as he went back, you have to keep in mind that his right shoulder was already slightly raised and his head was leaning left, so it gave the illusion of being forced left.

Don't take my word for it, try it yourself;

Sit on your couch, lean forward and left with your right shoulder raised.

The outcome for me was back then to the left.

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Doug Horne himself suggested the "back and to the left" was possibly an artifact of frame removal in Zapruder.

I'm also reminded of Roy Kellerman's testimony about a "flurry of shells" coming into the limo, and Dino Brugioni's description of a huge white cloud shooting straight up in the air at the time of impact.  Is this an indication of a number of bullets hitting at the same general instance?  I think Doug Horne posits three hits to the head.

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Snipers call this a "command fire" tactic.

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• 5 months later...

From Livingstone's High Treason 2, p. 229:

I also asked him if he had seen any damage in the left temple area. In Dallas, the death certificate said that the President had died "from a gunshot wound to the left temple." Jenkins said that neither he nor anyone else at the autopsy to the best of his knowledge had seen any such wound.

"I might have gone along with right temple," he said. I agree with that because just above the right ear there was some discoloration of the skull cavity with the bone area being gray and there was some speculation that it might be lead.

"There might have been an entry wound there?"

"Yes. And the opening and the way the bone was damaged behind the head would definitely been a type of exit wound. The reason I have said this is I saw this before in other wounds and it was very striking

[.... p.246]

"In the temporal area, right in front of the ear, as I told you before, there was a flap of skin there that was hanging on and there was a discussion about some markings on the bone in that area."

"For a possible bullet going in or out?"

"Yes."

"This would be the flap that we see in the photo?"

"Yes."

“We’re talking about the Back-of-the-Head picture with the flap sticking straight out of the side of the head by the ear?”

“Yes. The flap was right above and forward of the ear.”

From Livingstone's Killing The Truth:

Jenkins also stated that there was some gray discoloration of the skull and skin in the right temple area that possibly could have been caused by lead. (a: May 24, 1991)

Edited by Micah Mileto
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Witnesses who made statements indicating a small wound in the right temple: 1. George Burkley (early statements summarized by Malcolm Kilduff and Tony Krome), 2. Tom Robinson, 3. Dennis David, 4. James Curtis Jenkins, 5. Joe O'Donnel, 6. Quentin Schwinn

Left temple: 1. Dr. Robert McClelland (in his hospital report and his WC testimony in which he reaffirms the accuracy of his report, later recanted and blamed the confusion on Dr. Marion Jenkins), 2. Father Oscar Huber, 3. Richard Dudman of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch (without naming his source), 4. Dr. Marion Jenkins, 5. Dr. W. David Stewart (relays information told to him in private conversations with other Parkland colleagues), 6. Dr. Ronald Jones, Dr. Lito Porto (as relayed from Dr. Jones), 7. Hugh Huggins.

Edited by Micah Mileto
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"Father Huber

Father Oscar L Huber was one of the priests that gave the last rites to the already dead JFK . Part of the ceremony included tracing a cross on the President's forehead using holy oil. Obviously, Father Huber would have been in an excellent position to look at JFK's head wounds. Father Huber was quoted in the press the weekend that the President died saying that he had seen a terrible wound over the President's left eye .

"

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6 minutes ago, Ray Mitcham said:

"Father Huber

Father Oscar L Huber was one of the priests that gave the last rites to the already dead JFK . Part of the ceremony included tracing a cross on the President's forehead using holy oil. Obviously, Father Huber would have been in an excellent position to look at JFK's head wounds. Father Huber was quoted in the press the weekend that the President died saying that he had seen a terrible wound over the President's left eye .

"

This could be a reference to the large head wound. Huber didn't describe the "terrible wound" as being small.

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13 hours ago, Micah Mileto said:

This could be a reference to the large head wound. Huber didn't describe the "terrible wound" as being small.

According to a Mrs Martin who spoke at length to Father Hubert he first said that it was a bullet hole until he heard that the shots came from behind JFK.

Edited by Ray Mitcham
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4 hours ago, Ray Mitcham said:

According to a Mrs Martin who spoke at length to Father Hubert he first said that it was a bullet hole until he heard that the shots came from behind JFK.

Thanks for the link. Sounds ok enough. Added it to the list.

Edited by Micah Mileto
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On 4/18/2019 at 9:52 PM, Micah Mileto said:

Tom Robinson said that he was under the impression that the right temple wound represented an exit for a fragment.

PURDY: Did you notice anything else unusual about the body which may not have been artificially caused, that is caused by something other than the autopsy?
ROBINSON: Probably, a little mark at the temples in the hairline. As I recall, it was so small it could be hidden by the hair. It didn't have to be covered with make-up. I thought it probably a piece of bone or a piece of the bullet that caused it.
PURDY: In other words, there was a little wound.
ROBINSON: Yes.
PURDY: Approximately where, which side of the forehead or part of the head was it on?
ROBINSON: I believe it was on the right side.
PURDY: On his right side?
ROBINSON: That's an anatomical right, yes.
PURDY: You say it was in the forehead region up near the hairline?
ROBINSON: Yes.
PURDY: Would you say it was closer to the top of the hair?
ROBINSON: Somewhere around the temples.
PURDY: Approximately what size?
ROBINSON: Very small, about a quarter of an inch.
PURDY: Quarter of an inch is all the damage. Had it been closed up by the doctors?
ROBINSON: No, he didn't have to close it. If anything, I just would have probably put a little wax in it.

[...]

PURDY: Were there any other wounds on the head other than the little one in the right temple area, and the big one in the back?

ROBINSON: That's all.

[...]

Purdy: Did you get a good look at that wound on the right temple area?

Robinson: Oh yes, I worked right over for some time.

Purdy: What did you feel caused that wound.

Robinson: I think either a piece of bone or a piece of the bullet. Or a very small piece of shrapnel.

Conzelman: Did it pierce the entire scull, could you see from the inside that it was evident from the inside scull as well as outside?

Robinson: The inside of the scull was badly smashed, it could have well been a piece of bone that passed through there or

[...]

Purdy: Do you feel that any significant portion of the bullet after it hit the head, exited from the head, not just being picked up by the doctors? Do you feel that possibly exited, where could some if exited from the head? If any. You mentioned one possibly was that right temple.

Robinson: Yes, that did go through my mind. Well they had the little pieces, They picked them out.

Purdy: So you feel that's the only place that the significant size of the bullet could have exited.

Robinson: It was no bullet, it was a fragment or a piece of the bone. Purdy: You would say that there is no other part of the head where that bullet would exited or a part of the bullet? Were there other little holes anywhere?

Robinson: No.

[...]

Purdy: And your feeling about the forehead, you felt then and you feel now that was caused by what?

Robinson: A piece of bone or metal exiting.

A quarter of an inch.  Like an entrance wound.  No questioning about why the thought about a bone or metal exit.... noting in the "x-ray's"?

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16 hours ago, Ron Bulman said:

A quarter of an inch.  Like an entrance wound.  No questioning about why the thought about a bone or metal exit.... noting in the "x-ray's"?

It would seem to me that no matter how the open-cranium photographs are situated, they show two small oval holes in the right temporal scalp.

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