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The inevitable end result of our last 56 years


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6 hours ago, Dennis Berube said:

Sandy Larsen, I do not consider any list of top Presidents with Truman at #6 to be credible, well informed, or expert in any way, not to mention the very generous ratings for Teddy, Jefferson, Eisenhower and Reagan.

How about Reagan, LBJ and Eisenhower?

Read this for Obama on National Security and foreign policy.  He was Mr. Drone without due process.https://consortiumnews.com/2020/12/07/barack-obama-the-death-of-idealism/

 

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7 hours ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

 

That is what Dennis Berube thinks of Obama's presidency. Let's see how it compares to a poll taken of 170 scholar members of the American Political Science Association in 2018. Here is the ranking according to them (click on the link for the complete list of presidents):

  1. Lincoln
  2. Washington
  3. F.D. Roosevelt
  4. T. Roosevelt
  5. Jefferson
  6. Truman
  7. Eisenhower
  8. Obama
  9. Reagan
  10. L.B. Johnson

            o
            o
            o
            o
            o

     44. Trump

 

Surprise!

It's nice to see that well informed experts appreciate the significance of Obama's accomplishments in 1) saving the economy and 2) adding 20+ million to those with medical insurance.

 

You're a few months too late now Andre J.  And in this case JFK didn't serve long enough to rate.

 

IMO Sandy, I wouldn't argue about the top 3 in any order. Teddy and LBJ both  were high in domestic policy with Teddy as a trust buster and the President most identified with the Progressive movement, and LBJ with Civil Rights and the Great society, but both were warmongers.  And Teddy get more of a pass because he's more in the past.

I remember when I was a Senior in Hhigh School looking at the top 10 great Presidents by historians and they rewarded imperialism and expansionism much more by including Jackson and Polk. We'll never know if FDR would have dropped the atomic bomb. He'll always be criticized for the Japanese internment, but Lincoln was very oppressive as well, and they were times of great crisis. But  I'll never forgive Truman for letting the Cold war happen and Eisenhower for passively going along with it.

Reagan will always  get credit for the eventual  fall of the Iron Curtain but the truth is, it fell in his lap with a new generation of Soviet leaders. Any president at that time, if he had any pulse and instinct, and wasn't a hardcore right wing dialogue, could have brought that about.

But since this was brought on  by evaluating Obama's performance.To capsulize my opinion , Obama does deserves credit for getting us out of the Great Recession, but he was in a position to extract more reforms including reinstating Glass Stiegall. The economic historical contingent of the Historians seem to buy the Wall Street excuse that if Obama had clamped down more on the banks that the Great Recession would have turned into a debacle greater than the Great Depression. I don't buy it, but I do think the recovery would have been a little slower, but more honest. To hear Wall Street tell it, they were bitchin' and moaning about how slow the recovery was for the last 6 years of Obama but they were bitching and laughing all the way to the bank. Of course, however much we can Monday morning quarterback Obama, and rush to judgment, well never really know.

Internationally Obama did the Democrat dance trying to not look soft on wars the Republican President started and expanding the use of clones to minimize American deaths.I don't think it's anything more mysterious than that. Any escalation Obama would do would have been done in spades by a Republican President, and probably a few more incidents.

The Obama administration has gained historically in hindsight and Clinton has lost.

Edited by Kirk Gallaway
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9 minutes ago, Andrej Stancak said:

Sorry, why do we need a thread on US election on this Forum if none of the posts mention JFK? 

 

We don't NEED this thread... we LIKE it. It's like the office water cooler where we can hang out and shoot the breeze. And so far the boss (admin) hasn't complained.

It's only one thread which disinterested members can choose to ignore.

 

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I agree with Sandy.  With the way this year has gone, one needs any kind of relief valve at their disposal.  This thread has been great for exactly that reason.  I would thank the moderators for allowing such a free flowing and admittedly non compliant thread to continue a they have.  Let's hope that we do not need it at some point in the future.  Hopefully it can find a home at another place on one of the other forums even then.

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3 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

The good news is that Rob Wheeler stopped posting fake news about Hunter Biden's laptop after November 3rd.

The bad news is that Wheeler has been posting fake news about alleged election fraud for the past month.

 

Hahaha yeah that's true. The guy who came up with the laptop I think disappeared or something so that ought to get the rabbits burrowing.

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1 hour ago, Andrej Stancak said:

Sorry, why do we need a thread on US election on this Forum if none of the posts mention JFK? 

Hijacker! 😃

(Andrej: "One day it'll just disappear..."  Until 2024.)

Edited by David Andrews
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1 hour ago, Andrej Stancak said:

Sorry, why do we need a thread on US election on this Forum if none of the posts mention JFK? 

  • Coup against Trump > Joe Biden > Hunter Biden > Burisma Board > Cofer Black > Ted Shackley > JFK Assassination
  • Coup against Trump > Stefan Halper > Ray Cline's Daughter > Ray Cline > JFK Assassination
  • Coup against Trump > Bob Mueller > Bob Mueller's Mom > Bob Mueller's Mom's Cousin Richard Bissell > JFK Assassination
  • Coup against Trump > Steele Dossier > Miss Universe Pageant > Sberbank > Troika Laundromat > Peter Derby > Peter Deryabin > JFK Assassination
  • Coup against Trump > Joe Biden > Hunter Biden > Burisma Board > Cofer Black > Taliban Aug. 2001 > Christina Rocca Bagley > Pete Bagley > JFK Assassination

 

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This guy, Peter Wehner, is my favorite Republican intellectual.  Worth reading.

His 2016 essay in the NYT about the "theology of Donald Trump" is probably the best description of Trump's worldview that I've read anywhere.

Here, he nails it again.

Trump’s Most Malicious Legacy

The outgoing president leaves behind a tribalistic, distrustful, and sometimes delusional political culture.

Trump's Most Malicious Legacy - The Atlantic

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4 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

This guy, Peter Wehner, is my favorite Republican intellectual.  Worth reading.

His 2016 essay in the NYT about the "theology of Donald Trump" is probably the best description of Trump's worldview that I've read anywhere.

Here, he nails it again.

Trump’s Most Malicious Legacy

The outgoing president leaves behind a tribalistic, distrustful, and sometimes delusional political culture.

Trump's Most Malicious Legacy - The Atlantic

This is a great article, by it seems a level headed, intelligent, respected Republican.  The ideal of speaking civilly to each other is commendable. But I don't see a large part of his party coming to the table. 

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Because many members here so have so often posted music links and especially Bob Dylan's on this thread ... 

I'm suprised no one has mentioned Bob Dylan selling the rights to his entire 600 song portfolio ( including his last JFK conspiracy one ) to a large conglomerate group.

I have read estimates as high as $300 million for it all.

Didn't Michael Jackson pay 1 billion for the Beatle's portfolio? Out bidding Paul McCartney himself?

Bob Dylan, you should have been paid 1 billion for your entire life's work as well ... imo.

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33 minutes ago, Joe Bauer said:

Because many members here so have so often posted music links and especially Bob Dylan's on this thread ... 

I'm suprised no one has mentioned Bob Dylan selling the rights to his entire 600 song portfolio ( including his last JFK conspiracy one ) to a large conglomerate group.

I have read estimates as high as $300 million for it all.

Didn't Michael Jackson pay 1 billion for the Beatle's portfolio? Out bidding Paul McCartney himself?

Bob Dylan, you should have been paid 1 billion for your entire life's work as well ... imo.

 

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