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The inevitable end result of our last 56 years


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17 minutes ago, Matt Allison said:

Yep.  And the Orange Psychopath is already frantically trying to deny and distort the facts in this damning story, as he has done in the cases of all of his many crimes and scandals through the years.

Mark Meadows has a bizarre response when Trump calls the story about his early COVID diagnosis 'fake news'

https://www.rawstory.com/mark-meadows-trump/

 

 

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Trump may be an orange-headed psychopath.

He also has about 1/10,000th the influence that the globalist security state has to stage events, control US foreign-military policy and manipulate the M$M. 

LBJ-Nixon prosecuted counterproductive wars that cost millions of lives and trillions of dollars.

Bush jr.-Obama prosecuted counterproductive wars that cost millions of lives and cost trillions of dollars. 

Trump? Also monstrous in that he droned a couple thousand to death in lost causes. But in comparison to LBJ-Nixon-Bush jr-Obama?  

Are people obsessed with Trump...as they have been trained by the M$M to be obsessed with Trump? 

Oddity time: Why did Trump slap tariffs on Chinese imports?

Why was Obama-Clinton so cozy with Beijing...but not Trump? 

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Monday:Ben: Surely, you are aware when it comes to clandestine, subversive resources, and control over M$M narratives, the national-security-state has 10,000 times the power of the Trump crowd? 
 
Wednesday: BenAs I say, the Deep State has about 10,000 times the resources of the Trumpers to control M$M narratives and work behind the scenes to create PR stunts, such as a 1/6.
 
Yesterday: Ben: do not trust the Trumpers...or the Deep State. But the Deep State has 10,000 the resources, that the Trumpers did or do.
 
And Now: Ben He also has about 1/10,000th the influence that the globalist security state has to stage events, control US foreign-military policy and manipulate the M$M. 
 
 
Ben I see your "a figures" guy. You've now written this 10,000 figure 4 times over the last 4 days. Are you aware how repetitive your writing is?"   Have you ever thought of clicking on your picture and reading the journal of what you wrote the day before?    
 
I don't mean to just isolate your statement here Ben, because I do think it typifies what a lot people think here, and there's no doubt who has the funds. I don't mean to be so revolutionary but over and over I find other people backing into statements that I think of as long held mythology but doesn't apply at all to the current situation..
 
Ben: And control over M$M narratives, the national-security-state has 10,000 times the power of the Trump crowd?  
 
10,000??   You sure it's not 9,9996? Ok, they can  effect MSM narratives but that's about it.And so what? Do people really pay much attention to the "msm narrative" anymore? Fewer and fewer people get their news from the msm."Spooky " sells big among a few here, but I'm more into concrete events and whose doing the damage here?.
 
Can the NSS, in 2021 make people gather at Dealey Plaza waiting for JFK or JFK jr to show up? 
 
 
I'll turn it around on you Ben, do you really think the NSS is capable of designing a  PSYOP  to enslave a mass of people to make them as absolutely debilitatingly wacko as the present Trump constituency?
 
-Does the NSS really have the influence, or the imagination to make millions of people believe that Democrats are a group of pedophiles and baby eaters operating out of a pizzery in New York City?
 
-Could the NSS right now perpetuate a group like Q Anon? Have you taken any stock in the world you're currently living? This is a recurring problem that there are people here that are so focused on fears from things that happened long  ago that they swear are still happening now, that they can't see what's currently going on all around them. Certainly no one can accuse you of being a current events sleuth Ben.Whose doing the damage here?
 
 
-Do you really think the NSS, has the ability to influence numbers of people on near the scale of the right wing groups that are popping up on the Internet almost daily?
 
-Again, Whose doing the damage here?? Does the NSS have the imagination to make a third of the American electorate believe that the 2020 election was a hoax?
 
-Lastly if the NSS wanted to undermine a foreign enemy. Do you think they could actually pull off installing a puppet who eventually when a pandemic came, first propagated that the pandemic was a hoax, discouraged people from undertaking the most basic precautions, ignoring scientists, resulting in the deaths of 100's of 1000s of people, and further destabilizing the country he leads?  He ends up contracting it himself, and spreading it to a number of people, and yet his dictatorial grip is still powerful and he controls one of the 2 major American parties? Could the present day NSS have pulled off anything near  this? Of course not, show me any thing near approximating this anywhere!
 
Does the NSS really effect millions of common people or do they just glom on to writers who already share their pro defense point of view and offer talking points to use them for articles that are really read by a fewer and fewer and fewer number of people who are regarded as "academics" or the "intelligentsia."! Are they really the "influencers" they were 60 years ago? I know there's more media influence than just that. But how effective is it really? I think most of us can agree that most of the CIA is not pro Trump, so maybe we can agree, they're not behind that movement. But you don't think they would if they could? The truth is they can't.
 
Besides, When you factor everything in, you can argue that in reaction to the perceived manipulation  of the msm message , there has emerged a counter force of contrarianism. It ranges from a healthy  questioning of norms, to adolescent stupidity, and groups of people who won't believe anything they say, even with stuff that reasonable people don't dispute.
I'm more into the present day reality than speculations out of fears.Ben I haven't seen that you have a clue of what's really going on in the states. As you say Ben, " Case Closed."
Edited by Kirk Gallaway
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20 minutes ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Trump may be an orange-headed psychopath.

He also has about 1/10,000th the influence that the globalist security state has to stage events, control US foreign-military policy and manipulate the M$M. 

LBJ-Nixon prosecuted counterproductive wars that cost millions of lives and trillions of dollars.

Bush jr.-Obama prosecuted counterproductive wars that cost millions of lives and cost trillions of dollars. 

Trump? Also monstrous in that he droned a couple thousand to death in lost causes. But in comparison to LBJ-Nixon-Bush jr-Obama?  

Are people obsessed with Trump...as they have been trained by the M$M to be obsessed with Trump? 

Oddity time: Why did Trump slap tariffs on Chinese imports?

Why was Obama-Clinton so cozy with Beijing...but not Trump? 

Ben - let’s separate something out. Trump is the worst kind of xxxx, braggart, sociopath, racist. Can we agree? I hope so. 
Bush the 2nd was devastating. We are still suffering from his War. Obama in the same breath? Come on. Trump - way better on that level. National Security State? Not monolithic - factional. Black and white comparisons are oversimplifications. All presidents vetted? Yeah. The national security state exists to serve Empire, then and now. China policy, foreign policy in general barely changes between administrations. But there are vast differences between the two parties, especially on domestic issues. And one of those parties is ruled by Orange headed psychopath. In a heartbeat I prefer the other party, knowing full well that they are corrupted by money and power. You? The Supreme Court would be a better one had Obama gotten to pick another justice. Agree? Can you distinguish between levels of corruption, factions of empire? False equivalencies, backed up by elements of truth that ultimately do not prove your point. In my opinion. 

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1 hour ago, Paul Brancato said:

Ben - let’s separate something out. Trump is the worst kind of xxxx, braggart, sociopath, racist. Can we agree? I hope so. 
Bush the 2nd was devastating. We are still suffering from his War. Obama in the same breath? Come on. Trump - way better on that level. National Security State? Not monolithic - factional. Black and white comparisons are oversimplifications. All presidents vetted? Yeah. The national security state exists to serve Empire, then and now. China policy, foreign policy in general barely changes between administrations. But there are vast differences between the two parties, especially on domestic issues. And one of those parties is ruled by Orange headed psychopath. In a heartbeat I prefer the other party, knowing full well that they are corrupted by money and power. You? The Supreme Court would be a better one had Obama gotten to pick another justice. Agree? Can you distinguish between levels of corruption, factions of empire? False equivalencies, backed up by elements of truth that ultimately do not prove your point. In my opinion. 

Paul-

Thank you for your points of view, and I respect them.

No, we do not agree on much, but you are correct there are some nuances in both your views and mine. 

Sure, the Donks have been different on a few domestic policy issues from the 'Phants...certainly for public consumption. In real life? Maybe a few issues, but both parties have been evolving. 

It pains me to say it, but Trump's economic policies were actually better for the American employee class than the Donks. The Donks are totally in bed with globalism.

But open borders for trade and immigration---what does that mean for America's employee class? The 'Phants used to be the globalists, but with the apparition of Trump, they have actually moved to a better position (IMHO). 

Remember, the most ardent immigrationists in US history were...the slavers. Upper classes always want more immigration, and usually for the worst reasons. 

Of late, the Donk public proclamations seem intended to create divisions among people, by gender, race and ethnicity. Advantage: Ruling classes. Marxist analysis is relevant here (I am not a Marxist, but every viewpoint has strengths)

There is less then zero class consciousness in the modern Donk Party, save for a few old warhorses like Bernie Sanders. 

I disagree with you on China policy. Trump, for whatever reasons, placed tariffs and enraged the most powerful commercial combinations in history, that of global manufacturing enterprises and China factory platforms, offered by the CCP. 

The biggest business combinations in history----the Apples, the BlackRocks, the GMs, the WalMarts, Disney et al, want good relations and trade with the CCP, not bad. 

Trump's China policy, which I think is the right policy and should go further, was a break from the globalist Clinton-Obama approach. A real policy difference, and one I agree with. 

So...no, I am not enamored of the Donks or the 'Phants. Nor Trump the person, though his foreign-trade-military policies, on balance, were better than Obama's. 

I hope the modern 'Phant party can eschew the worst elements, and migrate towards a true populist party, with the interests of the employee-middle class foremost. Non-interventionist foreign policies, and pro-American trade policies.  A feeble hope, but a hope. 

Strange as it seems, the national security state is now aligned with the Hillary Clinton-Liz Cheney-M$M globalist axis.  Where are the Donks of yesteryear, the the JFKs, the George McGoverns? 

Well, those are my views. I welcome your views, and those from people across the political spectrum. I ain't seen yet the guy or tribe with a monopoly on wisdom. 

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

hope the modern 'Phant party can eschew the worst elements, and migrate towards a true populist party, with the interests of the employee-middle class foremost. Non-interventionist foreign policies, and pro-American trade policies.  A feeble hope, but a hope. 

That's not even a hope . it's a complete pipe dream from someone who reads and dreams about the U.S. but what was your experience?. You lived a few years in L.A. back in the 90's'?.

Have you even put in the effort to know who you're Republican heroes are outside of that one Libertarian complete pariah, Massey? 
 
You're making the assumption. that the Trump disenfranchised have been assimilated into the Republican Party and effect policy. They don't. The most tangible legacy of the Trump presidency   can be put in 2 words, Mitch Mc Connell. The tax cuts to the rich are Mc Connels, So is Citizens United, the disenfranchising ruling that corporations have the same rights as people, you've now expressed you're against. You responded by saying."The multi-nationalist-globalists own Washington". In general I might agree with that statement but no, Ben, this was solely the work of  of the Trump Mac Connel induced conservative Supreme Court. The vote was 5-4 straight down liberal conservative lines and the conservatives won out 5-4. You're putting blacks hat on the losing heroes.,All the liberal justices in the U.S. are anti corporate and voted  against it. Period! Understanding this is vital! Do some research. Are you sure youi're  not just a Libertarian posing as a pro working guy? Because these policies are the absolute antithesis of who you're portraying yourself to us as.
 
The Trumpies have no legislative efforts, or any real legacy, because they want nothing as far as a political agenda. Their only requirement of Trump is to vent their frustration to give them an illusion of "owning the libs". Though this is a bonanza for the failing Republican Party, a constituency who contribute votes to the GOP, but require no concrete policies changes from the Republicans , which is great because if they could articulate policy, the Republicans are the least likely to give it to them anyway. So mum's the word! The handful who aren't lying through their teeth are the ones that you expect to "migrate towards a true populist party", but they are the  dumbest in the lot! heh heh heh   You have some serious research to do.
 
It's correct to assume the Democrats have gone through changes over the years in their  make up in policy, one negative such policy is Clinton abandoning the working man for the monied interests, that we've all pointed out.  The Republicans with Trump or without are ideologically virtually identical to 20 years ago and haven't really changed,  They're globalist, pro business, pro Wall Street, pro Military  and you can  throw in thee Religious Right. .But now like sheep, they'll say whatever they need to court favor with Trump and not get "primaried".
 
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Edited by Kirk Gallaway
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I’m mostly with Kirk on this. 
Ben - I can’t understand how you can think Republicans are pro working class. It’s only words. Their policies are pro rich, period. Globalism is pretty much bi-partisan, for what it’s worth. And my point about China is that Biden’s policy is much like Trump. 

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1 hour ago, Paul Brancato said:

I’m mostly with Kirk on this. 
Ben - I can’t understand how you can think Republicans are pro working class. It’s only words. Their policies are pro rich, period. Globalism is pretty much bi-partisan, for what it’s worth. And my point about China is that Biden’s policy is much like Trump. 

Paul-

That's fine. We disagree on certain issues. 

Perhaps each of us will advise the other to keep an open mind. 

 

 

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As we say in the states. You can buy a cowboy outfit but that doesn't make you a cowboy. Ben.

We also use a phrase  "walking the walk". If yout say you  want a party, "with the interests of the employee-middle class foremost" but then extol candidates whose biggest  achievements are to oppress  everyday people. (Tax cuts to the wealthy, and Citizen's United, fortifying the corporate state) and whose biggest failures are  trying to deny people health care. Your not on the side of "the employee middle class foremost" or at all.

Edited by Kirk Gallaway
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2 hours ago, Chuck Schwartz said:

This article summarizes the criminal (and other) cases against Trump and where they stand today...https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-faces-flurry-investigations-beyond-054925775.html

Thanks Chuck - I’m not holding my breath. Many of these investigations, such as in NY, are a decade or more old I believe. I’d love to see him taken to task, but just don’t see him in court any time soon if ever. 

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6 hours ago, Paul Brancato said:

Thanks Chuck - I’m not holding my breath. Many of these investigations, such as in NY, are a decade or more old I believe. I’d love to see him taken to task, but just don’t see him in court any time soon if ever. 

You'll see multiple indictments against Donald Trump in the new year, Paul. Bet on it.

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4 hours ago, Matt Allison said:

John Eastman? Not an employee of the Trump Administration.

Evidently, an unemployed lawyer, now at a self-created public-interest law firm, though a lawyer (in his past) with some some academic credentials.  

Parts of the Politico story are puzzling, perhaps laughable. 

See---

The former Chapman University law professor also pressured Pence, who is constitutionally required to preside over the Electoral College certification on Jan. 6, to unilterally (sic) refuse to count some of Biden’s electors and send the election to the full House for a vote — or delay long enough to give states a chance to submit new electors. 

So, how would an unemployed lawyer "pressure" Pence? With what personal or institutional resources? Furrowed eyebrows? A stern look?  Eastman family members would not vote GOP, in the next election?

Pence must have quivered in wing-tips! 

So, how was Eastman connected to the scrum at the Capitol on 1/6? 

Did Eastman have instigators and provocateurs in the scrum? Text messages from scrummers we have by the hundreds. 

To date, not a single defendant that the federal government has prosecuted for the 1/6 occupation of the Capitol has been charged with a conspiracy involving  anyone in the Trump Administration.

The truth: only a very few scrummers have been charged with any conspiracy at all, and those few for conspiring  with other member of Oathkeepers or Proud Boys.

Which is very odd, as the leaders of Oathkeepers and Proud Boys are suspected federal informants and assets. 

The Afro-Cuban Enrique Tarrio, top man at the Proud Boys, is a made federal informant, and was (helpfully) let out of jail on Jan. 5.  You can't make this stuff up.

The top guy at the Oathkeepers is Stewart Rhodes, still never charged with anything at 1/6, although underlings have been. 

Ray Epps is copiously on video advocating storming of the Capitol, made a most-wanted list...and then nothing. 

Again, I pose the question: Who has the resources to manipulate events, to place instigators and assets into activist groups, and to control subsequent M$M coverage? 

Eastman?

Can you think of any other entities that fill the bill? 

The M$M 1/6 story is looking like the Brian Sicknick story. A security-state purple-party narrative. 

 

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10 hours ago, Paul Brancato said:

Thanks Chuck - I’m not holding my breath. Many of these investigations, such as in NY, are a decade or more old I believe. I’d love to see him taken to task, but just don’t see him in court any time soon if ever. 

Paul,

     I don't think it's an exaggeration to say that Donald Trump has spent half of his life scamming people and the other half trying to avoid consequences for his scams.  In fact, one of his biographers said a few years ago that Trump has always taken a perverse delight in scamming people and getting away with it.

     Of course, Trump's biggest scam was convincing the white working class in 2016 that he represented their interests and was not beholden to the Koch plutocrats who bought the GOP ten years ago. 

     Most of his white working class base still haven't even figured out that they got scammed.  It's false consciousness on steroids.

    

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