The inevitable end result of our last 56 years

[Benjamin Cole]

Just now, Bob Ness said:

I have no idea what this issue is about but I do know there are inumerable jusrisdictions that don't let their citizens vote and yet you're not posting that in 30 point font. The dismantling of the post office and limiting voting centers to four (or something) in Harris County Texas come to mind. The attempt to disenfranchise voters en masse across five battleground states is another. Some of that is still going on I believe.

Bob N.--

Sorry about the 30-point font. That is just how it posted...I will use plain text next time. 

I am against any type of disenfranchisement.

On the other hand, most nations in Europe require national ID to vote. In Thailand, you have to show national ID to vote. This seems like a reasonable precaution. 

Both parties, and allied media, have suggested vote fraud around the use of absentee ballots. The Trump claims may be spurious, as possibly were the claims about Bush's dubious and late Ohio votes in 2004. 

This system does not engender confidence.  It needs to be tightened up to engender confidence. 

Having non-citizens vote in US elections strikes me as PC-insanity.

Seriously, does this work: Anybody can vote, citizen or not, and not show ID.  

 

 

 

[Bob Ness]

19 minutes ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Bob N.--

Sorry about the 30-point font. That is just how it posted...I will use plain text next time. 

I am against any type of disenfranchisement.

On the other hand, most nations in Europe require national ID to vote. In Thailand, you have to show national ID to vote. This seems like a reasonable precaution. 

Both parties, and allied media, have suggested vote fraud around the use of absentee ballots. The Trump claims may be spurious, as possibly were the claims about Bush's dubious and late Ohio votes in 2004. 

This system does not engender confidence.  It needs to be tightened up to engender confidence. 

Having non-citizens vote in US elections strikes me as PC-insanity.

Seriously, does this work: Anybody can vote, citizen or not, and not show ID.  

I really know nothing about the NY thing. It kind of sounds stupid to me but there may be some justification for local representation of something. I don't know and will have to look at it.

As luck would have it re Bush 2004 I happen to have a friend who was in Puerto Rico (he's a true to life Silver Star/MOH winner - solid source) and did volunteer work with recently unemployed and pour call center workers in 2005. They were hired to make random calls to people with African American and Jewish names and direct them to the wrong precinct locations to vote. In Ohio. True story. If they could find elderly people all the better. Carl Rove I suspect. Scumbags. The current round of republicans make them look exceptionally principaled.

Regarding the ID requirement I just don't see where it makes any difference as long as the votes can be verified. The last election would have seen the dumb asses claim fake IDs! And you know it. So everyone's getting bogus IDs to back up there dead Uncle's yada yada yada. They have secure systems in place now.

Edited December 10, 2021 by Bob Ness

[Benjamin Cole]

52 minutes ago, Greg Doudna said:

Also on Noam Chomsky, Ben: he quote you give is vintage Chomsky, BUT Chomsky also votes Democratic and has recommended others vote Democratic in any swing state in presidential elections, because--and he argued this explicitly--"small differences have big consequences" on a lot of average people. He made the point that while the two parties had many similarities in the bad things he criticized--it was just a fact that the Democratic Party was a little less inhumane, less  cruel, on domestic policy and social infrastructure support issues--that "small differences have big consequences" to large numbers of people.

I agree with that analysis. Someone earlier asked who would JFK support today? That is just obvious: he would be a Democrat supporting Biden. Trump is like General Edwin Walker, and the supporters of Trump are the same kind of people who supported General Walker. There is your right-wing populism. Or the later populist George Wallace as another parallel to populist Trump today. Pox on both houses logic: Kennedy vs. General Edwin Walker. Kennedy vs. George Wallace ... all the same ... except no, it is not all the same. In terms of the major parties, even small differences have big consequences.

Kennedy was the US version of the Soviet Union's Gorbachev, and that is the existential tragedy of the JFK assassination.

You don't get Kennedys and Gorbachevs from right-wing populism. 

Greg D.-- Well, each to his own.  I respect your views. 

Authoritarianism? Hillary Clinton is advocating "gatekeepers" on the news. The Donks have been totally absorbed by the national security state. 

I realize the whole conversation on which party is best (or, more accurately, worst) is beyond the ken of this forum. 

My take is the globalists, with open borders policy for trade and immigration (and I like immigrants) have savaged the US middle-employee class. They have converted the US military into a mercenary global guard service for multinationals. This picture is ugly, and accomplished through both parties. 

The globalists escape taxes---Apple says it makes it money in Ireland. And it chooses to make is phones in CCP-China. Income taxes have become a domestic and international shell game. 

Obama was supine on the CCP, along with Disney, the NBA and BlackRock.

Oddly, it was the nut Trump that did something. Trump also (maybe for the wrong reasons) tightened up the US border. 

The ID politics of the new Donk Party is divisive, and poisonous. The dog-whistling of the 'Phants is offensive too. 

I did not vote the last few Presidential cycles. 

For me, there are shades of purple, not blue or red. 

But that is IMHO. 

Also, Trumpers can be awful people but also the targets of prosecutorial misconduct. Those are not mutually exclusive. 

 

 

 

[Benjamin Cole]

11 minutes ago, Bob Ness said:

I really know nothing about the NY thing. It kind of sounds stupid to me but there may be some justification for local representation of something. I don't know and will have to look at it.

As luck would have it re Bush 2004 I happen to have a friend who was in Puerto Rico (he's a true to life Silver Star/MOH winner - solid source) and did volunteer work with recently unemployed and pour call center workers in 2005. They were hired to make random calls to people with African American and Jewish names and direct them to the wrong precinct locations to vote. In Ohio. True story. If they could find elderly people all the better. Carl Rove I suspect. Scumbags. The current round of republicans make them look exceptionally principaled.

Regarding the ID requirement I just don't see where it makes any difference as long as the votes can be verified. The last election would have seen the dumb asses claim fake IDs! And you know it. So everyone's getting bogus IDs to back up there dead Uncle's yada yada yada. They have secure systems in place now.

Karl Rove was a satanic genius, and part of the 9/11 crowd. He knew how to frame the issue (for the Bush benefit). 

Bush jr. and the Iraqistan wars sucked trillions out of the US for a counterproductive entanglements, causing copious amounts of human carnage along the way.

I cannot say enough bad things about the globalist 'Phants around Bush jr. 

Which, btw, included the present-day Donk hero, Liz Cheney. That is spooky.  

[Steve Thomas]

“Russia, if you’re listening — I hope you are able to find the 30,000 Mark Meadows emails that are missing. I think you will probably be rewarded mightily by our press. Let’s see if that happens."

 

I'm almost sure that's what Donal Trump said. I'm almost positive.

Steve Thomas

[Bill Fite]

14 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

W.-

 

I think Noam Chomsky is a bit of an academic, without leavening experience in working in government and in the private sector. 

But he is a smart guy. Here is what he says:

In the US, there is basically one party - the business party. It has two factions, called Democrats and Republicans, which are somewhat different but carry out variations on the same policies. By and large, I am opposed to those policies. As is most of the population.

Noam Chomsky

I always liked another smart guy's summary of the 2 parties:

"The Republicans stand for nothing but unmitigated greed and evil wrapped in the American flag.

The Democrats stand for nothing but wanting to be Republicans"

That guy was the late great Frank Zappa.

[W. Niederhut]

19 minutes ago, Bill Fite said:

I always liked another smart guy's summary of the 2 parties:

"The Republicans stand for nothing but unmitigated greed and evil wrapped in the American flag.

The Democrats stand for nothing but wanting to be Republicans"

That guy was the late great Frank Zappa.

Bill,

   I don't think I've ever met a Democrat who wanted to be a Republican.  Have you?

Edited December 10, 2021 by W. Niederhut

[Bill Fite]

1 hour ago, W. Niederhut said:

Bill,

   I don't think I've ever met a Democrat who wanted to be a Republican.  Have you?

well W, that was back in the 80s.

I'd say now - a lot of them have made the transition to 80s Republicanism, while the Republicans have moved way farther over there to the right.

But that's just my opinion.

[Matt Allison]

What was true 40 years ago no longer applies.

Today's bombshell:

Trump met privately with rally organizers in the White House January 4th according to subpoenas issues by the 1/6 committee today.

https://january6th.house.gov/sites/democrats.january6th.house.gov/files/20211209 Robert Peede, Jr. Letter.pdfs.january6th.house.gov/files/20211209%20Robert%20Peede,%20Jr.%20Letter.pdf

[W. Niederhut]

3 hours ago, Bill Fite said:

well W, that was back in the 80s.

I'd say now - a lot of them have made the transition to 80s Republicanism, while the Republicans have moved way farther over there to the right.

But that's just my opinion.

Bill,

    Now that I think about it, there was that whole "Democrats for Nixon" thing back in the day.  As I recall those people were either Dixiecrats who were angry about the passage of the Civil Rights Act and Voting Rights Act, and/or hawkish about the Vietnam War.

    And the Scoop Jackson aligned "Neocons" also defected to the Republican Party.

    As for Matt's latest reference-- we, clearly, need Trump's January 6th records.

[Benjamin Cole]

5 hours ago, Bill Fite said:

I always liked another smart guy's summary of the 2 parties:

"The Republicans stand for nothing but unmitigated greed and evil wrapped in the American flag.

The Democrats stand for nothing but wanting to be Republicans"

That guy was the late great Frank Zappa.

Bill F--

Thanks for reading, and your comments. 

Love the Zappa. I had a 12-inch vinyl of his back in the day. All I can remember now is something about making love on the White House lawn. 

Of course, in this forum, we can address issues only with broad brush strokes, so we get a lot of "Democrats are good and Republicans are bad" type comments. I do not think people are so simple-minded, but we all sound that way when we express ourselves through bumper stickers. 

The Donks have indeed morphed in the last several decades, becoming indistinguishable from the national security state on policy issues, and now calling for authoritarian controls over the media and activist groups.  The Donk Clinton-Obama wing assumed the old 'Phant position (still expressed by that wing-tipped runt and former veep Pence) that globalism is wonderful, and sending jobs overseas and importing cheap immigrant labor is nirvana. Wall Street, Silicon Valley, M$M-entertainment-media love it. And the CCP-Beijing way of government is just Confucianism, so says Ray Dalio of Bridgewater. 

Think of the NBA reaction to Hong Kong, and you get the picture. But they painted "Black Lives Matter" on the courts. 

Now the 'Phants are hardly a bunch of nice guys, but it was Trump who took on Beijing, and not Obama, who was supine (I am too polite to say Obama was prone, splay-legged, face down and counting his money). Tramp put tariffs on Sino imports, disrupting lucrative arrangements of the largest and most powerful commercial combines of all time---Apple-CCP, Wal-Mart-CCP, BlackRock-CCP et al.  

Today,  some 'Phants are saying very interesting things: 

"Rubio: We Need to Restore Common Good Capitalism

NOV 05 2019

Rubio: “Common-good capitalism is about a vibrant and growing free market. But it is also about harnessing and channeling that growth to the benefit of our country, our people, and our society. Because after all, our nation does not exist to serve the interests of the market. The market exists to serve our nation and our people.”
 
Washington, D.C. — U.S. Senator Marco Rubio (R-FL) addressed students at Catholic University’s Busch School of Business. Rubio spoke on “Catholic Social Doctrine and the Dignity of Work” building off his op-ed in First Things, titled “What Economics is For,” that focuses on the economy and dignity of work."

 

---30---

OK, so I know there be howls from audience, that Rubio is not sincere. Indeed, a lack of sincerity would not be a surprise in any Senator, Donk or 'Phant. 

But things have changed. That Rubio speech could have been lifted from a 1960s left-wing Catholic, some of whom I had the personal pleasure of listening too.  It is a radioactive speech for Donks today, barring maybe AOC-Sanders types (although AOC-Sanders are not allowed to breath even one good word about capitalism).

Well, that's it for today. 

Keep an open mind. 

 

 

 

[Matt Allison]

After losing the election, Trump's plans for a coup went into action. Two days after Biden was declared the winner, he fired the Secretary of Defense, Mark Esper, and replaced him with someone he could control, Chris Miller.

Removing the protections that would be in place when the Capitol was attacked was key, so this directive went out: 

 

 

[Benjamin Cole]

Biden Eulogizes Dole as ‘Genuine Hero’ Who ‘Lived by a Code of Honor’

The New York Times34 minutes ago

 

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[W. Niederhut]

2 hours ago, Benjamin Cole said:

Bill F--

Thanks for reading, and your comments. 

Love the Zappa. I had a 12-inch vinyl of his back in the day. All I can remember now is something about making love on the White House lawn. 

Of course, in this forum, we can address issues only with broad brush strokes, so we get a lot of "Democrats are good and Republicans are bad" type comments. I do not think people are so simple-minded, but we all sound that way when we express ourselves through bumper stickers. 

The Donks have indeed morphed in the last several decades, becoming indistinguishable from the national security state on policy issues, and now calling for authoritarian controls over the media and activist groups.  The Donk Clinton-Obama wing assumed the old 'Phant position (still expressed by that wing-tipped runt and former veep Pence) that globalism is wonderful, and sending jobs overseas and importing cheap immigrant labor is nirvana. Wall Street, Silicon Valley, M$M-entertainment-media love it. And the CCP-Beijing way of government is just Confucianism, so says Ray Dalio of Bridgewater. 

Think of the NBA reaction to Hong Kong, and you get the picture. But they painted "Black Lives Matter" on the courts. 

Now the 'Phants are hardly a bunch of nice guys, but it was Trump who took on Beijing, and not Obama, who was supine (I am too polite to say Obama was prone, splay-legged, face down and counting his money). Tramp put tariffs on Sino imports, disrupting lucrative arrangements of the largest and most powerful commercial combines of all time---Apple-CCP, Wal-Mart-CCP, BlackRock-CCP et al.  

Today,  some 'Phants are saying very interesting things: 

"Rubio: We Need to Restore Common Good Capitalism

NOV 05 2019

Rubio: “Common-good capitalism is about a vibrant and growing free market. But it is also about harnessing and channeling that growth to the benefit of our country, our people, and our society. Because after all, our nation does not exist to serve the interests of the market. The market exists to serve our nation and our people.”
 
Washington, D.C. — U.S. Senator Marco Rubio (R-FL) addressed students at Catholic University’s Busch School of Business. Rubio spoke on “Catholic Social Doctrine and the Dignity of Work” building off his op-ed in First Things, titled “What Economics is For,” that focuses on the economy and dignity of work."

 

---30---

OK, so I know there be howls from audience, that Rubio is not sincere. Indeed, a lack of sincerity would not be a surprise in any Senator, Donk or 'Phant. 

But things have changed. That Rubio speech could have been lifted from a 1960s left-wing Catholic, some of whom I had the personal pleasure of listening too.  It is a radioactive speech for Donks today, barring maybe AOC-Sanders types (although AOC-Sanders are not allowed to breath even one good word about capitalism).

Well, that's it for today. 

Keep an open mind. 

 

 

 

Ben,

 Marco Rubio's political career has been funded and promoted by the Koch brothers.  They were looking for intelligent salesmen who could appeal to Hispanic voters. 

Rubio has backed the Koch agenda an estimated 98% of the time in the Senate-- including his repeated efforts to sabotage Obamacare and to reduce corporate taxes to their current lows.  (His one area of dissent was his support for the bi-partisan Senate Immigration Reform bill that the Tea Party House refused to pass.)

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2016/oct/27/patrick-murphy/patrick-murphy-marco-rubio-voted-98-percent-time-k/

In reality, the Koch/Rubio concept of "common good capitalism" is basically de-regulated, laissez faire, Gilded Age style Robber Baron-ism-- appropriately labeled by Duke University historian Nancy MacLean as, "misanthropic libertarianism."

Rubio is also a staunch climate change science denier-- a fossil fuel industry shill.   His employers, the Kochs, have spent millions on propaganda denying climate change science.  

In our protracted discussion of Donks vs. 'Phants,  I have enumerated for you the many substantive domestic policy differences between the modern Democratic Party and the modern Koch-aligned GOP-- on tax policy, Medicare, Medicaid, Obamacare, education, environmental protection, climate change mitigation, voting rights, etc.-- but the facts I post always seem to go into one of your ears and out the other.

In that sense you, certainly, do seem to have an open mind... 🤥

In truth, it is simple minded and toxic to push the false narrative that there are no substantive differences between Donks and 'Phants.   As an example, the 'Phants passed two House budget bills after 2010 that would have, essentially, abolished Medicare-- turning it into a Koch/Paul Ryan Voucher Care scam!

I would urge you to study the historic impact that Medicare has had on reducing senior poverty in the U.S.

No doubt, both political parties have been corrupted by money, and the Donks have, unfortunately kow towed to the military-industrial complex since 11/22/63...

BUT almost all significant, progressive legislation of the past century has been accomplished by the Democratic Party-- e.g., the Social Security Act, the Securities Exchange Act, the Civil Rights and Voting Rights Acts, Medicare, Medicaid, and Obamacare. 

Nixon deserves some credit for creating the EPA-- but look at what Reagan, the Bushes, and Trump did to undermine environmental protection!  Need I mention the records of James Watt, Dick Cheney, and Scott Pruitt on environmental protection?  Geez...they were all fossil fuel industry factotums who actively sought to roll back Clean Air and Clean Water protection in the U.S.!

Those are your 'Phants...

If Jack and Bobby Kennedy could see what the Republican Party has become in the 21st century, they would roll over in their graves!

So would Dwight Eisenhower.

Edited December 11, 2021 by W. Niederhut

[Ron Bulman]

8 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

Bill,

   I don't think I've ever met a Democrat who wanted to be a Republican.  Have you?

No.

Is that a Sears poncho or a real poncho?