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Identification of two men in Alyea film


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I just happened upon this while reviewing some of the assassination related films.  I wondered if someone on the forum was familiar with the Alyea film and had noticed/identified the two men who appear at around 45 seconds (of 1:29) into this YouTube video.   It is titled Alyea film (posted by Lone Gunman).  I list this in case the link I'm putting in doesn't work because I haven't always been successful at that.  It is an older & taller man who appears to be escorting another man (resembling Oswald) away from the TSBD front steps.

 

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Thank you.  I knew I had seen this frontal shot, but couldn't remember where.  I just found it as well.  I have a bookmark for the JFK Assassination Photo Research Galleries and didn't think I'd find it as quickly as I did.  Thank you again, I appreciate it.  I'm at the age that if I learn new information (or in this case rediscover it), some old information falls away.

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35 minutes ago, Rob Clark said:

I believe it is Robert Edwards or Ronald Fisher....can't ever remember which one 😆

index.jpg

Who are those two guys?

The taller man has some type of odd uniform looking shirt on.

Is that a badge above his left breast shirt pocket?

If so, representing what employer?

And does he also have shoulder patches?

Why would the older man so deliberately be holding and guiding the younger man away from the building? 

They're a little too close than even two co-worker friends might be in just deciding to walk out and away from the TXSBD together, imo.

Strange looking characters. Strange photo. One I have never seen before.

Does the rifle Lt.Day is holding in the film look exactly like the Italian Carcano, or a Mauser as Constable Seymour Weitzman  ( former sporting goods shop owner and gun buff ) identified just minutes earlier?

 

 

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14 hours ago, Joe Bauer said:

Who are those two guys?

The taller man has some type of odd uniform looking shirt on.

Is that a badge above his left breast shirt pocket?

If so, representing what employer?

And does he also have shoulder patches?

Why would the older man so deliberately be holding and guiding the younger man away from the building? 

They're a little too close than even two co-worker friends might be in just deciding to walk out and away from the TXSBD together, imo.

Strange looking characters. Strange photo. One I have never seen before.

Joe,

Based on the badge over his left shirt pocket, the shoulder patch on his left bicep, the non-blue color of his uniform, and the papers sticking out of right shirt pocket, I'm going to guess and say that he might be a Deputy Constable working for Robie Love.

Constable Duties & Responsibilities

https://www.co.walker.tx.us/egov/apps/document/center.egov?view=item;id=110

 

Although the constable is considered a local precinct officer, his territorial jurisdiction, like that of sheriff, extends to the entire county. He is entitled to serve civil process in those counties contiguous to his own, and with a warrant, to make arrests beyond the limit of his county.

Civil court actions in the state of Texas begin with the service of different types of citations, writs, or subpoenas. The county or state charges various fees for such documents, and for legal service thereof to a defendant or witness in a civil suit. Deputy sheriffs, municipal police officers, constables, and private process servers are authorized to serve these civil papers.

Steve Thomas

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I see. Thanks Steve.

Who's the young man he is escorting away from the building?

I feel for the kid if he was just some innocent TXSBD employee or curious walk-in off the street to that scene.

He looks like he's a little in shock and worried.

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Here is an interview of Ronald Fischer for those interested...by Mark Oakes! Courtesy of Bart Kamp...via Malcolm Blunt Just click play, it will automatically start at the right part. :up

 

Edited by Rob Clark
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4 hours ago, Richard Price said:

Joe, according to jfkassassinationfiles.wordpress.com, it is Ronald Fischer.  They have a few pictures also.

Richard,

If this is a picture taken in front of the TSBD; based on what Fischer told the WC he did after the shooting,  I don't think it's Fischer.

He and Bob Edwards were standing on Houston watching the parade. After the shooting, they ran up the grassy knoll and looked around the railroad yards. They then went back to the office.

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/fischer.htm

 

“Mr. BELIN - All right. When you went back there, did you walk by the front of the Texas School Book Depository Building?
Mr. FISCHER - No; when we went back, we came we went back the same way we came. We went straight across Elm and then up to Houston on the south side of Elm, and then crossed.

Mr. FISCHER - Well, as I said, we went up to the fourth floor to our office. Uh---I stayed there for 5 or 10 minutes. Bob had left. And then I went next door in the purchasing department where they've got a radio.

About that time a deputy from the sheriff's office came up and asked me if I was Ronald Fischer, and I said, "Yes ;" and he said that Sheriff Decker wanted to see me in his office right now.
Mr. BELIN - About what time was this now?
Mr. FISCHER - This was at--oh--1 o'clock on or about 1 o'clock.

Mr. BELIN - You then went to Sheriff Decker's office?
Mr. FISCHER - I went to Decker's office and--uh--Bob Edwards was in there. He looked up--and he had given them my name and told them--at least, this is what he told me that he told them that we had both been standing there together and had seen this man in the window...“

When he testified, Edwards never came to explain how he came to be in Decker's office when Fischer was brought in.

I'd say if it was either of these two, the young man was was probably Bob Edwards.

Steve Thomas

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Thanks, Steve.  As we used to say when I played sports, "my bad".  When I looked back over the pictures I was searching (more for Brennan than anything else), I discovered that I had reversed what I read on jfkassassinationfiles.wordpress.com.  It actually had Robert Edwards as the person in the picture according to them.  They have a composite group of pictures from 5 sources that they label as Edwards.  The confusing part to me is in the dialog you posted.  Fischer says "they" went to their office on the 4th floor.  He says Bob had left, but doesn't say where he had gone.  Does this mean that Bob/Robert Edwards had went back to the Elm Street area and this is when he was brought in?

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That interview of Ronald Fischer is really interesting.

Fischer mentions his Warren Commission questioner David Belin becoming so angry at some of his responses to his questions that he ( Belin ) had to leave the room at least once and maybe more times to calm down.

A reaction that was befuddling to Fischer because he couldn't understand any reason for Belin's extraordinary anger. Fischer states he personally was very calm and respectful in his own demeanor while under questioning by Belin.

The interviewer in this video reminded Fischer of his own words stated years earlier that he (Fischer) almost came to blows with Belin, or thought he might have to.

Fischer later stated his belief that Belin had a JFK shooting agenda that Fischer's testimony was not fitting. Fischer also adds his personal belief that the JFK shooting was the result of a conspiracy and that Oswald was a non-shooting participant who realized after JFK was shot that he was the designated patsy. 

Fischer feels that Oswald was too calm for a man who supposedly just shot the President of the United States, yet who then became frantic only after shooting Tippit.

Fischer states he was 24 years old that day. The same age as Oswald.

I've never seen this interview or heard of Ron Fischer. After viewing it I highly recommend others here view it as well.

By the way, the photo above of the odd uniform man escorting the younger man does not look the the older Fischer in the interview imo.

The young man being escorted has a much shorter nose than the older Fischer. And his head shape and ears seem different. Again, imo.

Edited by Joe Bauer
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Just out of curiosity I watched the entire earlier part of the Fischer interview video.

Really interesting. You should check this out.

The mother of James Worrell who was standing just under the TXSBD 6th floor window when the shots rang out.

And Dallas PD motorcycle officer H.B. McClain ( 30 years of service ) who escorted the JFK motorcade just a couple of cars back from JFK's limo, and whose motorcycle microphone was supposedly left on which the HSCA used to conclude there was a 4th shot in the JFK shooting sequence.

McClain recounts how he helped pull Jackie Kennedy off of her husband in the limo at Parkland hospital that day.

McClain states he also believes the shooting was part of a conspiracy.

Just click on the beginning far left side of the red bar on the bottom of the screen.

Edited by Joe Bauer
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3 hours ago, Joe Bauer said:

Fischer stated his belief that Belin had a JFK shooting agenda that Fischer's testimony was not fitting. Fischer also adds his personal belief that the JFK shooting was the result of a conspiracy and that Oswald was a non-shooting participant who realized after JFK was shot that he was the designated patsy.

Joe,

The WC testimony of Bob Edwards, who was with Fischer:

Mr. BELIN - If you said four, you mean the affidavit-maybe we'd better introduce it into the record as Edward's Deposition Exhibit A. Where do you think the shots came from?
Mr. EDWARDS - I have no idea.
Mr. BELIN - In the affidavit you stated that the shots seemed to come from the building there. Did you really say that or not?
Mr. EDWARDS - No; I didn't say that.
Mr. BELIN - All right, anything else you can think of?
Mr. EDWARDS - No.
Mr. BELIN - I want to thank you for coming down here.

Steve Thomas

 

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