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Hollywood Media Self-Punking? Project Mockingbird Not Needed?


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On 7/18/2021 at 11:50 AM, Kirk Gallaway said:
 
Well I certainly concur with you about Latin America Jeff.
 
As far as secret veto power? Maybe you're right? It's useless  We're completely f--k--!. and so are our kids.
But in the United States we're not even near getting a consensus to put anything on a ballot. Polling shows over and over, Most people here don't vote in their interest.
74 million people voted for Trump though he's not in the majority in any major polling topics except he had an edge over Biden on the economy.
 
It's not just the government Jeff. Just because we're the  wealthiest, most powerful nation in the history of the world, don't overestimate us!  I  know you don't.
We don't need a highly evolved  deep state to be able to repress us. We offer almost no opposition. As far as true oppressors, the elites, we aid them.
 
With most of these people  storming the capitol, there's absolutely no personal interest in these  guys voting Republican..
In this tragic death  of  Ashli Babbitt  who was killed at the riots trying to break in a door in the capitol. She actually obtained   a credit card at 44% annual interest to finance her trip to Washington. Just another unwitting victim turned reluctant corporate shill. Have any of these people ever heard of Bernie Sanders or Elizabeth Warren? These are truly anti elite candidates that have actually campaigned in their interest!
 
And the people that get elected. For example,  Senator Ted Cruz's has got a self righteous, sanctimonious,  smarmy  sort of corn pone style, and  does nothing in the Senate but piss people of both parties off, and yet he's gets re elected. Texas  also has an attorney general no less, whose been under indictment for 5 years and gets reelected. How can they get re elected?, because Texans really eat this sh-t up! They say thing may be  changing. We'll see.
 
They have a congressman Louie Gohmert, (another mask adverse covid denier who caught covid) who actually asked the chief deputy of the Forest Service if we could alter the path of the earth's orbit around the sun to effect climate change!   Of course he's just a congressman, but  some elected officials in the U.S. you just wouldn't believe. They have a governor whose whose a threatening slave driver.  Ok, It's not fair to just pick on some elected officials in Texas. I'm only beating up on them because it's so easy.  But we and now have all of these representatives from many states just straight faced lying in knots and retracting  their first statements about 1/6 Capitol riots just to please Trump.
 
Also of course the U.S. defense state and war machine is a scourge throughout the world and a major topic of agreement here. It would seem that the MICs all powerful, but there's really a lot of public  complicity. There are whole cities with economies that live on  defense, mostly in red states where the federal defense appropriations are a higher percentage of their smaller economies. The American people aren't as peacenik as you and I Jeff. That doesn't even fall in the category of "implementing the public will" because cutting defense is not a high priority."
 
Because Americans don't vote in their interests and those people are easily diverted into "culture wars."
I would say the Democrats have to get in touch with their inner " Deep state  national security state" side  that Benjamin's talking about and ruthlessly rip the assh-le out of the filibuster and push their voting rights bill, greatly expand a national health plan, push for more environmental legislation and pay for it by  soaking the mega  rich, and force your 'secret veto', and see what happens.. We've seen the Republicans ruthlessly  use their narrow majorities to push their Supreme Court judges and tax cuts to the wealthy. They'd just be responding in kind. Obviously I'm not holding my breathe!
 
********
 
Jeff, I'd be curious what you think about this. Trudeau's shut down by pig Bolsenaro of Brazil no less, at the G 20! This is from some "Get the business  edge with better body language" guy.
It could happen to anyone, Trudeau makes a friendly handshake gesture just as Bolso is greeted from the other side. This guy totally sacks him! I think Trudeau is just being a "polite Canadian'
 
 

I would say the "secret veto" of your last paragraph already took place just ahead of Super Tuesday last year. 

Kirk - you seem more interested in Justin T than most Canadians are. I wonder if it's a California thing - I was on a road trip through your neck of woods several years ago and invariably once our nationality came up the subject immediately turned - fawningly - to Trudeau. Maybe he should relocate and run for governor.

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Jeff: I would say the "secret veto" of your last paragraph already took place just ahead of Super Tuesday last year. 

Po-ho! Super Tuesday! Are we going to go through that again?. Yes the all powerful CIA stole all the New England votes which were in a satchel in a public bathroom, with Hunter Biden's laptop, and changed most of  the votes from Bernie to Biden. They even made Biden an overwhelming victor in Massachusetts ahead of their own native son Elizabeth Warren.
Of course we in the west didn't flinch in our preference for Bernie. It's just that old guard in the northeast got cold feet.

I hate to toot my horn Jeff, but I've had quite a run of political predictions including picking 49 out of 50 states her in the Presidential election. (missed on Georgia) A major part of the art  of prognostication is having a clear idea what is going on in the present.

I actually told you and others in a thread a week before that after Super Tuesday that Dukakis and Klobuchar would lose and  throw their delegates to Biden, and Warren would drop out. So I caught hold of the "secret veto' Jeff. Does that make me CIA? The one thing I got wrong was Dukakis and Klobuchar dropped out just  before Super Tuesday. What really went on is the party went up to Buttigieg and Klobuchar and said ,"We can all see through our polling that neither of you are going to win, why not just do what you're going to do on Wednesday now to head off Bernie." .If Biden had gone up to Buttigieg and Klo and lead them in his direction.I would have given Biden kudos for taking charge. That's called 'politics' in our country a little more free wheeling and spontaneous system than yours but the political systems reflects the country.

Kirk; A major part of the art  prognostication is having a clear idea what is going on in the present.

I did ask , do you really think an editor from on high (or a liaison from the CIA) is telling them what to write? The crummy reviews of Stones has nothing to do with the CIA influencing the reviewers. Read what I wrote. Stone's seen as a controversial figure and some people just don't like his politics. It may seem unfair, but it happens all the time. If you get out of your bubble and meet people who are agnostic about the jfka, you'll hear a lot of mixed reviews about Stone, with even some people who are really into movies and his movies. It doesn't mean they're influenced by the CIA. All these reactions can be explained logically.
 

The CIA won that media battle 30 years ago, not that it's by any means hopeless. I challenged any one here to show me that the CIA is directly involved in any media influence now.  Benjamin, who brought the whole topic up responded by saying.

Benjamin: It is impossible to know how extensive CIA, or other military intel, grooming of the media is today.  
But judging from results....
 
but judging from results??? We've seen your judgment Ben. with all your "fine minds" of Trump supporters. No thanks,  Any idiot by now should be able to see an attempted fascist takeover, and we'd prefer to hold on to our republic.
 
'Translated:  The CIA/military intel does have a presence and is so omnipotent and so completely dominating everything we read and see and so expert at covering their tracks. It's impossible to ever know any thing about the terrible things they're doing.
That's  really just a wimpy excuse for really not having any facts. It's a corporate owned media. Do they really need the CIA?
 
Then Jeff, you come up with Super Tuesday. The only person who came up with any real evidence was W.  and that was 5 years ago in Germany.  Not even on our soil. But at least it's some evidence, an article. I think it could be true. But  to be clear, I don't blindly accept everything I read. You can put as much faith in that as  you want. 
 

Oliver Stone: ‘There’s still a presence out there reminding people not to speak about JFK’s killing’

 
 
Usually I just say things once, but this bears repeating. This is just Stone paranoid crap. The CIA is not fearful at all of us. If they are so dominant in our lives. ("They know when we've been sleeping, they know when we're awake.") Do you really think anything in those files are going to link them to the murder of JFK? Are you crazy? You see the contradiction?
 
I'm going to scoop all you guys and you Jeff.. The  Canadian Security Intelligence Service are about to break a big international spy case and  are about to reveal that Canadian rapper Drake is really a CIA agent. Kind a makes sense doesn't it?
********
 
Hope you're not too old to appreciate the humor of that joke Jeff..
 
And about Trudeau  just making small talk, Jeff.  Just trying to pry that Canadian out a little bit. You can see by the content, I'm hardly doting on him, like some others..
Trudeau fuels fans and critics with Melania Trump kiss, pink socks at G7 -  National | Globalnews.ca

image.jpeg.b33a71d24830054172d3f207bee283b8.jpeg

 

Edited by Kirk Gallaway
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Kirk,

     I can't refrain from pointing out that you have repeatedly ducked the Udo Ulfkotte story and book reference on this thread about whether the CIA is still actively involved in our mainstream media.

    That's sort of like ignoring William Colby's Church Committee testimony and Carl Bernstein's Rolling Stone article while discussing Operation Mockingbird.

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First off W., to be clear I just asked for evidence.

You didn't read W. I didn't duck that at all, In fact, I gave you credit as being the only person who came up with any hard evidence at all. And you mentioned your surprise that there  is no other evidence..  And I  explained how I look at it.

Kirk "The only person who came up with any real evidence was W.  and that was 5 years ago in Germany.  Not even on our soil. But at least it's some evidence, an article. I think it could be true. But  to be clear, I don't blindly accept everything I read. You can put as much faith in that as  you want. "

I don' blindly accept everything I read. Anybody can write an article or a book, W. that doesn't automatically confer legitimacy. I  even remember when you first came out with this, maybe  a year ago and I read it.. You can call this a major story. If you want to do more research or read a book about it, if there is one, go ahead.  As I say you can put as much faith in this story as you want. But don't ask everybody to accept it as some religious tenet.

You ultimately choose to put as much faith in  whatever story you choose. Ultimately,  Why is your heartfelt backing of this story any more valid than Dennis's heartfelt  backing  of the anti vax doctor in Lytton B.C.?

***

P.S.  W. wrote That's sort of like ignoring William Colby's Church Committee testimony and Carl Bernstein's Rolling Stone article while discussing Operation Mockingbird.

W. That was 50 years ago. Nobody's disputing that the CIA was actively involved in covering up the JFKA  for 30 years after the assassination!

*********

In studying the JFKA. I've seen a lot of holes in research.There are a number of witnesses over the years that have come to be accepted as credible. Authors can boast about the number footnotes in a book. and of course, footnotes are good, but of course, you are just handing down one account from someone to someone else. But along this long chain of hand me downs in a 55 year old story, there are other matters, for example, you're really just accepting one researchers claim that a certain witness is credible in an interview they may have made 40 years ago.. That researcher may be believing or discrediting witnesses because they don't fit into their grand thesis. Sometimes I just wonder who was this person being interviewed, and  would I see this person as credible, if i interviewed him?  I think there could be a lot of such characters.

Now because of Newman's work. All the Antonio Veciana claims could be B.S.  There were a lot of authors using his alleged claims for many years! Possibly I don't need to believe and I just have a higher standard of proof. 

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On 7/17/2021 at 6:21 PM, W. Niederhut said:

Here's a reference for those who are wondering whether CIA Director George H.W. Bush actually killed the Mockingbird, as advertised, in the 70s.

Ulfkotte's original book, Gekaufte Journalisten, was published in Germany in 2014 and became a major bestseller, despite being completely blacklisted by the mainstream media in the EU.

The original 2017 English translation, Bought Journalists, was never made available in the U.S. market.

An English edition of the book was finally published in 2019 as Presstitutes-- Embedded in the Pay of the CIA.

Presstitutes Embedded in the Pay of the CIA: A Confession from the Profession

https://www.amazon.com/Presstitutes-Embedded-Pay-CIA-Confession/dp/1615770178/ref=pd_sbs_1/147-0355117-5616453?pd_rd_w=NtvUh&pf_rd_p=f8e24c42-8be0-4374-84aa-bb08fd897453&pf_rd_r=8JDD3SYKFX3A4MQ01H4P&pd_rd_r=7224c4be-10f3-4252-b08b-90b12ec207e1&pd_rd_wg=zl98h&pd_rd_i=1615770178&psc=1

The suppression of Ufkotte's book and potentially his death is evidence of the continuing world wide reach of whatever Mockingbird has been re named today.  it's still there.  While much of it may have become institutionalized in the acquisition of the MSM by the 1% it can still sing when needed.  jmo.

  

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Hmm...So Ron, do you read a lot of right wing German  literature?

Here's what I'm reading about Ufkotte. Ok, Admittedly it's from Wikipedia. It sound like he's German neo N-z-.!

It sounds like at the very least, he's got a weird axe to grind!

Did you research this guy at all W?.

claiming on his Kopp Verlag blog that Barack Obama ordered the burning of bibles,[10]that African sportsmen would "slaughter whites" if allowed into Germany,[11] or that Muslims were waging "fecal jihad" against Europe.[12]

Ulfkotte was involved in the far right Pro Germany Citizens' Movement.[13] In June 2007, he signed the anti-Islam organisation Bundesverband der Bürgerbewegungen (BDB)'s "Wertheimer Appell" against the "creeping Islamisation" of Germany.[13] The BDB merged with Ulfkotte's Pax Europa[14] organisation to form Bürgerbewegung Pax Europa, but Ulfkotte left this in 2008 after an internal dispute.[13] Pax Europa was affiliated to the anti-Muslim Stop Islamisation of Europe (SIOE) alliance and approached the far-right Belgian party Vlaams Belang (VB) for their assistance.[15] It worked with them to organise an anti-Islamic 9/11 anniversary march in Brussels in 2007, but mayor Freddy Thielemans refused to license it and it was eventually cancelled, leading to a split between Ulfkotte and SIOE.[15]n

 

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9 hours ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

Hmm...So Ron, do you read a lot of right wing German  literature?

Here's what I'm reading about Ufkotte. Ok, Admittedly it's from Wikipedia. It sound like he's German neo N-z-.!

It sounds like at the very least, he's got a weird axe to grind!

Did you research this guy at all W?.

claiming on his Kopp Verlag blog that Barack Obama ordered the burning of bibles,[10]that African sportsmen would "slaughter whites" if allowed into Germany,[11] or that Muslims were waging "fecal jihad" against Europe.[12]

Ulfkotte was involved in the far right Pro Germany Citizens' Movement.[13] In June 2007, he signed the anti-Islam organisation Bundesverband der Bürgerbewegungen (BDB)'s "Wertheimer Appell" against the "creeping Islamisation" of Germany.[13] The BDB merged with Ulfkotte's Pax Europa[14] organisation to form Bürgerbewegung Pax Europa, but Ulfkotte left this in 2008 after an internal dispute.[13] Pax Europa was affiliated to the anti-Muslim Stop Islamisation of Europe (SIOE) alliance and approached the far-right Belgian party Vlaams Belang (VB) for their assistance.[15] It worked with them to organise an anti-Islamic 9/11 anniversary march in Brussels in 2007, but mayor Freddy Thielemans refused to license it and it was eventually cancelled, leading to a split between Ulfkotte and SIOE.[15]n

 

Kirk,

     Geez...  Wikipedia?  Talk about needing to consider your sources!  Have you ever read Wikipedia articles about other Deep State whistleblowers-- e.g., L. Fletcher Prouty, Theirry Meyssan, et.al.?  Most of them read like stuff written by John McAdams.  Wikipedia used to insist that Fletcher Prouty was a kooky anti-Semitic pilot with delusions of grandeur-- not to be trusted!  (They have toned that down recently.)

    $2 and a Wikipedia article about U.S. intelligence ops can buy me a Cafe Americano at Starbucks.

    As for Udo Ulfkotte, in reality, he was a Middle East war correspondent and long time journalist for the Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung.  His experiences as a mainstream media journalist, described in detail in Gekaufte Journalisten, directly mirror what Carl Bernstein described about Operation Mockingbird in the 1970s.

https://www.amazon.com/Presstitutes-Embedded-Pay-CIA-Confession/dp/1615770178/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=Udo+Ulfkotte&qid=1626966619&sr=8-1

 

Author Udo Ulfkotte was a respected journalist for 17 years with Germany's newspaper of record, the Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung. He begins this explosive exposé by first owning up to his own career, where he had to sell out to have the job. He then reveals the deceptive tricks and secret networks of power within the media. How perks are used to bribe journalists and opinion makers to twist their reporting. How the tone of corruption is set from the top -- play along or quit. How the long arm of the NATO press office enrolls the media to get Europe to support more foreign wars.

Ulfkotte names hundreds of names and gives you a behind-the-scenes look at the organizations that influence the German media with one-sided propaganda, such as The Atlantic Bridge, Trilateral Commission, German Marshall Fund, CFR, and Aspen Institute. He unmasks the intelligence agencies behind these lobbies groups and the propaganda techniques they use, such as US Embassy grants for projects to influence European public opinion

Would you be surprised to learn that spies sit and write articles in newspaper editorial offices? Which are then published on op-ed pages under the names of well-known journalists? Or which journalists receive bribes for their reporting? Have you heard how prestigious "journalism prizes" are a reward system for cooperation? Much as "Heroes of Labor" were honored for writing the best communist propaganda in the former East bloc. Seen from the inside, the difference between journalist and propagandist isn't as far as you might like.

The elite owners of the media feel it's their right to think for us, and to mold public opinion to their agendas. Their Freedom of the Press is Freedom to Censor the news.

Our nation depends on the media to understand our world, just as each one of us depends on our eyes and ears. The media are our senses. When they hide the truth, or lie to us, they put us all in danger.

A million people died in Iraq, Libya and Syria because the press didn't just report the news, didn't just lie about the news, but they invented and sold the events that served as pretexts for wars. The author spent years in the Middle East, surviving an attack with chemical weapons supplied by US and German firms.

This book is a veteran's guide to the media spider's web. It shows how the system works, sharpens your common sense skepticism, and increases your immunity to the controlled media's attempts to do our thinking for us.

You will gain a whole new perspective on media reports. A good idea of how much you can believe the news on TV or the radio: almost nothing. Ulfkotte dissects the German media establishment, which media outlets are owned by political parties, the journalists that are under their influence, and what keeps them there. You will see how whole countries are manipulated – and who is pulling the strings and why. Here is the bad news about the news: our idea of a free press with a broad spectrum of opinion is pure fantasy. Very often, what is called the "news" is simply brainwashing.

 

    

Edited by W. Niederhut
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I told you '' admittedly' the source is just Wikipedia. I don't make any claims that I'm sufficiently moved to really research this guy. But of course neither have you, W..  All you're doing is copy and pasting the forward. Ok we have some of his resume.

I'm not sure wikipedia makes  make up phony articles whole cloth, you can usually see the areas where critics skew interpretations and of course there's always quoting out of context, but what he has published and his party affiliations are a matter of public record.

He undoubtedly had a Kopp Verlag blog. If you're really serious about researching this.W. 1)Find out if he wrote that "Barack Obama ordered the burning of bibles and any other things he said about Obama and let's make a judgment.

2.Ulfkotte was involved in the far right Pro Germany Citizens' Movementobviously that sounds ominous  by itself! But are they really far right?   They do  say one of their battle cries was against the "creeping Islamisation" of Germany". Get some idea of the stands they took  on relevant political issues of the day. You've heavily endorsed this guy, give me some context on the world and the political climate he lived in.

3. They say the  party aligned with a far right Belgian party, It worked with them to organise an anti-Islamic 9/11 anniversary march in Brussels  Wow W.! I think you'd have something to say about that! Aren't you a 9/11 truther and don't believe Islamists were involved in that at all?? I know you'd probably like to  counsel Ufkotte about his misplaced hostility, but of course he's dead. 

Anyway check into that.  At the least, they  associate him with newspapers and political parties that are definitely very German right wing. Which as I said, always has sort of an ominous connotation to me. Check into the Obama allegations, his party associations, the anti islamic 9/11 anniversary march and whatever relevant stuff you can pick up, or of course, choose not to. Good Luck!

Edited by Kirk Gallaway
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Kirk,

      Again, the subject of this thread is whether George H.W. Bush and the Company killed the Mockingbird in the 70s.   Ulfkotte claims that they didn't.

      Your Wikipedia stuff has repeatedly changed the subject, which is why it was written.

      It reminds me of John McAdams & Co. repeatedly calling Fletcher Prouty an Anti-Semitic crackpot, based on Prouty speaking at a Liberty Lobby conference, etc.   It was a smokescreen-- a deflection from Prouty's detailed, firsthand accounts of CIA special ops, including evidence of their involvement in JFK's assassination..

      And, like Prouty, Ulfkotte has also exposed the CIA-- i.e., their active involvement in the European mainstream media in the 21st century. 

      As for the Wikipedia deflection, I don't know much about Ulfkotte's involvement with critics of Islam in Germany.   It sounds kind of Trump-esque to me-- racist paranoia about the Turkish Gastarbeiten and the recent influx of Syrian war refugees from CIA Operation Timber Sycamore.  But Ulfkotte is correct about the fact that the Nazis recruited Islamic SS units like the Skanderberg regiment to fight against ethnic Orthodox Christians in the Balkans during WWII-- in Albania, Kosovo, and Bosnia.

      Ulfkotte was, apparently, a war correspondent and an assistant editor of a major European newspaper for many years.  He studied Arabic, and lived in the Middle East during the Iran-Iraq War.  So he, obviously, knew a great deal about Islam.  I'm skeptical about the claim that he accused Obama of burning Bibles, but I haven't read the book which is the alleged Wikipedia source for the claim.

      As for Europe's 1,300 year conflict with Islam, it's a complicated, bloody subject that I have studied in considerable depth during the past 20 years.   After 9/11, I read Sir Steven Runciman's definitive history of the Crusades, and British/Egyptian historian Bat Ye'or's writings about the history of Islam in the Levant and the Balkans. Another interesting read is U.S. War College Professor John Schindler's account of the CIA's collaboration with Bin Laden and "Al Qaeda" in Bosnia and Kosovo-- Unholy Terror.  My take is that the CIA was working with Bin Laden and the Islamic militias in Kosovo and Bosnia to topple Milosevic's communist rump state in Belgrade-- as they had done in Afghanistan against the Soviets.

      I do still believe that the Bush-Cheney "War on Terror" was mainly predicated on false flag ops vilifying Muslim CIA associates like Bin Laden and his "Al Qaeda" mujaheddin fighters from the Soviet Afghan and Bosnian Wars.  But that doesn't mean that the 1,300 year history of Islamic jihad in Europe never happened!

     I traveled to Istanbul in the summer of 2000, and met the Greek Orthodox Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew at the Phenar.  The gate to the Phenar was guarded by a soldier with a machine gun, because the place had been recently fire-bombed by alleged Muslim terrorists.  On that same trip, I also attended a Greek Orthodox Church service in Taksim Square -- where the steel doors of the church were immediately chained shut after the liturgy, due to fears of a Muslim terrorist attack.  (And, in fact, the Novo Sholom Synagogue across the street from the Orthodox Trinity Cathedral in Galata was bombed shortly after my visit in 2000.)

    

    

     

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