Meatloaf & JFK

[W. Niederhut]

2 hours ago, Ty Carpenter said:

Mr. Loaf is apparently quoted as saying "If I die, I die" regarding his attitude towards Covid. When he proceeds to die from the virus, why would one feel the need to basically say "I told you so?" He stated his position on the issue and apparently was willing to accept the consequences of his decision. The conversation really should end there, any further commentary on the issue is pointless and not made to be constructive or helpful in any way.

I disagree, Ty.

It isn't "constructive" to say nothing about conduct that is destructive to the self and to others in our society.  It's collusion in dysfunctional behavior.

Would you have the same opinion about a drunk driver who insisted on his "freedom" to drive drunk, and ended up killing himself and endangering others?

 

[Vince Palamara]

14 hours ago, Vince Palamara said:

One thing I am confused/suspicious about: Warren Commission Volume 19 lists all the Dallas police officers (even 19 H 148:
"R.A. WHITE"), but no Orvis Wesley Aday.

 

Orvis Aday (1910s-1970s) | WikiTree FREE Family Tree

No one finds it alarming that Meatloaf's dad is not listed as a police officer in the lengthy and detailed roll calls in Volume 19? They even list clerical staff and trainees (including Roscoe White), yet no one with the last name Aday.

[Joe Bauer]

Googling Orvis Wesley Aday brings up nothing? Obituaries, etc.

If there was an obit wouldn't it have mentioned him being a Dallas Police Officer?

[W. Niederhut]

This thread is about two subjects; 1) something that happened 58 years ago and, 2) something that happened 58 hours ago.

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, Joe Bauer said:

Googling Orvis Wesley Aday brings up nothing? Obituaries, etc.

If there was an obit wouldn't it have mentioned him being a Dallas Police Officer?

I found something yesterday asserting him as being a police officer, suggesting he was from Dallas and the date he died. That was all a quick google search threw up. 

[Sean Coleman]

40 minutes ago, Vince Palamara said:

No one finds it alarming that Meatloaf's dad is not listed as a police officer in the lengthy and detailed roll calls in Volume 19? They even list clerical staff and trainees (including Roscoe White), yet no one with the last name Aday.

Wiki’s info states Aday was a ‘former’ police officer-probably dismissed due to the drink before the event?

[Ty Carpenter]

1 hour ago, W. Niederhut said:

I disagree, Ty.

It isn't "constructive" to say nothing about conduct that is destructive to the self and to others in our society.  It's collusion in dysfunctional behavior.

Would you have the same opinion about a drunk driver who insisted on his "freedom" to drive drunk, and ended up killing himself and endangering others?

 

Your drunk driver scenario has no merit in this discussion. As we now know, the vaccine does not stop one from becoming infected with the virus and does not stop transmission. Additionally, drunk driving is something you choose to do. Not getting vaccinated is something you choose NOT to do. 

Is there any proof Mr. Loaf would have survived his bout with Covid had he been vaccinated? I keep hearing vaccinated folks that have had the virus state that it would have been much worse if they weren't vaccinated. That is just ridiculous. My entire family, ages 39, 37, 12, and 8, all unvaccinated, tested positive on Christmas eve. My wife had the worst symptoms of all of us which was that she was pretty fatigued for one day. Other than that, it was a minor inconvenience. We canceled our holiday plans and stayed home to relax. I even went to the office and worked the next week (by myself). We chose to take our chances and are just fine. And according to the CDC we have stronger immunity than any vaccinated person out there. I didn't kill anyone by not getting vaccinated. 

[W. Niederhut]

6 hours ago, Ty Carpenter said:

Your drunk driver scenario has no merit in this discussion. As we now know, the vaccine does not stop one from becoming infected with the virus and does not stop transmission. Additionally, drunk driving is something you choose to do. Not getting vaccinated is something you choose NOT to do. 

Is there any proof Mr. Loaf would have survived his bout with Covid had he been vaccinated? I keep hearing vaccinated folks that have had the virus state that it would have been much worse if they weren't vaccinated. That is just ridiculous. My entire family, ages 39, 37, 12, and 8, all unvaccinated, tested positive on Christmas eve. My wife had the worst symptoms of all of us which was that she was pretty fatigued for one day. Other than that, it was a minor inconvenience. We canceled our holiday plans and stayed home to relax. I even went to the office and worked the next week (by myself). We chose to take our chances and are just fine. And according to the CDC we have stronger immunity than any vaccinated person out there. I didn't kill anyone by not getting vaccinated. 

Ty,

   The analogy between choosing to drive drunk and choosing to eschew public health measures like vaccination, social distancing, and mask wearing during a deadly pandemic could hardly be more precise.  In both cases, the subject is choosing to endanger his or her own life and the lives of others.

   We could call it toxic libertarianism.

   It is true that the vaccines have had less efficacy in preventing Omicron variant infections, compared to earlier variants, but here are some sobering stats.

   More than 99% of all U.S. COVID deaths in the last quarter of 2021 occurred in the un-vaccinated.

   During that same interval, un-vaccinated seniors were about 50 times more likely to require hospitalization than those who had received third boosters.

   That is striking evidence for the efficacy of vaccines in preventing morbidity and mortality from COVID-19.

Edited January 23, 2022 by W. Niederhut

[Vince Palamara]

1 hour ago, Sean Coleman said:

Wiki’s info states Aday was a ‘former’ police officer-probably dismissed due to the drink before the event?

That could be.

[Ken Martinson]

8 hours ago, Chris Barnard said:

It’s certainly poor etiquette to be defaming the dead so soon after they passed. I am not saying a friend or family member of his will read this but, it certainly wouldn’t be welcome or respectful, William. 
 

It’s interesting you are quoting the Daily Beast, that has been pointed out as a CIA front recently. “Mockingbird lives” but, only selectively in your mind. 
 

As for the C19 thing, you could not be more deluded, more and more data comes out every day, you won’t listen to it or people in the profession who are experts in their field, who are not profiting. You are against censorship but pro the Trusted Media Alliance. A glaring contradiction. You were a medical professional of some sort and understand how evidence based conclusions are important and multi varied analysis, yet you’re ready to hold up anecdotal evidence at the drop of a hat, because it suits your tribal mentality. 
 

 

 

Well said. Dying at age 74 from or with a viral infection is not that surprising. There are 3 factors at play: 1. Health in general and a healthy immune system. 2. Early treatments. 3. vaccines. In a society, we should focus on all 3. There are benefits and risks to any treatment. Granted, there are benefits of the covid jab (maybe a 10X reduction in near-term deaths), and short term risks (see below) and unknown long term risks.

  The new data out of New Zealand that shows that 1 in 5700 people who get the covid jab die with a few days, that is interesting and must be put in context (maybe it was only older people). https://hatchardreport.com/relationship-between-covid-19-vaccination-and-all-cause-mortality/

[W. Niederhut]

4 hours ago, Ken Martinson said:

Well said. Dying at age 74 from or with a viral infection is not that surprising. There are 3 factors at play: 1. Health in general and a healthy immune system. 2. Early treatments. 3. vaccines. In a society, we should focus on all 3. There are benefits and risks to any treatment. Granted, there are benefits of the covid jab (maybe a 10X reduction in near-term deaths), and short term risks (see below) and unknown long term risks.

  The new data out of New Zealand that shows that 1 in 5700 people who get the covid jab die with a few days, that is interesting and must be put in context (maybe it was only older people). https://hatchardreport.com/relationship-between-covid-19-vaccination-and-all-cause-mortality/

Hmmm... Da Nile ain't just a river in Egypt, I see... 🤥

Acute-onset viral deaths (other than those caused by COVID-19) aren't that surprising in 74 year olds, eh? Where did you hear that one, Ken?

Have you, perchance, been listening to Neil Gorsuch?

I don't recall witnessing deaths from acute-onset viral infections in medical school or during my medical career, with the exception of the tragic AIDS epidemic in the pre-treatment era of the 1980s.

To reiterate...

99% of all U.S. COVID deaths in late 2021 occurred in un-vaccinated people.

During that same interval, un-vaccinated seniors had 50 times the risk of hospitalization for COVID infections.

Ergo, Meat Loaf should have chosen to get vaccinated-- especially given his risk factors of age, obesity, and medical co-morbidities.

Instead, he was, apparently, one of those anti-vaxxers who yelled at flight attendants about having to wear a mask.

And, contrary to what some people on this forum keep saying, it's important, and appropriate, to talk about the problem of non-compliance with public health recommendations in the U.S. during this deadly pandemic, rather than denying the risks of non-compliance.

As an example, COVID death rates in the U.S. have been substantially elevated in counties that voted for Donald Trump-- highlighting the tragic consequences of ignorance and denial of the pandemic.

Edited January 23, 2022 by W. Niederhut

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Ken Martinson said:

Well said. Dying at age 74 from or with a viral infection is not that surprising. There are 3 factors at play: 1. Health in general and a healthy immune system. 2. Early treatments. 3. vaccines. In a society, we should focus on all 3. There are benefits and risks to any treatment. Granted, there are benefits of the covid jab (maybe a 10X reduction in near-term deaths), and short term risks (see below) and unknown long term risks.

  The new data out of New Zealand that shows that 1 in 5700 people who get the covid jab die with a few days, that is interesting and must be put in context (maybe it was only older people). https://hatchardreport.com/relationship-between-covid-19-vaccination-and-all-cause-mortality/

That’s just what I thought, a 74 year old who (as far as I can tell) spent long periods living very unhealthily. 
 

The scandal is that governments were not issuing advice to their constituents to eat/drink healthy, ditch the artificial sugars, cut the alcohol consumption, quit the cigarettes, sleep properly, exercise and make sure you have exposure to vitamin C, D and Zinc. We can do things that keep our immune systems in tip top condition, basic things and instead we watched public health get worse through lockdowns, not better. That’s separate from the early treatment program from McCullough. For all intents and purposes it looks like 88% could have been saved. That’s the scandal. I’ll let others pontificate as to why that happened. 
 

Something like this video regarding data from a FOIA request really should open the eyes of many. The manipulation and misinterpretation of data has been shocking during this thing, deliberate. Gradually, it’s all unravelling and some perspective is being had. 

An interview from Canadian clinical psychologist Dr Jordan B. Peterson talking sense.

The message has to be that we need to start living again. 

[W. Niederhut]

Did researchers at the University of Sydney accurately describe the Meat Loaf Syndrome last July?

I don't know much about Meat Loaf, but it sounds like he might fit the bill.

What psychology says about COVID non-compliers

https://www.sydney.edu.au/news-opinion/news/2021/07/30/what-psychology-says-about-covid-non-compliers.html

 

July 30, 2021

 

They're less open to new ideas, more extroverted, and driven by self-interests

 

People who purposefully breach COVID-19 regulations tend to share certain characteristics, finds a study of attitudes and behaviors in Australia, the UK, the US and Canada.

When people protested the COVID-19 lockdown in Sydney last week, many were speculating about whether a certain type of person was more likely to be involved. Does science back that up?

A new University of Sydney study assessed people’s behaviors and attitudes towards pandemic regulations in Australia, the UK, the US, and Canada. It found that roughly 10 percent^[1] of people were non-compliant.

Those individuals were mostly male, less agreeable (cooperative, considerate), less intellectual as a personality trait (less willing to try new experiences), and more extroverted.

Published in high-ranking journal PLOS ONE, the study also found that these people tended to prioritize freedom and their own self-interest. They also perceived their social culture as tolerant to variation in values and behavior, with greater tolerance for deviance. Contrary to the stereotype, most of them were not young.

They also tended to engage less with official sources, such as government announcements and news and engaged more in unhealthy coping strategies such as denial and substance use.

Edited January 23, 2022 by W. Niederhut

[paul maggio]

removed, already posted

Edited January 23, 2022 by paul maggio
already posted

[Tommy Tomlinson]

I just saw the Huckabee interview on Youtube. One of the most interesting points I almost missed was that he says that after Love Field, and the bowling alley they were stopped on Stemmons en route to Parkland, and had the car commandeered.

But he says it was by a member of the Secret Service on foot.

I guess he must have fallen out of one of the official cars, what with there not being any agents on foot that day?

 

And Ron, that song is one of the most under rated rock songs of all time. Saw him live in 1985 at the now legendary Knebworth 85 here in England that year. Mainly remembered for the rain... there was a LOT...

He and The Scorpions were supporting Deep Purple.  He had broken his leg and was in plaster, and during the Paradise set he chases the girl round the stage... The Knebworth stage was enormous, and she had to keep stopping to let him keep catching up.

Edited January 23, 2022 by Tommy Tomlinson