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Lone Nut arguments without the Single Bullet Theory being true?


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19 minutes ago, Jamey Flanagan said:

Was going back through some of the older threads on here today and ran across something peculiar. Not saying it is of any significance though but found it strange since earlier on here we had discussed a possible 45 slug found in Dealey Plaza. Anyway, someone had posted quotes from witnesses who had said that at least one of the shots sounded like a handgun and several who said the shots sounded like they came from inside the limo. I'm not trying to push this theory so just stay calm, lol! Anyway, the last quote was one of the Parkland doctors. I can't recall which one. When asked about the damage to Kennedy's skull he said it was the equivalent of someone shooting him in the head with a 45 caliber at close range. Not saying that happened of course, but I thought I would share that after my previous post.

See this: https://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/27014-buddy-walthers-widow-and-al-maddox-on-a-bullet-found-in-the-grass-south-of-elm-st/

 

There are many such artifacts and alleged artifacts in the Kennedy case. There isn't an all-encompassing essay on this, yet, but let's see if we can tally up all of the possible extra bullets and shrapnel:

Dallas County Records Building shell casing

Lester bullet

Rich Haythorne fragment

Barbee bullet

Roger Craig bullet

Mike Nally's uncle's bullet

The FBI's  .38 snubnose pistol

"James Files" grassy knoll shell casing

7.65 shell casing

Railroad fragment

Elm Street grass bullet

Gary Louck's alleged Sam Kinney limousine bullet

James Young limousine bullet

Paul Landis limousine bullet

Nurse Phyllis Hall "bullet lodged between his ear and shoulder" bullet

Dr. Robert Shaw's "bullet still in Connally's leg"

Henry Wade's Connally bullet

Audrey Bell's Connally fragments

Elizabeth Wright Connally fragments

Nolan's Connally bullet

Stinson's Connally bullet

Connally's "bullet from my body" clanking to the floor

Josiah Thompson's quote "I wish they would stop putting bullets on these stretchers"

Tomlinson, O.P. Wright, and Darrel Pool's (?) magic bullet

Johnsen and Rowley's magic bullet

Agent Behn's Johnsen magic bullet

Larry Newman bullet

Elmer Todd's magic bullet - without his initials?

National Archive photo "bullet claimed to have been removed" from the President's body

John Hunt's "third headshot fragment"

David Osbourne's JFK bullet

Jerrol Custer's JFK bullet

Paul O'Connor's fragment found in the President's "thorax"

Tom Robinson's JFK fragments

Dennis David's JFK fragments

Sibert and O'Neill's "missile" receipt

Belmont FBI memo on bullet "lodged behind the President's ear"

J. Edgar Hoover's bullets mentioned in memo

Honerable mentions: John Ebersole's "pellet" from when the President might have eaten "a duck or a rabbit", John Connally's Mexican Peso cufflink, JFK's shirt button (?), CE567 before the tissue sample was added (?), Walt Cakebread's substitute CE399(s) with different grooves (?), and all of the "millimeter or less" bullet fragments reportedly found by the pathologists.

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On 3/1/2022 at 7:40 PM, Micah Mileto said:

Belmont FBI memo on bullet "lodged behind the President's ear"

In that memo they state that the SS already have a bullet & are attempting to get the bullet behind his ear.

So you can mark that bullet down also.

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On 2/28/2022 at 1:02 AM, Micah Mileto said:

Going by that new 3D model, a straight-moving bullet going into Kennedy's upper back would end up hitting Connally. All of the 3d models show that. So I do not see the lone nut argument for separate shots unless one of the 6.5 rounds were undercharged for some reason. Maybe somebody could even try saying that a single assassin tried tampering with his ammunition in an unprofessional attempt at suppressing the noise of the shot(s).

but the 3D Model that John Orr has developed suggests that a bullet hitting JBC would have essentially circumcised him because of the trajectory and not gone into his wrist (full disclosure- i am one of the investors in this project).  

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From my understanding, reading what emergency room technicians have said, is that once a bullet enters a body it can go in practically any direction and will not always continue on the previous trajectory.

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, Lawrence Schnapf said:

but the 3D Model that John Orr has developed suggests that a bullet hitting JBC would have essentially circumcised him because of the trajectory and not gone into his wrist (full disclosure- i am one of the investors in this project).  

Thanks for your reply.

 

So it would seem that, not only does your 3D model refute the Single Bullet Theory, but it also refutes most other possible theories on the single assassin story. I was wondering, in the new 3D model, is there any opportunity for a clear shot from the Sixth Floor into Connally's official entry wound?

 

I can't help but envision a scenario in which the government finally admits the SBT isn't true but still tries to resurrect the single assassin story by theorizing that Oswald shot slow-moving bullets made by removing powder from Carcano ammunition. Yes, it would contradict the previous official interpretation of Connally's reactions Zapruder film, but conspiracy theorists have also came up with strange ideas on when Connally was hit in the Zapruder film, so maybe objections would be droned out, and seem to the average person as just quibbling over a blurry video.

Edited by Micah Mileto
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One can test any trajectory using the 3D model. I believe that the model suggests that Connolly may have been hit from somewhere other than the southeast corner of the sixth floor. However, we havemt drawn that trajectory since the focus is on the SBT. 

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20 minutes ago, Lawrence Schnapf said:

One can test any trajectory using the 3D model. I believe that the model suggests that Connolly may have been hit from somewhere other than the southeast corner of the sixth floor

Lawrence, does the 3D model include the Dal-Tex building, specifically the southern side and its eastern most windows.  I know I'm one of the few, if not the only one who believes this is the origin of at least one and probably two shots based on my reading of Howard Brennan's testimony and statement.  I won't go into details here as I know most have already judged Brennan and his descriptions as highly suspect.  I would however hope that someone with access/ability would test the validity of a shot from the 6th floor eastern most window of the Dal-Tex.  This would be an ideal location as I have posted about previously.  I have very limited ability to examine the premise due to age, income, distance and a variety of other issues.  I did use Google Earth to examine the view from Elm St. back to this window and found that (other than the elevated signs at the intersection) there were absolutely NO impediments to tracking the Presidential limo ALL the way to the triple underpass.

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Hi Richard- any shooting trajectory from any angle in Dealey Plaza can be tested with the 3D model.  Indeed, the Dal-Tex Building had probably the best angle for a gunman.  

Have you read Stephen Hunter's novel "Third Bullet"? it is premised on a gunman from the Dal-Tex Bldg.

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10 hours ago, Lawrence Schnapf said:

Have you read Stephen Hunter's novel "Third Bullet"? it is premised on a gunman from the Dal-Tex Bldg.

I have not as of yet.  I will look into it and hopefully find a copy.  I became intrigued with what Howard Brennan's statements, testimony, etc. had been and how they changed over time.  I got a copy of his book and read and reread everything I could find documented about him.  I tried to align them chronologically and clear my mind of all the interpretations provided by 3rd parties.  This, proved to be difficult as he made virtually no direct comments.  The official testimony and statements were pretty much it.  Even his book is ghostwritten so we are dealing with a 3rd party again.  His book provided much insight into his character, motivations and fundamental beliefs.  Unfortunately, the way I think and write, I could turn a short story into a novel the length of "War and Peace".  I will simply say, that upon compiling the information and trying to account for misinformation, misinterpretation and manipulation, there are underlying facts which betray how he has been portrayed and reveal important information.  This information, I think fits completely into the "professional and well planned hit" scenario and shows just how professional it was.

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43 minutes ago, Richard Price said:

I have not as of yet.  I will look into it and hopefully find a copy.  I became intrigued with what Howard Brennan's statements, testimony, etc. had been and how they changed over time.  I got a copy of his book and read and reread everything I could find documented about him.  I tried to align them chronologically and clear my mind of all the interpretations provided by 3rd parties.  This, proved to be difficult as he made virtually no direct comments.  The official testimony and statements were pretty much it.  Even his book is ghostwritten so we are dealing with a 3rd party again.  His book provided much insight into his character, motivations and fundamental beliefs.  Unfortunately, the way I think and write, I could turn a short story into a novel the length of "War and Peace".  I will simply say, that upon compiling the information and trying to account for misinformation, misinterpretation and manipulation, there are underlying facts which betray how he has been portrayed and reveal important information.  This information, I think fits completely into the "professional and well planned hit" scenario and shows just how professional it was.

The most overlooked fact about Brennan is that he ID'ed Oswald under the proviso Oswald was not wearing the shirt whose fibers were found on the rifle. In other words, the commission could either accept his ID of Oswald, or accept that Oswald was wearing that shirt during the shooting, but.not both.

That they tried to have it both ways is indicative of their prosecutor's zeal and is one of the strongest proofs the WC was a dog-and-pony show. That this simple and obvious fact has not been discussed on TV or in the mainstream press is an example of their willingness to push nonsense when it suits their purposes. 

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On 3/9/2022 at 10:12 AM, Pat Speer said:

The most overlooked fact about Brennan is that he ID'ed Oswald under the proviso Oswald was not wearing the shirt whose fibers were found on the rifle.

I think the most overlooked fact is that the original description of the shooter did not have on the same clothes AND - Mr. BRENNAN. Well, as it appeared to me he was STANDING UP and RESTING AGAINST THE LEFT WINDOW SILL, with gun shouldered to his right shoulder, holding the gun with his left hand and taking positive aim and fired his last shot.  Oswald OR any gunman could not have assumed this posture, the window, as verified by photos within seconds or minutes, was only open on the bottom about half way.  He also describes the man as continuing to stand in/near to the window until after the Presidential limousine had reached the triple underpass and then slowly disappearing from sight in the window.   I do not believe this description by Brennan is in error, I believe that it is correct and he is describing a different window in a different building (the Dal-Tex) and his overall statements are purposefully obfuscated/changed almost from the outset.  Along with this alteration/obfuscation, he was controlled by way of "men in suits with credentials" who appeared almost immediately and warned him of danger to him and his family because "he was the ONLY eyewitness of the assassin".  These men immediately started surveillance/following him and controlling his ability to speak with anyone about what he had seen.  He and his family were scared out of their wits and thought they were under "protection" against harm by unknown associates of the assassin.  These same men then used their control over Brennan and his family to keep him from making on the record statements, maneuvered him into a position in which his statements could be manipulated and used against him as though he was changing his story repeatedly in order to gain publicity.  He was not sophisticated enough to understand what they were doing.  In 1963, who among us would have been.  We trusted our government, our police, our officials, etc.  One last thought - before he was taken to Washington for Warren Commission testimony (which he DID NOT want to do, as he did not want publicity, he was too fearful for his family) - he had an "accident" in which his eyes were sandblasted thereby ruining his better than 20/20 eyesight and in my opinion sending him a message (go along with where you are led or something worse may happen to your or member(s) of your family.  He never spoke about exactly how this "accident" happened, to my knowledge and never sought publicity or acclaim.  Instead he sought isolation and tried to distance himself from the awful scene he witnessed because of searching out the perfect panoramic view of the Presidential motorcade.

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On 3/8/2022 at 7:02 PM, Lawrence Schnapf said:

Hi Richard- any shooting trajectory from any angle in Dealey Plaza can be tested with the 3D model.  Indeed, the Dal-Tex Building had probably the best angle for a gunman.  

Have you read Stephen Hunter's novel "Third Bullet"? it is premised on a gunman from the Dal-Tex Bldg.

I don't have a 3d model maker but using a slope angle calculator and the altitudes and distances from the West map and Google Earth I saw the line of sight from the throat shot at Fr 223 to Oswald's rifle continues back to the roof of the Dal Tex near the north west corner. If a roof shooter walked about 15 ft south they would clear the TSB and have a shot for fr 223. The trajectory would only vary from Oswald's by 2 or 3 degrees vertically and laterally. The close trajectories would make it impossible for a forensics investigation to tell the difference between the two, which would be great for setting up Oswald as a patsy.
I think the forensics could not determine the shooter location as the Dal Tex roof because for every 1/2 inch of variation on the  location of JFK's and JC's entry wound(where the wounds exist in space within the limo) there is a one degree change of trajectory. The Z film only allows for rough estimations of how much JC was rotated or leaning back or arching his back, so I  Assume we can only estimate the location of the entry wounds to within maybe 1 1/2 inches for each man or 3 degrees per man. That means there are  6 degrees of possible variance and a cone of possible trajectories would be 18 ft across by the time the cone lands on the 6th floor window. They could never establish the wound entry points accurately enough to  proof a shooter on the roof.
 

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