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Evidence that the bus transfer and unfired .38 rounds were never found on Oswald


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Posted (edited)

I found some documents that indicate that the bus transfer and unfired .38 rounds allegedly found on Oswald during a search by Detectives Richard Sims and Elmer Boyd may not have been found on him at all.

The first is an FBI teletype dated 2-3-64 that says that Oswald was "completely searched" by Detective Paul Bentley and "nothing was left in his pockets". It also contains verification of that by Capt. Fritz, who told the FBI that Oswald was "completely searched following his arrest."

 

105-82555-Sec-78-pg-14-1.png

The second document is from the HSCA interview with patrolman C.T. Walker. He told the HSCA that he searched Oswald when Oswald was brought in to Capt. Fritz's office. He told the HSCA interviewer that "I searched him good and found nothing".

image003.png

 

Both of these searches of Oswald took place BEFORE he was transferred by Sims and Boyd to the first lineup.

A third document, a report by Patrolman M.G. Hall, says that Hall assisted Sims and Boyd in that transfer, but makes no mention of any search of Oswald, nor does it mention them finding any bus transfer or unfired rounds.

 

mg-hall.jpg

 

So we have documents indicating that Oswald was searched TWICE before the transfer by Sims and Boyd. The first search resulted in his pockets being completely emptied. The second search verified that fact. This leads me to believe that the bus transfer and the unfired rounds allegedly found on Oswald were never found on him.

Edited by Gil Jesus
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So Walker says he removed a billfold (wallet) from LHO's pocket in custody, in the Dallas Police HQ. That billfold had two IDs, one for LHO and one for Hidell.

But supposedly that wallet had been removed from LHO's back pocket en route to DPD, after his arrest in the Texas Theater. 

Then Captain Fritz says they are looking for Lee Oswald. Is Fritz (unaware LHO is already in custody) saying out loud the DPD is looking for LHO due to a wallet found at the Tippit crime scene? Initially, the DPD was searching for LHO as a suspect in the Tippit murder. 

The whole LHO wallet story is a mash. 

 

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2 hours ago, Gil Jesus said:

I found some documents that indicate that the bus transfer and unfired .38 rounds allegedly found on Oswald during a search by Detectives Richard Sims and Elmer Boyd may not have been found on him at all.

The first is an FBI teletype dated 2-3-64 that says that Oswald was "completely searched" by Detective Paul Bentley and "nothing was left in his pockets". It also contains verification of that by Capt. Fritz, who told the FBI that Oswald was "completely searched following his arrest."

 

105-82555-Sec-78-pg-14-1.png

The second document is from the HSCA interview with patrolman C.T. Walker. He told the HSCA that he searched Oswald when Oswald was brought in to Capt. Fritz's office. He told the HSCA interviewer that "I searched him good and found nothing".

image003.png

 

Both of these searches of Oswald took place BEFORE he was transferred by Sims and Boyd to the first lineup.

A third document, a report by Patrolman M.G. Hall, says that Hall assisted Sims and Boyd in that transfer, but makes no mention of any search of Oswald, nor does it mention them finding any bus transfer or unfired rounds.

 

mg-hall.jpg

 

So we have documents indicating that Oswald was searched TWICE before the transfer by Sims and Boyd. The first search resulted in his pockets being completely emptied. The second search verified that fact. This leads me to believe that the bus transfer and the unfired rounds allegedly found on Oswald were never found on him.

Could the first document be read differently in that, following the search of LHO's trousers, anything that was found was removed, leaving the pockets empty (though the piece of paper mentioned in the first paragraph was missed)?

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6 hours ago, Ian Lloyd said:

Could the first document be read differently in that, following the search of LHO's trousers, anything that was found was removed, leaving the pockets empty (though the piece of paper mentioned in the first paragraph was missed)?

I suppose you can interpret it however you want to, but I don't see any mention of trousers. It said his pockets were searched. Normal police porcedure would have been to have the suspect empty all of his pockets, shirt and pants and then search him to make sure he wasn't holding anything he didn't want you to see. It's obvious to me that BOTH searches of his pockets that didn't turn up the five unfired .38 rounds or the bus transfer means they weren't there.

It's not rocket science. He never had them. The cops lied.

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9 hours ago, Gil Jesus said:

I found some documents that indicate that the bus transfer and unfired .38 rounds allegedly found on Oswald during a search by Detectives Richard Sims and Elmer Boyd may not have been found on him at all.

 

Gil,

You may be interested in this:

There are two versions of Fritz's interview with Oswald in the DPD Archives. One is in Box 1 and another is in Box 15 of the old DPD Archives.

1) Interrogation, by an unknown author. Typed rough draft with handwritten corrections pertaining to the interrogation of Lee Harvey Oswald, (Original), date unknown. This was in DPD Archives Box 1, Folder# 15, Item# 1. Consists of 12 pages. This is the version of the Interrogation that has stenographer's notes.

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=217800#relPageId=546

On page 550 of the pdf file, there is a handwritten not concerning the bus transfer allegedly found in Oswald’s pocket

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=217800#relPageId=550

Page 550.

This note was inserted into the Report concerning the interrogation that took place at 10:25 on Saturday morning.

2) Interrogation, by J. W. Fritz. Draft of the interrogation of Lee Harvey Oswald, (Photocopy) Poor Quality), date unknown DPD Archives, Box 15, Folder# 1, Item# 111.

This consists of 13 pages. By starting new paragraphs as called for in the draft in Box 1, this version has been extended to 13 pages. You can also see the differences between page 5 in Box1 and page 6 in Box 15 where Fritz wanted language added about the bus transfer in Oswald's pocket. This tells me that the draft in Box 1 came first.

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=217813#relPageId=157

(page 6 of the Interrogation, page 162 of the pdf file).

689295535_bustransfer(3).thumb.jpg.b6f69996f6f4df61401c0118e22d6c21.jpg

 

Steve Thomas

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5 hours ago, Ron Bulman said:

38 rounds, in any pocket would be difficult to miss in any decent search.  A thin cardboard (not paper) buss transfer missed 3x(?) possible but not likely?

Ron,

Did you notice that Fritz mentioned the bus transfer, but neglected to mention the bullets?

Was there something hincky about the bullets that Fritz knew would never stand up in court? I think any good defense lawyer would, make hay with just what you mentioned.

Steve Thomas

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Steve Thomas said:

Ron,

Did you notice that Fritz mentioned the bus transfer, but neglected to mention the bullets?

Was there something hincky about the bullets that Fritz knew would never stand up in court? I think any good defense lawyer would, make hay with just what you mentioned.

Steve Thomas

Someone's lying, either Fritz or

Sims perjured himself because he said HE found the transfer and Boyd found the rounds as they searched Oswald in the showup room. ( 7 H 173 ) 
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh7/html/WC_Vol7_0091a.htm

Boyd also committed perjury because his story matches Sims, in as much as they searched Oswald on the way to the lineup and he found the rounds
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh7/html/WC_Vol7_0067b.htm ( 7 H 126 )

Who searched Oswald and when he was searched is vital in determining whether the evidence is legit or planted.

I believe that all three are lying. Why would I say that ?

Because Bentley and Hall were never called to give testimony and CT Walker was never asked if he searched Oswald.

Looks to me like the WC went out of their way to keep the details of these searches of Bentley and Walker out of the public record.

 

 

Edited by Gil Jesus
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9 hours ago, Ron Bulman said:

38 rounds, in any pocket would be difficult to miss in any decent search.  A thin cardboard (not paper) buss transfer missed 3x(?) possible but not likely?

And you make an excellent point. Take five .38 unfired rounds and put them in your left front pants pocket, then proceed to "pat" yourself down and see if you can feel those rounds. This is not something they could have missed even if they searched him at the Texas Theater or they searched his pockets in the car. 

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So, the bus transfer was found two hours after Oswald's arrest in his shirt pocket, after his second frisk by Boyd & Sims.

Didn't Oswald change his shirt at his rooming house, or is that story just more uncorroborated confusion?

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10 minutes ago, Gil Jesus said:

Yes, he changed his shirt.

https://gil-jesus.com/?page_id=1618

Nice one Gil, so the next question is:- Did DPD search team purportedly find the bus transfer in the pocket of CE151?

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2 hours ago, Gil Jesus said:

Yes, he changed his shirt.

https://gil-jesus.com/?page_id=1618

https://www.jfk-assassination.net/russ/testimony/bledsoe.htm

Mr. BALL - Now, I have got a piece of clothing here, which is marked---
Mrs. BLEDSOE - That is it.
Mr. BALL - Commission Exhibit 150.
Mrs. BLEDSOE - That is it.
Mr. BALL - This is a shirt.
Mrs. BLEDSOE - That is it.
Mr. BALL - What do you mean by "that is it?"
Mrs. BLEDSOE - Because they brought it out to the house and showed it.
Mr. BALL - I know. What do you mean by "that is it?"
Mrs. BLEDSOE - Well, because I can recognize it.
Mr. BALL - Recognize it as what?
Mrs. BLEDSOE - Yes, sir; see there?
Mr. BALL - Yes. You tell me what do you see here? What permits you to recognize it?
Mrs. BLEDSOE - I recognize---first thing I notice the elbow is out and then I saw---when the man brought it out and let me see it?
Mr. BALL - No, I am talking about---I am showing you this shirt now, and you said, "That is it." You mean---What do you mean by "that is it"?
Mrs. BLEDSOE - That is the one he had out there that day?
Mr. BALL - Who had it out there?
Mrs. BLEDSOE - Some Secret Service man.
Mr. BALL - He brought it out. Now, I am---you have seen this shirt then before?
Mrs. BLEDSOE - Yes.
Mr. BALL - It was brought out by the Secret Service man and shown to you?
Mrs. BLEDSOE - Yes.
Mr. BALL - Had you ever seen the shirt before that?
Mrs. BLEDSOE - Well---
Mr. BALL - Have you?
Mrs. BLEDSOE - No; he had it on, though.

Steve Thomas

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