Shaw and Ferrie

[James DiEugenio]

Denis, please you do not even know how Roache and Smith got into this?

[James DiEugenio]

Denis, the man who trusts Fred Litwin on Ferrie.

 

From part 1 of my review of Fred's ridiculous book on New Orleans:

From the day of the assassination, Ferrie was looking for evidence that would link him to Oswald. In the wake of the assassination, this happened three times. On the day of the assassination, he went to Oswald’s former landlady, Jesse Garner. He wanted to know if anyone had been to her home referring to his library card being found on Oswald. (HSCA interview of 2/20/78) Within days of the assassination he repeated this question with a Mrs. Doris Eames. Again, he wanted to know if Oswald, who her husband had talked to at the library, had shown him Ferrie’s library card. (NODA memorandum of Sciambra to Garrison, 3/1/68) On November 27^th, Ferrie was on the phone calling the home of his former CAP student Roy McCoy. He wanted to know if there were any photos at the house depicting Ferrie in the CAP. He also asked if the name “Oswald” rang a bell. Mr. McCoy called the FBI about this episode and he quite naturally told them he thought that Ferrie was looking for evidence that would depict him with Oswald. (FBI report of 11/27/63)

Attorneys call this kind of behavior “consciousness of guilt”. But that does not just refer to Ferrie, it also refers to the FBI. With the report by Mr. McCoy they knew Ferrie was lying to them. It is a crime to lie to an FBI agent while you are under investigation. The fact that Ferrie committed perjury did not interest J. Edgar Hoover. If it had, with a little initiative, he would have discovered the other instances indicating the lie, and he would have found the picture revealing Ferrie with Oswald that PBS discovered in 1993. What this clearly shows is that Hoover was not interested in the Kennedy case. In other words, right after Kennedy was killed, Ferrie was lying on numerous material points, and the FBI was covering up for him.

Try and find any of this in Litwin’s book. Let me know when you locate it.

Edited November 9, 2022 by James DiEugenio

[Tom Gram]

1 hour ago, Denis Morissette said:

Fred L. told me Roache said that Ferrie, not Oswald had an office. So I’ll go with that.

I reviewed the files on Roache and he said both had an office. In the first call Ferrie isn’t even mentioned and Roache was talking about Oswald. In the second call he said that Ferrie had an office on a side street between Camp and St. Charles. 544 Camp is directly at the end of a side street that runs between St. Charles and Camp. 

My phone isn’t letting me post the direct link but the file for the first call is called Paul Wallach 3-11-75. (Nov. 3rd)  

https://drive.google.com/drive/mobile/folders/1RrTiwCzJSUFQIjPYvkpBkABwR1dDC291/1NWaDwu6kghbuDt2oKukOyRzTHncvPq2A?sort=13&direction=a

[James DiEugenio]

Nice one Tom.  Isn't that just like Fred.  

Denis, ask Fred why what I posted above is not in his book. Thanks.

Then ask him why he libeled me.  He will know what you are speaking about.

 

Let us know what he said on both OK?

Edited November 9, 2022 by James DiEugenio

[Benjamin Cole]

The FBI and Warren Commission had more leads than a blind dog in a meat house...but followed them up even less effectively. 

[Tom Gram]

10 hours ago, Denis Morissette said:

Has Garrison ever talked to Roache?

Garrison didn’t know he existed, but Roache mentioned Garrison in his second call with Wallach.

He added that “Garrison had something; I read his reports in the newspaper and they were correct, he received good intelligence information, whether he was using it for politics or not.” Roache also noted that (1) Garrison was all eyes and ears in the French Quarter and (2) that he had heard Ferrie was running when he was killed. 

Recall that this is a veteran INS investigator who was still with the agency at the time of this interview, not some crackpot off the street. They put a lid on him real quick - and minus a handful of surviving documents, the entire investigative record of the INS/Customs investigation subsequently disappeared, including the executive session testimony of Orestes Pena, Roache, and at least two of Roache’s colleagues from the NOLA INS investigative division. But I’m sure there’s an innocent explanation, right? Not a chance in hell. 

Edited November 9, 2022 by Tom Gram

[Benjamin Cole]

8 minutes ago, Tom Gram said:

Garrison didn’t know he existed, but the Roache mentioned Garrison in his second call with Wallach.

He added that “Garrison had something; I read his reports in the newspaper and they were correct, he received good intelligence information, whether he was using it for politics or not.” Roache also noted that (1) Garrison was all eyes and ears in the French Quarter and (2) that he had heard Ferrie was running when he was killed. 

Recall that this is a veteran INS investigator who was still with the agency at the time of this interview, not some crackpot off the street. They put a lid on him real quick - and minus a handful of surviving documents, the entire investigative record of the INS/Customs investigation subsequently disappeared, including the executive session testimony of Orestes Pena, Roache, and at least two of Roache’s colleagues from the NOLA INS investigative division. But I’m sure there’s an innocent explanation, right? Not a chance in hell. 

I have heard about this. Unbelievable. 

[James DiEugenio]

Years ago, when Joan Mellen was still active in this case, she confronted Tunheim about this very fact at one of Wecht's conferences..

 

She said, what the heck happened to the Customs and INS documents from the Church Committee.  She said, most of them appear to be gone.  Tunheim did not have any kind of strong reply.

 

But we know that Gochenaur's stuff also disappeared from the Church Committee.  ANd he said there was a strong Pentagon presence in the Church committee.

[Denis Morissette]

James…

https://www.onthetrailofdelusion.com/post/my-so-called-libel-of-james-dieugenio

[James DiEugenio]

Denis, I have learned a long time ago not to read Litwin or Roe.  I demolished Litwin in five consecutive days--all three of his books-- on my web site and he never got over it. You can read that of course, but you will not. Roe wrote one of the worst pieces of BS I have ever read anywhere in this case about Sebastian LaTona, in order to knock Stone's film.  It was utterly disgusting.

The fact that you and Jonathan Cohen read them is something that you two have to abide by in your own moral universe.  Apparently you have.

I read Litwin's books and I quote him accurately.  The reason he did what he did was that he wanted to get a twofer.  That is he wanted to nail both me and Oliver, since Oliver trusted me on the JFK case.  You can buy any BS excuse you wish.  Again, that is your moral universe.

But its not mine.  So now that your are a proven courier for Fred,  I can put you on ignore. Along with DVP, Parnell and Roe.   I should have done it earlier

Edited November 11, 2022 by James DiEugenio

[Denis Morissette]

Don’t question my moral. Truth is my only client.

[Paul Brancato]

On 11/8/2022 at 7:14 PM, James DiEugenio said:

Denis, the man who trusts Fred Litwin on Ferrie.

 

From part 1 of my review of Fred's ridiculous book on New Orleans:

From the day of the assassination, Ferrie was looking for evidence that would link him to Oswald. In the wake of the assassination, this happened three times. On the day of the assassination, he went to Oswald’s former landlady, Jesse Garner. He wanted to know if anyone had been to her home referring to his library card being found on Oswald. (HSCA interview of 2/20/78) Within days of the assassination he repeated this question with a Mrs. Doris Eames. Again, he wanted to know if Oswald, who her husband had talked to at the library, had shown him Ferrie’s library card. (NODA memorandum of Sciambra to Garrison, 3/1/68) On November 27^th, Ferrie was on the phone calling the home of his former CAP student Roy McCoy. He wanted to know if there were any photos at the house depicting Ferrie in the CAP. He also asked if the name “Oswald” rang a bell. Mr. McCoy called the FBI about this episode and he quite naturally told them he thought that Ferrie was looking for evidence that would depict him with Oswald. (FBI report of 11/27/63)

Attorneys call this kind of behavior “consciousness of guilt”. But that does not just refer to Ferrie, it also refers to the FBI. With the report by Mr. McCoy they knew Ferrie was lying to them. It is a crime to lie to an FBI agent while you are under investigation. The fact that Ferrie committed perjury did not interest J. Edgar Hoover. If it had, with a little initiative, he would have discovered the other instances indicating the lie, and he would have found the picture revealing Ferrie with Oswald that PBS discovered in 1993. What this clearly shows is that Hoover was not interested in the Kennedy case. In other words, right after Kennedy was killed, Ferrie was lying on numerous material points, and the FBI was covering up for him.

Try and find any of this in Litwin’s book. Let me know when you locate it.

I haven’t read any Litwin. 
referring to Ferrie, if he had been involved in the assassination in some way it makes no sense that he would wait until after the deed was done to start worrying about paper or picture trails leading from himself to LHO. If he had any brains he would have taken care to cover his tracks beforehand. 

[James DiEugenio]

Paul:

Smart about Litwin.  Since I read and reviewed all three of his books, I understand he is a neocon all the way.  Anyone who can discuss Bush's invasion of Iraq and never mention that 650,000 Iraqi civilians were killed over a lie, well that is up there with Kagan and PNAC.

As for Ferrie, I have gone through this with Shaw already.

Shaw did not understand just what the nature of the plot was. Which is why he called Andrews.

Same with Ferrie.  He did not either, since it was compartmentalized. 

Do you think they knew about Mexico City? I don't.

[James DiEugenio]

Paul deserves an expanded answer, since he is one of the  good guys on this forum.

After it was all over and Shaw was acquitted, Garrison gave an interview to a member of the foreign press.  At this point he did not want to talk to the American media.

This is what he said about the case and his concept of it.  He said his idea of the JFK assassination had gone through a radical reconfiguration.  He now thought the plot was much bigger and bolder than when he started.  He drew a figure of a parallelogram and he said there were four corners that the top level of the conspiracy had mapped out.

1. New Orleans

2. Dallas

3. Mexico City

4. Washington

He just had the one corner, and since the plot was compartmentalized, it was difficult to connect one to the other.  Although, I will say this, almost accidentally, Garrison gave us a window into step 4, with the testimony of Pierre Finck. But of course, the four corners were independent and not knowledgeable of each other. Only the  conspirators at the top level would know of it.

I have come to think that he was correct about this.  And it corresponds with a letter he wrote to the HSCA's Jon Blackmer in 1977, which I began my review of Charles Brandt with.  Garrison said, you will not solve the case by regular police investigative methods. You had to keep peeling back and peeling back and then redraw your working model over the new evidence-- until you found one that fit it all.  

I think his parallelogram does it.

 

 

Edited November 12, 2022 by James DiEugenio

[Paul Brancato]

That makes a lot of sense. Shaw and Ferrie were involved with setting up Oswald but it looks like they didn’t have the full picture and were caught unawares. As Mort Sahl said to me backstage after one of his last talks in Mill Valley before he passed away, Garrison was a true American hero. He had the courage to pursue the truth in the face of monumental obstruction.