A Response To DiEugenio's "Dale Myers and his World of Illusion"

[David Josephs]

21 hours ago, Mike Kiely said:

Of all familiar aspects of the case that Michael mentions, the toot-toot outside the rooming house has always been a stand-out. It just isn't something that you can argue Earlene Roberts 'imagined'. And if she didn't, then in all the post-assassination frenzy to reassign patrol cars, who from the DPD had the time to cruise down N Beckley and say 'hi' to Mrs Roberts via their car horn? Michael assigns this toot-toot to Tippit; now, while I've never seen a convincing argument it was Tippit; equally, I've never seen one to say it wasn't. Add the fact of a tunic hanging up inside the car at 10th and Patton to, perhaps, explain Mrs Robert's testimony that she saw two men in the patrol car, and there's more than a whiff of Occam's Razor about this incident. Or perhaps I just need to grow up.

Hi Mike...  There are so many open cans of worms in just this one paragraph.  

You might consider that it was WESTBROOK and CROY in that car, and the car which is in the driveway at a "T" to where Tippit stopped.

It is WESTBROOK who tries to explain away the car that was identified as being at the Beckley address around 1pm

Toot- toot !

(PS... WESTBROOK lied his butt off in many, many areas... not least of which was Ruby's gaining entrance and shooting Oswald under the DPD). Another topic for another conversation

DJ

[Bill Brown]

3 hours ago, David Josephs said:

Hi Mike...  There are so many open cans of worms in just this one paragraph.  

You might consider that it was WESTBROOK and CROY in that car, and the car which is in the driveway at a "T" to where Tippit stopped.

It is WESTBROOK who tries to explain away the car that was identified as being at the Beckley address around 1pm

Toot- toot !

(PS... WESTBROOK lied his butt off in many, many areas... not least of which was Ruby's gaining entrance and shooting Oswald under the DPD). Another topic for another conversation

DJ

 

Holan didn't live on Tenth Street.  She lived halfway down Patton between Tenth and Jefferson and she wouldn't have seen any such car in the driveway on Tenth.

 

Do you believe everything Mike Brownlow tells you, David?

[Michael Griffith]

19 minutes ago, Bill Brown said:

 

Holan didn't live on Tenth Street.  She lived halfway down Patton between Tenth and Jefferson and she wouldn't have seen any such car in the driveway on Tenth.

Do you believe everything Mike Brownlow tells you, David?

So are you saying that SMU Professor Pulte was lying when he said he attended one of Brownlow's two meetings with Doris Holan? 

Holan lived at 409 E. Tenth Street, and even Myers allows that Ms. Holan may have been home when the shooting occurred.

Furthermore, Holan may have had a view of the Tippit murder scene from her second-floor apartment. Some of her apartment's windows did face toward the 10th and Patton intersection. Overhead and street-level photos of the Tippit shooting scene suggest that Holan may have been able to see the scene. 

[Bill Brown]

9 minutes ago, Michael Griffith said:

So are you saying that SMU Professor Pulte was lying when he said he attended one of Brownlow's two meetings with Doris Holan? 

Holan lived at 409 E. Tenth Street, and even Myers allows that Ms. Holan may have been home when the shooting occurred.

Furthermore, Holan may have had a view of the Tippit murder scene from her second-floor apartment. Some of her apartment's windows did face toward the 10th and Patton intersection. Overhead and street-level photos of the Tippit shooting scene suggest that Holan may have been able to see the scene. 

 

"Holan lived at 409 E. Tenth Street"

 

No.  She did not.

 

[Matthew Koch]

On 11/16/2022 at 3:50 PM, Bill Brown said:

A common sense, fact-filled response to DiEugenio's nonsense:

 

http://jfkfiles.blogspot.com/2022/11/the-single-bullet-fact.html

Hard to believe that no one posted Dale Myers Kryptonite.. Bob Harris 

Dale Myers was debunked in Beyond the Magic Bullet, you've seen that, right Bill? 

 

Edited November 29, 2022 by Matthew Koch

[Bill Brown]

1 hour ago, Matthew Koch said:

Hard to believe that no one posted Dale Myers Kryptonite.. Bob Harris 

Dale Myers was debunked in Beyond the Magic Bullet, you've seen that, right Bill? 

 

 

From the Dale Myers blog:

 

Robert Harris "manages to prove how little he knows about my computer work, photography and geometric relations, and the Kennedy assassination in general in less than six minutes."

 

"Apparently Mr. Harris never heard of (or understands) the underlying principle of photogrammetry, which in essence shows that it is impossible to project three dimensional lines in space onto two dimensional photographs without taking into account the location and angle of both known vantage points. By some wizardry unknown to human science, Mr. Harris is able to do both."

 

https://jfkfiles.blogspot.com/2008/08/youtube-pied-pipers.html

 

Edited November 29, 2022 by Bill Brown

[Matthew Koch]

1 hour ago, Bill Brown said:

 

From the Dale Myers blog:

 

Robert Harris "manages to prove how little he knows about my computer work, photography and geometric relations, and the Kennedy assassination in general in less than six minutes."

 

"Apparently Mr. Harris never heard of (or understands) the underlying principle of photogrammetry, which in essence shows that it is impossible to project three dimensional lines in space onto two dimensional photographs without taking into account the location and angle of both known vantage points. By some wizardry unknown to human science, Mr. Harris is able to do both.

 

https://jfkfiles.blogspot.com/2008/08/youtube-pied-pipers.html

 

Speaking of Wizardry Bill, Connally and JFK are roughly the same size. Why are they not represented like that in Dale Myers recreation? Because if Dale Myers did this accurately we would see that the shot won't line up with the armpit area it hits Connally in the lower back. Hence it was debunked in their own episode!

Bill can you guess why they didn't put a skeleton in the Connally Ballistic Dummy? 

 

Edited November 29, 2022 by Matthew Koch

[David Josephs]

1 hour ago, Bill Brown said:

 

"Holan lived at 409 E. Tenth Street"

 

No.  She did not.

 

Please provide any supporting evidence that leads you to that statement.... 
Saying it without sourcing is like not saying it at all BB.

 

Armstrong and I have been researching the Tippit murder for more years than you've been alive and he too found out that HOLAN lived directly across the street from the murder..

 

Even Dale Myers calls out the 409 10th Street address with a footnote to the source.

[17] Interview of Lad A. Holan, Jr., March 26, 2021, Pt.2, p.25

[Bob Ness]

36 minutes ago, Bill Brown said:

... without taking into account the location and angle of both known vantage points

What does this mean? Can you explain?

IOW what vantage points is he talking about?

Edited November 29, 2022 by Bob Ness

[Bill Brown]

38 minutes ago, David Josephs said:

Please provide any supporting evidence that leads you to that statement.... 
Saying it without sourcing is like not saying it at all BB.

 

Armstrong and I have been researching the Tippit murder for more years than you've been alive and he too found out that HOLAN lived directly across the street from the murder..

 

Even Dale Myers calls out the 409 10th Street address with a footnote to the source.

[17] Interview of Lad A. Holan, Jr., March 26, 2021, Pt.2, p.25

 

https://jfkfiles.blogspot.com/2020/11/doris-e-holan-and-tippit-murder.html

[Tom Gram]

5 hours ago, Bill Brown said:

 

https://jfkfiles.blogspot.com/2020/11/doris-e-holan-and-tippit-murder.html

Maybe I’m wrong, and I don’t know much about this story, but a quick browse through that article suggests that Myers’ only source for the Holans moving from 409 10th St. in September ‘63 is his 2021 interview with Lad Holan - hardly conclusive evidence, especially when Myers’ footnote to that claim states the following: 

[31] Ibid., p.4 [NOTE: According to one family member, the Holan family was living at 113 ½ S. Patton by September, 1963, although the exact date could not be confirmed by other family members.]

Edited November 30, 2022 by Tom Gram

[Bob Ness]

6 hours ago, Bill Brown said:

... without taking into account the location and angle of both known vantage points.

I'm still really curious about the "vantage points" Bill. Can you answer that or is that described on his blog? If not, that's ok, it just seems those two would be very important to determine how reliable his conclusion was.

[James DiEugenio]

On 11/28/2022 at 1:53 PM, David G. Healy said:

lmao... why respond to anything/anyone trying to push the validity of a Saturday Morning Cartoon? -Or,- trying to make hay out of a tragic, albeit cop's 11/22/63 murder on the streets of Dallas...?

And "It should be noted," 21,557 day's have passed since the Kennedy Assassination and right-wing whack jobs STILL can't prove LHO did it all by his lonesome...  Get-a-grip!

LOL, thanks Dave.

I thought Myers' reply was so off the wall juvenile it did not deserve a counter. 

For example, I asked Mantik again about that phone call.  For the third time he said he does not recall any phone call or message from Dale.

As per the thing about his so called simulation, I thought I took care of this when I compared him to Henry Lee.  Lee would be allowed to testify in court about this issue.  This is what would happen with Dale:

Judge: Sir, where did you get your medical degree?

Dale: I did not.

Judge: How many classes did you take in anatomy?

Dale: I have not.

Judge: Have you done any E room work, or observations of bullets in bodies with doctors who are surgeons?

Dale: Uh no.  But I read John Latimer's book.

Judge: Who is that?

Dale: He was a urolgoist.

Loud giggling in the court room.

Judge: Order in the court. Sir, how could I possibly even begin to approve your testimony as a CSI reconstruction expert?  Especially as opposed to Dr.Lee? I mean what are you even doing here?

And this is what I think of Myers' reply. Mr. Single Bullet Fact has no clothes.

I also posted elsewhere the Don Thomas reply to Dale's long report on the acoustics, you know the 200 mph Don Garlits motorcycle. As per Tippit I stand by what i said.  We showed in the film that Oswald did not shoot Kennedy. And we did it via court room evidence with professionals who would be allowed to testify. If Oswald did not shoot Kennedy, why would he shoot Tippit?  

PS Did everyone notice that Dale did the same thing with Holan that he did with Edgar Tippit? When Edgar proved to be problematic, after Joe's book came out, he consults a family member in order to discredit him. Well take a look at what he did with Doris, he waited what? Only 58 years. LOL 

Edited November 30, 2022 by James DiEugenio

[David G. Healy]

"he was a urologist".... lmfao!

[Tom Gram]

5 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

PS Did everyone notice that Dale did the same thing with Holan that he did with Edgar Tippit? When Edgar proved to be problematic, after Joe's book came out, he consults a family member in order to discredit him. Well take a look at what he did with Doris, he waited what? Only 58 years. LOL 

Absolutely - but I was thinking of a slightly different angle. Myers presents the information obtained during his interview of Lad Holan as absolute fact in his article even though his own footnote says that other family members could not confirm the Sept. ‘63 move date from 409 10th St.

Basically, according to Myers, we should trust unconditionally the decades-old recollections of anyone who supports his thesis that Oswald did it but reject the recollections of someone like Edgar Lee Tippit. 

Myers gets a point for the accurate footnote, but anyone reading the article that didn’t know any better (or that believes everything Myers says like BB) would think the Sept. ‘63 move was settled history - when in fact it is ambiguous information obtained from a sole source over half a century later with zero corroboration. That’s pretty bad, IMO.