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Sandy Larsen

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The new secret 'over the top' plan on how fascists could win in 2024

by Thom Hartmann February 28, 2024

https://www.rawstory.com/gop-2024-plan/

 

First, Republicans need to make sure they’re in control of the House of Representatives on January 6th, 2025, when the new president will be certified.

To do that, even though Democrats might have won enough seats to take back the House in the 2024 election, Speaker Johnson will refuse to swear into Congress on January 3rd a handful of those Democrats, claiming there are “irregularities” in their elections that must be first investigated.

Consider that Johnson is still refusing to swear in Tom Suozzi (who recently won George Santos’ old seat), something Johnson apparently did to maintain enough Republican-majority votes to impeach Alejandro Mayorkas. (Johnson says they’ll swear him in this coming Thursday, but nobody’s holding their breath.)

That keeps Speaker “MAGA Moscow Mike” Johnson in charge of the House, so they can also refuse to accept the Electoral College certificates of election from a handful of states where they claim there are “problems.”

Keep in mind, Johnson was the guy who organized the wave of 138 House members who voted not to certify Joe Biden’s election in January of 2020. That’s why Trump wanted him as speaker.

Then, regardless of how many votes Biden won by, electoral or popular, the House simply refuses to certify the electoral college votes of enough states that the minimum of 270 isn’t reached. Under the 12th Amendment, like with the election of 1876, that throws the election to the House, where each state has one vote.

 

Steve Thomas


 

 

 

 

 

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On 2/27/2024 at 12:16 AM, Sandy Larsen said:

 

Ah, okay. You were referring to the first of the Ten Commandments.

I don't think of the Ten Commandments as being Christian. I think of them as being part of the Old Law that was fulfilled and obsoleted with the Coming of Christ.

 

 

I've always just assumed that the Israeli Jews tended to be devout. I mean, why else would they choose to live there?

But now we have new generations of Israeli Jews. And I guess they have become less religious.

There is good reason for me to think that Jews are more religious than others. The fact that they tend to be much more successful than other peoples. Only 2% of Americans are Jews, and yet you see successful ones all the time in the news.

And so I've wondered what it is about Jews that makes them so successful. The only thing I could think of that would be common among them all is their religion. I thought it was their religious teachings that led to their being successful.

But maybe they tend to be successful merely because they are the Chosen People. God favors them.

 

 

I grew up in a Mormon household in the center of Mormonism, but have been agnostic most my life. I didn't think there was any way to prove there is a god, etc.

I became a believing Christian ten or fifteen years ago, when I discovered what I believe is proof that Jesus rose from the dead. I have also identified Old Testament prophesies that were were fulfilled with amazing accuracy.

Also, several years ago I learned that there actually is proof of a god. Amazingly, even Steven Hawking (among numerous other physicists) knew/know the proof, but may not have realized it as such.

 

I've been wondering whether to comment on this. Kathy may come on the forum and stop our discussion  and say "it's just gets too personal because after all, that's what religion does and is not appropriate on the forum."
I actually have no personal attachment, and  resent talking about it about as much as caring about how Michigan and Wisconsin vote in the primaries. 
But I do have serious problems in what I see as a very parochial "homeboy" religious  hypocrisy in statements both you and W. have made.
 
Sandy:Wondering how Israeli Jews could justify their excessive response to the Oct. 7 Hamas attack, I did some digging and discovered that a 2015 Gallup survey determined that 65% of Israelis say they are either "not religious" or are "convinced atheists", while only 30% say they are "religious". That may explain it. Of course, even religious Israelis could be not living their religion.
 
 "That may explain it." ? Explain what? Sandy please explain the point you're trying to make here.   That they're committing genocide because they're not religious, like you ? 
I'm turning this around on you. Policy wise I think many Israelis are like you and do not like the genocide but they don't want a ceasefire. In their case, it's more understandable. They were attacked. We in the U.S. have lost nothing. You see IMO, despite your proclaimed religiosity, you're position is not near as justified as the typical Israeli. You've lost nothing! Just to give an alternative view. Should I hold the fact that you're religious against you, like you do the non religious Jews? That is that you are similar to them in that you don't like genocide but are not ready for a ceasefire?
 

You understand, I'm not arguing about your viewpoint on a ceasefire.. I'm just arguing against, what I see as  the parochial religious hypocrisy of your statement.

 

*****
 
and now W.
 
Most Americans don't know about the Orthodox Jewish custom of spitting on Orthodox Christian priests and bishops in Israel.  But I have known Orthodox Christian priests who have been spat upon there.  The Talmud has always taught that Christ and Christians are an abomination.  Someone needs to tell the bad news to Trump's clueless Evangelicals.
 
Once in a while W. makes these old world one way cookie cutter comments that are designed to inflame, .
 
Oh, thanks for informing us about that W. This sort of one sided trash talk between religions is exactly why religions will never transform anything and are politically so destructive. Yeah, and that should  even the score  toward Christians who only recently in history slaughtered 6 million of them? That's about all the retribution they're entitled to, the teeniest  minority of them spitting on Christian clergy in their own land? You sound like Donald Trump, W.   Ahhhh such indignity!!
 
W. the Talmud teaches that non-Jews, the Goyim, have the spiritual status of beasts!  The Goyim are considered unclean,
 
W. thanks for, as usual  getting sucked right into the middle of it, and increasing the separation. Again this perfectly illustrates my point about the horrendous political record of religion throughout the centuries. I was asking you politically speaking, to this day, has the net political effect of religion on  humanity, been anything other than horrendous? And I don't see it getting any better.
.
As if the Christian hands are clean, and the reverse hasn't happened many times throughout history. All religion has been used to oppress other religions and humanity over millennia. Ignoring the holocaust by saying that Hitler wasn't a true Christian is Christian BS! And any assertion that someone's hands are  clean because in this case, they're  Christian and not a Catholic perfectly reflects the cowardice in the U.S. by the traditional Christian churches to take any kind of stand against the evangelicals, or the present genocide in Gaza. Again, where is the Christian outrage?. Their attitude is, "Hey, it's not my problem."
 
Whatever forces for good the largest  religion in the world was, they were silent during WWll. To be clear W. your 1937 Pope Pious Xl secret communique with Hitler is rendered completely irrelevant by what happened just 5 years later, when Hitler comes to the doorstep of the Vatican in Rome and snatches 1200 Jews from their grasp, and takes them to Auschwitz, and when the Pope asked his German Ambassador if the Catholic Church can secretly make a protest  to Germany, the Ambassador tells him he probably shouldn't and the Pope obeys. I asked you the question, since they knew what was going on, what good are they if they have no real courage?
 
I see these comments as reflecting a lot of phony piety. I find it ironic that both Popes coming and entering WWll were named Pious!  i guess that was because piousness was their specialty?
Isn't it interesting  not many people are named "Pious" anymore?
 
heh heh
 
 
 
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Kirk,

   Like most Americans and Western Europeans, you're a walking case of Dunning-Kruger syndrome when it comes to understanding the Babylonian Talmud and the 2,000 year history of Eastern Christianity-- too ignorant to recognize your profound ignorance.  What Netanyahu is doing in Gaza is, basically Talmudic-- destroying the unclean Goyim for the benefit of Israel.  I'm simply saying the quiet part out loud.

   You also haven't studied history in sufficient depth to learn that the worst genocides in modern world history were all perpetrated by anti-Christian atheists -- 1) Joseph Stalin, 2) Adolph Hitler, 3) the Khmer Rouge, and 4) the (non-atheistic) Muslim Turkish genocide of Armenian Orthodox Christians.

    Hitler and his Nazi Wotanists were rabidly anti-Christian, as were Lenin, Stalin, Beria, Yagoda, and the Bolsheviks who murdered an estimated 20 million Russian and Ukrainian Orthodox Christians after 1917.  They also destroyed and desecrated Orthodox churches and monasteries throughout Russia, just as the communist Chinese desecrated Buddhist temples and monasteries in Tibet.

    Naziism took root in a post-Christian culture that celebrated Nietzsche and Wagnerian neo-paganism.

    The Bolshevik genocide of Orthodox Christians took root in a sub-culture of atheistic Marxist-Leninism.

    The history of these 20th century atheist atrocities has remained largely untold in the West-- with the exception of the Nazi Holocaust.

    I can direct you to some excellent historical sources if you want to educate yourself on these subjects.

    

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20 minutes ago, Douglas Caddy said:

Yes, Doug, it certainly seems like the SCOTUS is delaying justice for Trump.

Apparently, they only needed four judges to accept the case.

I'm guessing it was Thomas, Alito, Kavanaugh, and Gorsuch.

 

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Today was the worst day for the U.S. since the 1/6 insurrection.

The Supreme Court works for Trump, MAGA and the Kremlin.

Not the United States and its people.

This is the most perilous time for our country since the Civil War.

People need to be on alert.

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6 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

Kirk,

   Like most Americans and Western Europeans, you're a walking case of Dunning-Kruger syndrome when it comes to understanding the Babylonian Talmud and the 2,000 year history of Eastern Christianity-- too ignorant to recognize your profound ignorance.  What Netanyahu is doing in Gaza is, basically Talmudic-- destroying the unclean Goyim for the benefit of Israel.  I'm simply saying the quiet part out loud.

   You also haven't studied history in sufficient depth to learn that the worst genocides in modern world history were all perpetrated by anti-Christian atheists -- 1) Joseph Stalin, 2) Adolph Hitler, 3) the Khmer Rouge, and 4) the (non-atheistic) Muslim Turkish genocide of Armenian Orthodox Christians.

    Hitler and his Nazi Wotanists were rabidly anti-Christian, as were Lenin, Stalin, Beria, Yagoda, and the Bolsheviks who murdered an estimated 20 million Russian and Ukrainian Orthodox Christians after 1917.  They also destroyed and desecrated Orthodox churches and monasteries throughout Russia, just as the communist Chinese desecrated Buddhist temples and monasteries in Tibet.

    Naziism took root in a post-Christian culture that celebrated Nietzsche and Wagnerian neo-paganism.

    The Bolshevik genocide of Orthodox Christians took root in a sub-culture of atheistic Marxist-Leninism.

    The history of these 20th century atheist atrocities has remained largely untold in the West-- with the exception of the Nazi Holocaust.

    I can direct you to some excellent historical sources if you want to educate yourself on these subjects.

    

 

7 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

Kirk,

   Like most Americans and Western Europeans, you're a walking case of Dunning-Kruger syndrome when it comes to understanding the Babylonian Talmud and the 2,000 year history of Eastern Christianity-- too ignorant to recognize your profound ignorance.  What Netanyahu is doing in Gaza is, basically Talmudic-- destroying the unclean Goyim for the benefit of Israel.  I'm simply saying the quiet part out loud.

   You also haven't studied history in sufficient depth to learn that the worst genocides in modern world history were all perpetrated by anti-Christian atheists -- 1) Joseph Stalin, 2) Adolph Hitler, 3) the Khmer Rouge, and 4) the (non-atheistic) Muslim Turkish genocide of Armenian Orthodox Christians.

    Hitler and his Nazi Wotanists were rabidly anti-Christian, as were Lenin, Stalin, Beria, Yagoda, and the Bolsheviks who murdered an estimated 20 million Russian and Ukrainian Orthodox Christians after 1917.  They also destroyed and desecrated Orthodox churches and monasteries throughout Russia, just as the communist Chinese desecrated Buddhist temples and monasteries in Tibet.

    Naziism took root in a post-Christian culture that celebrated Nietzsche and Wagnerian neo-paganism.

    The Bolshevik genocide of Orthodox Christians took root in a sub-culture of atheistic Marxist-Leninism.

    The history of these 20th century atheist atrocities has remained largely untold in the West-- with the exception of the Nazi Holocaust.

    I can direct you to some excellent historical sources if you want to educate yourself on these subjects.

    

 

W. I remember that silly  attempted lecture of yours a while back endeavoring to say you could offer positive proof that non religious genocides of the last century were somehow less humane than the  religious based genocides of the previous 2000 years. I would never be so presumptuous  to make such an argument.  Genocides are genocides. Not only were there much fewer people in millennia past. Socialism was was the fastest growing religion in the 20th century.  It was an evolutionary social movement beyond religion that nonetheless was embraced with a religious fervor, just as the previous fanaticism that caused religious genocides of the past. It's not a competition for me as it is for you. I'm only concerned with results, and both sides are the same. That is, they are  genocidal.

Back to your inflammatory comments about your alleged  "custom" of Jews spitting on Christian  clerics in Israel. You missed my point entirely.
W. the more you get onto your comparative religions raps, which you love to do,  the more you reinforce to me these religious assholes are going to be fighting each other into God's eternity. And you'll be there, rooting one side on.
Nobody will ever accuse you of being uplifting. Since our views are similar about Israel carrying out  genocide in Gaza. Can't you argue against Israel's policies without condemning the people as being the mindless product of  their religion that you so vehemently scorn? You really end up just contaminating the real issues with your religious fervor.
 
Maybe you could take a deep breathe and think about that.

 

 

 

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And the winner of the 'Bad Timing Award' goes to Lauren Boebert, ...whose son was arrested the same day this was posted!

 

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20 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

Lauren Boebert’s Son Arrested in ‘Crime Wave’

 

Well, if Trump's high poll numbers amid his court cases are any indication, Boebert's son's crime wave should help her in her MAGA bid for re-election!

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Kirk,

I don't know why you are so bent out of shape.

I'm not an Israel scholar, and don't know a lot about Jews. I discovered the other day that pious Jews, like pious Christians, believe it is a commandment to love one's neighbor. Wanting Palestinians to be killed is hardly loving one's neighbors, and yet a lot of Israeli Jews are in favor of that, apparently.

In addition, the religion teaches the principle of "an eye for an eye," which their asymmetrical war with Hamas is in gross violation of.

So I figured that Israeli Jews are either largely ignorant of their beliefs and/or aren't believers. Or maybe they are knowledgeable believers who don't follow what the believe. I then found that poll that shows that most Israelis are not religious, which (roughly) supports what I'd figured.

(Of course, that are a lot of exceptions and nuances to that that should be considered. But I'm writing a forum post, not a doctoral thesis or a scholarly book.)

For some reason you take exception to this. Well, okay. Regardless of what you think, I think what I said is perfectly reasonable... a good first approximation, as engineers like to put it.

 

15 hours ago, Kirk Gallaway said:
That they're committing genocide because they're not religious, like you ?

 

I would never be pro-genocide, neither now that I'm a believing Christian, nor earlier when I was agnostic. That level of hatred is not in me.

And BTW, I have never -- not a single instance in my lifetime -- placed myself above others because of my religious beliefs. (Or my religious non-beliefs, back when I was agnostic.) I don't know where you got that idea.

 

15 hours ago, Kirk Gallaway said:
I'm turning this around on you. Policy wise I think many Israelis are like you and do not like the genocide but they don't want a ceasefire. In their case, it's more understandable. They were attacked. We in the U.S. have lost nothing. You see IMO, despite your proclaimed religiosity, you're position is not near as justified as the typical Israeli. You've lost nothing!

 

I was incensed after 9/11. Yet I wasn't in favor of killing Arabs. I wasn't in favor of any war that would be high in collateral damage. In fact, I wasn't in favor of any war given that we were attacked by individuals.

And by the way, this has nothing to do with my religious beliefs.

Also, I don't know what position I have that you are talking about.

 

15 hours ago, Kirk Gallaway said:
Should I hold the fact that you're religious against you, like you do the non religious Jews? That is that you are similar to them in that you don't like genocide but are not ready for a ceasefire?

 

Who says I'm not for a ceasefire?

And who says I'm holding against non-religious Jews that they aren't ready for a ceasefire?

I do hold it against those people who are for Palestinian genocide, (or Israeli or Jewish genocide) regardless of how religious they are, and regardless of how much their loss was in the 10/7 attack.

 

15 hours ago, Kirk Gallaway said:

You understand, I'm not arguing about your viewpoint on a ceasefire.. I'm just arguing against, what I see as  the parochial religious hypocrisy of your statement.

 

I don't have any religious hypocrisy. My beliefs now are the same as they were when a was areligious. If there is "religious hypocrisy" in any of my statements, it is only because it is poorly worded or misunderstood.

 

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13 hours ago, W. Niederhut said:

Yes, Doug, it certainly seems like the SCOTUS is delaying justice for Trump.

Apparently, they only needed four judges to accept the case.

I'm guessing it was Thomas, Alito, Kavanaugh, and Gorsuch.

 

I read where the Supreme Court vote was 6 to 3, with the 6 being the Republicans, So, national early voting in the presidential race began yesterday with 6 Supreme Court judges casting their votes.

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