Dennis David

[Robin Unger]

Quotes from "Dennis David" in response to questions put to him.

QUOTE:

Have no idea what happened to the films and pictures I saw in Bill's office. Bill had 8 or 9 photos,do not recall exactly how many were B&W and how many were in Color. Yes, I looked at all the still photos, and 3 to 4 feet of the 16mm film. I do not know if Bill Pitzer took the pictures/film. I never ask him. I am "on the fence"

as to whether Bill was murdered or committed suicide. This is due to the excellent job Allan Eaglesham has done in his researching of the circumstances and evidence of Bill's death. I am most grateful to Allan for his endeavors. In 1992, at a meeting in Pittsburg, Jerol Custer stated he had taken 17 X-rays. How many have been shown to the Public? At the same meeting, Floyd Reibe stated that at least 130 pictures (60% B&W and 40% Color) were taken by himself or Stringer. How many autopsy photos have been made Public?

Dennis D

QUOTE:

The memo, which I typed that evening, stated "the following fragments were removed from the head .....during post-mortem procedures on this date" or words to that effect. Am I sure there were "four" fragments? ABSOLUTELY! I can still see them in my minds eye today.

The fragments I saw were in an orangish/opaque pill vial with a white top. The Gov.Agent had set the vial on the desk while he was dictating the memo to me. When the memo was finished, the Agent took the memo and proof read it. As he did, I picked up the vial and was looking at it, the Agent saw me and said "go ahead and look at them". I then opened the vial and poured the fragments into my hand, looked at them, and then replaced them in the vial. After Proofing the memo, the Agent signed it, put the vial in his pocket, took the memo and carbons, removed the ribbon cartridge from the typewriter (an IBM selectric) and left. As he left, he turned to me and said "this is considered classified matter, and is to be treated as such".

Do not remember the name of the Agent. I had never seem him before or since. I doubt that I would recognize him, even from a photo, after all these years. I recall him as being in mid-thirties, approx. 6 ft tall, about 180 to 190, dark hair, tan complexion. The only comments he made to me were those I cited above.

As to the prints I saw in Bill's office: they were 4x8. Do not remember any markings, nor do I recall looking at the back of the pictures. I also recall three or four 35mm slides, but did not get a good look at them.

The film was B&W. Also, the camera never moved. There was no Y incision on the torso, so I presume what I saw was before any incision or intrusive procedure had begun. The angle of the camera appeared to be above and to the right of the body. Only lower body and arms of two people were also shown as they rolled the body up on its side to look at the back of the President. The frontal and posterior views (of the body) were the same as in the still photos.

Dennis D

QUOTE:

Do no recall anyone expressing any doubts that early. Actually, the "official" story was that Oswald did it. But, the autopsy report was not issued until much later. There WERE a lot of rumors around.Such as: two caskets being used, allegedly to prevent the body from being kidnapped and/or avoid morbid people. I know this sounds outlandish, but that was some of the remarks floating around.

I received only the grey shipping casket that night. The following evening (Saturday), I was watching TV, when I first saw the bronze casket and heard the announcer stating it contained the body of the President. I remember telling my wife that was not the casket I had received. On Mon/Tues, I ask Dr. Boswell which casket was contained the body of the President. He told me "you should know, you were there when it came in". The only time Bill and I discussed anything about the autopsy, was while looking at the pictures/film on Monday. Both of us were of the opinion that the killing shot was to the right forehead and exited in the occipital-parietal area. I never talked to anyone, of my experiences that night, again until 1974 when I discussed it with Art Peterson (Waukegan Sun) under a guarantee of anonyminity.

Dennis D

QUOTE:

Sorry for not responding sooner. My wife and I have been running back and forth between Doctors and hospitals for the past six weeks. I will be having cataract surgery next Wed. (03/16) and my wife will be undergoing surgery on 03/18 for a carcinoma mass in her right lung. As to your question Richard, I do not recall seeing a PHOTOGRAPH of the back in Bill's office. I do recall seeing the back in the few feet of film that we looked at. AARB questions did not seem to put much credibility on my contention of the existence of the 16mm film. I screwed up in the interview with William. I should have clafified that my recollection of the back was from the film, not a photograph.

Dennis D

http://www.jfklancerforum.com/dc/dcboard.p...e=&topic_page=1

Edited April 9, 2005 by Robin Unger

[Robin Unger]

FBI Memo from A.H.Belmont to Tolson.

This document mentions a bullet which was lodged behind the presidents ear.

Credit: Chuck Robbins

[Robin Unger]

Update:

New information from Denis:

posted on Lancer forum today.

Re this image which i posted some time back showing a temple wound.

Denis has today confirmed that this WAS the wound he saw.

Richard Smith.

QUOTE:

I think Robin originally posted this photo, a close up showing what may be the entrance hole Dennis described. Dennis, could you confirm this location as what you saw?

Denis David.

QUOTE:

Richard: That is exactly what I saw in the photos. Except your "attachment" is not as clear and defined as the photo I saw.

If you draw a line bisecting the right pupil and parallel to the sides of the photo, you will see the area I am refering to at the hairline. At a Pittsburgh meeting of Paul, James, Gerald, Floyd, and myself, the issues of forged/altered photos and

x-rays was discussed. Gerald stated he took 17 x-rays that night. Floyd stated that between himself and Stringer approximately 130 photos (approx 60% BW and 40% Color) were taken at the autopsy. I don't think that many x-rays have been made public, to say nothing of the photos. Yes, there was a feeling that some of the x-rays and the photos were forged/altered/touched-up.

You will find much of this in the book by William Law.

Dennis D

Edited August 6, 2005 by Robin Unger

[Robin Unger]

QUOTE:

The pictures which I saw with Bill were very similar to some of those later made public. One was of the "death stare" but was more defined. Both Bill and I saw what appeared to be an entrance wound at the hairline directly above the outer corner of the right eye. Another photo showed the back of the head. This one showed a wound approximately 3" x 4" involving the occipital and parietal bones. Bill and I felt this to be an exit wound. It was not until 1979/1980 when I first saw photos of the massive wound to the head where a flap in the frontal bone area appears.

The 16 mm film was on a "hand-crank" editor when I entered Bill's office. We looked at about 3 feet of it while I was there. What I saw appeared to be the onset of an autopsy exam, as no Y incision had been made in the torso.

Yes, the men, in civilian clothes, where dressed in dark suit and ties. The first ones I saw came in with the hearse and the shipping casket. Later that evening, I saw others in the passageway outside the morgue (they may have been the same ones), I was not paying that much attention to faces, etc. The actions of the ones I saw were what you would expect under the circumstances.

I am familiar with the story of the body of an AF Major being brought in that night. As far as I know, that's all it is, a story. When the hearse arrived, I was standing on the dock as it backed up to the dock. Several men in suits got out of the rear of the hearse. I assume they were SS, they did not show any ID's to me.

These men moved the coffin from the hearse, hoisted it onto the loading dock where my detail picked it up and carried it into the ante-room (where the coolers were) and set it down. The other two men in the hearse were the driver and is assistant. Both impressed me as being civilian, due to dress and mannerisms. I had a brief discussion with the Driver, during which he stated "....we came up 16th Street to Jones Bridge Road and came in by the back gate."

The men in suits did follow the casket into the ante-room or stood in the passageway outside the morgue. After my detail had set the casket in the ante-room, I dismissed them and proceeded to go to the front of the NNMC. Where I observed the arrival of the Navy Ambulance arrive and Mrs. Kennedy's entrance into NNMC.

Would like to make three points here: 1. If the shipping casket had contained an AF Major (04), the body would have been accompanied by another AF Officer of equal or higher rank. No such officer accompanied the shipping casket. 2. On the following Monday or Tuesday, I had occasion to ask Dr. Boswell, "...which casket was the President's body in...". His reply "... you should know, you were there." I was only present at the arrival of one casket that evening, the grey shipping casket. 3. Paul O'Connor, among others, will tell you that the body of the President was removed from a shipping casket. Finally, No I would not have been notified by the morgue personnel IF another casket came in that evening. This would have been recorded (if it occurred) in the Morgue Log, which I understand is "missing".

Dennis D

http://www.jfklancerforum.com/dc/dcboard.p...e=&topic_page=2

[John Dolva]

Update:

New information from Denis:

posted on Lancer forum today.

Re this image which i posted some time back showing a temple wound.

Denis has today confirmed that this WAS the wound he saw.

Richard Smith.

QUOTE:

I think Robin originally posted this photo, a close up showing what may be the entrance hole Dennis described. Dennis, could you confirm this location as what you saw?

Denis David.

QUOTE:

Richard: That is exactly what I saw in the photos. Except your "attachment" is not as clear and defined as the photo I saw.

If you draw a line bisecting the right pupil and parallel to the sides of the photo, you will see the area I am refering to at the hairline. At a Pittsburgh meeting of Paul, James, Gerald, Floyd, and myself, the issues of forged/altered photos and

x-rays was discussed. Gerald stated he took 17 x-rays that night. Floyd stated that between himself and Stringer approximately 130 photos (approx 60% BW and 40% Color) were taken at the autopsy. I don't think that many x-rays have been made public, to say nothing of the photos. Yes, there was a feeling that some of the x-rays and the photos were forged/altered/touched-up.

You will find much of this in the book by William Law.

Dennis D

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[John Dolva]

Quotes from "Dennis David" in response to questions put to him.

QUOTE:

Have no idea what happened to the films and pictures I saw in Bill's office. Bill had 8 or 9 photos,do not recall exactly how many were B&W and how many were in Color. Yes, I looked at all the still photos, and 3 to 4 feet of the 16mm film. I do not know if Bill Pitzer took the pictures/film. I never ask him. I am "on the fence"

as to whether Bill was murdered or committed suicide. This is due to the excellent job Allan Eaglesham has done in his researching of the circumstances and evidence of Bill's death. I am most grateful to Allan for his endeavors. In 1992, at a meeting in Pittsburg, Jerol Custer stated he had taken 17 X-rays. How many have been shown to the Public? At the same meeting, Floyd Reibe stated that at least 130 pictures (60% B&W and 40% Color) were taken by himself or Stringer. How many autopsy photos have been made Public?

Dennis D

QUOTE:

The memo, which I typed that evening, stated "the following fragments were removed from the head .....during post-mortem procedures on this date" or words to that effect. Am I sure there were "four" fragments? ABSOLUTELY! I can still see them in my minds eye today.

The fragments I saw were in an orangish/opaque pill vial with a white top. The Gov.Agent had set the vial on the desk while he was dictating the memo to me. When the memo was finished, the Agent took the memo and proof read it. As he did, I picked up the vial and was looking at it, the Agent saw me and said "go ahead and look at them". I then opened the vial and poured the fragments into my hand, looked at them, and then replaced them in the vial. After Proofing the memo, the Agent signed it, put the vial in his pocket, took the memo and carbons, removed the ribbon cartridge from the typewriter (an IBM selectric) and left. As he left, he turned to me and said "this is considered classified matter, and is to be treated as such".

Do not remember the name of the Agent. I had never seem him before or since. I doubt that I would recognize him, even from a photo, after all these years. I recall him as being in mid-thirties, approx. 6 ft tall, about 180 to 190, dark hair, tan complexion. The only comments he made to me were those I cited above.

As to the prints I saw in Bill's office: they were 4x8. Do not remember any markings, nor do I recall looking at the back of the pictures. I also recall three or four 35mm slides, but did not get a good look at them.

The film was B&W. Also, the camera never moved. There was no Y incision on the torso, so I presume what I saw was before any incision or intrusive procedure had begun. The angle of the camera appeared to be above and to the right of the body. Only lower body and arms of two people were also shown as they rolled the body up on its side to look at the back of the President. The frontal and posterior views (of the body) were the same as in the still photos.

Dennis D

QUOTE:

Do no recall anyone expressing any doubts that early. Actually, the "official" story was that Oswald did it. But, the autopsy report was not issued until much later. There WERE a lot of rumors around.Such as: two caskets being used, allegedly to prevent the body from being kidnapped and/or avoid morbid people. I know this sounds outlandish, but that was some of the remarks floating around.

I received only the grey shipping casket that night. The following evening (Saturday), I was watching TV, when I first saw the bronze casket and heard the announcer stating it contained the body of the President. I remember telling my wife that was not the casket I had received. On Mon/Tues, I ask Dr. Boswell which casket was contained the body of the President. He told me "you should know, you were there when it came in". The only time Bill and I discussed anything about the autopsy, was while looking at the pictures/film on Monday. Both of us were of the opinion that the killing shot was to the right forehead and exited in the occipital-parietal area. I never talked to anyone, of my experiences that night, again until 1974 when I discussed it with Art Peterson (Waukegan Sun) under a guarantee of anonyminity.

Dennis D

QUOTE:

Sorry for not responding sooner. My wife and I have been running back and forth between Doctors and hospitals for the past six weeks. I will be having cataract surgery next Wed. (03/16) and my wife will be undergoing surgery on 03/18 for a carcinoma mass in her right lung. As to your question Richard, I do not recall seeing a PHOTOGRAPH of the back in Bill's office. I do recall seeing the back in the few feet of film that we looked at. AARB questions did not seem to put much credibility on my contention of the existence of the 16mm film. I screwed up in the interview with William. I should have clafified that my recollection of the back was from the film, not a photograph.

Dennis D

http://www.jfklancerforum.com/dc/dcboard.p...e=&topic_page=1

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

As I have no idea if this is actually the photo referred to by Denis as he says 'it seems more defined' the following may be irrellevant (except as a guide to one way of analyzing photo's)

The bullet hole as presented here appears peculiar in a couple of respects

the edges are blureed in a way that the individual hairs, for example are not.

the perspective seems wrong. On a contoured face sloping away from the camera it shouldn't be so 'round'

in the following is the 'original', next to it is the original tilted roughly to the angle I think it should be revealing a different shaped hole. These are placed next to each other below.

the toip right image is a inverse grayscale 3D map of the area. A hair outlined in blue has a distinctly different value over the 'hole'.

the lower right image is perhaps a indication of how this particular 'hole' was 'defined'. : A blurred edge round 'burn', moved top down.

[Robin Unger]

John.

Here is another photo showing the same area.

Below is a link to the "very large" original copies of the autopsy photo's.

They are beleived by many to have been "altered" from the original photo's taken at the time of the autopsy.

http://www.jfklancer.com/aphotos.html

Edited August 6, 2005 by Robin Unger

[Thomas H. Purvis]

I've spent much of the last two years studying the medical information and autopsy photos.  And I've come to some conclusions which differ from most in the JFK community.  If you read my seminar and compare it to Dr. Mantik's, I'm sure you'll find mine the more rational and well-thought out.

Point one. The bevelling that has been pointed out on the forehead to correspond with the purported entrance hole on the forehead is in fact an exit wound. The nature of bevelling is that the energy radiates outwards. Thus the larger side of the hole indicates the direction of travel.

Point two.  The autopsy photo which depicts the open cranium, which some call F-8 or #44, is in fact the back of Kennedy's head, not his forehead.  If you read my seminar you'll find a discussion on this topic and a number of photos which I believe prove this to be true.  The HSCA got it wrong!  Dead wrong.

Point three. There is an obvious bullet hole in the open cranium photo,  but it is down by the hairline, in an area which Robin interprets as blood. 

I'm currently updating and expanding my seminar, at which point many of the questions about the autopsy photos and x-rays will be answered.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

By "down by the hairline", it is assumed that you refer to the entrance wound in the back of the head/neck which was located just into the edge of the hairline?

If so, this is the entrance wound which correlates with the bullet entrance through the coat of JFK at the edge of the coat collar.

As regards the semi-circular "exit" wound in the frontal area of the skull/forehead, as you have clearly stated, this is a full bullet exit wound. Or at least most of it.

Tom

[John Dolva]

OK, Robin, . Now the gray scale is 'flatter' In the other image perhaps all that happened was an attempt to 'enhance' or define the area resulting in a value shift.

A second look at it also makes it seem that it is partly a shadow of the hair standing up. Not unreasonable for deep shadow as hair was probably matted. A look at shadows on top left indicates that this is the angle of light. Also a look at the edge of hair mass and comparing to how shadow might have appeared on face contour, also the blurriness could be as the edge of hair mass is translucent.

Great Link BTW. I've been looking for better pics of all that stuff.

[Thomas H. Purvis]

I've spent much of the last two years studying the medical information and autopsy photos.  And I've come to some conclusions which differ from most in the JFK community.  If you read my seminar and compare it to Dr. Mantik's, I'm sure you'll find mine the more rational and well-thought out.

Point one. The bevelling that has been pointed out on the forehead to correspond with the purported entrance hole on the forehead is in fact an exit wound. The nature of bevelling is that the energy radiates outwards. Thus the larger side of the hole indicates the direction of travel.

Point two.  The autopsy photo which depicts the open cranium, which some call F-8 or #44, is in fact the back of Kennedy's head, not his forehead.  If you read my seminar you'll find a discussion on this topic and a number of photos which I believe prove this to be true.  The HSCA got it wrong!  Dead wrong.

Point three. There is an obvious bullet hole in the open cranium photo,  but it is down by the hairline, in an area which Robin interprets as blood. 

I'm currently updating and expanding my seminar, at which point many of the questions about the autopsy photos and x-rays will be answered.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Since we are a "visual" society, I have attached a simple drawing which assists in explanation of "beveling".

Although we know what it refers to, one should not assume that each and every person fully understands to what we refer.

In this drawing is also included examples of how metallic residue/fragment can remain embedded into the skull bone as a result of such inpact.

Of course, a bullet does not always leave such embedded residue, but when it does, it assist in explaining certain aspects of the entry and exit.

Tom

Edited August 6, 2005 by Thomas H. Purvis

[Robin Unger]

I Colorized the frontal X-pray to try and get a more 3-dimensional image of the head wound.

I don't see how it is possible that kennedy's face could have appeared natural with the massive loss of bone to the right frontal area of his head.

There appears to be a large fracture and bone loss behind the right eye.

The RED line below indicates the REAR of the skull.

The BLUE line indicates the FRONT of the skull.

[Robin Unger]

Boswell's 1996 revision.

Edited August 6, 2005 by Robin Unger

[Robin Unger]

When you lighten the back of the head autopsy photo's you will notice what Boswell in his ARRB testimony said was a scalp " hair piece " which could be pulled forward over the skull to cover the open cavity where the skull was missing.

As Boswell explained in his ARRB Testimony if you look at the B/W image below you can see that the doctor is holding the hair between his fingers in order to pull the scalp forward and cover the skull cavity

Edited August 6, 2005 by Robin Unger

[Robin Unger]

Boswell drawing made during the autopsy.

I think this is a good representation of the skull damage indicated on Boswell drawing.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Boswell drawing made during the autopsy.

I think this is a good representation of the skull damage indicated on Boswell drawing.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Robin;

Your posting of the "Boswell Drawing" which was done during the autopsy, left off the bottom portion which also shows the semi-circular piece of bone which contains one-half (basically the top half) of the EOP entry wound, as well as the straight line drawn into the (one-half) of a hole in this piece of skull.

Tom