The Strange Case of J. Timothy Gratz

[Tim Gratz]

Shanet, how can you POSSIBLY state I was a "henchman" of Donald Segretti when I objected to what he was proposing and would not take "No" for an answer when CREEP first told me they did not know who he was and did not care what he was doing? I did my best to stop him and when he stopped calling back I thought he had been stopped. Interestingly, if I recall right, although Segretti had his little pawns working against the Democrat candidates in other primary states, he never tried anything in Wisconsin again, so I did succed in shutting down his operation in Wisconsin.

And if you do not detract your statement that I knew Arthur Bremer, I may jolly well sue you!

[Shanet Clark]

I wondered what a "critical reporter" was doing in Madison Wisconsin back in the day....now we know.....he was a henchman of Donald Segretti, Karl Rove and various authorized dirty tricksters......Tim Gratz was the guy infiltrating a liberal college town and getting mixed up with ARTHUR BREMER.

You have definitely been tumbled, Tim.

All your bonhomie and bombast won't get you out of this one, fellow member.

You know all this along, that YOU YOURSELF was a published figure in the PLUMBERS 1972 disruptions and agents provocateur actions

{Culminating in the shooting of GEORGE WALLACE, Tim?}

You should have come clean long ago, the cover up establishes the error, once again.

No more Castro did it theories, okay?

No more KGB killed JFK windbag schemes, okay?

No more world exclusives based on the obscene ramblings of Gerry Hemmings, Okay?

Sayonara baby

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retracted, I should have said

"Tim Gratz is on record as somehow mixed up with the artie bremer colson WH segretti operation"

Did you ever see, meet, observe or have information about Bremer before he shot George Wallace?

You have no idea what this exposure has done to your cogency.

///////////

[Tim Gratz]

Shanet, I'd never heard of Bremer, or Cassini for that matter. Never heard of Cassini until a few months ago on the Internet.

Is it not clear to you I was trying to stop Segretti's operation because those parts of it which were not illegal were stupid and probably unethical and I was sure he would get Nixon in trouble? Unvelievable Haldeman would authorize such nonsense!

[Shanet Clark]

Shanet, I'd never heard of Bremer, or Cassini for that matter.  Never heard of Cassini until a few months ago on the Internet.

Is it not clear to you I was trying to stop Segretti's operation because those parts of it which were not illegal were stupid and probably unethical and I was sure he would get Nixon in trouble?  Unvelievable Haldeman would authorize such nonsense!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Tim,

Sorry I turned sharply on you, but these are still very hot issues with me.

The interference wasn't limited to Donald Segretti, although he became a parody example of NIXON's approach to political campaigning.

Murray Chotiner and Bob Haldeman were famous for getting swept along by each other, Nixon, Colson or whoever was the most ruthless one at the time.

For one example, did you know that Haldeman sent out 400,000 pieces of mail illegally identified as DEMOCRATS FOR NIXON (a non existent group)?

The MOCKINGBIRD PROGRAM, CO-INTEL PRO, Segretti's dirty tricks squad, the systematic interference with campus and left wing newspapers, the infiltration and introduction of AGENT PROVOCATEURS into the campus politics....

These are related subjects,

related programs,

and here is where we find (historically now)

KARL ROVE

& YOU !

Edited May 17, 2005 by Shanet Clark

[Tim Gratz]

Shanet, I accept your apology. Thanks.

You wrote:

For one example, did you know that Haldeman sent out 400,000 pieces of mail illegally identified as DEMOCRATS FOR NIXON (a non existent group)?

Not sure of Haldeman did this or his stooge Segretti. Obviously this was a violation of campaihn finance laws and I think some of the people Segretti recruited were convicted for such shenanigans.

All I can say about Rove is he never mentioned dirty tricks in the seminar he taught in Wisconsin, or in any of his private dealings in Wisconsin. (I understand others have claimed he played "hard ball" politics in other states but my knowledge is limited to his activities in Wisconsin, of course.)

You know I now realize I played an even more important role in history than the Segretti matter. I remember one bitter cold night in Wisconsin; Rove had flown in to speak at College Republican Clubs and I was driving him (and two Wisconsin college students) on a snow-slick road between LaCrosse and Eau Claire (both beautiful cities on the Mississippi River. Now, had I not beem such an expert driver, Texas might still be Democrat, George Bush would still be managing the Texas Rangers . . . and Al Queada probably would have nuked NY or DC under gutless Gore! So I think that by saving Rove's life that night it is safe to say I played an important role in the 21st century fight to save Western civilization from the scourge of terrorism!

Edited May 18, 2005 by Tim Gratz

[Tim Gratz]

Shanet wrote:

the systematic interference with campus and left wing newspapers. . .

Shanet, I guess I am guilty here.

After one year at the UW I realized that the "official" (state-subsidized) campus newspaper "The Daily Cardinal" was appropriately named. So I rounded up three right-minded friends and we started a newspaper that would provide the UW students with a moderate viewpoint and fair news coverage. We started "The Badger Herald" as a weekly but it became a daily and it is widely recognized as a better paper than "The Daily Cardinal".

So I guess from your left-wing perspective any alternative to a single, Commie-symp paper constitutes "interference"?

To show some balance, however, let me add that a man named Paul Soglin was a city alderman from the UW area and a leader of the left-wing student activists. After he graduated and he ran for Mayor of Madison I supported his re-election because, despite his still leftist views on national politics, he was a darn good mayor!

[Pat Speer]

For one example, did you know that Haldeman sent out 400,000 pieces of mail illegally identified as DEMOCRATS FOR NIXON (a non existent group)?

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Shanet, I believe Democrats for Nixon was a real group headed by John Connally, who had already decided to switch over to the Repubs but was asked by Nixon to head this group, and thereby create the appearance Nixon was more moderate and Dem-friendly than he really was. In exchange, Nixon told Connally, who'd been his Sec. of Treasury, that he could be Pres. in 76. Haldeman writes about this in his books. Unfortunately for Connally his soliciting of kickbacks from milk producers tied him into Watergate and ruined his career.

When one looks at the common links between Johnson, Nixon and Connally, one can find Big oil, the same men who back the current regime, and the current war. This makes me a little uneasy.

[Tim Gratz]

Pat, you are right, of course. There was a group called "Democrats for Nixon" and it was headed by Connally. The Vice-Chairman was Leo Charne of the Research Institute of America, a group founded, if I recall, by William Casey (how Casey made a lot of his money).

[Shanet Clark]

Pat, you are right, of course.  There was a group called "Democrats for Nixon" and it was headed by Connally.  The Vice-Chairman was Leo Charne of the Research Institute of America, a group founded, if I recall, by William Casey (how Casey made a lot of his money).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The fraudulent DEMOCRATS FOR NIXON was a false front group of Nixon campaign men. This was back in the Governor's race in California in 1962.

At that time there was no legitimate DEMOCRATS FOR NIXON.

Later, in 1972, there was one, but in 1962 it was a false front.

Haldemen narrowly escaped mail fraud charges,

as there were no DEMOCRATS FOR NIXON.

I read this in Frank Mankiewicz's book

[Tim Gratz]

Shanet, good clarification, but you should have said in the 1962 gubernatorial race.

This tactic was similar to one used by Segretti (from my readings; it was not one he had suggested to me) so this further ties Haldeman to Segretti. The Segretti operation was controlled by Chapin, who was an assistant to Haldeman. From reading John's stuff on Watergate, Chapin was criminally convicted for lying to a grand jury about being involved with Segretti. More stupidity on his part; he should have either told the truth or taken the fifth amendment.

This further erodes my respect for Nixon. Assuming he must have known about what Haldeman was doing in 1962, he should not have involved Haldeman in his presidential campaigns or should have made it clear to him to knock off the silly stuff.

Questions or legality and morality aside, Haldeman was risking Nixon's re-election had Segretti been discovered earlier. (Again from John's postings; I don't recall Segretti had specifically suggested this to me.) And for what great purpose? Any possible benefit of most of Segretti's shenanigans was obviously outweighed by the great risk. Of course, they obviously thought they would get away with it.

Still, MOST of what Segretti was proposing, besides being unethical and/or illegal, was just plain silly and pointless.

[John Simkin]

I am currently writing a web page on J. Timothy Gratz. I think it is only right that his activities are reported for posterity. The information on this thread has proved very useful. Please add anymore information that you have accumulated over the last few months.

[John Simkin]

Pages 238-240 from Anthony Ulasewicz's book, The President's Private Eye (1990):

I arrived in Wisconsin to check out what a guy named Don Simmons was up to. On December 18, 1971, Timothy Gratz, Chairman of Wisconsin's Republican Party College Organization, received a call from a man calling himself Don Simmons. Simmons said he had gotten Gratz's name from Randy Knox, an active Wisconsin Republican. Gratz and Simmons met that afternoon in the Park Motor Inn Lounge. Simmons told Gratz that he had come to Wisconsin to recruit people to help with President Nixon's reelection campaign, and specifically to do "opposition research." He told Gratz he had all kinds of proposals for conducting a "negative campaign" to insure Nixon's reelection. His goal was to create as much bitterness and disunity within the Democratic Party as he could. He wanted that disunity to surface during the Wisconsin and other primaries to be held in the coming months. Three of his suggestions were to plant agitators in student audiences, set up picket lines, and infiltrate the local campaign offices of Democratic candidates. Simmons also wanted to line up a few blacks to picket Senator Edmund Muskie, a potential Nixon rival, wherever he spoke. After Muskie fell, Simmons told Gratz, McGovern would be next. At this point Gratz asked Simmons who had sent him to Wisconsin. At first, Simmons said he was working for a consulting company from New York, but he finally admitted that this was all his idea and that he was working with his own money. When Gratz reported his meeting with Simmons to top Republican officials in Wisconsin, who in turn passed the information along to the White House, it seemed nobody had ever heard of Don Simmons. I was given the assignment to blow his cover.

For the first time, this assignment required that the White House provide me with a cover story of its own. The connection between the White House and me had to be revealed to insure my credibility in Gratz's mind. After all, he had gone to the top level in Wisconsin Republican politics to report Simmons and so had a right to expect that someone from the top was coming to see him. Using another alias, I called Gratz and simply told him that I had been asked to conduct a discreet inquiry on Simmons's background for the White House. When I met with Gratz in his apartment, he seemed pleased to hear the words "White House." With his cooperation, I made preparations to record Simmons's voice when he called again. I wanted to give the tape to the White House so that it could figure out who Simmons might be working for. Gratz, it seems, had already made arrangements for Simmons to call him at a preassigned time. When Simmons finally called, he continued to be both bold and evasive, acting as if it didn't really matter who he was working for as long as Nixon was reelected. He had a job to do and he wanted help. If Gratz would help him with the recruiting, Simmons would provide the money. Simple as that: spread the dirt and pass the ammunition.

Gratz was disturbed, not knowing whether Simmons was legitimate, and whether he should refuse to cooperate with Simmons or play along with him to find out what else he was up to. Whatever he was doing, Gratz felt that Simmons was going about it mighty sloppily. Gratz even wondered whether Simmons might be working for the Democrats to find out whether the Republicans were planting spies in Democratic candidates' organizations.

Gratz was convinced that the Nixon White House didn't know anything about Simmons because one of his associates, John MacIver, had called some Republican Party big wigs who said they didn't know who Simmons was. If Simmons was legitimate, MacIver would surely have known about him. So who was this guy? I told Gratz I intended to find out. But, first, I was going to call the White House. As I left Gratz's apartment, I told him to sit tight until I came back. Next, I called Caulfield from a pay phone in the lobby of the motel where I was staying.

"Jack," I told Caulfield, "I'm going to pull the lid off this guy. He's throwing his weight around, and he claims he's got the bucks to back him up. I'm convinced someone in that White House of yours knows all about this. You better find out who it is. And quick. I'll give you an hour."

When Caulfield phoned back as scheduled, he said he had checked with both Ehrlichman and Dean and they knew nothing about Simmons.

"Check with the other side of the throne, Jack," I said, referring to H. R. Haldeman, the President's Chief-of-Staff.

"But I don't have a line into him," Caulfield said.

"Get one!," I demanded and then hung up.

In a few minutes, Caulfield was back on the line.

"You're right, Tony," Caulfield said. "Simmons is Haldeman's man. Get out of there. Back off. Simmons will be told to lay off Gratz."

When I returned to Gratz's apartment I told him that the matter had been taken care of and that he wouldn't be bothered again, but I couldn't believe Haldeman or anyone else would let a guy like Simmons loose on the streets. If anyone found out about him, he was bound to hurt Nixon's campaign. As I found out later, Simmons was actually Donald R. Segretti, recruited by Haldeman's appointments secretary, Dwight Chapin, for the political game of "dirty tricks." Payments for Segretti's services, described as "field operation expenses," were authorized by Haldeman and paid out of Kalmbach's trustee fund. The Simmons/ Segretti investigation made it clear to me that White House intelligence operations, at least those that were connected to Nixon's reelection campaign, were being directed by more than one hand. All of these hands appeared to have been dipping into the money on deposit in Kalmbach's trustee account. But with Ehrlichman not knowing what Haldeman was up to, no one hand seemed to be in charge of what was going on. Chaos was in the wind.

[John Simkin]

Email that I received today.

Mr. Simkin,

Came across the posts between Mr Gratz and yourself while doing an informal background check on Tim. I noticed he failed to provide the reason for his being disbarred on several occasions. After a bit of research, I was able to locate the public record regarding this issue and thought you might be interested. Nothing too dramatic I'm afraid, just your usual lies/corruption/theft so common with lawyers and politicians here in the US.

In case you were wondering, Tim is still alive and kicking, still trying to promote his Kennedy Assassination ideas, and is still completely and utterly loony.

Cheers!

Tim's former employer,

Key West, Florida

[Guest John Gillespie]

I was reading Richard E. Sprague's book, The Taking of America, today. I came across an interesting passage suggesting that the Power Control Group was involved in the plot to assassinate George Wallace. It includes this passage:

What evidence is there that Bremer's attempt on Wallace was a directed attempt by a conspiratorial group? Bremer himself has told his brother that others were involved and that he was paid by them. Researcher William Turner has turned up evidence in Milwaukee and surrounding towns in Wisconsin that Bremer received money from a group associated with Dennis Cossini, Donald Segretti and J. Timothy Gratz. Several other young "leftists" were seen with Bremer on several occasions in Milwaukee and on the ferry crossing at Lake Michigan.

That would not be our Tim Gratz would it?

http://www.ratical.org/ratville/JFK/ToA/ToAchp8.html

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

________________________________________________

GREAT book and it's online for all to read.

I await Mr Gratz' response with baited breath, anticipating a prompt denial.

I did notice the Donald Segretti connection some time back.

Gee....wonder what this means )

Dawn

__________________________________________

We risk a guilt by association tag here, but this connection remains fascinating. The Bremers, Hinckleys and Sirhan-Sirhans were made malleable and weren't exactly Agents. Obviously, I have no evidence but I do believe they were controlled. I also think Tim and those others are red fish, in the words of Mr. Turner.

Regards,

JG

[John Bevilaqua]

Gratz sounds like a troublemaker in this

posting too. John, you would be fully

justified to react strongly and swiftly

to eliminate this thorn from your side.

Allowing someone like him into your

backyard is just asking for trouble.

No one would blame you in the least.

Spray painting your postings and bringing

disrepute to your Forum is the very

least that he would try to do. He has

already threatened you with legal action

if you step foot in the USA. In some

states that in itself is actionable.

Reminds me of "froggy gremlin" on the

Buster Brown TV show from the 1950's.

Does anyone remember Buster Brown...

and his nemesis the little froggy gremlin...?

Jumps out of the coo-coo clock spits

on you then jumps back in for the next

time the hour chimes.