JFK Lancer Conference

[Tim Gratz]

You are in rare form tonight, Mark and James. Great fun!

I thought of James tonight as I ate in the Key West "Outback Restaurant" (just recently re-opened after Wilma; Sears, K-Mart and Office-Max are still closed!). Great food. Great Australian decor. Do they have an "Outback" near you, Mark?

Edited November 21, 2005 by Tim Gratz

[William Kelly]

Sitting on one's glasses reminds us that hindsight is 20/20...and expensive.

I broke my glasses just as I sat down to be sworn in as one of the first people to testify before the ARRB, so I had to dispose of my notes and wing it.

And, GPH, I also was in one of Gordon Winslow's early Research Directories, as I thought it would hook up researchers with similar interets, increase networking and prevent duplication. Boy was I wrong.

I'm also anxious to hear some more reports from Dallas.

Each of the three conferences this weekend ended with a panel on what to do next.

I'd like to know what was discussed along these lines, if anybody was there at any of them.

BK

[James Richards]

Tim,

Technically, Australian decore is an oxymoron.

Having said that, in this country, Australian outback pub decor is usually a faded portrait of Queen Elizabeth circa 1954 hanging behind the bar, a few drunks passed out in various stages of comatose indifference, a cattle dog asleep on the verandah and all this while being served by a seasoned barmaid complete with a smile that could sour milk.

I hope the Key West restaurant was classier than that?

James

Edited November 21, 2005 by James Richards

[Tim Gratz]

BK wrote:

Each of the three conferences this weekend ended with a panel on what to do next.

I'd like to know what was discussed along these lines, if anybody was there at any of them.

I think it would be interesting if every Forum member who attended any of the conferences posted a short essay on the various speakers as well as the information they obtained informally.

Hopefully, next year I will be able to attend one. All three looked excellent.

Best hope of course is one day we will be able to agree with the title of Posner's book and state: "Case Closed"!

[Ron Ecker]

Here's George Lardner Jr. of the Washington Post on one of the other conferences:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...5112000830.html

[Tim Gratz]

Ron, thanks for posting the article.

I found these reported remarks from G. Robert Blakey of great interest.

The committee's chief counsel, G. Robert Blakey, whose main suspect remains the late New Orleans Mafia boss Carlos Marcello, explained his loss of confidence in the CIA in a talk Saturday night. The committee had relied on the late George Joannides, a CIA officer called out of retirement, to help it find and review CIA documents during its investigation. But the agency never told the committee that Joannides had been the case officer for a CIA-funded anti-Castro exile group that had contacts with Oswald and an ostensible confrontation with him in New Orleans before the assassination.

"The agency set me up," Blakey said. Joannides, he recalled, frequently blocked the efforts of the House panel's young researchers to obtain relevant CIA records, but when they complained to him, Blakey said he accepted the CIA's assurances that his aides were being too pushy and suspicious. Looking back on it, he said, "I have no confidence in anything the agency told me."

Interesting that Blakey recalls that it was Joannides who seemed to behind the CIA efforts to stonewall the HSCA.

We may have discussed this before. Do you recall how Joannides got the liason position with the HSCA? I know he was called out of retirement to take it.

[Dawn Meredith]

Ron, thanks for posting the article.

Thanx Ron. Kinda surprising for Ladner!! Of course NO mention of Joan or her book.

Blakey is such a damn joke. He can say all he wants NOW but under his "leadership" there would be no going after the CIA. Sprague would have done so, thus he was ousted.

Blakey was the lap dog. A willing stooge. I don't even understand why Lesar invited him to speak. He does not deserve to be there, imho. Why not Gaeton Fonzi or VIncent Salandria.

Dawn

[Thomas Graves]

I'm going to google the Dealey Plaza sniper's nest camera and see if I can pick out any of you there.

Have a good one.

Ter

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Hi Terry,

Sounds like a cool idea. Could you please post the web address to that or send it to me via e-mail?

Thanks, Thomas

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[John Simkin]

John wrote (about Lamar Waldron):

I think he has got it about 95% right. I suspect that his theory will upset some members because he argues that JFK was serious about his plan to overthrow Castro in December, 1963.

John has seen the light!!!

You clearly have not read the book Tim. Lamar makes it very clear that Castro or the Soviets had nothing to do with the assassination.

Lamar shows from recently released documents that JFK was following two strategies for dealing with Castro. Both were highly secret and were known to only a small number of people. If either of these "policies" were exposed, JFK faced the possibility of impeachment. It was an amazingly dangerous strategy and was full of risks.

This is not just a theory. Both David Kaiser (Professor in the Strategy and Policy Department of the Naval War College) and Larry Hancock, have used these documents to come to the same conclusion.

The two strategies were:

(1) Secret negotiations with Castro via Lisa Howard, William Attwood, Jean Daniel etc.

(2) A secret plot to overthrow Castro on 1st December, 1963.

JFK prefered the first option but Castro was playing hard to get. For example, in November, Castro was keeping Jean Daniel waiting for a meeting. In fact, he only agreed to see him on the day of the assassination. They were together when news came through that JFK had been killed. Who knows what would have come out of this meeting? The main sticking point involved United Nations inspections of Cuba. Documents have just been released that show that JFK's pledge not to invade Cuba was linked to UN inspections.

Given these documents the issue is: "would JFK have chosen option 1 or 2". If he went for 1 he would have betrayed the anti-Castro Cubans again. The leaders of this group were already angry with JFK for insisting on a broad coalition after the overthrow of Castro. Some of these proposed leaders like Ray and Artime were considered by people the right as dangerous left-wingers.

JFK was of course right that only a broad coalition had any chance of success in a post Castro Cuba. The far right Cubans realised that even if JFK went for plan 2, they would not gain power themselves. Both plans were therefore unacceptable to them. Therefore it was members of this group that betrayed JFK's operation to the Mafia. Oswald and the Cubans were therefore set up to appear to be responsible for killing JFK. It was thought that this would have triggered an invasion that would have resulted in another right-wing military dictatorship that would allow the Mafia back into Cuba.

My disagreement with Lamar concerns LBJ. I think it is true that RFK would have been forced to go along with the cover-up. However, it was difficult to predict how LBJ would have reacted. For example, once president, he had enough information to realize that Marcello, etc., was involved in the plot. He could have used this information to destroy the Mafia. How did Marcello know he would not do this? I believe that LBJ was part of this Marcello plot. The timing of JFK's death is vitally important. Don't forget Don Reynolds' secret testimony to the Senate Rules Committee on the day of the assassination. If JFK did not die in November, LBJ would have been impeached. That is why the conspirators did not wait until 1st December to see if the coup took place.

My view is that JFK would have done a deal with Castro. The coup idea was too risky. Even if JFK could have put together a coalition that was acceptable to most Cubans, a significant number would have continued to resist. It is possible that JFK could have found himself in another Vietnam or Iraq. This was the very reason why JFK was unwilling to send troops to Vietnam. JFK was no George Bush (or Tim Gratz).

Lamar has not released details of who the coup leader was going to be. Reading between the lines, David Kaiser and myself have come to the same conclusion. Will be interested to know what other readers think the man's name is.

Both Lamar Waldron and David Kaiser have agreed to join the Forum. The debate should be very interesting.

[John Simkin]

Thanx Ron. Kinda surprising for Ladner!! Of course NO mention of Joan or her book.

Blakey is such a damn joke. He can say all he wants NOW but under his "leadership" there would be no going after the CIA. Sprague would have done so, thus he was ousted.

Blakey was the lap dog. A willing stooge. I don't even understand why Lesar invited him to speak. He does not deserve to be there, imho. Why not Gaeton Fonzi or VIncent Salandria.

I am afraid people have not made much of Joan's book. A new biography of Jim Garrison was needed but she has done nothing to advance the investigation of the assassination of JFK.

I think you are being very harsh on Blakey. After all, he did name Marcello as being involved in the JFK assassination. What he missed was the CIA involvement (Carl Jenkins and David Marales). He is now explaining why this did not happen. I think he should be praised for this admission.

The conference was a great success. There were some tremendous presentations. This included those by Lamar Waldron, Larry Hancock, John Hunt, William Law, Stu Wexler, Pat Speer, Bill Miller, David Kaiser, Jim Marrs and Thomas Pearcy. Most of these people are also members of the Forum. Those that are not (Lamar Waldron, John Hunt, David Kaiser and Thomas Pearcy) have agreed to join.

We are in for some exciting times. I do really believe we are getting very close to working out the complete story. Lamar made the point that if we can persuade the CIA to declassify the rest of the documents relating to the case (estimated to be over a million documents) then we can get closure. Getting Carl Jenkins to talk is going to be another important step. This could be a turning point in the history of all our countries. It should lead to reform of the way we are governed. The main point about this matter is that we have not been living in a fully functioned democracy. Hopefully, this will now change.

[John Simkin]

I am afraid my presentation overrun and I was unable to take questions. Please post them here if you have any.

You will find my Dallas presentation here:

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/1Dallas.htm

However, I will be updating it as a result of what I heard from Lamar Waldron. It is now clear why Robert and Edward Kennedy refused to act after hearing Grant Stockdale's story. In fact, they virtually signed Stockdale's death warrant.

Dorothy Kilgallen's death now also makes much more sense. She probably knew about JFK's dual Cuban policy via Florence Pritchett (the coup plot via Earl Smith and the secret negotiations via JFK).

I hope Pat Speer will also post a link to his excellent seminar.

[Thomas Graves]

The conference was a great success. There were some tremendous presentations. This included those by Lamar Waldron, Larry Hancock, John Hunt, William Law, Stu Wexler, Pat Speer, Bill Miller, David Kaiser, Jim Marrs and Thomas Pearcy. Most of these people are also members of the Forum. Those that are not (Lamar Waldron, John Hunt, David Kaiser and Thomas Pearcy) have agreed to join.

We are in for some exciting times. I do really believe we are getting very close to working out the complete story. Lamar made the point that if we can persuade the CIA to declassify the rest of the documents relating to the case (estimated to be over a million documents) then we can get closure. Getting Carl Jenkins to talk is going to be another important step. This could be a turning point in the history of all our countries. It should lead to reform of the way we are governed. The main point about this matter is that we have not been living in a fully functioned democracy. Hopefully, this will now change.

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John,

Thanks for keeping us up to date. Excellent stuff, indeed. (You are also to be commended for bursting Tim's baloon so quickly and so diplomatically.)

Thomas

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Edited November 23, 2005 by Thomas Graves

[James Richards]

You will find my Dallas presentation here:

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/1Dallas.htm (John Simkin)

Good stuff, John.

I wish I could have been there to see it.

James

[Gerry Hemming]

I am afraid my presentation overrun and I was unable to take questions. Please post them here if you have any.

You will find my Dallas presentation here:

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/1Dallas.htm

However, I will be updating it as a result of what I heard from Lamar Waldron. It is now clear why Robert and Edward Kennedy refused to act after hearing Grant Stockdale's story. In fact, they virtually signed Stockdale's death warrant.

Dorothy Kilgallen's death now also makes much more sense. She probably knew about JFK's dual Cuban policy via Florence Pritchett (the coup plot via Earl Smith and the secret negotiations via JFK).

I hope Pat Speer will also post a link to his excellent seminar.

---------------------------

John:

Might I be so bold as to suggest a couple of minor corrections to your "Presentation" and bio details on Eddy Collins and Jim Lewis.

Collins was never a Marine, nor had he ANY affiliation with the Navy UDT [underwater Demolitions Teams].

You might have been confused by my having mentioned that numerous No Name Key Pics show him wearing the "UDT" style Life-Jacket ["Mae West"] around his waist -- which was issued to all InterPen GW instructors.

Collins came to us just after he had been seperated from active duty with the U.S. Army in Europe. His last

Army assigment was with "E-Comm-Comm" [a similar sounding name was used in the movie "7 Days in May" -- cited as the "illegal" military unit (supporting the coup d'etat plotters) and led by the JCS General, who was played by Burt Lancaster]

"E-Comm-Comm" translates from "Pentagonese" as: European Communications Command, S.H.A.P.E., and headquartered in Frankfurt, West Germany [1952 - 1964].

Collins was a communications [CW radio/teletype M.O.S.] specialist/operator, and had a security clearance just below the "Q" and "Umbra" crypto categories.

James Arthur Lewis indeed was a Marine, and moreover, held U.S. and numerous foreign maritme licenses up to the category of "Unlimited Master" [of steam & motor vessels]. He also held certificates as "Master" of the "Sailing Class" schooners. For a while he captained some of Mike Burke's "Windjammer Barefoot Cruise" Tall Ships, from the Port of Miami.

Jim was employed by both Alaska Barge & Mining and Pacific Architects & Engineers -- to ferry some vessels to Vietnam during the late 1960s. Other InterPen members joined him, and upon arrival [much to Jim's chagrin] opted to remain in the RVN to work for the "RMK/BRJ" construction consortium.

Capt. Hans G. Milton had arranged for Jim's vessel ferrying jobs. Some vessels were CIA spec/war boats which were later assigned to the MACV/SOG sub-unit -- the N.A.D. based at Cam ranh Bay and Danang [Tourane]. The "Naval Advisory Detachment" at Danang was tasked with raids, supply barge interdiction, and the insertion of Vietnamese commandos & spies into the coastal [littoral] areas of North Vietnam.

The Danang N.A.D. use Norwegian "Nasty" MTBs [Motor Torpedo Boats] which routinely outran the NVA PT Boats and the PLA [ChiCom] "Swatow" boats. During 1962, and just after JFK approved the creation of the Navy SEALS [1962] -- he personally drafted the plans for the specific use of these very PT Boats in the 'nam.

Ironically, the very same two ASR-81 Boats used in the filming of "PT-109" [re-built by Tom McCrory at Miami Ship] were later sent to Danang, but they both turned out to be miserable failures -- and were later shot up and destroyed during routine target practice off of Cam Ranh Bay !!

The N.A.D. Danang "Nasty" boats were the very same ones involved in the "Tonkin Gulf Incident" [Aug. '64]

wherein while being pursued by NVA PT Boats [after raiding Vinh] they fled for the "safety/fire-cover" protection offered by the Destroyers "Turner Joy" and "Maddox".

Jim Lewis had previously been hired by a group of Euro-American artifacts/treasure-trove marketeers, who had heard of his skills as a treasure hunter, and moreover: That he had visited the Spanish Archives in Seville, Spain on more than one occasion.

He got into a little trouble when he pre-emptively "Jumped" a treasure trove -- which he had been hired to locate, and had subsequently "dived uppon" same !! [without informing the sponsors]

[His death resulted from his secretly "claim-jumping" one of our ventures]

Upon his final return from the 'nam, he had a fat bank account, and decided to join CIA's Tom McCrory in a joint-venture merchant vessel operation -- which focused on trade between Dominica, Antigua, and other Lesser Antilles locales.

He postponed that plan to have a go at our "treasure trove" operation; this one in 1970s Dollar$ was estimated at over $200 Million. [After the 1979 explosion of Gold prices to $500+ per ounce -- this "trove" would have been worth over $2 Billion ("melt-down" value -- NOT artifact value, which is many times higher) had we had sat on it till then !!]

James Arthur Lewis died while diving "alone" [a big No-No] near Egmont Key, at the mouth of Tampa Bay, during 1970. He was using a recently purchased "Beckmann Electro-Lung" [Re-Breather SCUBA] which permitted a diver to go to extreme depths without the risk of getting "Bent" -- or having to "decomprees" at multiple ascending "stage" levels. His "Diver-Tender" was Ralph "Skinny Ralph" Schlafter.

It took us two days to find his body !!

Chairs,

Gerry

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[Tim Gratz]

Thomas wrote:

Thanks for keeping us up to date. Excellent stuff, indeed. (You are to be commended for bursting Tim's ballon so quickly and so diplomatically.)

Thomas

John wrote:

I think he [Waldron] has got it about 95% right. I suspect that his theory will upset some members because he argues that JFK was serious about his plan to overthrow Castro in December, 1963.

I have not yet read the book, John. Nor, I imagine, have you. From its reviews I know it does not posit Cuban participation.

Where John has, I think, made progress is in now concluding that there was significant Mafia involvement (a point he had contested with me last winter) and that there were serious efforts afoot for a coup in Cuba (apparently under the code name "AMBLOOD", a rather chilling code name to be sure).

Clearly if Waldron and Hartmann are correct that there were serious efforts to stage an imminent coup, to be followed by an imminent invasion, Castro had more than one motive to want to effect a "regime change" in the U.S. I have argued that if Castro was involved it was through Florida mafia chieftan Santo Trafficante, Jr., who many writers have suspected (and Gerry confirms) had close ties to the DGI. It has been stipulated here, I believe, that Castro's intelligence had advance knowledge of the assassination plot against JFK. If Castro even encouraged Trafficante in the plot, that is sufficient, legally, I believe, to make him a conspirator.

John wrote:

JFK prefered the first option but Castro was playing hard to get. For example, in November, Castro was keeping Jean Daniel waiting for a meeting. In fact, he only agreed to see him on the day of the assassination.

I have said before that I consider it suspicious that Castro had postponed his meeting with Daniel so that it happened to coincide with the moment of Kennedy's death. It also happened to coincide (to the hour if not the moment) that the CIA was delivering an assassination weapon to Cubela, most likely an agent provocateur for Castro. (And remember Cubela had close association with Trafficante, an association that Trafficante lied about before the HSCA.) If Castro indeed had advance knowledge of the assassination, he was in a unique position to make those three events coincide. It could have been Castro's way of demonstrating that while JFK was supposedly encouraging a peace initiative through Daniel, in reality the US government was plotting his assassination (through AMLASH) or his overthrow (through AMBLOOD).

Note also it is possible that if Castro and Trafficante were indeed communicating, Trafficante may not necessarily have communicated that to Rosselli and Marcello.

John wrote:

My disagreement with Lamar concerns LBJ. I think it is true that RFK would have been forced to go along with the cover-up. However, it was difficult to predict how LBJ would have reacted. For example, once president, he had enough information to realize that Marcello, etc., was involved in the plot. He could have used this information to destroy the Mafia. How did Marcello know he would not do this?

Here I both agree and disagree with John. I think the impetus behind Mafia involvement was the RFK efforts against the Mafia. I do not think Marcello feared LBJ; I think Marcello had "the goods" on LBJ. But I do agree that the Mafia may have feared how LBJ would react. Therefore, it has been my supposition that the Mafia gave LBJ limited advance knowledge of the assassination, with orders to cover it up. I believe that the method that LBJ used to force a cover-up (fear of a war) may have been handed to him by the conspirators. LBJ's participation in the cover-up may thus have been assured by his preknowledge of the assassination and threat of blackmail by the Mafia.

I do not discount the possibility that Rosselli may have involved CIA agents he knew to muddy the waters.

A conspiracy involving the Mafia, certain CIA operatives and Castro is exactly the scenario proposed by Michael Kurtz in "The Crime of the Century."

I think we are coming, gradually, closer to agreement, at least on who some of the players were. I do admit that there is no "smoking gun" evidence of Cuban involvement but, in my assessment, the circumstances would so suggest.

Edited November 22, 2005 by Tim Gratz