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A good summary at this link. Can't paste the text.



J. Edgar Hoover death records getting another look

Copyright © 1998 The Seattle Times Company

Posted at 09:38 p.m. PST; Sunday, January 18, 1998


by Kalpana Srinivasan

The Associated Press

WASHINGTON - A university professor of forensic science, suspecting foul play in J. Edgar Hoover's death, has been granted access to the District of Columbia medical examiner's records to reinvestigate how the former FBI director died.

George Washington University Professor James Starrs believes the records may clarify the circumstances around Hoover's 1972 death at age 77, which was attributed officially to a heart attack. No autopsy was performed.

Starrs says nothing in Hoover's medical history would suggest he was a candidate for a heart attack. Without an autopsy, other causes of death are still open, he said.

"Everything thus far indicates there was nothing of sufficient medical history to write this off as a heart attack," Starrs said yesterday in a telephone interview. "Hoover had numerous enemies from all walks of life; the man's life was marked for death by all kinds of people."

Hoover's death will be the subject of a panel at the upcoming American Academy of Forensic Science meeting on Feb. 13 in San Francisco, Calif. Starrs will join experts such as renowned forensic pathologist Dr. Michael Baden, a witness in the O.J. Simpson case, and handwriting expert Dr. Duayne Dillon, who examined papers believed to belong to John F. Kennedy.

Starrs says his longheld interest in the Hoover case has been compounded by various suspicious details people have reported through the years.

One theory suggests that burglars on the Hoover premises might have poisoned his toiletries, which could have triggered a heart attack, Starrs said. According to another report, a neighbor saw someone moving a body back to the house the day of the death, Starrs said.

While the professor is not advancing views on a motive or suspect, he notes that plenty of peoplemight have wanted Hoover dead.

"The main suggestion was that it was part of the Watergate scene in the '70s," Starrs said.

Starrs already has obtained some FBI records on Hoover, which he will use to compare notes with the medical-examiner papers. He is particularly interested in details such as when the funeral home embalmed the body and who the doctor was that Hoover had an appointment with the day of his death.

"This is not a cold fishing expedition," he said. "I know what I am looking for."

The various experts at next month's meeting will consider whether Hoover could have been poisoned, as well as whether there were any signs of a heart condition in Hoover's profile. A former federal prosecutor will listen to the collected material at the event and determine whether there is enough evidence to form a case. The former prosecutor's opinion, however, will have no official weight.

Starrs says he and other skeptics will not call for the exhumation of the body until they have amassed enough proof to warrant it.

"I'm conscious of the fact that the public thinks there are a group of people who are graverobbers," Starrs said. "We have to do significant investigation to prove the merit for an exhumation."

Several years ago, Starrs dug up infamous outlaw Jesse James. He also has asked to exhume the remains of famed explorer Meriwether Lewis to determine whether his death in 1809 was a murder or suicide.


Conspiracy Nation -- Vol. 12 Num. 06


("Quid coniuratio est?")



[Editor's note: Circa Autumn 1995, Sherman Skolnick's guest on his popular Chicago public access television program, "Broadsides," was independent film producer Cibacuyo Aguay Banar(sp?), a.k.a. "Ciba." Ciba has been investigating the attempted assassination in May of 1972 of then-Governor George Wallace. What follows is an abbreviated transcription of Skolnick's and Ciba's remarks.]

SKOLNICK: Tell our viewers what you've been working on.

CIBA: For the past three years I've been involved in a film that I'm producing, dealing specifically with the conspiracy and attempted assassination of Governor George Wallace of Alabama on May 15th, 1972.

SKOLNICK: You've travelled thousands of miles. What kinds of interviews have you done?

But first of all, tell us: Has there been any real documentary made of what some feel was a conspiracy to assassinate George Wallace?

CIBA: Not only has no documentary been made; no book has ever been written dealing with the attack on Wallace. My book is going to be, hopefully, the first.

SKOLNICK: Why have the assassination researchers ignored the Wallace attempted assassination?

CIBA: I believe that the answer to that question lies in the fact that the assassination of President Kennedy was one of the most seminal acts in the history of mankind, and thus, there is a concentration on wanting to solve the quandry, the mystery, the enigma, tied into that particular assassination.

SKOLNICK: What kind of interviews have you done in pursuit of this documentary, which you're hoping to get on television and then into a book?

CIBA: We interviewed Governor Wallace at his residence in Alabama.

SKOLNICK: You wanted him on videotape, but he was too ill.

CIBA: Yes. He was too ill to allow us to bring in our cameras. We had to write out a questionaire and submit it to the Governor, and then he went, question by question, answering each one as I stood at his bedside. We were, however, allowed the privilege of being able to photograph him.

He's bed-ridden, and disease has taken its toll on his voice-box. He is barely able to make himself audible, so that most of the questions (though not all of them) he will answer "yes" or "no."

SKOLNICK: At the time Wallace was shot -- so to speak into a wheelchair and not into the cemetery -- he was running for President and pulling about 21 percent of the vote.

CIBA: Which comes to 26 million popular votes.

SKOLNICK: But because of the different states that it was into, he could have had the whole thing thrown into the House of Representatives, where it would have been a turmoil.

Recently we did a show with spokespersons for some third-party candidates, including those for Perot. And I raised the same question. (Perot had 19 percent in the '92 election.) And when I raised this question, they said, "Oh, so if Perot had 21 percent, like Wallace, they'd have to shoot him?" I said, "In my opinion, yes." Why is that? I mean, some of us believe that the ultra-rich believe in the bullet, not the ballot. Is that the bottom line?

CIBA: The bottom line is money, the almighty dollar: who can best serve the interests of the Northeastern Atlantic elite and the Southwestern Pacific elite.

SKOLNICK: Just prior to Wallace being shot, he had made a statement. He said, "There's not a dimes worth of difference between the Democrat and Republican Parties." (He was a third-party candidate, very populist.) He said, "If I'm elected, one of the first things I'm going to do is tax the Rockefeller Foundation." When I heard that, I said, "Wallace, you haven't got enough life insurance." So you weren't able to get Wallace on video, but you still got pictures.





CIBA: One of the questions that I asked the Governor in writing was, "Was there a conspiracy behind the shooting of your person?" He said, "Yes. Definitely a conspiracy." And then he looked up, on the page, to where a previous question had been asked regarding Richard Nixon. And with the stub of his cigar he poked at the name of Richard Nixon. He said, "Conspiracy! Conspiracy!" And he jabbed at the name of Nixon on the page.

SKOLNICK: What else leads you to believe that there was a conspiracy?

CIBA: There was no way that Richard Nixon was ever going to be re-elected with Wallace in the campaign. To get back into the Oval Office, you had to do away with Wallace so that most of those 26 million votes -- which were center, or right of center -- would come over to the side of Nixon.

SKOLNICK: What do you make of the fact that 6 weeks after they took Wallace out of the campaign by almost killing him, the Watergate break-in occurred?

CIBA: The Watergate break-in was nothing more than a contrivance: a poorly executed mission that had, at its very bottom, a very sharp hatchet. And the hatchet was aimed at Nixon's head. The Watergate break-in was designed to be found, and to point the blame at Nixon and bring him down.

SKOLNICK: E. Howard Hunt, Frank Sturgis, and others, were involved in the break-in at the Watergate. And there's reason to believe that the White House sent E. Howard Hunt to Arthur Bremer's [bremer found guilty of shooting Wallace] apartment in Milwaukee...

CIBA: ...on orders from Charles Colson.

SKOLNICK: Bremer's apartment, after the shooting of Wallace, was not sealed off; stuff could have been planted there, such as fake diaries. In other words, Arthur Bremer's diary showed up.

CIBA: Yes, but the diary showed up in the car.

But when Bremer shot Wallace, the first people that went physically into the apartment were from a bogus news organization known as "TIPS" -- Transcontinental International Press Services. Now they are a creature of the Guardians, which are the militant wing of the Church of Scientology. And I'm talking about the branch in Los Angeles.

SKOLNICK: The Secret Service allowed Bremer to penetrate Nixon's security. In other words, if you create a vacuum where a would-be assassin can penetrate Secret Service security, then it becomes easy to kill somebody. Like they did with Dr. King: withdraw the security.

CIBA: Bremer was in the city of Ottawa, Capital of Canada, when Nixon was visiting Pierre Trudeau, the Canadian Prime Minister at the time. Bremer and Frank Sturgis stayed at the Lord Elgin Hotel, in Ottawa. They stayed in the same section of the Hotel. Frank Sturgis was the control officer of Arthur Bremer on the road. It was he who was passing on money and information to Bremer.

Sturgis and Bremer stayed in the same section of the Lord Elgin Hotel that the Secret Service detail of Richard Nixon was staying in.

SKOLNICK: Could Bremer, at one point, have targeted Nixon for assassination?

CIBA: You will recall that the same mythology was created in the assassination of John Kennedy: that Oswald was after Nixon and then, because security was so tight, he instead trained the crosshairs of his weapon on Jack Kennedy. The same thing here: they want you to believe that Bremer was after Nixon and because security was so tight, again, the "lone assassin" trained his gun on someone else -- Wallace.

It was all part of a false trail. You know, you always lay a trail of "golden apples."

SKOLNICK: So how long have you been on this case?

CIBA: On this particular case, I've been on it for close to four years. But I've been involved in assassination research for 27 years.

I was able to interview, on this particular junket, not only Governor Wallace; I was able to interview John Ehrlichmann, Colonel Fletcher Prouty... I also spoke to John Judge, president of the Coalition On Political Assassinations.

SKOLNICK: Continue telling us, Ciba: Why do you believe that there was a plot?

CIBA: In Milwaukee, Arthur Bremer's control officer was not Frank Sturgis. It was a man by the name of Dennis Salvatore Cosini Guzman(sp?). Dennis Guzman was a journalism student at Marquette University, in Milwaukee. While Bremer was in Milwaukee, he attended a series of meetings of the SDS: the Students for a Democratic Society.

SKOLNICK: There were agents provocateurs in the Students for a Democratic Society.

CIBA: And Cosini was one of them.

I'll tell you who else was involved: Donald Segretti.

SKOLNICK: Really!?

CIBA: He was seen in Milwaukee in the presence of Arthur Bremer and J. Timothy Gratt(sp?), who was the head of the Young Republicans.





SKOLNICK: You're saying that known figures were involved in the attempted assassination of George Wallace during the '72 Presidential campaign. You mentioned Frank Sturgis. Are you ready to contend that E. Howard Hunt, who was involved that same year in the Watergate break-in, that he was in some way involved? He went to Bremer's apartment, after the Wallace shooting.

CIBA: He denies it. But not only do I think he went to the apartment in Milwaukee, I think that it is E. Howard Hunt who planted "Bremer's diary" inside of Bremer's parked car, in Maryland. That's what I think.

SKOLNICK: All right: you've got Sturgis. You've got Hunt. You've got Segretti... Now Segretti was?

CIBA: He was chieftain of the "dirty tricks" department for Richard Nixon, at the street level.

SKOLNICK: In other words, to break up peace parades...

CIBA: ...the planting of Nazi memorabilia on Wallace's cars, and things of that nature.

SKOLNICK: To target Wallace?

CIBA: Oh yes. As a Nazi. In order to dissuade people from voting for him.




SKOLNICK: I followed some of the Wallace campaign in '68 and '72. Wallace wanted to tax the Rockefeller Foundation; he wanted to tax the very rich. He said things that appealed to common people, of all kinds of parties.

One of the things which I've been told by retired government intelligence officials that I've known over the years is, that when a person makes statements that give the impression that the era of the common man has arrived, if it gains momentum, it causes the ultra rich to say, "That guy... Forget about the ballot. The bullet!"

CIBA: The era of the common man has long been overdue. So whenever you get anyone who takes that stand...

SKOLNICK: Like Abraham Lincoln. [Like Martin Luther King.]

CIBA: Yes. Because the truth has always made authority tremble.

SKOLNICK: Did Wallace fit that mold? Did he start a psychology that the era of the common man had arrived?

CIBA: Yes. Without a doubt. His whole campaign was geared toward the blue-collar.

Bear in mind that many, many was the time that the Governor of Alabama said, "They are having meetings about me in them there banks up in the Northeast."

It is known that the Rockefellers were very worried about the candidacy of Governor Wallace because it threatened the re-election of their man, Richard Nixon.

SKOLNICK: What are some of the "nuts and bolts" that lead you to believe there was a conspiracy against Wallace?

CIBA: It has been, for over two decades, believed that the Milwaukee CIA control officer of Arthur Bremer, Dennis Salvatore Cosini Guzman, died on July the 6th, 1972, in Toronto, Canada. He was supposed to have been given a "hot shot" of heroin.

Dennis Salvatore Cosini Guzman is not dead. He is alive. I know this for a fact. I know where he's living. I know the alias that he's using. I know the industry that he works in. And if there was, in fact, a body found at the Toronto airport, it was not Dennis Guzman.

SKOLNICK: Is Bremer in jail for the rest of his life?

CIBA: Yes. He got 67 years. He will never get out alive.

SKOLNICK: He doesn't say anything in the jail?

CIBA: He refuses to speak to anyone about anything. They keep him segregated.

He's another mystery. When he was arrested, the people standing next to the shooter couldn't identify Arthur Bremer as being the shooter. Arthur Bremer's fingerprints are not on the weapon. The weapon could not be matched to the bullets taken from the Governor.

SKOLNICK: Was there a government investigation?


They gave Arthur Bremer a parrafin test. They found no gunpowder residue on his hands.

SKOLNICK: One indication of a covert operative is that he's very active in things, with no visible income. He lives well. Was that true of Bremer?






CIBA: Yes, and he travels well. We know that part of the money was being garnered from Robert Vesco's organization in Toronto...

SKOLNICK: Vesco!? He's involved in it too?

CIBA: In the trafficking of narcotics into Canada. Here's how the Vesco money was being utilized, in part. Money was being sent from Toronto by Vesco's organization into the Maryland political organization, the Republican organization. Part of that money was taken out. The rest was sent over to the office of Congressman William O. Mills. Congressman Mills would take his cut, and pass the rest on to Vice President Spiro Agnew. (Remember that Maryland was Agnew's fiefdom. He ran it like a camp.) Agnew would take his cut and pass the rest on to Richard Nixon. Richard Nixon would then take part of that money that was left and put a smile on the pocket of Attorney General John Mitchell. And it was John Mitchell who was directly responsible for keeping Robert Vesco out of the hands of U.S. authorities.

SKOLNICK: They're trying lately to bring Vesco back to the United States.

CIBA: They're not going to bring him back to the United States because the people that are in power behind-the-scenes do not want Robert Vesco on U.S. soil. There's too many bones, and he knows where the bones are buried.

SKOLNICK: They'd have to dig up Nixon's skeleton from the cemetery and hang him from a rope.

CIBA: Nixon, after sharing the money with John Mitchell, took the remainder and passed it on to Bebe Rebozo, his Cuban lifelong friend in Miami. Bebe had a bank. And it was through Bebe's bank that the money was funneled out into the Bahamas. Upon reaching the Bahamas, the money was put into a bank, taken out immediately, and shifted over into Switzerland into a bank that was -- no surprise -- run by Robert Vesco.

Part of that money that Robert Vesco shipped down south into Maryland, to Nixon... $25,000 was taken out of that, out of the coffers of Congressman Mills, and sent north into Milwaukee. It was placed into the hands of Milwaukee multi-millionaire attorney Herbert A. Spenner(sp?). Spenner was the head of the German bund in Milwaukee in 1972. And he was seen drinking beer on many an occasion with Arthur Bremer.

SKOLNICK: Are you saying that Nixon was part of it all? Or that there was an apparatus that helped Nixon, whether Nixon knew or not?

CIBA: Nixon was part of it. Nixon knew. And Nixon was a witting conspirator.

SKOLNICK: Do you think Wallace knows the nature of the conspiracy that almost killed him?






CIBA: Sure. He knows.

And let me just say before we're through: it wasn't just Wallace who knew. You couldn't just move upon Wallace while J. Edgar Hoover was alive. Because J. Edgar Hoover was threatening the Nixon White House.

SKOLNICK: Whoa.... Wait a minute. You bring up an interesting point. Hoover died very mysteriously.

CIBA: He died May the 1st, 1972, two weeks before Wallace was moved upon.

SKOLNICK: A story about Hoover's death appeared in the Harvard University Crimson. Two people who claimed they were tied in with Frank Sturgis claimed that they were the ones who put exotic poison into Hoover's dental items or toiletries?

CIBA: What they did was the following: Hoover had to be removed before they moved upon Wallace, because Hoover was an enemy of those that had encircled Richard Nixon -- what was known as the German Mafia. Hoover hated them with a purple passion, he wanted them removed, and he had told Nixon that he must get rid of them.

SKOLNICK: On May 1st, J. Edgar Hoover was probably murdered. There was no autopsy. The laws provided for an autopsy, but there wasn't any. And they took him away to the mortuary. And then two people showed up who supposedly poisoned Hoover.

May 1st: Hoover probably murdered. Attempted murder in the middle of May against George Wallace. Then, several weeks after that, the Watergate break-in.

CIBA: Nixon spoke to Hoover and told him, "I want you to resign." Hoover told the President, "I am not going to resign." So then, the "Plumbers" went into Hoover's house, and they doused his toiletries with a genre of Thio-phosphates(sp?). This is a poison that is based on limestone and brimstone and sulphur that eats up the oxygen in your circulatory system.

SKOLNICK: We have a few minutes left, Ciba. Tell us: What do you want the public to understand?

CIBA: History, despite its wrenching pain, cannot be unlived. But if we rise up to meet it head-on, then history need not be re-lived. When we as a people fail, or worse yet, refuse to stand up to the injustice of our historical past, then that injustice becomes an ever-present constant in our daily lives.

SKOLNICK: Is political assassination part of the fabric of America?

CIBA: It is part of the tapestry, and it is a very vital weave indeed.

SKOLNICK: In other words, when they say, "Oh, that was long ago..."

CIBA: You're still living it now!!

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For related stories, visit:




'Conspiracy' was a word that was verboten. It was not to be heard on anybody's lips. The idea that Oswald had a confederate or was part of a group or a conspiracy was definitely enough to place a man's career in jeopardy."

-- Anthony Summers, writing in the afterword (for

paperback edition) of his book, *The Secret Life

of J. Edgar Hoover*

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*The Secret Life of J. Edgar Hoover* by Anthony Summers

Author Summers, writing in the afterword of the paperback edition of his book, laments the fact that "Although this book is about issues far wider and more serious than Hoover's sexual preferences, it was the sex that preoccupied the media."

This is the book known for revealing that long-time FBI director Hoover and his sidekick and second-in-command at the FBI, Clyde Tolson, were gay. Yet this book is much deeper than the stuff of mere daytime TV talk shows. True, it tells about such things as

[Roy] Cohn ushered them into a suite to find Edgar, again attired in female finery. His clothing this time was even more outlandish. "He had a red dress on," Susan recalled, "and a black feather boa around his neck. He was dressed like an old flapper, like you see on old tintypes."

"After about half an hour some boys came, like before. This time they're dressed in leather. And Hoover had a Bible. He wanted one of the boys to read from the Bible. And he read, I forget which passage, and the other boy played with him, wearing the rubber gloves. And then Hoover grabbed the Bible, threw it down and told the second boy to join in the sex."

Or how about this one:

Edgar could not stand to see his friend [Tolson] show his weaknesses in public. When Clyde stumbled and fell at the [racetrack] in California, Edgar ordered an accompanying agent not to help him. "Leave him alone," he snapped. "Let the dumb asshole get up by himself."

Hoover, who author Summers, a veteran BBC journalist, insists on referring to as "Edgar" throughout the book, had a habit of gambling on horse races with friend and lover Tolson. The two were often seen together at the Pimlico racetrack in Maryland. Apparently, Hoover received "payoffs" from the Mafia in the form of hot racing tips: he would win big at the track and in return would act dumb and say things like "Mafia? What Mafia? I don't see any Mafia."

But there's more to it than that. It is alleged that Hoover's homosexuality was known by mobsters who, in fact, had solid proof. It appears that the mob used this information as potential blackmail so as to keep Hoover from going after them. To anyone who remembers wondering, during the 1960s, how it could be that Hoover kept saying the Mafia didn't exist -- here is the answer: he was being blackmailed and bribed by them.

As noted, however, this book is much more than mere gossip about the Heinrich Himmler of the national police. Like Upton Sinclair's The Jungle which was about a lot more than unsanitary conditions in Chicago meat-packing plants, *The Secret Life of J. Edgar Hoover* is a profound study of American history and politics. It also works as a caricature of bureaucratic non- accountability and power run amok.

The historical element of the book is achieved via its focus on how Hoover, FBI director for 47 years, interacted with famous individuals of his time. Hoover had so much real power that U.S. presidents routinely bypassed their attorneys general and went directly to J. Edgar. "According to Nixon, Edgar told him 'every president since Roosevelt' had given him bugging assignments... By ignoring ethics, and on occasion the law, and by using the FBI to do it, they all made themselves beholden to Edgar."

And that brings in the political angle of this book: Secret Life is a fundamental textbook of political science, a "Politics 101". Forget about the crap they've taught you in school, your "education", paid for not coincidentally by the federal leviathan. This book gives you the real dirt on what actually goes on. Do you want something done? Then get detectives to dig through garbage cans, seduce old girlfriends and get them to squawk about what they know, pay off the right people, with a wink and a nod. "Somebody somewhere owes a favor, that's how things really get done." You don't believe it? Then read the book.

Summers seems to miss the deeper levels within his own book. He casually mentions that Hoover was a Thirty-third Degree Mason. Later, in discussing Hoover's rise to power, the author writes of the new FDR administration's proposed attorney general, Thomas Walsh, and his plans to reorganize the Justice Department. Hoover's career seemed threatened, but then "fate" intervened: Walsh died of a "heart attack" on the train bearing him to Washington, D.C.

Homer Cummings became FDR's attorney general and he, too, seemed to be about to fire Hoover. "Then fate intervened again -- this time with the death of Wallace Foster, a former Justice Department official Cummings was considering for Edgar's job."

Were these two deaths "fate", as Summers seems to believe, or was Hoover, the Thirty-third Degree Mason, already pre-determined by forces other than "fate" to remain installed as the absolute Czar of the national police -- no matter what the cost?

So too, the author misses a deeper insight into Hoover's death. According to Summers, Egil Krogh, "Nixon intimate and chief Plumber", declared that "We didn't knock off Hoover. He knocked himself off." Summers interprets Krogh's statement as alleging that Hoover committed suicide, but I don't read it that way. Previously in his book, Summers had laboriously documented how Nixon and friends (as well as others before them) had desperately wanted the aging Hoover to step down from his post at the FBI. Yet Hoover could not be budged, due to the voluminous files he maintained on others -- he had so much dirt on everyone that he was politically untouchable. Hoover knocked himself off, I think, because he would not allow himself to be retired; he left his opponents no other option.

Summers even goes into allegations that "aspirin roulette" may have been toyed with as a means of eliminating the FBI director:

Edgar had been the target of two operations, according to these sources. A first break-in attempt, in "late winter of 1972," was designed to "retrieve documents that were thought to be used as potential blackmail against the White House." It failed, but was followed by a second, successful break- in. "This time," Frazier reported, "whether through misunderstanding or design, a poison of the thiophosphate genre was placed on Hoover's personal toilet articles."

Thiophosphate is a compound used in insecticides, highly toxic to human beings if taken orally, inhaled or absorbed through the pores of the skin. Ingestion can result in a fatal heart seizure and can be detected only if an autopsy is performed within hours of death.

Hoover's body was found in pajama trousers and lying beside the bed. It is assumed that Hoover had risen during the night to go to the bathroom and had had his "heart attack" then. But it is equally likely, in my opinion, that Hoover could have died on his way from the bathroom, perhaps just prior to first going to bed. If that were the case, could it not be that Hoover took the wrong "aspirin" and collapsed on the floor, poisoned, on his way to the bed?

Quoting Hoover's physician, Dr. Robert Choisser, Summers shows that Hoover's sudden death was in no way expected: "I was rather surprised by his sudden death, because he was in good health. I do not recall prescribing him medication for blood pressure or heart disease. There was nothing to lead anyone to expect him to die at that time, except for his age."

Summer's never says it but, reading between the lines, one can infer that Hoover was murdered.

This book has a lot. Was the FBI the precipitator of the 1970 killings at Kent State? What about the FBI files still too explosive to be released? Did Hoover's being blackmailed and bribed allow the Mafia a needed foothold at a time when they could still have been nipped in the bud? Is Hoover's ultimate legacy that organized crime has now grown so powerful that it has merged with the government? Did the FBI have information that could have helped the U.S. be prepared for the Japanese raid on Pearl Harbor? Was the FBI the actual force behind the so-called "McCarthy hearings"?

And finally, my own question to come out of this book: Is the FBI, behind its public relations mask, in fact just a foul pus growing upon the united States?

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Looks like Nixon and Garrison had the same bedfellows:

There were many people who believed that Nixon and the Mafia were bedfellows. Martha Mitchell, wife of the former Attorney General told UPI reporters, "Nixon is involved with the Mafia." Nixon’s chief of staff, General Haig, even ordered an investigation into the president’s Mob ties through the Army’s Criminal Investigation Unit.

In 1972, Richard Nixon arranged an unprecedented presidential pardon for New Jersey mobster, Angelo DeCarlo, a feared killer and capo in the Genovese crime family. It seemed that Nixon was paying back favours for more financial contributions to his re-election campaign. If Nixon was linked to the Mob, there can be little doubt that one of his connections to it was Marcello.

It's from the crime library.

Edited by Lynne Foster
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Oh what a pitty. The thread where Mark posted Hoover's early Mafia contacts was erased, probably because Dawn complained, again.

Anyways, any information about Hoover's contact with the Mafia is appreciated.

I understand he was Frank Costello's pal and he was close with Marcello, who else was Hoover in bed with?

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who else was Hoover in bed with?

Clyde Tolson? Not that there's anything wrong with that....


I need proof, is that what Clyde said?


Not sure where you are going. Did you read the first link? Hoover was a blackmailer, a closet homosexual, a 'blackmailee,' a meglomaniac, and had a very strong position of power almost synonymous to a King [or Queen, depending upon how you look at it]. He surrounded himself with suck-ups, loved to grandstand, and refused to retire. If there's any truth to the Plumber story, an aspirin a day was good for everyone.

Here's another one to consider:


- lee

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[quote name='Lynne Foster' date='Dec 16 2005, 12:42 AM' post='48981']

who else was Hoover in bed with?

Clyde Tolson? Not that there's anything wrong with that....


I need proof, is that what Clyde said?

Humor of the day :D


I guess she does serve a purpose here. We all have

to laugh sometimes!

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who else was Hoover in bed with?

Clyde Tolson? Not that there's anything wrong with that....


I need proof, is that what Clyde said?

Mmmm, tough crowd. That loud whooshing sound you may have heard was a joke flying right over your head. Granted, it wasn't much of a joke but then I'm not much of a comedian.

That aside, I fear an attempted exchange of ideas here would be like having a conversation with a squeaky gate hinge. Now, how does that block out feature work again?


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Patriots are beginning to call anybody who challenges the "patriotism" of Hoover and Garrison a crackpot !


Criticizing their heroes, Hoover and Garrison, always brings them out of the woodwork.


What is your point? I went back through the thread trying to figure out why I had initially replied - only to find that you had edited your posts. What is the point of this thread again? Perhaps the title of the thread should be revised?

Gordon Novel is still alive I believe. Maybe you could give him a call and ask him a few questions relative to Hoover, Tolson, Angelton, Garrison, etc.

- lee

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Why would Ms. Foster do that?

Did Mat/Matt Wilson mention Gordon Novel? If not, I would wager Ms. Foster has no interest in him whatsoever...I may be wrong, but I doubt it, based upon recent history on the forum.

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What is your point? I went back through the thread trying to figure out why I had initially replied - only to find that you had edited your posts. What is the point of this thread again? Perhaps the title of the thread should be revised?

The point is simple, it is difficult to understand anything about the Kennedy assassination without talking about Hoover and especially this document.

I think it's very basic and necessary context, that is all.

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