Walker - Ruby Connection

[Jim Root]

Tim

Ron

I continue to believe that McCloy was America's "C" (the person at the top of all intelligence organizations under US control). It seems to me that Hoover may have been one of the few people in the world that would be aware of that information if in fact it were true.

Within this context the statement,

"I'm not so certain as to the matter of the publicity that he might seek on it"

could have an interesting interpretation.

Perhaps the type of publicity that might be focused upon McCloy could backfire and the significance of his position on the Warren Commission could compromise the fact that the US did have a serious problem with Oswald and his relationship to US Intelligence.

But then again perhaps that is the information that we wanted to be understood by the Soviets who also may have had there own intelligence dilemma.

What type of publicity did McCloy seek by being on the Warren Commission is a perplexing question that I have spent a great deal of time mulling over. I am bothered by the fact that in the discussions that occured before the atomic bomb was dropped during WWII McCloy comes off as the "cooler head" who spoke against the total destruction of Japan by providing information that was made available to him via John B. Hurt. Also in an interview with Epstein that occured shortly after the Commissions Report was finished McCloy leaves open the possibility that at some time it might be discovered that Oswald was some sort of agent.

What exactly McCloy knew, how he knew it and when he first knew it will continue to facinate me!

Jim Root

Edited January 28, 2006 by Jim Root

[Robert Howard]

Jim,

In LBJ's phone conversation with Hoover on 11/29, LBJ goes over names of those he is considering for the commission. Hoover has good things to say about everybody except one. When LBJ says, "What do you think about John McCloy?", Hoover says, "I'm not as enthusiastic about McCloy. . . . I'm not so certain as to the matter of the publicity that he might seek on it." (Ellipsis in original)

What do you make of that? If McCloy was a conspirator, was Hoover really out of the loop? I have always found the latter hard to believe. And Hoover's apparent reason for not endorsing McCloy, that McCloy might be looking for publicity, doesn't seem to make much sense. Did McCloy have some need for publicity? Or was there just some enmity between Hoover and McCloy? I've always wondered about this exchange.

Ron

Well, for one maybe Hoover was displaying a somewhat muted dislike of McCloy because he was never able to dig up any dirt on him for blackmail purposes, it does seem to be Hoover's Modus Operandi to compromise his ideological and/or personal enemies. Although that is arguably only one of several possible angles to explore.

I am assuming that Forum members are aware that there were allegations that Jack Ruby had paid a visit to Walker's H.Q.'s circa April/May 1963.

This story emanated from William McEwan Duff. and appears to have been something that the WC didn't want to delve into, in my opinion.

In Andy Armstrong's [Ruby's bartender] HSCA Testimony he was asked:

Q: Did Jack Ruby ever mention Gen. Walker to you, Edwin Walker?

Armstrong: Yeah, he mentioned something about that, you know, putting the signs in the yard over there.

He went over there and made some pictures of that sign I think, not too long before the assassination.

Q: Do you remember him knowing Edwin Walker personally?

Armstrong: No

END

If I were a betting person, I would imagine Hemming was referencing Lester Logue as the mystery guest that was there the night of April 10th, 1963, But that is just speculation.

If I could inject another angle regarding the whole McCloy/Walker/Test Ban Treaty matter.

Before JFK took office there was the infamous U-2 incident, in which Francis Gary Powers U-2 was "shot down" over Russia, thus, sabotaging the "Peace Summit" which Eisenhower made no secret of the fact that he hoped the Summit would de-escalate the tensions between the USSR and the United States.

The U-2 Affair did to Eisenhower's goals re the Peace Summit, what the explosion did that brought down Power's U-2. There are, to everyone familiar with the U-2 incident, obvious indications that not only the cover story of how Power's U-2 went down was in error, but equally erroneous was Power's belief that Oswald's transmission of classified information to the Soviet's was why his U-2 had been brought down.

Eisenhower's desire to de-escalate the Cold War, at least with the Soviets places him in a geopolitical framework, that arguably is not so different from that of his successor Pres. Kennedy.

And here is the salient point, is it a reach to think that the same individuals who were involved in the intrigues which resulted in the U-2 crashing before the Peace Summit, [and later spinning the story that it was because of Oswald's providing codes and other critical data re the U-2] were the same parties to the assassination of JFK?

Edited December 1, 2006 by Robert Howard

[Jim Root]

Robert

If my research conclusions are correct the timeline that I presented earlier in this thread can be expanded on both sides.

For instance within months of the CIA mail opening program in New York (involving Richard Helms, Allen Dulles and James Jesus Angelton) Lee Harvey Oswald writes a letter to the Socialist Party in New York. Richard Helms would be monitoring the movements of Lee Harvey Oswald in the months preceeding the assassination of JFK. Was he monitoring Oswald begining in 1956/7 until 1963? I believe this is a possibility. If true this story becomes more complex.

The backyard photos with magazines that are Communist and Socialist (according to the Warren Commission and Marina Oswald) taken just days before the assassination attempt on Walker may have been Oswalds attempt to show that he realized that he had been used by the Socialists to deceive the Communists in the U-2 affair and that Walker had been the conduit that provided him with the necessary information to enter the Soviet Union via Helsinki (a logical reason why the passenger lists for flights from London to Helsinki were never provided to the Warren Commission). Walker was in route to Augsburg, Germany at the same time that Oswald journyed to Helsinki.

I am not sure that Oswald visited the Soviet and Cuban Embassys on his trip to Mexico City. The photo of "Oswald" seems to suggest that it was not him that entered those buildings. If that was not him but we know that he went to Mexico City we could ponder the question, "for what reason?" After the assassination two facts are true: Oswald wanted a Smith Act Attorney (Jonathon Abt) and

Oswald attempted to contract someone by the name of John Hurt

Was Oswald provided with those names? I believe that the possibility exists.

If my research has led me in the proper direction Oswald's attempt to contact a person with the name John Hurt would have shaken the Intelligence Community to the core! We do know for a fact that the Warren Commission failed to provide information about this failed attempt to contact John Hurt to the American public. It was also just by chance that a telephone operator kept a trashed piece of paper and presented it to the HSCA that we would learned of this attempted phone call. We also know for a fact that the NSA assigned two men (Frank Rowlett and Meridith Gardner) to investigate potential intelligence contacts that Lee Harvey Oswald may have had. Both these men were closely associated to John B. Hurt whose 33 years of secrete work with the NSA is still to this day classified. (There is a famous picture of William Friedman's team of Cryptologists taken about 1935 that has Rowlett standing just one person away from Hurt and in a recently published article about Hurt, Beverly Hotch provides numerous annecdotes about Hurt provided by John B. Hurt's long time friend Frank Rowlett).

Besides the two men who investigated Oswald's "potential" intelligence connections being associated with John B. Hurt, we find that John J. McCloy, Maxwell Taylor and Edwin Walker can also be connected with the same John Hurt as well. The odds of this connection being coincidental would be, I believe, staggering.

I believe it was Lee Harvey Oswald's attempt to contact John Hurt that put the wheels in motion to have Oswald assassinated. By providing Oswald with the name John Hurt the conspirators may well have known that Oswald would have to be eliminated to protect the secrete work that involved Hurt and could have linked Oswald's defection to the Soviet Union and the downing of the U-2 to the US Government. In this scenario the conspirators would guarentee a coverup without having to directly involve themselves in the organizational details of that portion of this dirty deed. It would be left to the minons in the intelligence community to understand the necessity of protecting the National Security of the United States without understanding the simplicity of the action that put them into motion to coverup the assassination of the President.

The intelligence work of John B. Hurt (still classified to this day) may have been so important that it could align the government to protect the assassins without the multitudes providing the protection knowing who they were in fact protecting.

And McCloy (a potential conspirator with motive and means) would be placed in a position to package the completed product within the manuscript known as the Warren Commission Report.

It is intriguing.......

Jim Root