Robert F. Kennedy, Jr., : 2004 Election Stolen

[J. Raymond Carroll]

Was the 2004 Election Stolen?

Republicans prevented more than 350,000 voters in Ohio from casting ballots or having their votes counted -- enough to have put John Kerry in the White House. BY ROBERT F. KENNEDY JR.

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/104...election_stolen

[J. Raymond Carroll]

Was the 2004 Election Stolen?

When I posted this I did not realize that Michael Hogan had already beaten me to the punch and posted it in the section of the forum dealing dealing with non- JFK political conspiracies. Since that is no doubt where this topic properly belongs, perhaps John Simkin should remove my thread entirely.

[Brendan Slattery]

Funny how the Dems never, you know, LOSE elections. They're always the victims of those dastardly, underhanded Republicans, this time masquerading as ordinary Ohio voters who didn't succumb to Corporal Kerry's bullxxxx.

[Bruce Cormier]

Funny how the Dems never, you know, LOSE elections. They're always the victims of those dastardly, underhanded Republicans, this time masquerading as ordinary Ohio voters who didn't succumb to Corporal Kerry's bullxxxx.

Truth be told, election stealing in America knows no party boundaries -- evidencing our aphorism, "politics ain't beanbag." Given Bush-Cheney's very substantial margin in Ohio, and approximately 3.5 million vote margin nationwide, I for the most part had brushed off the notion that the 2004 election was heisted. Now I'm open to persuasion, as I'm quite convinced that this Adminstration, along with the Ayatollahs who constitute its "conservative" base, would respect no boundaries in their will to power. If they are willing to trash the truth and our Constitution -- as they demonstrably are -- then what's a little vote stealing among friends?

Of more pertinence to this thread, the 1960 election too may well have been stolen in Illinois with the assistance of - yes - the Mob. This fact greatly annoys our brothers and sisters who lay this murder and its cover up solely at the feet of right-wing thugs and their CIA enablers. It also causes angst among those who perpetuate a Camelot myth that rightly collapsed under the weight of disclosures now three decades old.

Interesting, isn't it, how inconvenient and stubborn facts can be?

[J. Raymond Carroll]

Of more pertinence to this thread, the 1960 election too may well have been stolen in Illinois with the assistance of - yes - the Mob...

Interesting, isn't it, how inconvenient and stubborn facts can be?

Mr. Cormier is a new member and apparently unfamiliar with certain facts that the rest of us have known for some time. If Mr. Cormier would care to search the forum, he will find that his ridiculous theory that the mob helped JFK win in Illinois has been thoroughly debunked.

I have posted about Mr. Slattery on another thread. The nicest thing I can say about him is that his contributions so far reveal him to be an idiot. He is like a poor man's version of Tim Gratz, who was kicked off this forum for wasting everybody's time.

It is obvious that, Like Tim Gratz, Mr. Slattery has not the slightest interest in seeking the truth about the JFK assassination.

Edited June 4, 2006 by J. Raymond Carroll

[Bruce Cormier]

Of more pertinence to this thread, the 1960 election too may well have been stolen in Illinois with the assistance of - yes - the Mob...

Interesting, isn't it, how inconvenient and stubborn facts can be?

Mr. Cormier is a new member and apparently unfamiliar with certain facts that the rest of us have known for some time. If Mr. Cormier would care to search the forum, he will find that his ridiculous theory that the mob helped JFK win in Illinois has been thoroughly debunked.

I have posted about Mr. Slattery on another thread. The nicest thing I can say about him is that his contributions so far reveal him to be an idiot. He is like a poor man's version of Tim Gratz, who was kicked off this forum for wasting everybody's time.

It is obvious that, Like Tim Gratz, Mr. Slattery has not the slightest interest in seeking the truth about the JFK assassination.

Oh really? "ridiculous theory ... thoroughly debunked ..."? Well what about the West Virginia primary, and satchels of cash, and Frank Sinatra, Judith Exner, and Sam Giancana -- is that all "thoroughly debunked" too?? By whom, you? Judith Exner and her ties to JFK -- well, they are all lies, no doubt .... CIA sponsored lies, undoubtedly

Of course, all of this is inconvenient for you ... and the irony is that far more extravagant -- and less supported -- assertions regarding JFK's death are happily endorsed

[J. Raymond Carroll]

Well what about the West Virginia primary, and satchels of cash, and Frank Sinatra, Judith Exner, and Sam Giancana -- is that all "thoroughly debunked" too??

Sorry, old chap. It's a great story, of course, but I'm afraid this one, too has been pretty thoroughly debunked. Of course it was always even more ridiculous than the "Mob stole Illinois" theory. You might want to check the ARRB report.

and the irony is that far more extravagant -- and less supported -- assertions regarding JFK's death are happily endorsed

Like the story about Lee Oswald firing from the sixth floor? I think we all agree that there have been many unsupported assertions regarding JFK's death.

[Bruce Cormier]

And, of course, the one undeniable fact is that the Kennedy family itself, and principally Robert Kennedy Sr., aided and abetted the Warren Commission fantasy. That's undeniable. As mere examples, Robert Sr.

1. Restricted JFK's autopsy;

2. At LBJ's bidding, unsuccessfully sought to enlist CJ Warren to head the Comm'n. He failed to persuade Earl Warren, and LBJ had to bludgeon the CJ into it ... We know what became of this misadventure;

3. Impeded Jim Garrison's investigation; and, most imporantly,

4. For 4 years after its publication, fully endorsed publicly the WC findings when he was privately telling others that they were utter fantasy. Ted, of course, has continued in this vein for 43 years.

If your brother was blown away, why proceed in this fashion? The answer is pretty simple -- protect his image, continue the myth. A full investigation would have unearthed a lot of ugliness.

[J. Raymond Carroll]

The answer is pretty simple -- protect his image, continue the myth. A full investigation would have unearthed a lot of ugliness.

like Tim Gratz, it seems that one of Mr. Cormier's primary purposes in coming to this forum is to smear JFK and his family. I hope he will find that he came to the wrong place.

[Bruce Cormier]

The answer is pretty simple -- protect his image, continue the myth. A full investigation would have unearthed a lot of ugliness.

like Tim Gratz, it seems that one of Mr. Cormier's primary purposes in coming to this forum is to smear JFK and his family. I hope he will find that he came to the wrong place.

It's no smear. I've voted for every Kennedy I could, every chance I got. But as Teddy said about Bobby, there is no need to idealize them in death beyond what they were in life: very tough politicians who fought for keeps for things I happen to believe in.

But please do not try to tell us that the family, and Bobby in particular, did not endorse the WC fantasy findings because they plainly did. The historical record is could not be more clear -- anyone, you included, can google it any time you please.

[J. Raymond Carroll]

I've voted for every Kennedy I could, every chance I got.

Since it is a secret ballot, no one can ever refute (or confirm) this particular claim.

But please do not try to tell us that the family, and Bobby in particular, did not endorse the WC fantasy findings because they plainly did. The historical record is could not be more clear -- anyone, you included, can google it any time you please.

Actually, I don't have to rely on Google. Bobby never even read the Warren Report, and said so.

like Tim Gratz, it seems that one of Mr. Cormier's primary purposes in coming to this forum is to smear JFK and his family. I hope he will find that he came to the wrong place.

[Bruce Cormier]

I've voted for every Kennedy I could, every chance I got.

Since it is a secret ballot, no one can ever refute (or confirm) this particular claim.

But please do not try to tell us that the family, and Bobby in particular, did not endorse the WC fantasy findings because they plainly did. The historical record is could not be more clear -- anyone, you included, can google it any time you please.

Actually, I don't have to rely on Google. Bobby never even read the Warren Report, and said so.

like Tim Gratz, it seems that one of Mr. Cormier's primary purposes in coming to this forum is to smear JFK and his family. I hope he will find that he came to the wrong place.

Good Lord. This is from "The Mother of All Cover Ups" by David Talbot in Salon, 9/15/04 issue:

Critics of the Warren Report's lone-assassin conclusion were often stumped by defenders of the report with the question, "If there was a conspiracy, why didn't President Kennedy's own brother -- the attorney general of the United States, Robert Kennedy -- do anything about it?" It's true that, at least until shortly before his assassination death in June 1968, Bobby Kennedy publicly supported the Warren Report. On March 25, during a presidential campaign rally at San Fernando Valley State College in California, Kennedy was dramatically confronted by a woman heckler, who called out, "We want to know who killed President Kennedy!" Kennedy responded by saying, "I stand by the Warren Commission Report." But at a later campaign appearance, days before his assassination, Bobby Kennedy said the opposite, according to his former press spokesman Frank Mankiewicz. When asked if he would reopen the investigation into his brother's death, he uttered a simple, one-word answer: "Yes." Mankiewicz recalls today, "I remember that I was stunned by the answer. It was either like he was suddenly blurting out the truth, or it was a way to shut down the questioning -- you know, 'Yes, now let's move on.'"

So if Bobby never read the WC Report, but "publicly supported it" -- which is indisputable, with one exception -- the result is the same.

[J. Raymond Carroll]

When asked if he would reopen the investigation into his brother's death, he [RFK] uttered a simple, one-word answer: "Yes."

I would like to see a show of hands: How many forum members consider this a ringing endorsement of the Warren Report by RFK?

like Tim Gratz, it seems that one of Mr. Cormier's primary purposes in coming to this forum is to smear JFK and his family. I hope he will find that he came to the wrong place.

[Bruce Cormier]

When asked if he would reopen the investigation into his brother's death, he [RFK] uttered a simple, one-word answer: "Yes."

I would like to see a show of hands: How many forum members consider this a ringing endorsement of the Warren Report by RFK?

like Tim Gratz, it seems that one of Mr. Cormier's primary purposes in coming to this forum is to smear JFK and his family. I hope he will find that he came to the wrong place.

But J., your request for that show of hands is akin to ballots utilized by Saddam Hussein. How about this for a public endorsement of the WC by RFK?:

"It's true that, at least until shortly before his assassination death in June 1968, Bobby Kennedy publicly supported the Warren Report. On March 25, during a presidential campaign rally at San Fernando Valley State College in California, Kennedy was dramatically confronted by a woman heckler, who called out, "We want to know who killed President Kennedy!" Kennedy responded by saying, "I stand by the Warren Commission Report."

[J. Raymond Carroll]

When asked if he would reopen the investigation into his brother's death, he [RFK] uttered a simple, one-word answer: "Yes."

I would like to see a show of hands: How many forum members consider this a ringing endorsement of the Warren Report by RFK?

[quote name='Bruce Cormier' date='Jun 4 2006, 05:46 AM' post='64467'

But J., your request for that show of hands is akin to ballots utilized by Saddam Hussein.

My request for a show of hands is akin to ballots utilized by Saddam Hussein? You have betrayed yourself, Mr. Cormier, and in the process you have made explicit your contempt for this forum.