Order in the Courts!

[Jack White]

Ashton...been there, done that.

The original is much bigger, but too big to attach here.

Astounding piece of work, Jack. I shudder to contemplate the effort. Thanks for posting it.

Wouldn't it now be wonderful to get one of these done, since this technology is available:

Quicktime VR Panoramas

There are lots of examples down the page that open full screen.

Ashton

I should explain. This is one of three panoramas done by John Costella

based on photos I shot from the pedestal using a tripod mounted Leica.

Here is Dr. Costella's panorama based on just the Z frames, greatly

reduced from the original. He wrote a special computer program to do

the panorama seamlessly. I will try to find the panorama he did using

just the frames I shot.

Jack

[Ashton Gray]

Wouldn't it now be wonderful to get one of these done, since this technology is available:

Quicktime VR Panoramas

There are lots of examples down the page that open full screen.

There is a new special kind of camera used mostly by (I believe) architects, city planners, VR people, etc. that sits on a tripod, has a revolving prisim and takes in very large amounts of data from various angles as the camera moves on a drive - this data is stored electronically and can later be used to view the image from a large variety of angles and locations - even those in which the camera was not actually postioned via interpolation.

What 'ya got in mind Ashton?

You really want to ask such an open-ended question, Peter?

Seriously, I do think that a virtual reality 360° panorama akin to some of those examples on the site above could be of great interest and possible research value. I'd love to see some done from the Zapruder location, the head shot location, even from out in the plaza. (You watch: the lone nutters will probably jump on this and do one only from the sixth floor "sniper's nest" window. Heh.)

I do have a few things in mind—and directly related to this thread—but whatever they are, they are incidental to what I believe would be the greater general value to the entire research community.

Having said that, I'm going to say something else that I think might offend some in said community, but I never can seem to get myself into the popularity-contest mold sufficiently to stop saying what I think: I think that no amount of photo or film analysis ever is going to answer the most fundamental and important questions. I stand completely by my oft-stated belief (maybe too oft-stated, but who's counting) that a meticulous and comprehensive timeline will answer more questions ultimately than any amount of time spent peering at inadequate, blurred, splotchy, low-resolution, degraded, and in some cases doctored images of subjects that often are far too small in the frame ever to be resolved to anything more than possibly an amorphous bit of film grain.

And having said that, I also believe that the photo and film analysis that has been done and continues to be done:

A. Is valuable, and,

B. Will realize its greatest value when a complete timeline is available to complement it, and,

C. Would be enhanced and aided by the kind of VR panorama(s) described above.

On the timeline issue, I've been receiving snippets here and there from one being put together by several acquaintances, and one of those excerpted sections (made up of a search on a few names, but covering decades of time) gave rise to this very thread.

What I've just been told about Decker essentially evacuating the County Courts building—and even herding all his people to the railroad tracks area behind the TSBD—is so dead center bull's-eye on where that relatively small excerpt of timeline seemed to be pointing that it's downright scary. (It also even ties into the testimony of one officer that he vaulted over the fence and burned his hand on what he curiously said must have been a steam pipe.)

See what happens when you ask open-ended questions?

Anyway, I just think such a panorama (or panoramas) with the new technology would be of great interest and use to all concerned.

Ashton

Edited August 10, 2006 by Ashton Gray

[Jack White]

Here is a portion of one of the panoramas at actual size, clearly

showing the reposition of lampposts done to frustrate photo

research.

Jack

Here is Dr. Costella's panorama using the photos I shot from the pedestal.

This is 40% of actual size. At this size, you cannot see the gridlines marked

in degrees of arc used to pinpoint any location within the scene.

Jack

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Here is a portion of one of the panoramas at actual size, clearly

showing the reposition of lampposts done to frustrate photo

research.

Jack

Here is Dr. Costella's panorama using the photos I shot from the pedestal.

This is 40% of actual size. At this size, you cannot see the gridlines marked

in degrees of arc used to pinpoint any location within the scene.

Jack

In event you can position Mr. Altgens in, on the bottom photo, it just may tell you a thing or too.

[Thomas H. Purvis]

Here is a portion of one of the panoramas at actual size, clearly

showing the reposition of lampposts done to frustrate photo

research.

Jack

Here is Dr. Costella's panorama using the photos I shot from the pedestal.

This is 40% of actual size. At this size, you cannot see the gridlines marked

in degrees of arc used to pinpoint any location within the scene.

Jack

In event you can position Mr. Altgens in, on the bottom photo, it just may tell you a thing or too.

This may be of some assistance in the "where", as well as the "why".

http://www.aarclibrary.org/publib/jfk/wc/w...Vol17_0458b.htm

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mr. ALTGENS - This would put me at approximately this area here, which would be about 15 feet from me at the time he was shot in the head--about 15 feet from the car on the west side of the car--on the side that Mrs. Kennedy was riding in the car.

I was prepared to make a picture at the very instant the President was shot. I had refocused to 15 feet because I wanted a good closeup of the President and Mrs. Kennedy, and that's why I know that it would be right at 15 feet, because I had prefocused in that area, and I had my camera almost to my eye when it happened and that's as far as I got with my camera.

Mr. LIEBELER : Now, you have previously indicated that you were right beside the President's car when he was hit in the head.

Mr. ALTGENS - Well, I was about 15 feet from it.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Michael Hogan]

Ashton Gray wrote, in part:

".....I think that no amount of photo or film analysis ever is going to answer the most fundamental and important questions. I stand completely by my oft-stated belief (maybe too oft-stated, but who's counting) that a meticulous and comprehensive timeline will answer more questions ultimately than any amount of time spent peering at inadequate, blurred, splotchy, low-resolution, degraded, and in some cases doctored images of subjects that often are far too small in the frame ever to be resolved to anything more than possibly an amorphous bit of film grain.

And having said that, I also believe that the photo and film analysis that has been done and continues to be done:

A. Is valuable, and,

(some of said photo and film analysis has been invaluable--mh)

B. Will realize its greatest value when a complete timeline is available to complement it, and,

C. Would be enhanced and aided by the kind of VR panorama(s) described above."

I agree.

Mike Hogan

[David G. Healy]

'Ashton Gray' wrote:

[...]

Having said that, I'm going to say something else that I think might offend some in said community, but I never can seem to get myself into the popularity-contest mold sufficiently to stop saying what I think: I think that no amount of photo or film analysis ever is going to answer the most fundamental and important questions. I stand completely by my oft-stated belief (maybe too oft-stated, but who's counting) that a meticulous and comprehensive timeline will answer more questions ultimately than any amount of time spent peering at inadequate, blurred, splotchy, low-resolution, degraded, and in some cases doctored images of subjects that often are far too small in the frame ever to be resolved to anything more than possibly an amorphous bit of film grain.

[...]

Ashton

*********

Agreed, makes on wonder why, DP film/photo purists make such an effort defending the current historical phot/film record. I say the current thinking is: keep the CT film folks busy with non-sensical debate over photo minutae that no one is going to prove one way or another, in other words, D I V E R S I O N.

The Bill Miller's of the world could spend the next 3 years refuting Harry Livingstones book about the Zapruder film. They won't even try, why? They'd have to address Harry's comments regarding RZavada's report and investigation... they won't go there!

Edited August 11, 2006 by David G. Healy