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Photographer Woman in ALTGENS # 5 ?


Don Roberdeau
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Good Day.... In the Altgens #5 photo, does it look to you that the dark haired white woman wearing a dark coat with a large purse or bag, located on the Houston east sidewalk in front of the Records building, standing photo-apparently directly beneath the "L" and the "E" of the "CLEAN" light-colored truck parked just south of the Dal-Tex, is in the act of preparing to or capturing a photo or movie with the camera up to her right eye?

Here are some A#5 photo crops featuring the woman....

altgens5.gif

Best Regards in Research,

Don

Don Roberdeau

U.S.S. John F. Kennedy, CV-67, "Big John," Plank Walker

Sooner, or later, The Truth emerges Clearly

ROSEMARY WILLIS Ultra-fast Headsnap Westward Towards the "Grassy Knoll" Discovery

Dealey Plaza Professionally-surveyed Map of Victims Precise Locations, Witnesses & Photographers, Suspected Bullet Trajectories, Evidence, & other Important Information

BOND Photos Do Not Timestamp GORDON ARNOLD's Presence on the "Grassy Knoll" + Addendum

AOL Homepage.... "4 Principles"

T ogether

E veryone

A chieves

M ore

TEAMWORK.gif

DHS3elevatedYELLOW.gif

"Drehm seemed to think the shots came from in FRONT OF or BESIDE the President."

(my EMPHASIS)

----CHARLES F. BREHM, a combat gunfire experienced, United States Army Ranger, World War II, D-day veteran, & very close Dealey Plaza attack witness, quoted only minutes after the attack, and while he was still standing within Dealey Plaza (11-22-63 "Dallas Times Herald," 5th & final edition)

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Good Day.... In the Altgens #5 photo, does it look to you that the dark haired white woman wearing a dark coat with a large purse or bag, located on the Houston east sidewalk in front of the Records building, standing photo-apparently directly beneath the "L" and the "E" of the "CLEAN" light-colored truck parked just south of the Dal-Tex, is in the act of preparing to or capturing a photo or movie with the camera up to her right eye?

Don, it very possibly could be. It sure does appear that way, doesnt it? I have thought for a long time, there were other people filming that day during the assassination. I beleive that the assassination may be "proved" to a point, that it was a conspiracy, and may actually show what, and how it happened by someone elses "never seen" film. Not everyone is after money. There may be some man or woman out there with this film, and has never came forward because of fear of harm, or fear of getting involved in such a horrible Government issue. It may very well be that they will not ever let it be seen until they are gone, and at that point, some son, daughter, or relative, may come forward with what everyone has always waited for. If it does happen that way, it will be because of greed probably, against the persons wishes. Their family may have never known of the film, but will upon their death. It is possible. Just my opinion. FWIW

thanks-smitty

Here are some A#5 photo crops featuring the woman....

altgens5.gif

Best Regards in Research,

Don

Don Roberdeau

U.S.S. John F. Kennedy, CV-67, "Big John," Plank Walker

Sooner, or later, The Truth emerges Clearly

ROSEMARY WILLIS Ultra-fast Headsnap Westward Towards the "Grassy Knoll" Discovery

Dealey Plaza Professionally-surveyed Map of Victims Precise Locations, Witnesses & Photographers, Suspected Bullet Trajectories, Evidence, & other Important Information

BOND Photos Do Not Timestamp GORDON ARNOLD's Presence on the "Grassy Knoll" + Addendum

AOL Homepage.... "4 Principles"

T ogether

E veryone

A chieves

M ore

TEAMWORK.gif

DHS3elevatedYELLOW.gif

"Drehm seemed to think the shots came from in FRONT OF or BESIDE the President."

(my EMPHASIS)

----CHARLES F. BREHM, a combat gunfire experienced, United States Army Ranger, World War II, D-day veteran, & very close Dealey Plaza attack witness, quoted only minutes after the attack, and while he was still standing within Dealey Plaza (11-22-63 "Dallas Times Herald," 5th & final edition)

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It looks like it could be, but when stretching the difference between grayscale values it looks like what may be taken for a hand up by camera is a white blouse and hand locations suggest a child on hip.

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Gary Mack had this to say about the woman ...

"After looking at an extreme blowup of the Bell film, in which the woman also appears, it's obvious she is simply waving. It's not likely she would take a picture while JFK was so far away, but not when he was close to her."

My impression of what this woman was doing was that she may have been shading her eyes so to better see the approaching President.

Bill Miller

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Good Day.... Ho Ho Ho !, It does look like only her hand in your photo and photo enhancement.... Thank You for sharing your A5 copy.... That is exactly what I was hoping; for someone to also share a clearer copy and/or enhanced copy of the A5, along with an o-pine.

o<:{ )

Best Regards in Research,

Don

Don Roberdeau

U.S.S. John F. Kennedy, CV-67, "Big John," Plank Walker

Sooner, or later, The Truth emerges Clearly

ROSEMARY WILLIS Ultra-fast Headsnap Westward Towards the "Grassy Knoll" Discovery

Dealey Plaza Professionally-surveyed Map of Victims Precise Locations, Witnesses & Photographers, Suspected Bullet Trajectories, Evidence, & other Important Information

BOND Photos Do Not Timestamp GORDON ARNOLD's Presence on the "Grassy Knoll" + Addendum

AOL Homepage.... "4 Principles"

T ogether

E veryone

A chieves

M ore

TEAMWORK.gif

DHS3elevatedYELLOW.gif

"Drehm seemed to think the shots came from in FRONT OF or BESIDE the President."

(my EMPHASIS)

----CHARLES F. BREHM, a combat gunfire experienced, United States Army Ranger, World War II, D-day veteran, & very close Dealey Plaza attack witness, quoted only minutes after the attack, and while he was still standing within Dealey Plaza (11-22-63 "Dallas Times Herald," 5th & final edition)

Edited by Don Roberdeau
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Good Day.... Ho Ho Ho !, It does look like only her hand in your photo and photo enhancement.... Thank You for sharing your A5 copy.... That is exactly what I was hoping; for someone to also share a clearer copy and/or enhanced copy of the A5, along with an o-pine.

o<:{ )

Best Regards in Research,

Don

Don Roberdeau

U.S.S. John F. Kennedy, CV-67, "Big John," Plank Walker

Sooner, or later, The Truth emerges Clearly

ROSEMARY WILLIS Ultra-fast Headsnap Westward Towards the "Grassy Knoll" Discovery

Dealey Plaza Professionally-surveyed Map of Victims Precise Locations, Witnesses & Photographers, Suspected Bullet Trajectories, Evidence, & other Important Information

BOND Photos Do Not Timestamp GORDON ARNOLD's Presence on the "Grassy Knoll" + Addendum

AOL Homepage.... "4 Principles"

T ogether

E veryone

A chieves

M ore

TEAMWORK.gif

DHS3elevatedYELLOW.gif

"Drehm seemed to think the shots came from in FRONT OF or BESIDE the President."

(my EMPHASIS)

----CHARLES F. BREHM, a combat gunfire experienced, United States Army Ranger, World War II, D-day veteran, & very close Dealey Plaza attack witness, quoted only minutes after the attack, and while he was still standing within Dealey Plaza (11-22-63 "Dallas Times Herald," 5th & final edition)

Glad to give something back Don.

You have long been sharing your dealey plaza plat with the JFK community, and we all appreciate your efforts in putting that information together in one place.

All the best for your christmas season.

Robin.

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Guest John Gillespie
Good Day.... Ho Ho Ho !, It does look like only her hand in your photo and photo enhancement.... Thank You for sharing your A5 copy.... That is exactly what I was hoping; for someone to also share a clearer copy and/or enhanced copy of the A5, along with an o-pine.

o<:{ )

Best Regards in Research,

Don

Don Roberdeau

U.S.S. John F. Kennedy, CV-67, "Big John," Plank Walker

Sooner, or later, The Truth emerges Clearly

ROSEMARY WILLIS Ultra-fast Headsnap Westward Towards the "Grassy Knoll" Discovery

Dealey Plaza Professionally-surveyed Map of Victims Precise Locations, Witnesses & Photographers, Suspected Bullet Trajectories, Evidence, & other Important Information

BOND Photos Do Not Timestamp GORDON ARNOLD's Presence on the "Grassy Knoll" + Addendum

AOL Homepage.... "4 Principles"

T ogether

E veryone

A chieves

M ore

TEAMWORK.gif

DHS3elevatedYELLOW.gif

"Drehm seemed to think the shots came from in FRONT OF or BESIDE the President."

(my EMPHASIS)

----CHARLES F. BREHM, a combat gunfire experienced, United States Army Ranger, World War II, D-day veteran, & very close Dealey Plaza attack witness, quoted only minutes after the attack, and while he was still standing within Dealey Plaza (11-22-63 "Dallas Times Herald," 5th & final edition)

Glad to give something back Don.

You have long been sharing your dealey plaza plat with the JFK community, and we all appreciate your efforts in putting that information together in one place.

All the best for your christmas season.

Robin.

__________________________________

Ditto, Robin...nice work all around, guys. Thank you and happy holdidays.

JohnG

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Gary Mack had this to say about the woman ...

"After looking at an extreme blowup of the Bell film, in which the woman also appears, it's obvious she is simply waving. It's not likely she would take a picture while JFK was so far away, but not when he was close to her."

My impression of what this woman was doing was that she may have been shading her eyes so to better see the approaching President.

Bill Miller

Miller gets one right. She is shading her eyes from the sun.

Jack

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Can anyone supply the source for the interview with Altgens wherein he

denies having taken exposures #5 and #8 attributed to him?

I have read about this for years, and have even cited the quote myself

without attribution...but I cannot remember where I read it.

He admitted taking 1 thru 4, plus 6 and 7. If you look at the photo and

then calculate the time necessary to run from the Main/Elm intersection

with camera on strap around neck and toting a bulky camera bag, to a

spot down Elm a block away to be in position to shoot #6, it seems to

be impossible for him to shoot #5.

In #5, the JFK limo is approaching Elm, and in #6 it has just turned

the corner. Was Altgens a world class sprinter? Has anyone ever timed

his alleged sprint?

As for #8, why would an experienced newsman shoot such a photo

which shows nothing of interest?

Jack

Edited by Jack White
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He admitted taking 1 thru 4, plus 6 and 7. If you look at the photo and

then calculate the time necessary to run from the Main/Elm intersection

with camera on strap around neck and toting a bulky camera bag, to a

spot down Elm a block away to be in position to shoot #6, it seems to

be impossible for him to shoot #5.

In #5, the JFK limo is approaching Elm, and in #6 it has just turned

the corner. Was Altgens a world class sprinter? Has anyone ever timed

his alleged sprint?

As for #8, why would an experienced newsman shoot such a photo

which shows nothing of interest?

Jack

Jack, what is all the confusion about? Altgens took photos in DP and processed them himself and sent them off right away. Years later, researchers were showing assassination photos to Altgens and asking which photos were his and he didn't have a specific recollection of some of them. For instance, Willis took a photo of the limo on Houston Street heading North at about the same moment Altgens took his. If one didn't know better - those two photos could get mixed up as to who took which picture.

As far as being a world class sprinter ... you must be joking - right? After taking his photo of JFK's limo moving down Houston Street towards the corner of Elm, Willis was still able to shag-ass to the corner of Elm and Houston in time to see JFK round the corner. Brehm also left the corner of Main and Houston after the limo made its turn and Charles carried his son under his arm and still made it in time to see the President coming towards him on Elm Street. Muchmore who filmed the limo heading down Houston also made it to the reflection pool in time to film Brehm. So there is nothing miraculous in Altgens getting into position to take his number 6 photograph. Gary Mack said to me about all this, "If he'd (Jack) just review the Discovery Channel program we did, Death In Dealey Plaza, he'd know that we re-created Altgens' activities. Our actor ran from Main & Houston down to Elm Street and was there in time to photograph the limo, just as in 1963."

Now why did Altgens take the number 8 photo of the colonnade - because he thought that shots had come from that direction. What is significant about the people he caught in that picture is that he captured the individuals (Zapruder and Sitzman) leaving the pedestal who you have wrongly been claiming were never on the pedestal in the first place, but were merely added into all the assassination films and photos showing the shooting.

Bill Miller

Edited by Bill Miller
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"Miller" demonstrates his accuracy by stating...

"Jack, what is all the confusion about? Altgens took photos in DP and processed them himself and sent them off right away. "

For anyone interested in Miller's accuracy, see Trask p.318.

Jack

Jack, page 317 is the page that interested me. Altgens went straight to the lab to have his photos processed. The photo lab was a very small space and whether Altgens spoke on the phone while standing there overseeing them being processed or helped do them himself ... I won't try to split hairs over that one. I will add however, that it was through Gary Mack at some point where I heard it was said that Altgens was involved in the processing of his photos. The bottom line is that Ike Altgens went immediately to have the photos processed - saw them for only a moment upon completion before they were sent off and this is why his memory so many years later on which photos were his was somewhat vague on a couple of them.

Bill Miller

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"Miller" demonstrates his accuracy by stating...

"Jack, what is all the confusion about? Altgens took photos in DP and processed them himself and sent them off right away. "

For anyone interested in Miller's accuracy, see Trask p.318.

Jack

Jack, page 317 is the page that interested me. Altgens went straight to the lab to have his photos processed. The photo lab was a very small space and whether Altgens spoke on the phone while standing there overseeing them being processed or helped do them himself ... I won't try to split hairs over that one. I will add however, that it was through Gary Mack at some point where I heard it was said that Altgens was involved in the processing of his photos. The bottom line is that Ike Altgens went immediately to have the photos processed - saw them for only a moment upon completion before they were sent off and this is why his memory so many years later on which photos were his was somewhat vague on a couple of them.

Bill Miller

Balderdash. You have never processed film in a darkroom. It is a one-person job

IN TOTAL DARKNESS. No telephone lights. No overseeing needed. Usually at big newspapers,

the darkroom staff did processing and printing, not the photographers. You are misrepresenting

what is on page 318 of Trask. This is not splitting hairs, it is lying.

At large newspapers photographers used to turn in film, the darkroom staff developed and

made contact prints and handed them to editors who ordered enlargements. The photographer

did not participate on breaking news stories after snapping the shutter.

Reading farther down the page on 318, we see that Altgens told Trask that he "TOOK FIVE OF

THE PHOTOS" and NEVER SAW ALL OF THE PRINTS BEFORE THE NEGATIVES WERE SENT TO

NEW YORK. There is nothing about him seeing the photos for "only a moment"...quite to the

contrary he said HE HAD NEVER ACQUIRED A SET OF HIS PICTURES.

What I am trying to recall is where I read that Altgens years ago denied taking #5 and #8.

Trask hints at it, but does not say.

Jack

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