Craig Lamson

Lets start with total crime ( all crimes not just violent crime) from Nationmaster.

US 11,877,218 from a population of 300 million

UK 6,523,706 from a population of 60 million

Strike one UK...

I'm out the door, more later.

That isn't what you were talking about. You were talking about Violent Crimes. That 6.5 million will include people fiddling their electricity meters and pensioners shoplifting packs of bacon from Asda.

Quite convenient trip out. Hope you take you Magnum. Can't be too careful.

You are the paranoid. I took my Mom to the doctor. Sorry to burst your bubble.

Now you do also now the overall crime figures include a host of lesser crimes for the US numbers as well That however won't fit well for the false narrative you are trying to portray. I'll be happy to continue you show you the folly of your position. But you said you were done. Which is it, or are you simply blowing more smoke?

But hey I can spot the UK a 50% reduction of the overall crime rate if it makes you feel better....but you still won't do any better in the end....

Lamson has a propensity for using invalid data to try proving his points. This is just a further example. Now, let’s all pack up and move to the utopian society that is Islamabad.

So Lee, when we remove the crime, yo say is not really crime, and use the numbers FROM your OWN HOME OFFICE, exactly what to you have left? A still FAR GREATER number of violent crimes for UK compare to the US.

Whats invalid now besides you?

Tell everybody what they are. You need to be more specific.

Excuse me?

Give us all a breakdown of the numbers minus the "crimes" you say that I say are not a "crime."BTW: I haven't said that an "affray" is not a crime. I'm merely pointing out to you that it involves no serious violent crime, only the threat of violence. I think it's you that need to learn to read.

Lets start with total crime ( all crimes not just violent crime) from Nationmaster.

US 11,877,218 from a population of 300 million

UK 6,523,706 from a population of 60 million

Strike one UK...

I'm out the door, more later.

BTW, one travels to were one is interested. The UK does not interest me. Heathrow is good enough.

I don't care what interests you. From the way you articulate yourself on this forum it would probably consists of pain, torture and humiliation. You seem to enjoy that sort of stuff.

A black operation rendition site would probably be your idea of a good vacation.

LOL! Thats the best you have?

Come on, Craig. You must know you have a problem? The first step is admitting to it.

A grown man coming onto a forum and telling other members you love creating "fear" in them is psychologically unhinged. Telling other members that you enjoy watching them eat excrement is a sign of a sick mind.

Get some help.

But Lee that's exactly what you do here on a daily basis. You should read some of your posts to people like DVP. A mirror would be a very good tool for you.

BTW, one travels to were one is interested. The UK does not interest me. Heathrow is good enough.

I don't care what interests you. From the way you articulate yourself on this forum it would probably consists of pain, torture and humiliation. You seem to enjoy that sort of stuff.

A black operation rendition site would probably be your idea of a good vacation.

LOL! Thats the best you have?

Lamson has a propensity for using invalid data to try proving his points. This is just a further example. Now, let’s all pack up and move to the utopian society that is Islamabad.

So Lee, when we remove the crime, yo say is not really crime, and use the numbers FROM your OWN HOME OFFICE, exactly what to you have left? A still FAR GREATER number of violent crimes for UK compare to the US.

Whats invalid now besides you?

Tell everybody what they are. You need to be more specific.

Excuse me?

Lamson has a propensity for using invalid data to try proving his points. This is just a further example. Now, let’s all pack up and move to the utopian society that is Islamabad.

So Lee, when we remove the crime, you say is not really crime, and use the numbers from your own HOME OFFICE, exactly what to you have left? A still FAR GREATER number of violent crimes for UK compare to the US. Heck cut your violent crime rate in half and you still lose.

Whats invalid now besides you?

Welcome to reality. Oh wait you don't do reality.

BTW, one travels to were one is interested. The UK does not interest me. Heathrow is good enough.

I know from experience which country is safer.

From violent crime...the US

Craig,

So would you agree with the "guns don't kill people, people kill people" line?

Martin

GUNS can't kill anyone without a person. Would you agree with "hammers don't kill people, people kill people?

I see what you mean. I also note you said elsewhere your weapons are securely stored. Is that commonplace? Here police are required to inspect storage facilities when issuing a licence. Where our system falls down is there's nothing to ensure that they are kept locked.

The laws vary from State to State. There is no national law. Where I live there is no law requiring guns to be licensed. If you own a hand gun a concealed carry permit is required to move your handgun from your residence or place of business unless you are transporting it from a gunshop or gunsmith. A concealed carry permit allows you to have the handgun on your person provided it is not in open view. In my State the laws for open carry simply require you have a concealed carry permit Again this varies by State.

I can't carry a handgun here:

1. In or On School Property.

2. On a school bus

3. In or on property that is being used by a school for a school function

4. Private School(IC 20*9.1*1*3) & (IC 35*41*1*24.7)

5. Head Start (IC 35*41*1*24.7)

6. Preschool (IC 35-41-1-24.7)

7. IC 35*47*9*1Allows the carry of firearms by persons permitted to possess and who are transporting a person to or from school or a school function.

8. On an aircraft

9. Controlled access areas of an airport

10. During annual State Fair 80 IAC 4-4-4 (Must lock in vehicle)

11. Shipping port 130 IAC 4-1-8 (Controlled by Indiana Port Commission)

12. A riverboat Casino

Long guns are not subject to these provisions in my State.

Personally I don't leave a loaded weapon unsecured in my home. I have no children to worry about but I prefer they be secured but still easily and quickly accessed in the event they would ever be needed.

As I've already said, much of that 37% (assault) takes place on weekends in clubs and bars. But don't take the word of someone who lives in the country. Let's all believe Craig Lamson who doesn't live here and has never visited.

35 gun related deaths versus nearly 12,000.

1 school shooting in 40 years versus 89.

I'm sure all the Brits watching their local news station right now are horrified by the amount of murders they're reporting tonight. Alternatively, Craig Lamson's local news is telling him nothing whatsoever happened in his neck of the woods today. But he'll still load his Magnum after getting into his Jim-jams. Ha ha ha

We can all see that when Lee gets cornered and is losing big time he has to resort to changing the subject. How original and oh so ct . I have no dispute there is a higher gun death rate in the US. Too bad that was not the subject at hand. Nice, and very failed attempt at changing the subject.

You once again prove you have no reading ability at all.

When you REMOVE that 37% of simple assaults from the overall violent crime stats...you are STILL LEFT WITH A VIOLENT CRIME RATE far above that of the US.

You lost. Deal with it.

Craig,

So would you agree with the "guns don't kill people, people kill people" line?

Martin

GUNS can't kill anyone without a person. Would you agree with "hammers don't kill people, people kill people?

Yes. You quoted figures. Are you really so detached from reality?

Learn to read yourself. Go back and see what I said and stop changing it to suit your own demented ends. Do you know what the word "majority" means? Idiot.

You have had your arse handed to you on a plate. Learn to live with it, tough guy.

You were spouting nonsense because of your ignorance.

Show me the quoted figures Lee.

Lets review the ACTUAL quote shall we.

"And yet you live in a country that has far MORE violent crime per 100,000 than mine."

You simply can't read.

Live with it. You made yourself look mightily foolish.

Again no news there. You are a ct after all.

We can all be as pedantic as you.

Here are the figures you quoted:

First there was a 1. That would be the first figure.

Then you quoted 0 or zero. Second figure.

Then another 0 or zero. Third figure.

Then another three 0's or zeroes. Figures four, five and six.

Sadly the stats say LOTS of violent crime happens in your neck of the world. Far more per capita than in the USA. Oh wait, you think the numbers are junk. Maybe you can prove that to us.

What numbers where you talking about?

http://www.foxnews.c...nking-epidemic/

Thanks for showing I quote no figures, but rather a qualifier.

Nope, just your own Home Office numbers. And when you factor in the 37 percent of Violent Crime for simple assault, You still have FAR MORE violent crime than the US.

Sure is fun watching you continue to look so foolish...

Responsible and law abiding gun owners commit very few of the gun crimes in the US.

What a brilliant observation.

Responsible and conscientious pedestrians commit very few of the jaywalking crimes in the U.S.

Brilliance is contagious...

Good luck with that one....

The obvious eludes you so often, Craig, it's a moment of celebration when it doesn't.

You need to check the mirror Cliff.

Responsible and law abiding gun owners commit very few of the gun crimes in the US.

What a brilliant observation.

Responsible and conscientious pedestrians commit very few of the jaywalking crimes in the U.S.

Brilliance is contagious...

Good luck with that one....

Yes. You quoted figures. Are you really so detached from reality?

Learn to read yourself. Go back and see what I said and stop changing it to suit your own demented ends. Do you know what the word "majority" means? Idiot.

You have had your arse handed to you on a plate. Learn to live with it, tough guy.

You were spouting nonsense because of your ignorance.

Show me the quoted figures Lee.

Lets review the ACTUAL quote shall we.

"And yet you live in a country that has far MORE violent crime per 100,000 than mine."

You simply can't read.

Live with it. You made yourself look mightily foolish.

Again no news there. You are a ct after all.

Listen, you complete and utter imbecile. You cited the figures. You're the one promoting them as proof that the society I live in is more violent than the one you live in. I'm here telling you that you are spouting absolute nonsense.

Who is the imbecile here? Why that would be YOU. I cited no figures, unless you want to call "per 100,000" figures. I simply made a general statement. Thanks for proving once again what a lousy reader you really are. But then again you consider grabbing someone around the neck as a non violent crime.....

You have absolutely no idea what the hell you are talking about. I told you the figures are skewed because our figures include "AFFRAY." What bit of that don't you understand? Do you require a photograph to help you?

If I walk up to somebody and grab them around the neck and tell them I'm "going to smash their face in" I can be charged with "AFFRAY" that will be included on the eventual list of "violent crimes" whether I do smash their face in or whether I don't.

Except that by grabbing one around the neck , you just committed a violent crime. ROFLMAO! Great example there Lee!

On the subject of "binge drinking" you are speaking from a place of utter ignorance. Each and every Brit on this forum will back me up on this. This country has a serious "binge drinking" problem that has been escalating for the the last 10 years. It is considered at this stage to be of "epidemic" proportions and each weekend it puts an incredible strain on ALL emergency services and the NHS. It's so bad that it costs the NHS nearly £3 billion a year.

You wouldn't know this because you have built up a preconceived idea of what these violent crime figures mean based upon what happens in your own country. Apples and oranges.

You can "love it" all you like. The simple fact is that the majority of violence that occurs in this country takes place in very specific hotspots in the City Centre's of the United Kingdom every weekend. .

YOU HAVE NO CLUE WHAT THE HELL YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT WHEN IT COMES TO THE VIOLENT CRIME FIGURES OF THE UNITED KINGDOM.

Actually I have a pretty good idea. Unlike you I can read.

Really? No violent crime elsewhere in the UK? You want to stick with that?

Because you are completely ignorant you really thought you'd be able to use these figures to prove a point only to have it blow up in your face. Ha ha ha ha ha.

Except it didn't blow up in my face, it blew up in yours. And yes its really a hoot watching you look so foolish.

Washington DC is less violent than London? Yeah, right.

What an idiot you are.

The only idiot here is you Lee, but that's really not news.

Responsible and law abiding gun owners commit very few of the gun crimes in the US.

What a brilliant observation.

Yes it was, thanks for noticing.

You could examine the other causes of why gun crime is so high in the US, but that would be complex, costly and take a long time. The simplest way of putting out a fire is to remove the fuel (I suggest the gun in this example) rather than try to figure out why the fire is there in the first place.

There is a good argument about the choice of the individual but - and I'm no Constitutional expert - it would seem that the second amendment was not intended for society as it exists today.

Just my view, not trying to suggest that anyone is wrong....

I would suggest the 2nd was intended for society exactly as it exists today. Lee whats to talk about crime stats in the UK being driven up by booze. LIkewise the stats in the US are in part fueled by drugs, gangs and the 'great society'.

Responsible and law abiding gun owners commit very few of the gun crimes in the US.

The US has a Tyrannical Governement that is running amok.

I would not dispute that for a second. Our government is a complete mess.

Lee, did you see Alex Jones on Piers Morgan arguing gun control?

Why repeat that debacle here.

Yea, the gun control side had no chance then either. And then Ben Shapiro destroyed poor Piers...

The numbers you site are pure junk because culturally speaking you know nothing about the world that exists around you other than what you read or what you are told to believe.

The U.K. Home Office figures concerning violent crime when compared to violent crime figures in the U.S. are skewed. They are skewed for a number of reasons but there is very much a primary cause. The U.K. violent crime statistics count an affray as a violent crime. An affray according to the Home Office is simply an altercation where acts of unlawful violence are threatened and they are recorded as a violent crime whether the threats are carried out or not. Unlike in the U.S.

Now, because you live inside your own bum hole when it comes to trying to understand the rest of the world, you wouldn't understand that the U.K. has quite a distinct problem when it comes to the culture of drinking. Each weekend thousands of young men and women go out in the many different bars and clubs that exist in every major town and city and get absoultely xxxx-faced. We have a culture of "binge-drinking". Every Friday and Saturday night there are thousands of altercations that are recorded as "affrays", many of them result in violence. Young studs fighting over young mares. Teenage testosterone mixing with 14 pints of European strength beer resulting in fighting every weekend certain areas in City Centre's like Manchester, Liverpool, Leeds, London, Glasgow etc. We as a society overall drink differently to you in the U.S. and we also have a different drinking culture to many places in Europe. The amount of altercations each weekend are in the thousands.

These "affray" figures skewer the overall crime statistics so badly that the European Union publishes reports that say that in the U.K. you have a 70% chance of being a victim of a violent crime. Absolute nonsense. Complete crap.

Now, if you are staggering around Mathew Street in Liverpool City Centre after having consumed 3 pints of Jagermeister at 2am I'd say your chances of becoming a victim of a violent crime increase dramatically. And having a .357 Magnum in your safe at home ain't going to help you.

So the figures you are using has the U.K down as more violent place that Washington D.C. which is utterly ludicrous and completetly ridiculous. I've been to many major cities in the U.K., even been out drinking during the evening, and nothing comes close to the feeling of dread that is felt than the feeling of dread being outdoors in Washington after 10pm. Yes, Craig, unlike you I've actually travelled the world and experienced these things for myself. Believe me, no matter what the crime figures say, there are no places in London, Manchester or Liverpool, that compare to let's say, South Houston.

So take you figures and shove them where the sun don't shine because they're not unlike the other wares you hawk on this site. Complete and utter drivel from someone who has a couple of screws loose and a set agenda based upon his political beliefs.

Oh I just love this one. The bum numbers are MY fault. ROFLMAO! And my posts are complete and utter drivel because I have a few loose screws and and an agenda!

Wow this is really rich coming from whacky ct, with an agenda!

Its all the fault of binge drinkers...yea that the ticket. That's the very best you can do?

Care to apply that to home invasions, for example? No one has ever been stabbed and killed right at the front door of a multi million dollar home bristling with security measures over there?

ROFLMAO! You guys are a real hoot! No wonder the world considers you all kooks.

BTW, I have a lifetime permit to conceal carry. No need for that 357 in the gunvault if I choose. And the poor slobs in England getting beaten in England don't have this CHOICE. Gotta love the nanny state! Cal a cop after its all over to clean up the mess and hose the victims blood from the street

Ben Shapiro tried to turn it into a left/right issue, which it is not. ANd to say that Morgan is a LW shows you just how far to the loony right he is. Maybe as far as you.

Morgan then stuffed that on him when he took out a letter signed by Ronald Reagan and Gerald Ford requesting congress pass an assault rifle ban.

He then tried to make the NRA out to be a poor besieged innocent lobbying group instead of the multi million dollar intimidation group it is.

The worst part was this: he first tries to attack Morgan for "standing on the dead bodies of the kids from Sandy Hook". Five minutes later he tries to say that if America gets strict about gun control there will be a Jewish Holocaust similar to the Nazis in America.

GIve me a break Craig.

Better, give us all a break. Take up painting.

It IS a L/R issue jimbo, always has been, always will be.

So Ronny signed the letter, good for him. He had his own opinion, which last time I looked was also enshrined in the constitution. His opinion is not golden.

And the gun gabbing left ALWAYS dances on the graves of some victim, and Morgan is doing it solely for ratings. Without this latest round of gun grabbing crap his would be in the toilet.

Tell us jimbo, you think anyone had duck hunting in mind when they wrote the 2nd? Or tyrannical governments run amok?

Shaprio laid it all out and you just showed you are a leftest gun grabber too. Surprise, surprise.

Got to love it it when lefties have their panties all twisted. You don't deserve a break jimbo, in fact you deserve more and more.

Lee, did you see Alex Jones on Piers Morgan arguing gun control?

Why repeat that debacle here.

Yea, the gun control side had no chance then either. And then Ben Shapiro destroyed poor Piers...

I was being facetious about your bedside drawer being littered with handguns, you utter clown.

Nice ...failed... attempt at a backstroke.

I've never been mugged. Never been beaten up. Never been hit, punched or kicked. Never been robbed. Never had my house broken into. Never had a family member killed or robbed. Never been held up by highwaymen. Never been invaded by a crack special forces team from Istanbul. Never had my local gas station attendant mowed down in a hail of lead. Never been carjacked. Never had my car stolen. Never had any sort of serious violence visited upon me or anybody that I know. Never been kidnapped by Somalian pirates.

Me either, but unlike you I have the FREEDOM to provide myself and my family with protection SHOULD IT BE NEEDED. I don't ever expect to raise any of my firearms in anger. I sincerely hope that will always be the case. You HAVE no choice. All you have is your hammer. If that.

Nobody on my entire estate where I live has ever had anybody break into their home wielding a .357 Magnum or any other type of firearm. It just doesn't happen. EVER. Not where I live. So consequently we don't feel the need to leave handguns loaded in our drawers next to our beds. We also don't want our kids getting hold of them and shooting us, or each other.

I did witness a shop robbery once when I was 22. Almost 18 years ago.

Is there violent crime in England? Sure is. I'm sure there's quite a bit. But my experiences dictate that I do not need an AK-47 next to me before I can close my eyes at night. Only someone who is utterly petrified of their surrounding society would need a .357 magnum, and additional weapons, under their pillow so they can feel safe before going to sleep.

Any particular types of people you're petrified of, Lambo?

So it can NEVER happen? EVER? And you don't even GET THE CHOICE. Your government took that away from you. Sadly the stats say LOTS of violent crime happens in your neck of the world. Far more per capita than in the USA. Oh wait, you think the numbers are junk. Maybe you can prove that

to us.

BTW, all my firearms are safely and securely stored.

I'm so happy for you. I'm not 'petrified' at all. I sleep very, very well. I simply have a CHOICE you are denied. MY CHOICE is to have the means to protect myself SHOULD THE NEED ARISE. Don't believe I will ever have the need arise but I can tell you IF it does at least I'm in a better position that an unarmed victim like you. I hope you never find yourself in the position of needing a firearm, no one should, but quite frankly crap happens. That is a fact of life. You have had the CHOICE denied.

P.S. The numbers are BOLLOCKS. Not "bullocks."

How many school shootings have there been in the U.K. in my lifetime? That would be 1. In the same time period how many in the U.S? That would be 89.

Now that you've given us your big-butch-.357 magnum-wielding masculine routine, haven't you got some flowers to go photograph or some further work measuring David Von Pein's bulge?

How in the world would you ever know. You just admitted you don't have a clue.

Yea, GUN FREE ZONES for the most part. What wonderful SOFT TARGETS for nutjobs on a "mission". And of course the largest school killing in the US had no guns involved...just a bomb. Crazy people will kill regardless of the tool. Which kind of explains why hammers and other blunt instruments kill more people than rifles in the US.

Oh the .357 is not that masculine. Its the gun my wife prefers to shoot. No slide to rack, no misfeeds, decent recoil and ultra reliable. Thus the reason it lives in the bedroom. Too bad you are a pantywaist, you will never even be given the CHOICE to understand.

Lambo!.

Question of the Day:

If a person cannot tell the difference between a convex curve and a concave curve -- should they be allowed to possess firearms?

Convex "bulge":

Concave "indentation":

Still at a loss I see cliffy. Understandable. You lost your argument a long time ago. Its just a fantasy running around in your fevered brain.

BTW, you can't tell concave from convex...since they are both just simple FOLDS.

What the hell are you going on about you looney?

You told us you had three weapons in your house. I told you that wouldn't protect you if you were invaded by Venezuala. You said what makes me think that is all [as in all you had]. I said the fact that in my world only lunatics are preoccupied with guns in that way.

What's your point again, Mr Charisma?

No I don't Craig. You see, the figures you're spouting are bollocks and the actual figures pale into insignificance next to yours. I'm perfectly safe going to bed at night in the town that I live in. Don't need one.

Once some sicko went into a school and shot a load of kids we banned them. Consequently we now have 30-35 gun murders a year. Unlike your 11,000.

No there are "not a couple of ways to read it". You simply can't read. I was pretty specific about what was at my bedside. As usual you just mucked it up.

So now you need to be in England to know what's in the news? Do you have the freedom to own any handguns you might choose?

Got any weapons in your home?

What the hell are you going on about you looney?

You told us you had three weapons in your house. I told you that wouldn't protect you if you were invaded by Venezuala. You said what makes me think that is all [as in all you had]. I said the fact that in my world only lunatics are preoccupied with guns in that way.

What's your point again, Mr Charisma?

No I don't Craig. You see, the figures you're spouting are bollocks and the actual figures pale into insignificance next to yours. I'm perfectly safe going to bed at night in the town that I live in. Don't need one.

Once some sicko went into a school and shot a load of kids we banned them. Consequently we now have 30-35 gun murders a year. Unlike your 11,000.

No weapons? Really? Got a hammer? Hammers and other blunt instruments resulted in more homicides in the US than rifles...all rifles.

NO weapons? Think again.

you really don't have the reading skills nor the recall of a 2 year old do you? Surprise surprise.

Lets review shall we, even though I'm sure the words will flow right past that blank space between your ears.

Lee sez:

"I guess because in my world only weirdos and lunatics have this type of obsession collecting and storing in their bedside drawers so many objects that have been designed specifically to kill other human beings."

It pretty much useless trying to argue with an empty head like you. Why you mucked up even the simple facts about England and violent crime and somehow then tried to twist it into gun deaths.

Not at all unlike what we see everyday where ct's gather.

The numbers are "bullocks" ROFLMAO!

I don't think you're safe with such a small arsenal of weapons.

If a Venezuelan task force ever tries to occupy your home you're gonna need a couple of rocket launchers and possibly a flame thrower or they're gonna be all over you like a rash.

What makes you think that's all?

I guess because in my world only weirdos and lunatics have this type of obsession collecting and storing in their bedside drawers so many objects that have been designed specifically to kill other human beings.

Thanks for clearing things up for me, Rambo.

I see we can add being totally unable to read to you long list of faults.

Great job Lee,I can now see why your attempts at research are so miserable.

In your world, you don't have the FREEDOM to possess these sorts of firearms. You are a bitch to the state.

And yet you live in a country that has far MORE violent crime per 100,000 than mine. Maybe you can use a knife to defend yourself from the crazies ...oh wait... But I digress.

Learn to read.

Learn to be more specific. You asked a question. There were a couple of ways to read it. I read it the way I thought you meant it.

I didn't know you had been over here. Tell us. When was the time you were in England, Craig? Or are you getting your info from Larry Pratt?

No there are "not a couple of ways to read it". You simply can't read. I was pretty specific about what was at my bedside. As usual you just mucked it up.

So now you need to be in England to know what's in the news? Do you have the freedom to own any handguns you might choose?

Got any weapons in your home?