Peter McGuire

Dear John, and all who might have read the above:

1) I really do get worn out trying to argue with people as in the bove.

2)

(i) This lady does NOT accept the word of a researcher who knew, intimately, Marina Oswald, concerning her affair with Robert: Mary Ferrell. I reported what Ferrell told me, in the presence of a corroborating witness.

(ii) she does not accept the word of Thomas Mallon, as he reported it, also with a corroborating witness, Patricia Johnson McMillan, and an un-named source. When I offer that the only alternative, then, is that she is saying that we are all lying, she makes it seem that I am name calling. I am not.

(3) She says I have changed my story. What she has read are twisted versions of my story which I tried to correct. When I tried to correct these twisted versions, yes, I was accused of changing my story. Did she offer examples of my changed story? No. She made an accusation I take very seriously.

(4) She has had the opportunity, for years, to contact me. The email address was in plain view for three years. I never heard from her.

(5) Marina Oswald has chosen not to respond to all my attempts to contact her. That is not my fault.

(6) When my book comes out, will Bernice see 'no' evidence in it, either? Since she does not accept my word concerning Marina's affair, she does not accept Mallon's, she does not accept McMillan's support of Mallon, she does not accept Reynold's support of me, she apparently rejects witness testimony. Since in many cases I will only be able to offer the testimonies of witnesses to back up what I say in the book, will she reject those as inadequate? I have living witnesses to back up what I say. If she rejects their word, what is one to do?

(7) I NEVER recommended that people read Mallon's book. I cited Mallon. The lady insinuates that I have done a disservice in mentioning Mallon's book to unwary readers. She asked me for support of my statement. I gave it. Then she attacked me for mentioning this book. Was I only allowed to cite from books that this lady likes?

(7) AM I merely gossiping? The lady said my statement had nothing to do with the assassination. Is that true? The matter is important: was Robert Oswald compromised? The camera was found immediately after the affair came to light, according to Mary Ferrell. Since two people can corroborate what Mary said, I felt it was important to ask ourselves if Robert Oswald was compromised.

Is THAT how he came to 'find' the Imperial Reflex camera? WHY wasn't the camera placed with all the other camera equipment, etc. found on November 22-23? The corruption of the Dallas police in changing testimonies, not keeping track of chains of possession of evidence, and in 'losing'--- and then conveniently 'finding' --- evidence stinks to high heaven.

The exchange above is very typical of what happened in the newsgroup. No matter what I might have offered as proof, it was never enough.

Thank you for the opportuunity to speak here. I hope others will weigh in with their opinions about whether or not I had a good reason to bring up this matter and also if it was reasonable for me to say that Robert Oswald and Marina had a brief affair. BTW, nobody has ever argued with Mary Ferrell's information about Marina Oswald. She was an expert on Marina. As for me, I knew where she worked, everything, but did not impose myself on her when I lived in Dallas. I asked to see her: she refused. I did what I could to try to contact her. She always turned me or my friends down. She is not the helpless woman being maligned as suggested above. She has had many opportunities to speak out.

Imagine how frightened I am -- and I am--to bring out the book and name names. For some people, there will NEVER be enough evidence. And in America, specious lawsuits are a plague. I do not look forward to getting the book published. It will mean only more misery. I will do it only because it is the right thing to do.

I apologize for this long post. I HAVE written again because she rejected a reasonable amount of evidence and also said I changed my story. That had to be addressed.

Ask yourself-- WHO, in the above exchange, offered REAL INFORMATION, such as on the camera? What did the other person offer? Nothing but opinions that she doesa not like what I said. She also said I changed my story -- an insult to my integrity. She offered no proof. She rejected my citation of Mallon -- why? She doesn't like his book. Well, that's not a good enough reason. Where is her objectivity? She offered opinions, not evidence. I'm very used to that from those who attack me. But readers here need to be made aware that the accusation I changed my story is not taken lightly by me. If she tries to back it up, I'll prove it's not true. ADDING DETAILS to a story, by the way, is not CHANGING it. For example, nobody asked me if Lee was right-handed or left handed before Robert groden wrote and asked me. So it wasn't in the two earlier versions of the book, either. Now I have added that information. That is not changing the story. That is adding information people want to know.

Thank you.

Judyth

Judy Vary circa 1961

Nigel Turner is the producer of the television series, The Men Who Killed Kennedy. Made for the Central Independent Television company, it started off a two-part documentary broadcast in October, 1988: The Coup d'Etat and The Forces of Darkness. Three more installments were made two years later: The Cover Up, The Patsy and The Witnesses. The sixth episode, The Truth Shall Set You Free, was added in 1995.

These documentaries have been highly controversial. In the documentary broadcast in 1988 Stephen Rivele argued that the assassination of John F. Kennedy had been organized by Antoine Guerini, the Corsican crime boss in Marseilles. According to Rivele, Lucien Sarti fired from behind the wooden fence on the grassy knoll. The first shot was fired from behind and hit Kennedy in the back. The second shot was fired from behind, and hit John Connally. The third shot was fired from in front, and hit Kennedy in the head. The fourth shot was from behind and missed. As well as Sarti, also named Sauveur Pironti and Roger Bocognani as being involved in the killing. However, Pironti and Bocognani both had alibis and Rivele was forced to withdraw the allegation.

In another episode, Charles Harrelson, who some investigators believed was involved in the assassination of John F. Kennedy, told Turner that "on November 22, 1963, at 12.30, I was having lunch with a friend in a restaurant in Houston, Texas." He also told Turner that he would not have accepted such a contract as he knew that if he had, he would have ended up, like Lee Harvey Oswald, being killed by the Mafia.

In the sixth episode, The Truth Shall Set You Free, May 1995, Daniel Marvin claimed to have been solicited by an agent of the Central Intelligence Agency to "terminate" William Pitzer.

The Love Affair (2003) was an account by Judyth Vary Baker of her (at first, unwitting) involvement in an anti-Castro conspiracy. A young woman who had received specialized training in cancer research, she was invited to New Orleans by Alton Ochsner to aid Dr. Mary Sherman in a research project that was being developed to kill Fidel Castro.

In 1963, Judyth met Lee Harvey Oswald and became involved on the clandestine side of the research project. Both had unhappy marriages and were attracted to each other. She and Oswald began working together: they were both hired May 10, 1963, at Reily's Coffee Company, which provided cover jobs for them. Several labs were involved, including a tumor and tissue culture processing mini-lab, at an apartment owned by anti-Castroite Dave Ferrie. Lee Oswald was selected to courier the biological materials to Mexico City, but the project was called off due to Hurricane Flora. Oswald was ordered to Dallas.

Oswald kept in touch with Judyth Vary Baker: they planned to escape to Mexico after his major assignment - his voluntary infiltration of an assassination ring against John F. Kennedy. Oswald believed a highly conservative Texas-sponsored cartel was working with the Mafia and rogue elements of the CIA and the FBI in the plot against Kennedy. He suspected that David Atlee Phillips was his handler. After Kennedy was assassinated, Dave Ferrie called Judyth and told her she was being watched. if she talked, she would die.

Researchers are divided on Baker's story: a number of researchers have seen most or all her original evidence files and defend her (such as Jim Marrs, Martin Shackelford, Wim Dankbaar, Howard Platzman) while other researchers attack her story (Jack White, David Lifton, John MacAdams, Dave Reitzes). Baker points out that almost all the researchers who have attacked her story have never met her or viewed her original evidence files.

This programme was followed by The Smoking Guns and looked at the research carried out by people such as James H. Fetzer, David Mantik, Douglas Weldon, Jack White and Vincent Palamara. The third programme was called The Guilty Men and looked at the possibility that Lyndon B. Johnson, Malcolm Wallace and Edward A. Clark were involved in the assassination of John F. Kennedy. The programme relied heavily on the book Blood, Money & Power: How LBJ Killed JFK by Barr McClellan.

This programme has caused quite a stir going on in America at the moment. A programme called the Guilty Men was aired on the History Channel. It claimed that LBJ was behind the assassination. LBJ’s wife and a group of former presidents (Ford, Carter, Clinton) complained and last night the History Channel put out another documentary rubbishing the one they made earlier. They have also promised not to allow the programme to be broadcast again.

Max Holland has written a highly critical article about Nigel Turner at.

http://hnn.us/articles/4487.html

A debate on this by supporters of Nigel Turner can be found at:

http://www.jfkresearch.com/forum/index.php...23&linear=1

http://www.jfkresearch.com/forum/index.php...93&linear=1

Does anyone know if the first six installments are ever shown on American TV, or have they disappeared also?

http://www.jfkmurdersolved.com/bush.htm

"Behind every success there is a crime"

Lyndon Baines Johnson

"If the people were to ever find out what we have done, we would be chased down the streets and lynched."

George H.W. Bush, 1992

Has anyone else noticed the pronunciation of the article "an" by Korean speakers of English? It seems they are taught in public school to pronounce it like an "un" not with the an"d" way that Native Speakers of English do. They seem to know it is "wrong" , but continue to do so.

Any thought or experiences?

Most people interested in the assassination of John F. Kennedy now use the web to do their research. It is claimed that since the arrival of Google search-engines can be trusted to rank websites in the order of relevance to the query. This is based on Google’s decision to place great emphasis on the number of websites linked to individual sites. Google class this as “peer-group” approval. This is a sensible approach, for example, people with an interest in the Kennedy assassination, are likely to give links to other websites that they have found useful in researching the subject.

Therefore, what happens if you type the “assassination of John F. Kennedy” into the Google search-engine. We are told there are 157,000 relevant websites. Ranked first is John Mcadams’ website. It is of course one of the few assassination websites that believes the conclusions of the Warren Commission. The second on the list is the NRA Assassination Records website. The third one is very surprising. It is a website in Germany that does not contain any information except a title page.

(1) http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

(2) http://www.archives.gov/research_room/jfk/

(3) http://www.jfk-assassination.de/

If you do a search of individuals involved in the investigation into the assassination you are likely to find Google take you to John Mcadams’ website.

If you type in “David Lifton” you discover that there are 22,900 relevant web pages on this subject. Ranked first is a page from John Mcadams’ website. This is in fact an article by Lifton with the title: “Is Jim Garrison Out of His Mind?” This page is linked to others on Mcadams website that of course an attempt to undermine Lifton’s theories on the assassination. My much more sympathetic account of Lifton’s theories is only ranked 4th.

(1) http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/lifton1.htm

(4) http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKlifton.htm

One would therefore assume that there are more links to Mcadams page on Lifton than mine. There is in fact a website that allows you to check how many websites are linked to individual pages.

http://www.marketleap.com/publinkpop/default.htm

In fact this website shows that Google does not show any links to either page. Therefore, Google must be taken something else into account. Maybe it is the links to the home page of the respective websites.

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/home.htm

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/

This is also not the case. Mcadams has according to Google got 264 websites linked to his home page whereas I have 6,750. This situation is reflected in other search-engines: AltaVista (744/30,601); Hotbot (0/17,433); MSN (0/17,321)

There are obviously other factors search-engines are using to rank web pages. It would be interesting to hear how they would explain these results.

In 1933-1934 there was a plot to remove President Roosevelt from office - a coup d'etat.  The conspiracy involved Wall Street brokers, bankers, industrialists, even some members of Roosevelt's Democratic Party, the House of Morgan, the Duponts and the Rockefellers.  Roosevelt, like John Kennedy, was considered a communist, a traitor to his class, and worse, by these elite forces who feared his actions to remedy inequalities and to better the situation during the Great Depression which had begun during Herbert Hoover's prior administration.  The plot entailed the use of war veterans of the American Legion, an organization founded by wealthy military officers after World War I to resist "radicalism," who were to be mobilized to march to the White House in Washington, D.C., to remove Roosevelt and to install a popular Marine General, Smedley Darlington Butler, as 'dictator" in his place.  The plotters were admirers of Benito Mussolini who had led a force of his 'black shirts' against Rome to remove the Italian King, putting Mussolini in power in 1922.  They also admired a French Fascist paramilitary organization, the Croix de Feu (Cross of Fire), of approximately 500,000 which they planned to pattern in their efforts in the United States.

For French historians, the Croix de Feu was not a facist organization : their leader, Colonel de La Rocque, was against plots. Such organizations had been called "ligues" (leagues ?) : some were monarchistic (Camelots du Roi, Action Française), some were nationalist, a few were facist, all were far-right organizations and often admirers of Mussolini. They took part (the French Communist Party too) in the riot of 6/2/1934 in Paris: a huge demonstration on the place of the Concorde near the Palais-Bourbon (house of the parliament), that became a march on the Palais-Bourbon with police shots (15 deads, 1435 wounded : a lot of ex-warriors of IWW). For left parties, the riot was a plot of the facist leagues and an attempt for making a coup d'etat.

The consequences were :

- dissolution of the leagues. Some changed into political parties, that were dissolved too (1935-1936)

- 1936 : victory of the French Popular Front

After the dissolution, some ex-members of the leagues founded the CSAR, best known as the "Cagoule" (cowl), whose leader was Eugene Deloncle (boss of the society Ripolin : oil-based paint). The "Cagoule" was a secret organization and a secret army (linked with fascist Italy and maybe - but no evidences - Nazis), that commited murders and bombing during 1937 and an attempt of putsch (November 1937 with members of the French army). The Cagoule gave up the putsch, arrestations came after. Because of the war, leaders were not tried. Deloncle is one of the cretors of the LVF (French legion of volunteers fighting against bolchevism with the nazi army in USSR, Darnand chief of the Milice (Vichy France)

Cf. Frédéric Monier, Le complot dans la République. Stratégies du secret de Boulanger à la Cagoule, Paris, La Découverte, 1998. (The plot in the Republic)

http://www3.uakron.edu/hfrance/reviews/wall3.html

http://www.sunderland.ac.uk/~os0tmc/fre320/front.htm

http://www.h-net.org/reviews/showrev.cgi?path=10961846692797

http://www.alphalink.com.au/~radnat/theori...ht/theory1.html

name='Tim Gratz' post='36776' date='Aug 13 2005, 06:25 AM']I suspect that it is possible that someone set Hart up with Rice, and that the relationship was then "leaked" by someone who wanted, for whatever reason, to derail his candidacy. It is only a suspicion.

But a single affair ruined Hart's presidency.

Clearly anyone with knowledge of the facts could have ruined JFK's presidency by publishing the fact that he shared a friend with a major Mafia don and that he had an affair with a lady suspected of ties to an Eastern bloc intelligence organization. Or, they could have used their knowledge of those plots to blackmail Kennedy.

Why, then, the assassination?

Several possibilties suggest themselves: (1) the conspirators were unaware of either relationship (but Rosselli and Giancana were aware of Campbell); or

(2) the conspirators hated JFK enough they wanted to murder him, not just drive him from office. [/qoute]

It seems to me that Kennedy was impeachable or at least, as you said, in a position to be driven from office. Good question. If this was so, why the assassination?

Hello,

I just posted an interview with filmaker Mark Sobel who has produced a new film 5 years in the making...

"The Commission" based on the Warren Commission. It stars; Sam Waterston, Martin Sheen, Ed Asner, Corbin Bernsen, Martin Landau, Joe Don Baker, Henry Gibson and others...

For more details check Black Op Radio archived shows, #168

The film will be shown in Dallas this Sunday. Don't miss it!

Thanks,

Len Osanic

http://www.blackopradio.com/

=========

How about the "Commission" has it been released?

To John Simkin:

I have explored this website and can't find how long it has been up, who the initatiors and/or sponsors are. Is there information on this? Could you give me the link?

It has been created over the last two months. I am the author of all the narrative that appears on the website (quotations are acknowledged). The section on the JFK does not have a sponsor. However, overall the website receives funding from the Public Record Office, EasyNet, Ask Jeeves, KeepAhead and Amazon. The sponsors do not have any control over the content of the website.

Exactly. Multiple conspiritors. This thing came together, in the end for that exact reason. So many people wanted him dead. For THEIR survival.

If you point out one "theory" and it is discredited , it doesnt matter. There were 100 reasons for the killing , but only so much evidence.

In the end, the truth will prevail.

I've received a number of messages pledging money, which is very encouraging.

All my best to you all and keep it coming!

John

What is the address again, to send my pledge of $50?

and continuing on after another year of reading/thinking/learning:: I incline towards the latter

I wouldn't call Lees pants tight, nor would I call them baggy. In the left pocket, as he sat for the interview with his hands manacled behind his back were a key, a bus pass and five bullets. On request the handcuffs were shifted to his front. The bullet ouline in his pants were not noted.

Thes five bullets were found while he was waiting to be in the lineup at 4.30+.

yet:

"2:15 P.M. Taken into Police Dept.

2:15 - 2:20 P.M. - "Talked to" by officers Guy F. Rose and Richard S. Stovall. No notes.

2:25 - 4:04 P.M. Interrogation of Oswald, Office of Capt Will Fritz

"My name is Lee Harvey Oswald . . . I just had them in there," when asked why he had bullets in his pocket."

4.30 P.M. (to lineup)

The bullets had, according to the person who found them while searching him outside the lineup room at 4.30+, not been found by the time of this interview.

I think the key and buspass being flat were found at the linup search. The bullets were not 'found' until the correct revolver was confirmed as in the loop. He was not asked about the bullets again after they really had been 'found'. The revolver was 'drop gun' substituted for the one he was carrying. It was the one he had bought, but never had. The one he had which had been switched for the one he bought before he picked it up was found the next day in a bag a few blocks away by an unknown Willie Flat. (interestingly there is an order by Ruby on behalf of a 'L.S. McWillie' for a .38 snubnose that was never delivered)

The notion of "Oswald as Communist" does not gel with his statements that he turned to Communism after reading Das Kapital, while elsewhere saying no, and laughing at the idea, to a question if he had studied political economy in the US.

Das Kapital is basically a book on Political Economy. "In this book, you will find basic concepts of labour theory of value (what determines the value of a commodity); monetary theory (the evolution of money); the Theory of Surplus Value (what is profit and how does it come about - .. and lastly, the mechanism of production."- Review Written by O. B. Makhubela (amazon)

Someone wanting to pass themselves off as communist and who had not read Das Kapital yet knew its importance to Communist ideology may make such a mistake. Had he read it he would for consistency sake say he had studied political economy. Had he really known what he was talking about and had not read Das Kapital the correct book would be the Communist Manifesto or perhaps the very easy and clear "What is socialism?" by the SWP. IOW he was attempting to pass himself off as a Communist in a way that made sense to him as a right winger. He was at the very least a lazy study. However, there are anectotes that belie that. The simple explanation is : he was a Communist Pretender, coming at it from a world view that was informed according to a right winger.

The idea of the "Communist Pretender" gels with this mistake and with his expressed admiration for the Minutemen, and with him finding Soviet life too booring to put up with. I've come across 'wreckers' of this kind, so Lee as such is not that farfetched to me.

The particular matter which he expressed admiration for the Minutemen over was in the idea of bringing things to a head. Doing things that amplified contradictions. So him (acting under orders?) to shoot at and miss Walker may not be so contradictory at all.

What it would do is set him up as the fall guy for the Kennedy assassination. Not that he had any idea that things would turn out like this. Did the German-Walker interview become known after Oswald was silenced? Was he at any time during his interviews asked about Walker? According to Mae: no. So then, until he was done away with he must also be kept quiet, ie. if he knew he had been connected with the Walker incident he would also know without doubt he was being hung out to dry and would have started singing. (speculation of course) The Walker shooting-Oswald link was only made after he was dead. It did load the case against the now dead assassin.

It seems to me that the irrgualrities started with going to Russia. It seems that something made this 'the plan' of which the numerous slips merely point to the unprofessional approach. Not exactly what one might expect from a 'master spy' but rather born of following instructions from someone that he placed his trust in judgement while this someone left the preparations incomplete. Lunacy, really. I'd look to a zealot outside the usual agencies.

Before during or after arrest Oswald had no signs of drug use like dilated pupils or sweating, or erratic enhanced reactions, so that wasn't a factor.

Patsy doesn't only mean scapegoat, but also 'cheated' or 'betrayed'. His inconsistencies tell of peripheral involvement. Not as he thought when starting to play with the big boys, but used and dumped. Therefore killing him was essential before he realised just how much he had been left out in the cold.

As far as Lee knew he was'covered' as far as the Walker shooting went. The police were looking for two and a car, and they had a steel jacketed bullet which was far too mangled to match any particular rifle.

Lee played with the big boys and got burnt. They knew all along he was going to burn. They could hardly give him any inkling of that however, quite the contrary. Not until sitting in the Theatre did it begin to dawn on him what was going down. He still wasn't sure however, as he had no idea of any cop being killed. This he found out later.

His white supremacy shackled-fist salute was an ID in preparation to going to jail.

"Lee played with the big boys and got burnt.'' That notion has occourred to me , too. I cant imagine that young man waiting in the Texas Theatre for his handler. That is sad.

and continuing on after another year of reading/thinking/learning:: I incline towards the latter

I wouldn't call Lees pants tight, nor would I call them baggy. In the left pocket, as he sat for the interview with his hands manacled behind his back were a key, a bus pass and five bullets. On request the handcuffs were shifted to his front. The bullet ouline in his pants were not noted.

Thes five bullets were found while he was waiting to be in the lineup at 4.30+.

yet:

"2:15 P.M. Taken into Police Dept.

2:15 - 2:20 P.M. - "Talked to" by officers Guy F. Rose and Richard S. Stovall. No notes.

2:25 - 4:04 P.M. Interrogation of Oswald, Office of Capt Will Fritz

"My name is Lee Harvey Oswald . . . I just had them in there," when asked why he had bullets in his pocket."

4.30 P.M. (to lineup)

The bullets had, according to the person who found them while searching him outside the lineup room at 4.30+, not been found by the time of this interview.

I think the key and buspass being flat were found at the linup search. The bullets were not 'found' until the correct revolver was confirmed as in the loop. He was not asked about the bullets again after they really had been 'found'. The revolver was 'drop gun' substituted for the one he was carrying. It was the one he had bought, but never had. The one he had which had been switched for the one he bought before he picked it up was found the next day in a bag a few blocks away by an unknown Willie Flat. (interestingly there is an order by Ruby on behalf of a 'L.S. McWillie' for a .38 snubnose that was never delivered)

The notion of "Oswald as Communist" does not gel with his statements that he turned to Communism after reading Das Kapital, while elsewhere saying no, and laughing at the idea, to a question if he had studied political economy in the US.

Das Kapital is basically a book on Political Economy. "In this book, you will find basic concepts of labour theory of value (what determines the value of a commodity); monetary theory (the evolution of money); the Theory of Surplus Value (what is profit and how does it come about - .. and lastly, the mechanism of production."- Review Written by O. B. Makhubela (amazon)

Someone wanting to pass themselves off as communist and who had not read Das Kapital yet knew its importance to Communist ideology may make such a mistake. Had he read it he would for consistency sake say he had studied political economy. Had he really known what he was talking about and had not read Das Kapital the correct book would be the Communist Manifesto or perhaps the very easy and clear "What is socialism?" by the SWP. IOW he was attempting to pass himself off as a Communist in a way that made sense to him as a right winger. He was at the very least a lazy study. However, there are anectotes that belie that. The simple explanation is : he was a Communist Pretender, coming at it from a world view that was informed according to a right winger.

The idea of the "Communist Pretender" gels with this mistake and with his expressed admiration for the Minutemen, and with him finding Soviet life too booring to put up with. I've come across 'wreckers' of this kind, so Lee as such is not that farfetched to me.

The particular matter which he expressed admiration for the Minutemen over was in the idea of bringing things to a head. Doing things that amplified contradictions. So him (acting under orders?) to shoot at and miss Walker may not be so contradictory at all.

What it would do is set him up as the fall guy for the Kennedy assassination. Not that he had any idea that things would turn out like this. Did the German-Walker interview become known after Oswald was silenced? Was he at any time during his interviews asked about Walker? According to Mae: no. So then, until he was done away with he must also be kept quiet, ie. if he knew he had been connected with the Walker incident he would also know without doubt he was being hung out to dry and would have started singing. (speculation of course) The Walker shooting-Oswald link was only made after he was dead. It did load the case against the now dead assassin.

It seems to me that the irrgualrities started with going to Russia. It seems that something made this 'the plan' of which the numerous slips merely point to the unprofessional approach. Not exactly what one might expect from a 'master spy' but rather born of following instructions from someone that he placed his trust in judgement while this someone left the preparations incomplete. Lunacy, really. I'd look to a zealot outside the usual agencies.

Before during or after arrest Oswald had no signs of drug use like dilated pupils or sweating, or erratic enhanced reactions, so that wasn't a factor.

Patsy doesn't only mean scapegoat, but also 'cheated' or 'betrayed'. His inconsistencies tell of peripheral involvement. Not as he thought when starting to play with the big boys, but used and dumped. Therefore killing him was essential before he realised just how much he had been left out in the cold.

As far as Lee knew he was'covered' as far as the Walker shooting went. The police were looking for two and a car, and they had a steel jacketed bullet which was far too mangled to match any particular rifle.

Lee played with the big boys and got burnt. They knew all along he was going to burn. They could hardly give him any inkling of that however, quite the contrary. Not until sitting in the Theatre did it begin to dawn on him what was going down. He still wasn't sure however, as he had no idea of any cop being killed. This he found out later.

His white supremacy shackled-fist salute was an ID in preparation to going to jail.

"Lee played with the big boys and got burnt."

This has always been my perception.

I just can't imagine him in the theatre waiting for his handler. That is sad.

Peter,

Yes, that was the photo of Greer that I remembered seeing. Thanks.

Ron

Here he is with a trophy.

Mark, Do you know the date and circumstances of this photo?

FWIW, Reading Mr. Palamara's book "Survivors Guilt", I have found that he goes into great detail concerning alot of the answers to alot of peoples questions concerning what went on, who was involved in the security, and who made the final desicions concerning JFK's protection. Very good book that covers the nagging questions that people have been asking for years about the SS protection on the fateful Dallas trip. The personal interveiws of most of the agents involved is very revealing. Having the pleasure of reading it on line now is very nice. Read it if you have the time.

thanks--smitty

Myra, If you've only been working on these 'sorts' of

As for the depth and breadth of articles on parapolitics in Hustler:

http://www.magazine-empire.com/hustler/hus...gazine_1985.htm

Damn damn. Look at the articles they have in just the few months in '78 after Mr. Flynt was shot:

September 1978

"Conspiracy Against Truth -- The Shooting of Larry Flynt" by Ron Ridenour.

October 1978

"The Assassination of President John F. Kennedy -- How the CIA Set Up Oswald" by Mark Lane.

November 1978

"The Assassination of Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. (Was James Earl Ray a Patsy?)" by Mark Lane.

December 1978

"The Assassination of Malcolm X (Government and NYPD Conspiracy?)" by Eric Norden.

Each issue is $30-100. Not feasible.

C'mon now folks. If ya got old issues fess up. No one will tease you... much.

I wish I had some , Myra!

Sharon Friedberg, a spokeswoman for the building's owners, said the museum has been paying a lower rental rate for what had been the building's most valuable retail space.

Moving the museum allows the owners to charge the market rate, she said.

"We really wanted retail in the building, and this was the only space that opened to the street without requiring people to walk through a lobby," Ms. Friedberg said.

The same thing that killed JFK is mirrored in this minor 'death' of the museum....but casts the big shadow of the death of America - the power of money over all else.

WHAT A SHAME!!!!!! Speaking for myself, i think that the museum is sort of a landmark for all who visit Dealey Plaza, wheather they are just visitors, or serious researchers/buffs. You dont go to DP, and not visit the Museum. A wonderful place to spend hours looking through all kinds of historical memorabilia, films, and just chatting with other like minded "buffs". Not to mention a place to find very cool out of print books on the assassination.. The thought of it not being there is heartbreaking. I surely hope they stay open, hopefully in the same building, or if not, not far from where they are. Its sad to hear that they cant, or, just break even. I dont know about anyone else, but i am going to send Mr. Bowden a donation, to help out with his relocation, and any other expenses needed to keep the place open. Anyone here who feels the same as i do, please help out if you feel led. I would hate to see it pass away like many other things concerning the assassination. We need to keep places like Mr. Bowdens museum open and active for others, and future generation "buffs' alike.

thanks-smitty

Michael, I forgot to thank you for starting this post. If possible, can you keep us posted as to what is decided 'later this week" by Mr. Bowden as to his plans? Thank you in advance.--smitty

I for one, am going to donate some money.

How long, prior to 11-22, do you believe the conspirators had to plan the assassination?

In other words, from making the decision, gathering the team, selecting the locations, deciding who would be in various positions, securing firearms, etc.

Did they have one week to decide? A month?

Do you believe they took as long as six months to plan the assassination in Dealey Plaza?

MARK, JFK WAS DOOMED FROM THE MOMENT THAT LBJ ACCEPTED THE VICE PRESIDENT POSITION ON THE DEMOCRATIC TICKET, A DECISION THAT WAS MADE AT THE LA HOTEL DURING THE 1960 DEMOCRATIC CONVENTION. THAT'S WHERE PHIL GRAHAM OF THE WASINGTON POST AND JOHN CONNALLY CONVINCED LBJ TO TAKE THE SECOND SPOT, CONSIDERING THE FACT THAT 20% OR 1 OUT OF 5 US PRESIDENTS DIED IN OFFICE. LBJ REPLIED THAT THOSE ODDS COULD BE IMPROVED.

BK

This thing was so well thought out and carried out. It was not something that was put together in a few months, or even a year. I agree totally with Mr. Kelly on this point.

This is a link to reference Edward Dealey Luncheon . This link also gives a history of AH Belo Company. OF NOTE AH BELO is part of the very,very elite British-American Society. THANKS SG

http://forum.dallasmetropolis.com/showpost...amp;postcount=2

Interesting stuff!

John

Remember the Secret Service is part of the Treasury Department and Kennedy had put a notorious republican businessman in this sensitive cabinet position, Clarence Douglass Dillon. Everything about the Secret service performance, the detour, the walking speed, the delayed reaction to fire, everything flows from the C. Douglass Dillon angle........he was sort of Kennedy's Andrew Mellon.

One of the most important aspects of the Kennedy assassination concerns the security arrangements of the motorcade through Dallas. According to the Warren Commission the event was organised by two men: Kenneth O'Donnell (special assistant to the President) and Special Agent Winston Lawson. Although O’Donnell

I believe that Secret Service control shifted out of the Treasury Department since Kennedy's time. In any event, this C Douglass Dillon connection is an interesting one.

THIS IS THE WAY THE PETITION READS AS REVISED; IT WILL BE REVISED AGAIN BEFORE BEING SUBMITTED. - BK

Federal Grand Jury Petition (Request) to evaluate the existing evidence and investigate the homicide of John F. Kennedy, the attempted murder of John B. Connally and the murders of J. D. Tippit and Lee Harvey Oswald in Dallas, Texas in Nov. 1963.

[Note: Although the assassination of the President was not a federal crime in 1963, it was a federal crime to conspire to kill a federal official in the line of duty. Therefore we are submitting this petition, with evidentiary exhibits of conspiracy to the Attorney for The North Texas Federal Court requesting he convene a Special Federal Grand Jury. Other petitions will be filed in New Orleans Parish in Louisiana and Washington D.C. requesting that a Special Federal Grand Juries be convened especially for these particular cases, guided by a Assistant U.S. Attorney and assisted by a Task Force of independent researchers, professionals, investigators, law enforcement officers and judicial officials.]

We citizens of the United States of America do hereby petition you [u.S. District Attorney] to fulfill your obligations [under U.S. Code : Title 18, Section 3331(Summoning and term) –3332 (Powers & Duties) & 3331 (Reports); Or appropriate statute for correct jurisdiction]; See: Documentary Exhibits #1 (a), (, ©] and carry out your duties to convene a grand jury of American citizens to “operate as an investigative agency…in cases of civic corruption or misconduct by public officers….to look into the criminal conduct prior to the arrest of any suspect…(since)…the inquisitorial power of the grand jury may operate to develop evidence against civic corruption, organized crime, or a broad array of criminal activity.”

This request is being submitted for the purposes of:

1) Completing previously impeded official investigations; by the Dallas Police, Texas State, Secret Service, FBI, the Warren Commission, Church Intelligence Committee, Rockefeller Commission, Pike Committee, House Select Committee on Assassinations, Assassinations Records Review Board; Justice Department of the United States;

2) To determine the disposition and establish the provenance of all relevant evidence, records and witnesses;

3) To answer all outstanding questions that can be reasonably answered by basic inquiry and independent investigation (and not by agencies or departments of the government that have been implicated in the crime);

4) To have qualified experts review the available acoustic, ballistic, medical and autopsy evidence and to order new, independent studies and tests you deem necessary, including proper forensic autopsies of victims;

5) To review the available documentary records and hard evidence, subpoena witnesses, take their testimony, determine what crimes have been committed and whether there is enough evidence to indict those individuals responsible for crimes related to the assassination, including but not limited to conspiracy, homicide, treason, destruction of evidence, obstruction of justice and perjury;

6) To help restore public confidence in government, the law and the legal and judicial systems of this country; The public confidence in the government of the United States began to decline, according to polls, in December, 1963, directly as a result of the assassination of the President, and has never been regained, and will not be until the remaining questions are properly answered.

We citizens of the United States hereby present you with this petition, along with the relevant discovered evidence, records and exhibits, and respectfully request that you carry out your responsibilities under the law.

When you are finished we ask you to publicly report [under Sec. 3333] what steps you have taken, what you have discovered and whether you have determined if indictments should be brought against any individuals for crimes related to the assassination of John F. Kennedy, 35th President of the United States.

Attached: Evidence List; Exhibits; Living MaterialWitness List; Living Expert Witness List; Outstanding Questions; List of Related Crimes;

William E. Kelly, Jr. –

Thanks for your work on this, Bill.

Mark,

Thanks for those photos. As can be seen, one thing that was usual in motorcades was JFK's military aide sitting in the middle of the front seat. In Dallas, General McHugh rode instead at the back of the motorcade along with JFK's doctor.

Needless to say, someone sitting between Kellerman and Greer would have been inconvenient in case someone had to shoot through the windshield.

Ron

Like this windshield?

I believe that Greer was a driver for JFK before the November trips, though I don't know how often. I remember someone posting a photo of JFK and his family that included Greer, presumably as their driver, as there was a limo in the photo.

This may be the photo you are referring to:

William Greer and his watchful eye guarding President Kennedy.

Think about it, Francesca. I think you answer your own question. It's a mirror, smoke.

It seems to me that the irrgualrities started with going to Russia. It seems that something made this 'the plan' which the numerous slips merely point to the unprofessional approach. Not exactly what one might expect from a 'master spy' but rather born of following instructions from someone that he placed his trust in judgement while this someone left the preparations incomplete. Lunacy, really. I'd look to a zealot outside the usual agencies.

Before during or after arrest Oswald had no signs of drug use like dilated pupils or sweating, or erratic enhanced reactions, so that wasn't a factor.

Patsy doesn't only mean scapegoat, but also 'cheated' or betrayed. His inconsistencies tell of peripheral involvement. Not as he thought when starting to play with the big boys, but used and dumped. Therefore killing him was essential before he realised just how much he had been left out in the cold.

EDIT::1 Remember that as far as Lee knew he was'covered' as far as the Walker shooting went. The police were looking for two and a car. A steel jacketed bullet which was far too mangled to match any particular rifle.

2 Lee played with the big boys and got burnt. They knew all along he was going to burn. They could hardly give him any inkling of that however, quite the contrary. Not until sitting in the Theatre did it begin to dawn on him what was going down. He still wasn't sure however, as he had no idea of any cop being killed. This he found out later. His white supremacy shackled-fist salute was an ID in preparation to going to jail.

[qoute]Also, didn't Nitrate tests on his right cheek prove that he had no traces of gunpowder and couldn't have possibly fired a rifle? It seems like this test alone would have exonerated him.

The Dallas Police conducted a parafin test which has been acknowleged by the FBI. It is unbelievable to me that they were still able to sell this turkey with this exculpitory evidence right before everyone's eyes. This clearly shows the power and determination of the people who did this.

"In 1963 Greer was listed as agent/driver for President Kennedy on three trips in November: Chicago on 11/2; Miami on 11/18 and Dallas on 11/22."

"Anybody find that interesting?"

It looks to me like the dates of two foiled assassantion plots and the one that succeeded.

Was JFK just another crooked politician? Did he have anything special to contribute? Would the world have been a better place had he lived?

All I know is that his speeches and the message they delivered were given by someone who truly cared for his country. And it seemed that he made the right decision during the Cuban Missle Crisis. He was advised to attack Cuba and decided against it.

Here is a link to the Rice University speech.

http://nootrope.net/kennedy.html

( there is an audio link once you get to this page)

Since 1963 ,books,television programs.etc. Something for these conspiracy buffs to profit off of the death of late President. Men like Herschal Womack and Jack White tell you it wasn't Oswald in the back yard photos! Who the hell was it? Oswald would be proud of his name in the history books. That's all he ever wanted! Larry Flint's offer still stands. Solve the JFK assassination and he will pay you $1,000,000 . As for me,yes I wish there was a conspiracy. There is no forensic evidence to prove otherwise! Prove me wrong.

Thank you Jack for your work on the backyard photos. I bought your tape second hand for a few bucks on Ebay a long time ago. It is great you have it online for free now.

Besides the fact that no one would produce such self incriminating material on one's self, ( common sense) , you can see the head is larger in the picture and not that of Oswald.

Speaking of Lee Oswald, I think the movie, " Executive Action" shows the framing of Lee Oswald , and the shot sequence very well.

Lee Oswald and David Ferrie together.