Robert Prudhomme Posted October 15, 2014 Share Posted October 15, 2014 Hello Pat I began reading, from your website, Chapter 2b: The Secret Service Secrets, and came upon an amazing piece of information. I tried to send you a PM to ask several questions about this but you have your PM's blocked. Would you mind terribly if we discussed this information in the open forum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Speer Posted October 15, 2014 Share Posted October 15, 2014 Hello Pat I began reading, from your website, Chapter 2b: The Secret Service Secrets, and came upon an amazing piece of information. I tried to send you a PM to ask several questions about this but you have your PM's blocked. Would you mind terribly if we discussed this information in the open forum? I'm fairly proud of that chapter because I came across a lot of stuff that other researchers swimming in the same pool, such as Purvis and Livingstone, missed entirely. Feel free to ask away. I hope I have the answer. (I didn't realize the PMs are blocked. I'll try to figure out what's going on.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Prudhomme Posted October 16, 2014 Author Share Posted October 16, 2014 Hello Pat You did indeed come up with some unique material. The one thing that fascinates me the most is the diagram, right at the beginning of Chapter 2b, accompanying the article "A Matter of Degrees". I would like to post the diagram here, for the benefit of the other members and guests but, unfortunately, I have never been able to make the cut and paste function work on this forum. Perhaps I could get you to post the diagram? Anyways, the diagram relates to something I have long wondered about and, being so far from Dealey Plaza here in northern Canada, have been completely unable to determine for myself. This something is the lateral or horizontal angle from the SE corner of the TSBD to the two positions it is believed by some that JFK was wounded at; namely, those positions that correspond to the limo's location at z210-220 and z313 in the Zapruder film. Of course, these angles would be measured from a longitudinal line running down the centreline of the limo. The one and only time I was in Dealey Plaza, in 1996, I was in a bit of a rush as I was catching a Greyhound bus just a block or two away to a horseshoeing school just south of Oklahoma City. I wish I had made more time available, as it would have been a simple matter of purchasing a compass and measuring the bearings for myself. Subtracting one from the other would have given me the angles from the SN. Your diagram shows two different surveys of Dealey Plaza with bullet trajectories from the SN marked in. The first is a map from page 118 of CD5, the FBI's report of 11-30-63; prepared from information provided by Secret Service Agent John Joe Howlett. It shows a lateral angle of 27° for the first shot although it does not say which frame of the Z film this corresponds to. It then shows an angle of 17° for the last shot, and I would assume this corresponds to z313 of the Z film. The other map is listed as document 4074-001 in Box 11, Folder 51 of the Dallas Municipal Archives, later CE 585, and is the plat created for the 12-5-63 Secret Service re-enactment. It shows, in place of the 27° and 17° trajectories, new trajectories for the same shots at 11° and 8°, respectively. It also shows the TSBD somewhat closer to Elm St., and the "island" in front of the TSBD steps truncated and shrunk some distance to the west. Well, I imagine you have likely already figured out what my question is. Has any unbiased researcher ever taken the time to measure these angles for himself (or herself), to determine which if these maps is accurate? As it is unlikely either the TSBD or Elm St. have moved in the last 50 years, this should be a fairly straightforward task. If I lived a little closer, I would do it myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Speer Posted October 16, 2014 Share Posted October 16, 2014 When I came across the first map showing the trajectories, and realized the angles were different than on the later plats, I had a friend who was visiting Dallas do an approximate measurement as he crossed Elm. He confirmed the measurements of the latter-day plats. I've been to Dallas several times since, and can confirm that the configuration of the TSBD and Elm is similar to the latter-day plats, which I now assume to be accurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Prudhomme Posted October 16, 2014 Author Share Posted October 16, 2014 Thanks, Pat. I was starting to come to the same conclusion. I've been looking at photos and maps of Dealey Plaza and nowhere does the "island" between the two Elms extend past the beginning of the front steps of the TSBD, nor is it ever shown nearly as wide as in the first map. The real clincher came when I went back to the photos taken from the SN during the re-enactment. Oh well, the angles would have been the ruin of the SBT, and then what would we do for fun? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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