Can Somebody Please Identify Anyone Other Than Lovelady, Williams, and Arce In These Two Film Clips?

[Thomas Graves]

Dear members,

Please help me to identify anyone other than Billy Lovelady, Bonnie Ray Williams, and Danny Arce in either of these two clips.

Or, for that matter, point out people who are in either of these two clips and also in some other photograph or film. e.g. Altgens 6 or the Nix film?

Thank you!

From a Robin Unger post # 142 on the "Neweusem Displays Oswald's Shirt" thread:

Martin / Hughes film sync TSBD doorway Credit: Gerda Dunckel

Give the Gif time to load

--Tommy

PS For example, could that be DPD Inspector J. Herbert Sawyer wearing the brown jacket and the white hat in the very near foreground of the Hughes clip, or is that guy "just" a taxi driver or something?

PPS Do you agree with Robert Mady that these two clips were "faked" or "staged" at a later date in order to make it look like Lovelady was wearing his long sleeved, mostly-red "plaid" shirt on 11/22/63?

Edited March 18, 2015 by Thomas Graves

[Greg Parker]

Was it Jarman or Norman who told the HSCA interviewer that they weren't happy about the fact that the cops pushed them back in, but let Oswald go...?

[John Dolva]

Guy in white cap, brown/yellow jacket/coat : traffic cop ?

[Thomas Graves]

Was it Jarman or Norman who told the HSCA interviewer that they weren't happy about the fact that the cops pushed them back in, but let Oswald go...?

It was Jarman, Greg. We do not know exactly what was happening on the steps, why Williams is left where he is whilst either Jarman or Norman are dragged back inside. Timestamping this film is difficult because of the mess left behind by the three of them concerning their movements. This could be 3-4 minutes after the assassination or it could be much longer.

I don't know it this helps, but we do know that Bonnie Ray Williams, Danny Arce, and Bill Shelley were taken away in a police car for questioning at some point.

If that event could be time stamped, it might help us to narrow down the period of time during which the Martin and Hughes clips (showing Lovelady, et al. in front of the TSBD after the assassination) were shot.

--Tommy

[John Dolva]

See the shadow on the side of the entrance. Thta is cast by a straight edge of knowable size,orientation and location (lat, long) on a flat plane of knowable size, orientaion and location by a point of light of a yet to be determined relative location.

Using suntables of the day and geometry and trigonometry it may be possible to determine where that point of light must have been in order to cast that shadow, and hence the time on thet day.

edit clarity et.c. and : Sorrry Lee, a bit busy. Just saying it seems doable to me. I spent time on all films years ago going through frame by frame doing panoramas and alignment corrections. Nice to see others doing the same now. Re this method it was pointed out to me in a PM ny GM when timing the Bell film portion shot from the Terminal Annex. Seems obvious now.

add : Also I remember that Frank and I used whole films to time events. If one back/forward tracks frames of paralell films it's possible to find other timestampable events and thus come to know times of other events (in many instances down to seconds, knowing film speeds). We did set about creating tables that dealt with connecting all films but didn't finish. Doable though. I can see the value of having such in this instance.

Edited March 19, 2015 by John Dolva

[Thomas Graves]

See the shadow on the side of the entrance. Thta is cast by a straight edge of knowable size and orientation on a flat plane of knowable size and orientaion by a point of light, to be determined, location.

Using suntables of the day and it may be possible to determine where that point of light must have been in order to cast that shadow, and henmce the time on thet day.

Knock yourself out, John. I can just about tell the time on a clock.

Can any of the women in the clips be identified? If so, were they interviewed or did they give testimony?

--Tommy