David Von Pein

And, of course, we can also go back earlier in the Z-Film and find many more frames which show the "blackness" on the back of JFK's head BEFORE he was even shot in the head. Here's just one example below--frame 275. And what about Roy Kellerman too? His head looks pretty black here as well. Does that mean Kellerman's head has been "blacked out" by film-fakers in Z275?....

Fabulous. It's now getting harder to keep up with the revised "new" theory that conspiracy theorists will now have to embrace in order to keep their "Blacked Out Head" theory alive and well. Here's the latest revision.... "JFK's and Clint Hill's and Nellie Connally's heads (and maybe a lot more heads too that nobody has even noticed yet) have been artificially blacked out in all post-Z313 frames of the Zapruder Film. Plus, JFK's head has also been artificially blacked out in frame 312, which is one-eighteenth of a second BEFORE he was even hit in the head by any bullet."

Thanks, Robin. The comments I made in Post 40 can now be revised as follows.... "So, from now on, whenever Ron Ecker and all other conspiracy theorists talk about this topic, the "New and Revised" theory has got to be this.... JFK's and Clint Hill's and Nellie Connally's heads (and maybe a lot more heads too that nobody has even noticed yet) have been artificially blacked out in all post-Z313 frames of the Zapruder Film. So, as we can see here, a dumb theory can easily snowball out of control." -- DVP; 5/21/2015

The back wound IS where it IS, Cliff. And there's nothing on this green Earth that either you or I can do to change the location of the ONE AND ONLY BULLET HOLE in John Fitzgerald Kennedy's upper back. It's right here in the autopsy picture below---for all to see 24/7. But, for some reason, you think it's much more reasonable to rely on the holes in the movable clothing of JFK to pinpoint the exact spot of the bullet's entry. Go figure. ~big shrug~ ....

The clothes! The clothes! ALWAYS the clothes! NOTHING else matters! Only the garments!

It's always all about the clothes, isn't it Cliff? The case lives or dies by the jacket and the shirt, right? Even though you know that the jacket and the shirt are MOVABLE OBJECTS on the body of John F. Kennedy.

Oh, really? "PROVEN AS FAKE", eh? Please tell me HOW the BY pics were "proven" to be fake, Ken. Of course, Kenneth Drew will do what most CTers do---he'll just totally ignore the following determinations reached by the HSCA.... "A comparison of the relative lengths of parts of the alleged assassination rifle that is in the National Archives with corresponding parts of what purports to be that rifle as shown in various photographs taken in 1963 indicates that the dimensions of the rifle(s) depicted are entirely consistent. .... A comparison of identifying marks that exist on the rifle as shown in photographs today with marks shown on the rifle in photographs taken in 1963 indicates both that the rifle in the Archives is the same weapon that Oswald is shown holding in the backyard picture and the same weapon, found by Dallas police, that appears in various postassassination photographs." -- 6 HSCA 66 "The panel detects no evidence of fakery in any of the backyard picture materials." -- 6 HSCA 146 And would that include the J.D. Tippit murder as well, Ken? (Even though your favorite patsy named Oswald was caught red-handed with the Tippit murder weapon in his very own hands just 35 minutes after Tippit was murdered?) jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2010/06/hilarious-defense-of-oswald.html jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2011/04/index.html#JD-Tippit

Once again, we're treated to Cliff Varnell assigning ludicrous levels of presumed spot-on accuracy to things that nobody can know with 100% certainty by merely looking at a photograph (such as the Croft photo) --- such as the EXACT amount of "bunching" of JFK's clothing. But Cliff pretends he can extrapolate perfect, to-the-millimeter "bunching" measurements JUST by looking at the photos. In a word --- Ridiculous.

Oh, so you DO think Brennan can be seen in the Zapruder Film at the time of the head shot, eh? Please show me that frame of the film which shows Brennan sitting on the wall as JFK was getting shot in the head. I'm really anxious to see that. And, btw, Brennan's affidavit was not written "some days later" either. It was written by Brennan himself on 11/22/63, the day the event happened.

John Connally had his brains blown out in Dealey Plaza on November 22, 1963? Gee, that's news to me. My comment above about frame 227 has nothing to do with John Kennedy having his brains blown out. I was focusing exclusively on Connally's reactions in the pre-Z227 frames of the Zapruder Film when I made that statement. The discussion that James Gordon and I were having had nothing at all to do with the fatal shot to JFK's head. Do you need better reading glasses, Kenneth? (I just bought half-a-dozen extra pairs last month for a really good low price. You can have a pair if you need them.)

And so you think we can actually SEE Howard Brennan throughout the ENTIRE Zapruder Film? Is that it, Kenneth? You'd better go and have another look at the Z-Film, because the last frame where Brennan is visible in the film is Z207 or Z208, which is more than 100 frames before the head shot. This is embarrassing to even have to respond to such provably wrong garbage. But the person who should be even more embarrassed is Kenneth Drew, for even suggesting that the Zapruder Film provides proof that Howard Brennan was not looking at the Book Depository "at the time of the shooting". Brennan's testimony is quite clear -- he saw the TSBD gunman fire the LAST shot at the President.... "I was looking at the man in this window at the time of the last explosion." -- Howard L. Brennan; 11/22/63 Affidavit And Brennan said the same thing in his Warren Commission testimony.

I just wanted to see DVP use the word "silly" again. Well, Ron, If you keep posting stuff like you just did in this thread, you're likely to see that word a whole lot more.

No matter how deep into the pit of never-ending conspiracy and "alteration" Ron has to go in order to endorse an impossible theory, he's apparently willing to go there. And I'll bet a lot of other CTers are willing to go there too. Thanks, Ron. Your posts in the thread are a perfect example of CTer desperation on full display.

I provided a reason. It's in Post 31. You just don't like my explanation, that's all. .... "So, quite obviously, since the back of JFK's head is still dark in Z340, it must mean that the back of his head is still deep enough in shadow so that the sunlight is not directly shining on that part of his cranium."

Thank you, Ron! Perfect timing! After writing my last post, I was hoping and praying that some CTer on here would post something that says, in effect, the alleged film-fakers DID, indeed, ALSO alter Clint Hill's head in the Zapruder Film. As we can see via Ron Ecker's last post, when a really silly idea gets started (like the theory about JFK's head being "blacked out" in the Z-Film), and when the silliness of that idea is brought to the forefront by someone (which I have done in this discussion), then the conspiracy theorists are forced to do a lot of scrambling and damage control in order to still embrace and endorse the silly idea they want to endorse. So, from now on, whenever Ron Ecker and all other conspiracy theorists talk about this topic, the "New and Revised" theory has got to be this.... Both JFK's and Clint Hill's heads (and maybe a lot more heads too that nobody has even noticed yet) have been artificially blacked out in all post-Z313 frames of the Zapruder Film. So, as we can see here, a dumb theory can easily snowball out of control. Over and out.

Thanks for the close-up of Clint Hill in Z340, Robin. And I realize that we're looking at Hill in that Z-frame through the sprocket holes, which makes things a little "hazier" (if that's the right word) when looking at objects in that part of the film strip, but that "looking through the sprocket holes" fact doesn't change the BLACKNESS that is most definitely apparent on the back of Clint Hill's head. And, to emphasize again --- Since no plotter or conspirator bent on altering or faking the Zapruder Film would possibly have had any need or desire to alter any part of Clint Hill's image in the film, then I think even most conspiracy believers would agree with me that the "blackness" that we see at the back of Clint Hill's head in frame 340 is legitimate, unaltered blackness being seen on his head. Therefore, since Hill's "blackness" is real and legit in Z340, then why would anybody think that the similar "blackness" at the back of President Kennedy's head in Z317 (which is just 1.25 seconds earlier than Z340 in the very same home movie) is blackness that must have been added to the film by some unknown film-fakers? It's time to stamp the "blacked out head" theory with this label --- DEBUNKED!

Obviously you're wrong, because the back of JFK's head does not have the noonday sun shining directly on it. But I've got a question for you, Robert.... Do you think the back of JFK's head has been artificially "blacked out" in this Z-Film frame?....

I never sleep, Bob. The bigwigs at Langley have been cracking the whip lately. All CIA Disinfo agents are now on call 24/7. It's a bitch. I even have to beg for my meals.

Mighty weak, Bob. The two pictures in my comparison are only 1.25 seconds apart in real time. Do you really think the degree of blackness (due to shadow) is going to have changed THAT much in just 1.25 seconds? Plus, as I mentioned before, many CTers think JFK's head has been "blacked out" in ALL post-Z313 frames. (Of course they think that. It would be kind of silly to believe in the "blacked out" theory and yet believe that only SOME Z-frames showing the back of Kennedy's head AFTER the head shot have been blacked out. Right?) So my comparison of the Z317 and Z340 frames is perfectly appropriate, given what many CTers believe about ALL of the post-Z313 frames depicting JFK's head. And as can be plainly seen in Z340, the back of Clint Hill's head is pitch black....just exactly like Kennedy's head in Z317. And the only difference that I can see in the two men's position (relating to the sun in the sky) is that Hill's head is turned a little more to his right (north) in Z340 than JFK's head is in Z317. So, quite obviously, since the back of JFK's head is still dark in Z340, it must mean that the back of his head is still deep enough in shadow so that the sunlight is not directly shining on that part of his cranium. Try again, Bob. Maybe your next theory will make more sense. Because my Hill/JFK comparison photo destroys the "blacked out" theory, IMO.

In this comparison I made below of the head positions of Secret Service agent Clint Hill and JFK, it doesn't look to me as if Hill's head is in a position (relative to the sun) that is all that much different than JFK's head position. Does it? And yet I see the same blackness appearing at the back of both of their heads. And with respect to the Z317 frame shown here of President Kennedy's head, I've heard many conspiracy theorists say that they think JFK's head has most certainly been artificially "blacked out" here.... Looks like one more conspiracy myth debunked by merely examining other parts of the same allegedly "altered" Zapruder home movie.

What's causing the same kind of "blackness" to appear on the back of Clint Hill's head in the very same Z-Film frame? Was Hill's head "blacked out" by the conspirators too?....

That's been blatantly obvious for days now.

Yes, I know that. I answered anyway. Is that against forum rules now?

But James.... Once we get to the blurry frame 227, it's all over with anyway. I.E., Connally's already been hit and he has ALREADY reacted back there in the clearer frames (Z224-225-226). So what makes the difference whether Z227 is clear or not? The cat's already out of the bag (so to speak). Connally's already been wounded prior to Z227, and he is visibly REACTING to being hit by the bullet in the clearer frames (Z224-226). So you can have Z227. I sure as heck don't need that frame to prove my point regarding John Connally's reactions. Because it's all over and done with by Z226.

Amen, Mark. And this slo-mo GIF shows Connally's initial involuntary reactions even better (this clip ends at Z225, before the arm/hat flip starts)..... And then, just one frame later, the arm/hat flip at Z226, which just happens to be the EXACT same frame when President Kennedy starts raising his right arm too. The right arms of the two victims who were shot that day are jerking upward simultaneously. If this isn't a good solid indication that both Kennedy and Connally were hit by the very same bullet, then what is? .... jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2013/02/sbt-clips.html single-bullet-theory.blogspot.com/#Debating-The-SBT