David Von Pein

What was my "fib", Bart? Just because the "chatter" is there, so what? That's supposed to mean the LNers are sunk??? Get real, man. Your theories are anything but "real" right now.

Yeah, Joe, looks like it's time for Langley to dig deep and dish up another hefty raise for Francois and myself, huh? Our dastardly job of "obscuring the new evidence" is surely worth a few more bucks, right?

It's done nothing to the LNers. I chose to post in this thread mainly to add some more stuff to my archives at my website. (So I thank you for that.) But to the "Prayer Man" CTers, this "P. Parade" find is apparently like the Holy Grail. But even if the handwritten notes were written by James Hosty (and they probably were; I'm not arguing that they weren't), then IMO it's just another in a long list of lies being uttered by Lee Oswald after he was arrested. My goodness, are LNers supposed to now fold up their tents and go home whimpering because another lie has been discovered coming from the lips of Lee Harvey Oswald (assuming LHO actually did say those exact words about going outside to watch the "P. Parade")? LNers didn't fold their tents after seeing that Oswald told Fritz he was on the first floor (and not the sixth) at the time of JFK's murder. So why would LNers now decide that this new revelation discovered by Malcolm Blunt in the National Archives is revealing something TRUTHFUL being spoken by Oswald? That'd be crazy. So, nothing's changed for Lone Assassin believers. Nothing at all. The hard evidence of Oswald's guilt in both the JFK and Tippit murders doesn't suddenly stop being in existence just because of one additional lie being told by the assassin himself. To think otherwise is to be mired in the "Prayer Man" garbage, which is where "Wishful Thinking" and a reference to "P. Parade" will now merge to provide the "PM" disciples with something to make them feel that their fantasy about Oswald being on the TSBD steps has now turned into reality. But, at most, all that's been "discovered" is just one more lie being told by a World Class L-i-a-r named Oswald.

So, Andrej, you must think Roy Truly and Marrion Baker were l-i-a-r-s then, right? Both men corroborated each other about encountering Oswald on the 2nd floor just after the shooting. But you think they BOTH lied their tails off??? Please tell me why they'd each do something like that?

How on Earth can we possibly KNOW all of those details from such a poor-quality image? Answer --- We can't know. And "colour of his hair"?? From a black-and-white film clip?? Come now.

You know, Tony, that's an interesting point you just brought up. I don't think I've ever heard this discussed before --- i.e., whether Oswald himself was ever asked any of the questions that the eyewitnesses and earwitnesses were all asked --- e.g., How many shots (if any) did you hear?, Where did the shots come from?, Did you see any strangers in the building?, etc. As far as I am aware, Oswald was never subjected to that type of "witness" questioning. But I think it would be fascinating to hear Oswald's answers to such questions. It makes me curious as to what type of lies he would have come up with if Captain Fritz had dished up those kinds of questions for Oswald to answer. But even if Oswald were totally innocent, we can be pretty certain that he definitely was aware, even before he left the building, that the President had been shot (or at least shot at). And the reason we can know that Oswald knew this fact is because TSBD employee Mrs. Robert Reid told Oswald "the President has been shot, but maybe they didn't hit him". (That sentence, as phrased by Mrs. Reid, makes no sense whatsoever, of course. But that's what Reid said she said to Oswald on the second floor within minutes of the shooting. It's likely, though, that Reid probably meant to say the word "kill" instead of "hit".) Well, Tony, you have to remember that my opinion about the statements that Lee Harvey Oswald made to Captain Fritz are totally different from the opinions of most conspiracy theorists when it comes to evaluating those exact same statements uttered by LHO. (That is, if you're inclined to believe that Oswald made any such "I was on the first floor" statement to Fritz in the first place, which many CTers do not believe; they think Fritz just made up all, or most, of Oswald's statements.) My opinion is (and has been for decades) that Oswald was lying through his teeth when he told Captain J.W. Fritz that he was on the first floor having his lunch about the time of the assassination, because I firmly believe (based on a whole bunch of evidence in the case) that he was up on Floor #6 firing three rifle shots at the President. So if you're trying to get me to look at Oswald's utterances from the POV of Lee being a completely innocent patsy and being on the first floor enjoying a leisurely lunch at 12:30 on Nov. 22, I won't be able to help you much there. Because the evidence indicates to me quite the opposite.

But, Tony, Oswald's response to the reporters in the TV news film generally matches the alibi that Oswald gave to Dallas Police Captain Will Fritz that same day, with Oswald telling Fritz that he was "having his lunch about that time [of the assassination] on the first floor" (Warren Report; Pg. 600). Fritz never said that Oswald told him that he was "out with Bill Shelley in front" or "standing on the top step in front of the building with Wesley Frazier" as the assassination was taking place. Oswald specifically said that he was inside the building on the first floor (which was a big fat lie, of course). But, per CTers, I guess I'm supposed to believe that Captain Fritz was the person telling a bunch of lies, instead of Mr. Oswald. But the main point I always stress to CTers when this topic comes up is.... When given several chances to shout out to the world (via the live television cameras and microphones that were being shoved in his face on both November 22nd and 23rd at Dallas City Hall), Lee Harvey Oswald never uttered a word about being on the front steps of the Book Depository at precisely 12:30 PM on November 22. Don't you think that's mighty strange if Lee Oswald had, in fact, been located on those steps when JFK was being killed?

Even though I have posted NOTHING that is against any of the rules of this forum --- and you damn well know it! But, I should be banished anyway....for providing my anti-conspiracy opinion (coupled with facts and citations and videos of Oswald saying the things he said, etc.). Right? You CTers have a unique (i.e., very strange) way of looking at things. Mr. Pot and Mrs. Kettle would be oh so pleased with the hypocrisy that conspiracy theorists exhibit here on a daily basis. It's downright hilarious.

Certainly not. Civilians Johnny Brewer and George Applin were also witnesses to Oswald's actions inside the theater. http://dvp-potpourri.blogspot.com/2010/07/johnny-brewer.html http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/applin.htm Is it the list that supposedly "mysteriously vanished"? Or the witnesses themselves? ~shrug~ But how is that relevant to whether or not Oswald pulled a gun on the cops and fought with them? ~another shrug~ Again, what's the relevance to my question? Who cares? (And, again, what's the relevance to my inquiry?) You like the cloak-and-dagger spy stuff, don't you? And I don't think your "Oswald Was Innocent" side is even in the race. Oswald's very own actions are providing ample proof of his guilt.

And yet not a single one of his co-workers who we know WERE standing on the steps said a word about seeing Oswald right there by them on the steps. How come? Were all of those fellow workers blind? Or were they all trying to frame him?

So, let me ask you this.... Do you think Lee Oswald pulled a gun on the cops and fought with those cops in the theater?

Keep it up, Bart. (Please.) The moderators are watching.

Tough. You don't get to decide when and where I post. And what I've posted in this thread is certainly not "BS". I've posted the WHOLE Oswald "Patsy" statement for all to hear! And he clearly says he was IN the building "at the time" of the shooting....not OUTSIDE the building. But CTers will do their pretzel act and twist things to conform to their Prayer Man speculation, even though Oswald never ONCE told anybody that he was ON THE STEPS at 12:30----even though he had MANY opportunities to do so on both Nov. 22 and Nov. 23.

I love it when CTers decide to put their ordinary common sense on hold as they try to pretend that this entryway is actually INSIDE the Book Depository Building. Ridiculous....

Yeah, why would the cops bother to apprehend a guy who was fighting wildly with the police while waving a gun around in a movie theater? Officer McDonald, after getting his face all scratched up by Oswald's revolver, should have merely shaken his finger at Sweet Lee and said "Don't do that again, okay?", and then just let Oswald go......right?

Good attitude. I'm sure the moderators just love you to death!

So, Jim, I guess you must think that Buell Frazier and Billy Lovelady and Bill Shelley were really INSIDE the building when they were watching the motorcade, huh? And WHY are you totally ignoring what Oswald told the press in my above video? Looks to me like my cannon fired much farther than yours. Better try again, Jimmy. Because Oswald's own words are sinking the "Prayer Man" ship.

I have "no right to be in here"??? WTF? Who the heck do you think you are? Geesh.

Where?

Reality Interjection.... As I've said before, nobody who was standing on the TSBD steps at the time of JFK's assassination would have claimed they were "in the building". And that's because, of course, the steps of the Depository are clearly OUTSIDE the front entrance to the building. But Oswald HIMSELF admitted multiple times that he was INSIDE the building at the time of the shooting, including his statement to the press on live TV at 7:55 PM CST on Nov. 22 (below).

A Blast From The Past (from 10 years ago).... "There are many conspiracy theorists who think that the wallet seen in Ron Reiland's WFAA-TV film footage was "planted" on Tenth Street by evil conspirators in order to frame Lee Harvey Oswald for Officer J.D. Tippit's murder. One such conspiracy theorist is James DiEugenio, who was talking about Oswald's alleged "three wallets" during his appearance on the "Black Op Radio" program that first aired on December 24, 2009. But do people like Jim DiEugenio actually want to believe that the Dallas Police Department, after having found a wallet on 10th Street that some conspiracists think was planted there by either the DPD or somebody else, would have NOT SAID A WORD about finding Oswald's wallet in any of their police reports? And keep in mind that the Dallas Police Department is an organization that DiEugenio and other conspiracy theorists certainly think was trying to railroad and frame an innocent Lee Oswald for Tippit's murder! And yet the DPD says absolutely NOTHING in any of their official reports about finding a wallet near Tippit's body that belonged to the person the DPD later arrested and charged with the murder of Tippit?? That's just nuts, folks! If the cops (or whoever) had actually planted the wallet on Tenth Street to incriminate Lee Oswald, then the DPD would certainly have been propping up that wallet for everybody to see! The fact that NO POLICE REPORT mentions anything about a wallet being found near Tippit's body is, all by itself, proof that the wallet that is seen in Ron Reiland's TV film is not Lee Harvey Oswald's wallet. And even conspiracy theorists like Jim DiEugenio (who thinks the DPD was up to its collective necks in conspiracy and plotting and planting evidence all over Dallas on 11/22/63) should realize the built-in common sense and truth that exists in the last sentence I just wrote above. BTW, one of those "three" Oswald wallets that DiEugenio was talking about is a wallet that Oswald was known to keep his "savings" in (vs. his regular wallet that he carried with him every day). That fact is proven by way of Marina Oswald's Warren Commission testimony below: MARINA OSWALD -- "In my room at Ruth Paine's there was a black wallet in a wardrobe. Whenever Lee would come he would put money in there, but I never counted it." [1 H 69] In addition to the above Warren Commission testimony, the "spare wallet" fact is confirmed in another official document as well -- a November 28, 1963, FBI interview with Marina Oswald (which is part of CE1781): "She [Marina] said [Lee] OSWALD had a wallet which he kept in the apartment in New Orleans with this money that he was saving." [CE1781; at 23 H 387] And since we know beyond all reasonable doubt that the wallet seen in Ron Reiland's film is not Oswald's wallet, the final tally of wallets known to be owned by Lee Harvey Oswald on 11/22/63 is two -- his regular wallet that he carried with him (which was removed from Oswald's pocket by police immediately after his arrest), plus the wallet that he used to store larger sums of cash." -- DVP; December 2009

More about "The Wallet".... "One thing we can be reasonably certain about: the wallet was not Oswald’s. .... Furthermore, a Dallas police officer had just been slain. It is inconceivable that members of the Dallas Police Department like Captains Westbrook and Doughty and Sergeant Hill would suppress and keep secret the fact that Tippit’s killer had left his calling card at the murder scene. That simply would not, could not, have happened. If Oswald’s wallet had been found at the murder scene, it is inconceivable that nowhere in the testimony or the reports of Westbrook, Hill, Doughty, Poe, and so on, would they bother to mention this extremely important fact." -- Vincent Bugliosi

CTers like to jump to unprovable conclusions, don't they? And if a wallet with the names "Lee Harvey Oswald" and "Alek James Hidell" in it had really been found at the site of J.D. Tippit's murder, then ANYONE who was (allegedly) framing Oswald---whether it be the CIA or the Dallas Police Department or Stafford, Indiana, Police Lieutenant Philip Gerard (from "The Fugitive")---of course would have been shouting "We found Oswald's wallet next to Tippit's body!" to the world. And they would have simply made the other wallet "disappear" (the one taken from LHO in the police car). That's as obvious as can be. But it's fun to watch you CTers tie yourselves into pretzels as you try to explain to the world why the cops wouldn't want to reveal that LHO's wallet was found on 10th Street (especially within the framework of the usual conspiracy theory that has the DPD framing the man whose wallet was allegedly found). It's similar to the amusement that can be derived from listening to conspiracy theorists as they try to explain why the "real" assassins in Dealey Plaza decided to complicate their plot to an absurd degree by shooting at JFK from the Grassy Knoll, even though they were attempting to set up a patsy in the Book Depository Building. It's hilarious---especially Mr. Lifton's "sophisticated strategic deception" malarkey. But, Sandy, it's nice to know that you don't think the Dallas Police Department framed Lee Oswald for any murder in 1963 (not even J.D. Tippit's) --- "...it was the CIA framing Oswald, not the DPD." -- S. Larsen; 2/7/19 You're certainly in the vast minority at this forum when it comes to that particular issue. (I wonder if you'll change your mind tomorrow?)

Sandy, There is no proof that Westbrook had Oswald's wallet at the Tippit murder scene. And if Oswald's wallet HAD been found right there at the murder scene, why on Earth wouldn't the cops (who were FRAMING OSWALD, according to you) have wanted to shout that fact to the world?! It makes no sense. Lots of good info re the Tippit murder (and "the wallet") can be found at the blog below.... https://jfkfiles.blogspot.com/search?q=Tippit+Westbrook

@David G. Healy.... Just totally ignore the basic common sense and logic that resides within my 5/11/09 quote and only focus on the fact that I quoted myself. Nice tactic.