W. Tracy Parnell
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Posts posted by W. Tracy Parnell
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Now we have Parnell accusing John of lying and fabricating. I am not even going to bother reading this thread until this particular discussion is over. The horse has been long dead.
If I said, "take my word for it" on some matter would you? Of course not.
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Jim Hargrove said:
1. A lot of evidence appears to be missing from this case. Where is an FBI report, or any evidence at all, showing agents actually bothered to ask Al Fowler to identify L'eandes/SR Landesberg (the actor)
I have a better question. Where is the evidence apart from heroin addict Al Fowler's alleged statements that the FBI was even aware of him?
...or interview ANY of the Village Voice reporters who met L'eandes
See page 3 of following from Armstrong's own files:
http://digitalcollections.baylor.edu/cdm/compoundobject/collection/po-arm/id/3420/rec/1
The Secret Service also interviewed Wolf. Goddard later called the FBI back and provided more information.
or speak to any of the nine different people identified, with addresses for each, by Rizutto/SH Landesberg (the student), who Rizutto said knew L'eandes (the actor), with the exception of the actor's former roommate, Michael Dunn?
Information in the FBI Gemberling Report indicates that the FBI spoke to some of these people, although there are no specific reports in the record that I am aware of.
2. There are credible reports indicating different addresses for the two different Landesbergs. L'eandes/SR Landesberg (the future actor) on 8th St. or McDougal St. and Landes/SH Landesberg, the student, who lived at 66 W. 10th St.Two NY newspapers, according to H&L critics, are simply incapable of getting NYC addresses straight.Once again, no one is saying any newspaper could not get addresses right except you. They had unverified reports of 8th and MacDougal Streets. The source of the unverified reports is unknown but the FBI suspected it could be L'Eandes (Landesberg the student) himself using another alias. The verified addresses where L'Eandes (Landesberg the student) lived were:
E. 84th (where his mother reported he lived for a time)
165 E. 49th (where he lived with Dunn)
W. 113th Street (FBI interview)
66 W. 10th (where the FBI finally found him)
3. When the FBI attempted to locate a man named “Regan” who Rizzuto/Landesberg (the student) said paid L'eander (the actor), they bothered to travel all the way to the Roosevelt Hotel in New Orleans, forgetting to visit the Roosevelt Hotel in New York, where Rizzuto said Regan lived. This, we're told, is a perfectly understandable mistake.See:
http://wtracyparnell.com/john-armstrong-and-his-evolving-landesberg-story/#The_Roosevelt_Hotel
4. Rizzuto/Landesberg (the student) told the FBI that Oswald, L'eandes and a man named Earl Perry worked together in New York City in 1961-62 (when Harvey Oswald was in Russia). Perry was from El Paso, Texas and was stationed at Barstow, CA. SA J. Richard Nichols contacted Major Robert C. Whitebread of the USMC in an attempt to locate Earl Perry, who knew L'eandes (the actor) and Oswald. Nichols learned that the only Earl Perry on active duty was assigned to the Marine Supply Center in Barstow, CA., and was from El Paso, TX. But on Nov 26, instead of requesting the military file for Earl Eugene Perry (El Paso, TX), SA Leonard Lewis obtained the file for Earl Sheldon Perry from the Military Personnel Records Center in St. Louis. Earl Sheldon Perry was from Casper, Wyoming, joined the US Army in 1954, and was discharged in 1956. The FBI avoided contacting Earl Eugene Perry from El Paso.
The FBI extensively investigated the issue and called every Perry in the book. There was no Earl Perry from El Paso. They simply looked at the Earl Perry from Casper as part of their investigation.
http://wtracyparnell.com/john-armstrong-and-his-evolving-landesberg-story/#Earl_Perry
5. Many people seem totally unconcerned that all paper court records and backup microfilm records for the arrest and incarceration of Stephen Harris Landesberg (the student) have disappeared. Researchers might want to contact the US District Court House for the Southern District of NY at 40 Foley Square in NYC, to see if the records have reappeard, but I won't hold my breath.
At this point with Armstrong's track record, I am unwilling to take his word for this. But since Landesberg was released after 10 days from Bellevue and the charges eventually dropped, I see no reason to think that the records would show anything sinister. Landesberg has been walking around free for years since then and could have come forward to tell his story. But I think you would find that his silence tells the tale-the FBI had it right and he was just a mentally ill man who tricked the FBI.
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Steve and anyone else trying to change the subject to the FBI,
For the sake of argument, lets say that you're right and the FBI is a horrible entity bent on making the life of the average American a living hell. In my opinion and my opinion alone, that does not give Armstrong the right to falsify sources to make his point. Let him put out factual information and someone like me will not be able to exist to challenge him. Of course, he has a problem already-a 1000 page book that is full of nonsense as most researchers already know. BTW, this thread is not about the FBI it is about John Armstrong and the H&L theory.
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Steve Gaal said:
Award-winning journalist Trevor Aaronson digs deep into the FBI’s massive efforts to create fake terrorist plots.
He is entitled to his opinion too. But you guys are not going to get me to leave Armstrong alone. I am a watchdog, just like your FBI watchdogs. And when he blatantly misrepresents the evidence I will be there. And I am not alone. Solution-tell Armstrong to stop using his current tactics and I will not have anything to report on. I will cease to exist. Let him use actual facts.
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David,
You have your opinion of the FBI, that is fine. I don't agree that the FBI is engaging in fabrication of evidence on a large scale. They have made mistakes as we all do, but none of this gives Armstrong the right to mislead researchers about sources and make unproven claims. If he has a case let him use actual evidence and get rid of the nonsense. Of course, I know that you believe the end justifies any means, but I don't believe that. And that is the type of researcher you are going to attract to this theory. The researchers that demand proof before they believe something, such as several that post here, are not going to be persuaded.
My proposal is this-I look at you and see a man who wants to go out on his own. I would encourage you to do just that. Why sit around all day apologizing for Armstrong's fabrications? You have already done a tremendous amount of work in this case. Go out on your own, but when you do use proper sources and don't lie to people. That is where Armstrong has failed and his assertions are easily disproven by anyone willing to do the work to look into them.
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Jim Hargrove said:
"HARVEY AND LEE" DECLARED DEAD FOR 434TH TIME BY H&L HIT SQUAD
I am not sure who the H&L "hit squad" consists of, but I understand that there is a certain audience that the theory appeals to and that will likely remain the case. I believe for reasonable people that the "Steve Landesberg the actor was L'Eandes" theory is dead. It was very shaky from the start and all that is left is heroin addict and drug dealer Al Fowler's assertions and Armstrong's own story about Golz and please excuse me for this, but I don't consider Armstrong very reliable at this point.
There are credible reports indicating different addresses for the two different Landesbergs. L'eandes/SR Landesberg (the future actor) on 8th St. or McDougal St. and Landes/SH Landesberg, the student, who lived at 66 W. 10th St. Two NY newspapers, according to Hit Squad critics, are simply incapable of getting NYC addresses straight.
No one ever said that any newspaper could not take down an address. I am sure they correctly recorded the information. The facts are that two newspapers reported that sources had told them that the FBI was looking for a man (who turned out to be L'Eandes). This source or sources (sometimes referred to as "a source close to the investigation") provided information-some of which was correct and some was not. For example, there was a report in Asbury's article that the man who turned out to be L'Eandes had been on the Marine Boxing Team and liked to shoot rifles-facts that exist no where else in the record.
Asbury's article states that L'Eandes and Oswald shared a room on Eight Street. But later in the same article using a source that was verified to have known and interacted with L'Eandes (Village Voice) Asbury reports the more likely fact that L'Eandes refused to tell anyone where he lived. Reports, especially early ones, are just that. The record as a whole shows that the people who actually knew and interacted with L'Eandes reported places where he lived (listed in my main article). And none of these are Eighth or MacDougal. But these type of unverified facts are what the H&L theory is made from and continues to exist by and they will always be available.
By the way, the new document found by Tom Scully also relates who the FBI theorized was providing some of the information the newspapers were using-L'Eandes himself using yet another alias. It makes sense because Landesberg the student loved to talk.
When the FBI attempted to locate a man named “Regan,” who Rizzuto/Landesberg (the student) said paid L'eander (the actor), they bothered to travel all the way to the Roosevelt Hotel in New Orleans, forgetting to visit the Roosevelt Hotel in New York, where Rizzuto said Regan lived. This, we're told, is a perfectly understandable mistake.
It is a mistake that wouldn't happen in a perfect world, but the fact that we live in an imperfect one keeps Armstrong alive. The reasonable explanation is the FBI (or more correctly one or more agents) simply assumed that since "Regan" was from Memphis that it made a logical starting point. When that didn't pan out, they shifted to the next known Roosevelt Hotel in the region-New Orleans.
http://wtracyparnell.com/john-armstrong-and-his-evolving-landesberg-story/#The_Roosevelt_Hotel
Rizzuto/Landesberg (the student) told the FBI that Oswald, L'eandes and a man named Earl Perry worked together in New York City in 1961-62 (when Harvey Oswald was in Russia). Perry was from El Paso, Texas and was stationed at Barstow, CA. SA J. Richard Nichols contacted Major Robert C. Whitebread of the USMC in an attempt to locate Earl Perry, who knew L'eandes (the actor) and Oswald. Nichols learned that the only Earl Perry on active duty was assigned to the Marine Supply Center in Barstow, CA., and was from El Paso, TX. But on Nov 26, instead of requesting the military file for Earl Eugene Perry (El Paso, TX), SA Leonard Lewis obtained the file for Earl Sheldon Perry from the Military Personnel Records Center in St. Louis. Earl Sheldon Perry was from Casper, Wyoming, joined the US Army in 1954, and was discharged in 1956. The FBI avoided contacting Earl Eugene Perry from El Paso.I'll make this short and sweet-the FBI conducted an exhaustive investigation. They called every Perry in the El Paso phone book and there was no Earl Perry in the Marines who lived there. They found a man who had a brother named Earl Perry but he never lived in El Paso. The document H&L supporters keep referring to does not have the word "El Paso" and does not say Earl Perry lived there. The only one who said Perry was from El Paso was Rizzuto-end of story.
http://wtracyparnell.com/john-armstrong-and-his-evolving-landesberg-story/#Earl_Perry
Many people seem totally unconcerned that all paper court records and backup microfilm records for the arrest and incarceration of Stephen Harris Landesberg (the student) have disappeared. Researchers might want to contact the US District Court House for the Southern District of NY at 40 Foley Square in NYC, to see if the records have reappeared, but I won't hold my breath.
I don't think the records would show anything at all and I am not sure what amazing fact Armstrong thinks they contain.The new facts are that in addition to the FBI agents, Roger Turner of WMCA identified the photo of L'Eandes as Rizzuto who was actually the student Landesberg. And Barry gray identifed the photo as the man he knew as L'Eandes. Details and chronology here:
http://wtracyparnell.com/latest-armstrong-tale-now-doa/
For the updated complete story of the discredited theory see:
http://wtracyparnell.com/john-armstrong-and-his-evolving-landesberg-story/
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My latest blog post summarizes the new information and corrects minor mistakes:
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This just in-the whole "L'Eandes was the actor Steve Landesberg" theory is dead and buried. The credit goes to researcher Tom Scully who posts at the Deep Politics Forum. The truth is that L'Eandes did appear at the WMCA studio in person in 1961 and when Rizzuto called Barry Gray to remind him of L'Eandes' appearance, he apparently recognized his voice. After the photo of L'Eandes was obtained Gray, Turner and the FBI agents all identified it as "Rizzuto".
https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=62288&search=rizzuto_and+Barry#relPageId=88&tab=page
Here is the actual chronology of the Barry Gray/L'Eandes/Rizzuto affair according to the FBI:
November 17, 1961: Barry Gray interviews L'Eandes on WMCA radio
Time Unknown: James Rizzuto calls Gray and reminds him of L'Eandes appearance on WMCA
November 23, 1963, 1:30 AM: Gray calls the FBI and tells them about Rizzuto
November 23, 1963, Time Unknown: FBI agents interview Barry Gray at WMCA
November 23, 1963, 2:00 AM: Rizzuto calls WMCA and is persuaded to meet with FBI
November 23, 1963, Time Unknown: The FBI meets with Rizzuto at a restaurant on 42nd Street and he is taken to FBI offices for questioning
November 23, 1963, Time Unknown: The FBI interviews Rizzuto who is evasive with his personal details
November 29, 1963: A photo of L'Eandes is obtained and the FBI agents identify Rizzuto as L'Eandes
November 29, 1963: Roger Turner identifies photo of L'Eandes as Rizzuto
November 29, 1963: Barry Gray identifies photo of L'Eandes as Rizzuto
December 5, 1963: FBI agents locate Rizzuto and learn he is Stephen Harris Landesberg
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This just in-the whole "L'Eandes was the actor Steve Landesberg" theory is dead and buried. The credit goes to researcher Tom Scully who posts at the Deep Politics Forum. The truth is that L'Eandes did appear at the WMCA studio in person in 1961 and when Rizzuto called Barry Gray to remind him of L'Eandes' appearance, he may have recognized his voice. After the photo of L'Eandes was obtained Gray, Turner and the FBI agents all identified it as "Rizzuto".
https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=62288&search=rizzuto_and+Barry#relPageId=88&tab=page
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If one reads all the thread its possible to not be .....,gaal
Barking mad...! // Laverick (unrelated people can look alike -try this phrase in GOOGLE,some below,gaal)
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I notice no one will answer Tommy's poignant question. What did 'Lee' tell his friends and family whilst 'Harvey' was in the USSR? // Laverick (per H & L book the family is IN on it, moved around a lot, NEW friends didn't know about Russian LHO. A truly poignant idea is reading and retaining the material presented in the H & L book which is this threads theme. gaal)
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AS long as LEE didn't get photographed/filmed in a public source, then LEE could do things like incriminating Castro gun running , ect. gaal
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Portraits of People Who Look Alike But Aren’t Related At All
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http://petapixel.com...related-at-all/
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40 People Who Look So Much Like Celebrities It’s Scary
http://www.buzzfeed....ties#.ixlZzrEqK
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
the why of it
We have the answer then, the whole family was in on it along with any friends etc. Looks like I am going to have to update my list of those involved in the plot. But I wonder how they could be certain about the LHO in Russia. The story was carried in the press after all.
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This just in-Armstrong has been caught using a bogus source for the second time in his new article that alleges "L'Eandes" was the actor Steve Landesberg.
http://wtracyparnell.com/the-3-am-interview/
My question to H&L supporters-is Armstrong going to correct this article any time soon? And how do you guys justify this?
Bumping this to make sure all see it.
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Steve,
Maybe one of the H&L supporters will take on the challenge using some of the images you provided.
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Steve,
OK, find any two different people in the world and using the techniques you mentioned make a composite image for us.
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Steve,
Photoshop didn't exist when your composite image was allegedly created. So if you want to make an image using my photo go ahead but it won't prove anything.
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As I look over the 1st 5 pages of threads, you haven't bothered to start a single one presenting what you think from work you've done...
have you brought to light anything new or interesting?
Maybe the blog you linked us to?
Mission StatementI believe the evidence shows that Lee Harvey Oswald is guilty of the crime of assassinating President John F. Kennedy. The goal of this website is to present articles and other information that will refute conspiracy theories and clarify facts.
oh..
{sigh}
Got it. One who has Faith. A WCR apologist refutes H&L...
My bad, didn't consider the source.
Take care Tracy.... and good luck with that Mission of yours...
The recent and past work I have done has been about showing the theory of H&L is incorrect so that researchers regardless of their position can use that information. I have been thanked by many CT researchers although some might not admit it. Regardless of where an individual stands on the assassination, truth is truth and a lie is a lie. Unfortunately, Armstrong has been caught in many lies (which is what using an incorrect source is-a form of a lie) over the years and 2 from his latest article. Those fibs kill two of his main points-that Rizzuto knew two separate individuals, namely the student and the actor and that L'Eandes had a red beard and therefore could have been the actor.
My questions stand:
When is Armstrong going to rewrite his article to get rid of these bad references?
Why do H&L supporters continue to look the other way and allow him to use these tactics?
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This just in-Armstrong has been caught using a bogus source for the second time in his new article that alleges "L'Eandes" was the actor Steve Landesberg.
http://wtracyparnell.com/the-3-am-interview/
My question to H&L supporters-is Armstrong going to correct this article any time soon? And how do you guys justify this?
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Thomas suggested a thread called the two Marguerites. I agree. The H and L theory hinges on their being two very different Marguerite Oswalds. Let's see it!!!
I am working on a blog post that we can use to start just such a thread.
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Paul,
I would also like to see a documented, verifiable timeline for the life of the mysterious "Lee Oswald."
David Josephs has an Excel spreadsheet, perhaps he would make it available even to those of us who doubt the theory?
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Thomas Graves said:
BTW -- What do you think about the two points I made about the general implausibility of the H & L theory?
I'll add one to the list. The H&L theory says that two guys who looked alike but were not twins had their photos put together to make one ID. I say that is not only unlikely-it is impossible and I challenge them to provide an example.
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David,
What we have here is a matter of perception. Where you see a willful act of manipulation I tend to see mistakes. And the mistakes that are a part of everyday life are what the Harvey & Lee theory is built on. And in Oswald's case because of his strange past (moving so many times, defecting to Russia, etc.) there were more opportunities for mistakes and oddities.
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Another mystery solved with a reasonable explanation-this time why the FBI went to NO instead of NYC. I have updated my article with the following:
Wrong. The FBI simply did something that Armstrong doesn't believe ever happens in the real world-they made a mistake and sent agents to the wrong Roosevelt Hotel. However, I located a document https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=62262&search=%22roosevelt_hotel%22#relPageId=74&tab=page at the Mary Ferrell website that reveals why they went to New Orleans. One FBI report of the Rizzuto interview clearly says the hotel was in New York. But another report doesn't mention the location although "NYC" was written in sometime later. Because "Regan" was ostensibly from Memphis, someone at the FBI, apparently working from the second document without the New York reference, assumed that the Roosevelt Hotel was in Memphis as well. So they checked Memphis first.
The document goes on to say that no Roosevelt Hotel was located in Memphis and then states the following:
Believe Rizzuto may have meant New Orleans. New Orleans division requested to check records Roosevelt Hotel in effort to identify Regan and to check other logical sources.
So although careful work by the FBI could have avoided this mistake, there certainly is a reasonable explanation behind it. More reasonable than believing the FBI went to New Orleans because they were trying to avoid a proper investigation when the record shows an extensive investigation up until the point Rizzuto was exposed.
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My response to Armstrong's article is now online:
http://wtracyparnell.com/john-armstrong-and-his-evolving-landesberg-story/
Wow! "Hargrove said" ... this and "David Josephs said" ... that! This IS research for the ages!!
Be sure to read the lengthy comments by "Buster" at the end before Tracy deletes them. I've taken the liberty of saving "Buster's" comments to my HD in case they should vanish as fast as an honest FBI doc!
No comments have been or will be deleted unless they become abusive, but I will give wide latitude. BTW, "Buster" is Brian Doyle.
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My response to Armstrong's article is now online:
http://wtracyparnell.com/john-armstrong-and-his-evolving-landesberg-story/
Tracy, your new article, entitled, John Armstrong and His Evolving Landesberg Story, is EXCELLENT.
Your article is professionally conceived and written, and I hope you get thousands of hits for it.
HIGHLY RECOMMENDED.
Best regards,
--Paul Trejo
Thank you kindly Paul, I appreciate it!
Harvey and Lee: John Armstrong
in JFK Assassination Debate
Posted
George Bailey-loved him in "Its a Wonderful Life".
Seriously, this has been answered time and time again and they keep bringing it up. Here, Bugliosi replies to the same allegation by Summers:
But the very preceding paragraph, which Summers conveniently makes no mention of, reveals why Hoover made the birth certificate reference and where he most likely got the idea of imposture—from Oswald’s mother, Marguerite. Hoover points out in the paragraph that Marguerite had informed the FBI the previous month that Oswald had taken his birth certificate with him when he had defected to the Soviet Union, and that three letters she had written him had been returned to her undelivered. Also, she had recently received a letter addressed to her son from the Albert Schweitzer College in Switzerland indicating that he had been expected to show up at the college on April 20, 1960, but hadn’t. The mother, Hoover said, was therefore “apprehensive about his safety.”
Bugliosi, Vincent (2007-05-17). Reclaiming History: The Assassination of President John F. Kennedy (Kindle Locations 28663-28668). Norton. Kindle Edition.