Alistair Briggs

There must be reasons for that. Is it because it's the most 'appealing' theory, one that makes the most sense. In a 'back to basics' and in an overly simplistic way... JFK wanted to 'destroy' the CIA - JFK is assassinated - the CIA survives... that's the 'motive' and they certainly had the 'means'... thus there is certainly an 'appeal' to that line of thinking... and it can be 'backed up' with evidence by 'connecting the dots' - that's not to say it is correct of course... I can understand your 'frustrations' on this point, Paul; yeah some people have been 'nasty' (to you) on this forum - of course, it's not overly helpful when you call them 'dumb'. lol People don't like being called dumb. lol Seriously though, one thing that I have found is that even with some CT's that are in general terms polar opposites there is still some cross over points between them and it can thus be helpful to listen more to those who have oppossing views because on some points there would be some agreement... ... anyroads; You mentioned something above that I thought was quite interesting; ... on what grounds is it more alarming? Regards

Just on that subject Paul; I recently picked up a book called 'The Mammoth Book of Cover-Ups' by Jon E Lewis, in which he briefly goes through 100 of the 'most disturbing conspiracies of all time' and he gives each 'cover-up' a plausibility rating from 0 to 10. In terms of JFK theories this is how he rated some of them; Castro/the USSR assassinated JFK: Alert Level 3 LBJ conspired to kills his predecessor: Alert Level 6 The CIA asassinated Kennedy: Alert Level 2.5 Anti-Castro Cuban exiles assassinated Kennedy: Alert Level 7 The Mob killed Kennedy: Alert Level 6 JFK was killed by a conspiracy, not a 'lone gunman': Alert Level 7 To put some of those numbers in context here are a few random other ones; British Royal Family are the imperial masters of the planet: Alert Level 2 Elvis lives: Alert Level 0 The Nazis sent a successful mission to the moon: Alert Level 1 Bobby Kennedy murdered Marilyn Monroe: Alert Level 4 Libya was framed for the Lockerbie bombing: Alert Level 9 Earth is hollow and inhabitated by aliens with UFO's: Alert Level 1

In terms of someone 'besting' 'expectations', 'motivation' can play a big part. In the same way someone could lift a car, by use of 'hysterical strength' maybe someone can (over a short enough distance) run faster than 'expected' if they were 'motivated' enough... maybe... ...as you say though, it is more likely the 2 vehicles were moving slower at the time... I have no problems with that thinking at all. It is an interesting topic to be sure. In deference to not wanting to go too off kilter within this thread, perhaps another thread for this kind of discussion may be an idea? Regards

lol when I first read that I was asking myself who Hill was... only because I'm pretty sure the Jack White 22mph running thing was about Willis... I think. lol Anyway, What about his momentum though because he wouldn't be starting from a standing still position (relatively) he would be travelling at the same speed as the car he 'leapt' from - wouldn't his relative speed by higher then... Yep, I'm aware of the alterations made by LIFE. I liked the bit in the 'letter' there that reads: "the original was not exactly the acme of photographic perfection" lol Regards P.S. I'm going to see if I can find the link to the Jack White thread about 22mph.

Cheers Paul, much appreciated. I will give it a watch later on. I've read, on this forum, a lot of Jack White's posts, and also read a few bits and bobs elsewhere... to be honest I am a bit skeptical because I have read some quite wild things that he said (one example that springs to mind was when he claimed that for a person to catch something travelling at 11mph they would need to run 22mph - which would only be true if they started 11 miles behind and had an hour to catch up with it. lol) but yeah I will give it the credence it deserves. Regards

A link to that would be conducive.

David, I'm always happy to be filled in with more info. Not really defending the HSCA experts... more raising the question of just how good somebody like Oswald would be himself at faking the photos. With regards to the 'Aerospace Corp' test... In furtherance to that; I will need to do some more digging in to this... Regards

I don't doubt for one second that Oswald had learned some photographic techinques... but would those techniques be good enough to fool the 22 experts that tested the photos for the HSCA and found no evidence of them being faked (and that included the 'graininess' of the images)... was Oswald such an expert that he could have indeed 'proved that the photo is a fake' but so many experts since have failed to do so... ... one thing that somewhat amuses me when reading about the 'Backyard Photos' being faked is how often I read that Oswald said they were faked and he could prove it - it somewhat amuses me because it seems so cut and dried, as if that's all that Oswald said on the matter and yet from reading through all that he said about them, a slightly different slant is put on it... ... first though, a consideration of a couple of points. If the backyard photos were indeed faked by putting Oswald's face on someone else's body then either that was done by Oswald himself and he would know that was the case, or it was done by someone else but Oswald at the time of first seeing it would surely (because of his 'photography expertise' know that straight away. Either way what should our expectations be when reading what Oswald said about them - that someone had superimposed his face on to another person's body... either that or for Oswald to say nothing about them at all. That really should be the only two options... From Bugliosi's book Four Days In November: Oswald at first says it isn't his face, then admits it is his face but that it's been superimposed on to someone else's body and then he slips up even more and says that it is his 'body' and someone has superimposed the rifle in his hand and the gun in his pocket... With consideration to your other point about the 'plausible deniability' for if the 'FBI came knocking at his door' - if that was the case, why create a number with different poses in them? Surely the best way to have 'plausible deniability' would be to have no photos at all - or if he did need one (as a memento) to have one with the stuff in situ and him not in it... or if he (for whatever reason) needed to be in one why not just have one... I've read this kind of thing before. As mentioned above though there were 22 experts at the HSCA who found no fakery in the backyard photos; and in more recent years there have been many experts who have come to the same conclusion... ... you mention 'Roscoe White's chin'... I presume then that you are of the opinion that the 'line' seen across Oswald's face in the Backyard Photo is where the 'cut' was made to paste in his face... on that point here are some images; Of course there is the 'intrigue' of how one of the Backyard Photos ended up in the 'care' of Roscoe White - how do you think that came about Paul? Regards

In furtherance to that, here are a couple of quotes regarding the issue from this article: How many different 'backyard photos' are there? Three, and possibly four! The fourth may be the one that Marguerite said that she and Marina 'destroyed' after the assassination showing the rifle being held over his head. On the assumption that all of the photos are genuine and were all taken by Marina then the question becomes why would she think she took only one (possibly two) if there were more than that... does the difference in numbers lead to the conclusion that some of them were indeed 'faked', or could there be another explanation... if for example she 'pressed' the button 4 or 5 times, but later on Lee told her that only two of them worked, how many pictures would she have taken... Anyroads, The easiest way to have 'plausible deniability' surely would be to have no photos taken at all. lol The next best way would be to merely take a photo of the rifle, pistol and newspapers in situ without himself in it... then he would have a 'momento' and 'plausible deniability'... ... why take any photos at all? To answer that question one needs to consider what he did with any of them after the fact. One he sent to the offices of The Militant's publisher, the Socialist Workers' Party presumably as a bit of 'political posturing',- what if that was his only reason for taking any 'backyard photos' to start with and the one he later 'gave' to DeMohrenschildt was an 'after the fact' thought... idk. Anyway, Paul, when you mention about 'with the help of Roscoe White', for clarity, can you expand on that a bit more please? Regards

I note that his last visit here was early July 2016 and last (visible) post on Facebook is dated middle of June 2016. He is still active on his blog though and posted as recently as 24th of March this year...

Just to ask, Marina makes mention of taking two photos (well, at first thinking it was only one but then saying that it was two), but the question is, and more in regards to the 'several variations' you claim Oswald made at JCS (with the help of Roscoe White) - to what purpose? Why would he need to make several variations of it? Regards

for the benefit of any readers, here is a link about it http://22november1963.org.uk/george-de-mohrenschildt-i-am-a-patsy From looking at Oswald's Timeline and 'simplifying' it somewhat... March 9/10 Oswald takes photos of Walker's house. March 12 Oswald orders a rifle March 25 Oswald picks up the rifle March 31 Marina takes 'Backyard Photos' April 10 Oswald takes 'potshot' at Walker Can it thus be inferred that the purchase of the rifle was directly related to his taking a 'potshot' at Walker inasmuch as that was the purpose for which he purchased it? Regards

Paul, following on from that, is it a case that Oswald took his 'potshot' at Walker in an attempt to impress George DeMohrenshcildt? Regards

I agree that his purported Marxist leanings would not mesh well with the White Russians... as to whether they had any hand in any part of the plot though, I am yet to be convinced, well, maybe not the White Russians as a totality - perhaps one or two had some part, but maybe indirectly, idk... but yeah, they certainly did suffer his presence and besmirch his character... ... how much of the character besmirching was exaggerated though? I think it's fair to say that if people have a low opinion of someone they tend to 'highlight' their bad points more than maybe is required and that leads me to thing that there would have been a fair bit of exaggerating going on about the kind of person Oswald was. I don't think they were making stuff up though, I mean, if they were part of a plot (to frame Oswald) would they not be a bit more forthcoming with things that would actually frame him? Unless I'm missing something, there seems to be little across the board that would in anyway incriminate Oswald as a potential assassin of the President. Being a lousy husband and having an attitude problem - or as Paul said, being an ignoramus - and being somewhat immature.. that's what the White Russian community seem to be saying about Oswald... what they aren't saying is just as important... they aren't saying that Oswald spoke often about a hatred of America or a hatred of Kennedy, they aren't saying that he was often out practicing with his rifle, they aren't saying that they thought, after the event, that he was capable of doing such a thing. Anyway, always glad to have your input Michael Regards

This may be a presumption on my part, but I would have thought that had Oswald's job been in the intelligence business, part of that job be to get 'intel' on the Russian community' and if so would he not 'buddy' up to them... yet as you say he was not interested in being cozy with the Russian's... so what was his job then? A double-bluff? lol To me it just seems that Oswald's behaviour drove the Russian Community away from him, perhaps that was his plan all along, for whatever reason. Certainly though, the more I delve in to the world of Oswald the more, I too, have a hard time saying one way or another what is going on with Oswald. Regards

I know what you are saying Paul, he could indeed have taken on a 'debt' for his own baby... well, he should have done so as surely a child's health is of the upmost importance... yet as we have already been discussing, Oswald was not exactly 'mature'... yet I can understand his objection to paying also - that's not to condone it of course, it's just I can understand it. I'm sure that there are plenty of other examples out there of people doing the exact same thing - it probably happens all the time - it's just highlighted more in the case of Oswald because of how his life ended up... In Michael's last post he included the following line: " trying to make his way up and out of the life of a discharged marine, ", one thing that is perhaps of note there is the knock on effect that the type of discharge would have in terms of getting certain jobs and getting on in life. When he left the Marines it was on a 'Hardship Discharge' (which is still an 'honourable' discharge), but because Oswald, when trying to enter Russia, said he was willing to divulge Navy secrets (which I think he was bluffing about ), his discharge was changed to a 'undersirable discharge'... of course, Oswald thought it had been changed to a 'dishonourable discharge' because that's what his Mother said when she wrote to him... ... his efforts to 'fix' that were, imo, a case of 'all talk no trousers'. lol

If Oswald was indeed trying to work his way into an intelligence niche within the White Russian community would he not try and be overly friendly with them to initiate himself within the group as much as possible - yet, to all intents and purposes, it would seem, that he did the polar opposite; from reading through the WC testimony of the 'White Russian Community' quite the picture of Oswald emerges, a picture that paints him in a rather 'unfriendly light'... that may be down to the circumstances of course... I can imagine someone like Oswald may well have been the kind of person who didn't like the 'charity' being offered, he would have been too 'stubborn' to accept the help that circumstances may have dictated were needed... ... the part of the WC testimony of Lydia Dymitruk highlights something quite telling imo. Here is the next wee bit of it as well as it ties in with it... It's not a bad point Oswald is making, if it's free in Russia why is it not free in America, why should he be required to pay in America if he wouldn't need to if he was in Russia... thinking it should be free in the US is a good thing, but ipso facto it wasn't free and, 'when in Rome'... ... Paul infers that Oswald wouldn't pay, but perhaps it is more likely that he couldn't pay. Perhaps it was his 'stubborness' that stopped him asking for help from the White Russian Community on this count, which is somewhat ironic because they seemed to be more than willing to help - Marina's dental work for example - and as an other example, the clothes and baby stuff that they gave to them, well, not really 'them', it's more like Marina and baby really. There seemed to be, in quite a short period of time, no love lost between the White Russian community and Lee Oswald because of his attitude but a lot of 'concern' for Marina. If Lee had just swallowed his pride a bit and had been a bit more appreciative of the help being given then things could have been different... on the flip side, had the White Russian Community not been so interfeering then things could have been different. I tend to see it from both points of view. lol Anyroads; as mentioned in the part of George DeMohrenschildt's WC testimony that you quote: " my car was loaded with her dresses. It was all contributions from the various people, in Fort Worth and Dallas." - in furtherance to that I would like to take this opportunity to quote another passage from his WC testimony and one from the WC testimony of his wife. The way I look at it is that the 'White Russian Community' were trying to be helpful, and Marina was certainly grateful for the help, but the help was too helpful to the point that it was 'counter-productive' and Lee certainly wasn't grateful for the help because he saw it as interfeering, and he was not wrong. Regards P.S. sorry to hear Paul has put you on ignore. I will have a word with him.

There is much in your full previous comment Paul that is accurate but maybe, just maybe, need to be put more in to some form of context - for example, the financial and medical neglect; it has to be remembered that Oswald was not well off in the slightest and thus such 'neglect' is borne of circumstances moreso than some 'psychological need of 'domination''... I mean, flip it round, would there still be that 'neglect' if Oswald had a high paying job? Unlikely! Kind of similar to the 'four month period of 'abuse'' - not to excuse such behaviour (whether verbal or physical abuse) - it's just, it would, by definition, be a difficult time for them for many reasons... all in all there would be 'mitigating' circumstances. Anyway, the learning of English by Marina, and the alleged stopping of it by Oswald is quite intriguing. One would imagine it would be in Marina's best interests to learn English seen as she was now living in an English speaking country - the question would then become why would Oswald not want her to have that freedom? Could it be simply because he thought that by her having that freedom it may have meant that she would have the freedom to leave him... the irony of that is that by trying to stop such a freedom would be the best way to make her leave him... etc etc. A cat and mouse game indeed... And yet, having said all of that, from the time they 'escaped' the Russian community, perhaps there were indications that they were turning the corner. If only Oswald could settle in to a job that could have allowed them a better lifestyle then they could have worked through their issues... ... maybe, just maybe,

Just on that note, this may be of interest; http://equator.eftours.com/the-ef-passport/passport-not-valid-for-travel-to-hungary It is about someone else's passport (from 1958) that also included the 'This passport is not valid for travel in Hungary' and it explains the why. Here is another example of a passport that said the same thing; https://profiles.nlm.nih.gov/ps/access/BBBAAC.pdf and this example http://grofjardanhazy.tumblr.com/post/51792624956/this-passport-is-not-valid-for-travel-in Edit for clarification: That is three other examples of passports from a similar time - one child, one man, one woman - and all of them have the same 'restriction', because Hungary was a 'no-go' country at the time and not for any 'nefarious' reasons.

I both agree and disagree at this point... I agree that the thought of living like his Mother (struggling) would be a 'deterent' to him, but I feel that he wouldn't have thought of his brothers in the same way, in fact I think that he would have seen how they were living at the time and that would have appealed somewhat, inasmuch as his thought process may have been that they had 'escaped' the 'struggles' of their 'upbringing' by settling down in to married lives and Oswald would have wanted to emulate that. Really though, it's a tough one to call... ... as for the thought that he would have stayed in Russia if Marina hadn't pressured him about it. I disagree, inasmuch as I feel that Oswald would have become unsettled anyway and wanted to come back regardless of what Marina said because his life thus far had almost 'pre-programmed' him not to get settled in any one place for too long. In furtherance, I also don't think that Marina pressured him about it to the same extent that he pressured her to do it, in fact I reckon that Marina was very reluctant to leave Russia and it was totally down to Oswald putting the pressure on her - some of the 'KGB taps' on them point in that direction, for example this one from 11th August 1961; So, when you say; As much as Marina may have disliked the Russian 'way of life', and as much as she may have been against 'communism', the transcript above surely points away from the thinking that she wanted to get the hell out of Russia. There would have been great fear in her about the language and the lack of 'friends' and the prospect of things breaking down in her marriage - all of which she touches upon above. Perhaps her love for Oswald tipped the balance in favour of leaving for the US, but if the choice was Marina's then I think she would have very much preferred for Oswald to stay in Russia. Why wouldn't Oswald want to stay in Russia? Apart form the feeling of being 'homesick', there would also no doubt be a consideration of his (Marxist) idea not matching the reality of how it really was for him in Russia. Yep, immaturity indeed. Not only that but I feel there would also be a huge disparity between the ideological position and the reality of things - a disparity between the self-perception and the perception others see of him. That, I feel, is borne out by many examples previous... and also borne out by the bit you mention about his writing and the 'want' to be Bond (which I will come back to later on. ) Regards

*See the bits that are in 'quotation marks', they really shouldn't be as it is not a quote... lol Tsk tsk the 'transcriber' of the WC. lol Maybe I'm just reading it differently, but to me when John Hall says 'it seemed to me...' it doesn't necessarily mean that he vocalised that to Oswald - even if he did, quite a leap from throwing out such a thought and actually 'helping' him achieve that; it's just when you mentioned earlier that some people tried to help Oswald start his own business I thought you were meaning literally, at that point, helping him to start his own business... no biggy though. This is something we probably disagree on to some extent, but that might come down to our own perspective on a couple of matters. Before I delve more in to it then, for clarity, I will ask you Paul do you feel that Oswald's return to the US came about, not because he wanted to come back but moreso because Marina 'pressured' him in to it? Regards

Ah ok, noted. Can't say I have come across that before - maybe I have and it just didn't register with me - Paul, can you point me in the direction of any available online sources about some of them trying to help him start his own business? Cheers

Aspergers is certainly a possibility - difficult to say to what extent of course.. I do genuinely think that if it was today Oswald would certainly be found to be on the 'spectrum' at some level, to what extent would be supposition on my part, but certainly many things point in that direction, imo...

I kind of agree - he could have had a successful life in the USSR, but I think he could have had a successful life after his return to the US too. You go on to mention that you believe, had he stayed in Russia, that he would have 'buckled down' and got a 'middle position'; I reckon the same could be said in terms of after his return to the US. I reckon that was where his life was heading tbh, that he was coming to the realisation that he needed to 'buck up', a second child on the way, a wife to support, that he wanted to 'settle down' in to a 'normal' lifestyle in the US - almost as if he was on the point of 'maturity'. Sure, perhaps he had to take one step back to go two steps forward, but I genuinely think that he was heading in the right direction... This is where it gets complicated. lol I say that with consideration of other CT's, including your own. I can see then why a thought of Oswald having stayed in Russia would 'act' as a 'catch-all' in 'predicating' him being the 'Patsy'... The difference I suppose, in overly simplistic terms, is that, as per your CT theory, had he stayed in Russia then there wouldn't have been a JFK assassination - in other CT's, had he stayed in Russia there (likely) would still have been a JFK assassination but we would be talking about some other 'Patsy' instead of Oswald. Indeed, if Oswald was the 'lone assassin', had he stayed in Russia then he couldn't have been the 'lone assassin'... I suppose then that it is indeed 'comforting' to consider how different things could have been had Oswald stayed in Russia... and yet it is also 'moot' because he didn't stay in Russia. lol For some reason the Oasis song 'Masterplan' just popped in to my mind, and especially the following verse... I digress! Hemmingway was not the best speller, it used to drive his editors nuts and when they complained about them, his retort was "Well, that's what you're hired to correct!" Regards

The psychology of the unconscious, I like that. Yeah I think there probably is something there on some subconcious level that would have appealed. Not of any real significance in the grand scheme of things though. lol Getting back to his time in Russia and from when he first adopted the name of Alek, I can imagine that would have helped him a lot - new name, new start - almost as if it would help him reveal the person he really wanted to be, perhaps it would have made him feel more 'outgoing'... to start with at least...