Len Colby

Len Colby said:

"Please spell out any technical qualifications you have to have reached such a conclusion; Debra Conway's sister is a CT regarding the assassination and forensic expert specialising in blood splatter, she reached the same conclusion regarding a similar claim made by Costella. You do realize the Z-film was low resolution and only 18.3 FPS and that even the MC fired bullets at over 2000 ft/sec? Even if the debris ejected at 700 FPS (1/3 the speed of an MC bullet) it would have travelled over 30 ft between frames."

If what you say is true, don't you find it rather amazing that frame z313 of the Zapruder film not only seemed to capture ejected material going upwards from JFK's brain in mid-flight, it also seems to have captured the same piece of skull bone in several locations above JFK's head as it shot upwards?

z313.jpg

So do I take it you disagree with Daniel that we can't see ejecta? Due to the low resolution and frame rate it was possible but far from certain ejecta would be recorded. It would be instructive to know the shutter speed as well.

Mr. Colby

I think you misunderstood me here. If you look at z313, there appears to be objects travelling almost vertically from the top of JFK's head which some researchers claim to be pieces of skull bone. Some researchers even feel that the numerous pieces are one single piece of bone.

Until you posted that reply to Mr. Gallup, it had not occurred to me that the ejecta was, by your calculation, possibly moving at a speed approaching 700 feet per second.

Although the question is how could this camera, taking exposures at a rate of 18.3 frames per second, have possibly captured this piece of bone as several exposures in one frame, the real question is how did this camera capture the individual pieces of bone at all? This camera obviously did not have a fast shutter speed, judging by the blurring of bystanders as opposed to the sharpness of the limo. The ejecta, at your calculated speed of 700 feet per second, should, at the very most, have only left a blur on z313.

1) frame rate is not the same as shutter speed the latter was 1/40 second

2) I did not calculate 700 ft/sec it was a rough guesstimate from a layperson, I used it illustrate roughly how fat the debris could have gone between frames. Apparently Sherry did a study that was far more in depth than her posts here, the former might have a calculation as to the velocity

3) to me all we can see is a blur

This does really help you much does it Paul? The author whose expertise regarding intel. matters is unclear seems unconvinced of the charges and his evidence the Fogle was indeed CIA is risible:

1) he supposedly was one of about 8 million people who lived in Virginia (not to mention the couple of million who lived in DC and MD suburbs.

2) he supposedly was one of many thousands of people who received the Stratfor mailing list, supposedly this can lead to recruitment by the agency

3) supposedly " the US State Department referred some press inquiries to CIA HQ"

But even if what the FSB alleges is true it doesn't lend credence to your fantasies.

Steve / Len,

Thanks for the replies.

1. I'll check out that possibility of photo mix-up with the monkey; it COULD happen so is worth checking.

2. You'd think that it required a high level of technology to build a nuclear weapons but it doesn't. What is difficult is getting certain key components for the manufacture. Of course, the level of bomb technology is a factor; if you wanted a thermonuclear weapon with multiple independent warheads, each of between 20 - 100 Kt yield and weigh not more than 50 Kg each, then that does require a greater degree of technology. If you just want a warhead with a yield of between 10-20 Kt and deliverable by a ballistic missile with a range up to 2000 Km, then the problem is much simpler. See https://www.fas.org/irp/threat/mctl98-2/p2sec05.pdf

3. On the other hand, developing a UAV with stealth characteristics is much more difficult. Stealth technology requires high level computer modelling and is still a close held secret. Then there is the UAV mission sensors; what is it designed to do and so how good are they? Likewise, the command and communications system on the vehicle takes a great deal of work (otherwise it is going to be easily compromised or subverted).

But it is the pure propaganda farce that amuses me. Come on, seriously - a shopping trolley wheel for nose gear? That alone tells you this is not serious. Likewise the indigenous fighter; sure, Iran could develop an aircraft industry but what they showed was at best a mockup; the photoshopped image of it claiming to be in flight just made it a farce.

As far as US claims regarding Iran's nuclear technology, I think they could be right but we have been burnt by them too much in the past and so I can agree with part of your comments. I think taking a very sceptical view of their (the US) claims and wanting to see some solid evidence is a very reasonable stance to take.

It looks more like something made by engineering students for a competition or end of course project. Are you sure the 'landing gear' and other aspects are inadequate? Don't forget that to Jack White's much of the Apollo hardware was 'obviously' inadequate.

Len Colby said:

"Please spell out any technical qualifications you have to have reached such a conclusion; Debra Conway's sister is a CT regarding the assassination and forensic expert specialising in blood splatter, she reached the same conclusion regarding a similar claim made by Costella. You do realize the Z-film was low resolution and only 18.3 FPS and that even the MC fired bullets at over 2000 ft/sec? Even if the debris ejected at 700 FPS (1/3 the speed of an MC bullet) it would have travelled over 30 ft between frames."

If what you say is true, don't you find it rather amazing that frame z313 of the Zapruder film not only seemed to capture ejected material going upwards from JFK's brain in mid-flight, it also seems to have captured the same piece of skull bone in several locations above JFK's head as it shot upwards?

z313.jpg

So do I take it you disagree with Daniel that we can't see ejecta? Due to the low resolution and frame rate it was possible but far from certain ejecta would be recorded. It would be instructive to know the shutter speed as well.

David, I have never used the Z-film to prove anything because I find the lack of debris exiting the avulsive wound in the right rear of the head as proof of alteration. 10 years ago Bill Miller on Lancer responded that the debris exited the back of Kennedy's head too fast for the camera to capture.

Please spell out any technical qualifications you have to have reached such a conclusion; Debra Conway's sister is a CT regarding the assassination and forensic expert specialising in blood splatter, she reached the same conclusion regarding a similar claim made by Costella. You do realize the Z-film was low resolution and only 18.3 FPS and that even the MC fired bullets at over 2000 ft/sec? Even if the debris ejected at 700 FPS (1/3 the speed of an MC bullet) it would have travelled over 30 ft between frames.

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=6162

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=7695

Funny-- Toni Foster in her 2000 interview with Debra Conway said the "spray went behind him." So Toni could see easily what the camera could not.

LOL witnesses are not reliable even when recalling events shortly after the fact, that is way forensic evidence trumps them not the other way round. Ms. Foster only came forward 33 years after the assassination and AFAIK it has yet to be confirmed she had really been in DP at the time. FWIW Poser previously interviewed “Francine Burrows” who claimed to have been the same woman seen in the Z-film. Foster's 'recollections' were 37 years old at the time. But it would not be the least bit surprising if what she claimed was true, as noted above “ the Z-film was low resolution and only 18.3 FPS” the human eye and brain are capable of much better than that especially at the distance she claimed to have been.

http://www.patspeer.com/chapter7%3Amorepiecesofthepuzzle

Therefore I argue nothing from the film. Yet you seem to take the film seriously. May I pose the question then to you: how do you account for the lack of debris exiting the back of Kennedy's head? ITEK confirmed there are no debris exiting the back of Kennedy's head in the extant film

I assume you have a citation handy.

I'm with Tom on this one, Robert. The line about your penis is in bad taste. No one on this forum of whom I am aware wants to think about your penis, let alone think about it every time they read one of your posts. I suggest that you remove it immediately.

The line that is, not your penis.

No problem. Then tell Len Colby to take it out of his tag line, too. That is why I put it up there in the first place to show folks what "out of context" quote of mine Colby was referring to. That is the fact the the Clintons beat up and nearly murdered Gary Johnson on June 26, 1992 - I have no doubt about that, none whatsoever. Gary

Johnson (not the libertarian) was also the lawyer for Larry Nichols, former Clinton insider turned enemy, and Johnson lived next door to Gennifer Flowers who was very aware of this savage beating.

LOL I doubt anyone but you thinks your comment was more reasonable "in context".

Why is this prurient garbage relevant or important? You cap it off by betting your penis. Our posts and avatars have to coexist with yours on this forum. Give us all a break and act it out elsewhere.

Truly. If you examine Morrow's interest, first in all things Clinton, "graduating" to JFK you will see that his main purpose is prurient.

And gay bashing. He once bragged that he put thousands of fliers all over a small community just north of Austin. It was also online. Now what do you suppose THAT was all about?

Perhaps it has something to do with this 'As for relationship status, Morrow says he’s single, and that he’s interested in “Men and Women.”'

http://blog.sfgate.com/abraham/2011/08/18/who-is-rick-perrys-gay-and-stripper-sex-accuser-robert-morrow/

I have nothing against gays or bis I have gay friends but I'm not very fond of bigots, especially hypocritical ones.

Was the real purpose of the abortive CIA recruitment to rewrite the Boston patsies' histories through an FSB agent-in-place?

http://aangirfan.blogspot.co.uk/2013/05/mysterious-ryan-fogle.html

Quite weak even by the low standard of your posts on this thread. The blogger who also has posts on “SOME TOP JEWS”, “JEW TAKES OVER NEWS PROGRAMME” , and “JEWISH GANGSTERS LOSING IN TURKEY AND SYRIA”claimed but failed to produce evidence that the extremists the elder Tsarnaev met in Dagestan were backed by the CIA.

Russia's CIA spy bust 'was linked to Boston Bombing': U.S diplomat was trying to recruit Dagestan expert who travelled to terrorist’s home town when he was arrested

U.S. diplomat named as Ryan Christopher Fogle was arrested on Monday

Russia claim he was attempting to recruit a Russian secret services official

Letter allegedly found on him offers agents $1million per year to defect

U.S. ambassador summoned to Russian foreign ministry to explain today

By DAILY MAIL REPORTER

PUBLISHED: 12:44, 15 May 2013

[...]

Many details remained shrouded in mystery last night. It is not known whether the target was part of the sting operation or if they have been arrested. Russia’s haste to make the news public could mean either that the attempt was so audacious that it shocked leaders, or that hardliners have seized on it to stop a move towards detente with the US. Yesterday Patty Fogle, the diplomat’s mother, refused to comment at her home in St Louis, Missouri.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2324861/Russias-CIA-spy-bust-linked-Boston-Bombing-U-S-diplomat-trying-recruit-Dagestan-expert-travelled-terrorist-s-home-town-arrested.html#ixzz2TOqZMoTm

I still wonder about this it seems too odd to be true. It's a bit of a contradiction to believe the same CIA can carry out these elaborate plots would have fitted out Fogle with such a goofy wig, and why would he be carrying around a compass? And worst of all why a letter spelling out the offer? Can anyone following this thread point to confirmed cases of the CIA using such recruitment letters. But even IF true this doesn't really help your case. Also 'odd' that the Mail is the only source reporting a few stories relating to this incident, they either have the best or among the worst journalists covering it.

I don't know how many people have followed the international joke that is Iran, but they have done it again.

First they claim they achieved spaceflight but the monkey payload appears to have been swapped whilst in flight.

Then they reveal a stealth super fighter that isn't much more than an oversized Airfix kit. Photos of it in flight are shown to be laughably crude fakes.

Now they roll out their stealth attack drone.... which seems to be made from shopping trolley parts, rubber bands and Tupperware!

Seriously - do they actually believe they are fooling anyone? Are the people of Iran so naïve that they believe it? I'd imagine that North Korea looks up to them and will be asking for some technology transfer! These guys make the Keystone Cops look like a world class law enforcement agency.

Doesn't this contradict the notion Iran is capable of and perhaps even close to building nuclear weapons?

Len,

You are right- there is nothing to be ashamed of with the "autism" label..

Yes odd that Jim seemed to think there was.

...it was my niece's birth over 40 years ago that really opened my eyes on this subject.

Quite understandable, people tend to be especially interested in and sensitive to issues with which they have a personal connection. And in most such cases, they are aware of aspects that others aren't.

DJ: ....which was eventually classified as an extremely minor autism or aspergers's syndrome when he entered middle school. We still don't know exactly what kind of learning disability he has.....

Note the date I'd last read that a few years ago. Did you have a point?

I was very alarmed last year when Thompson was celebrated for his Umbrella Man bit.

[...]

That is what's at stake. That is the high cost of Thompson's de facto mea culpa limelight dancing.

Did you even watch the video? By the end Tink is arguing that the evidence suggests the head shot came from the front.

As far as the Umbrella man video... Tink claimed Morris interviewed him for a number of hours, and that the video was just an excerpt... As Morris is purported to be working on an assassination-related movie, it seems likely we'll see more of this interview in the future...

Obviously not but why let a little thing like that stop him from opining?

Mr. Colby, it seems, sees a President in every other 1963 Brazilian governor.

If I could decipher your gibberish I'd reply to it, unfortunately my decoder ring broke and I haven't gotten a new one yet.

Len, I'm not sure where you got the impression I have an autistic child. I do have a niece with Down's Syndrome, and have been quite open about that.

I was very alarmed last year when Thompson was celebrated for his Umbrella Man bit.

To me what stood out was that Thompson did not manage to sneak in one iota of pro-conspiracy argument into the clip. He knew that this piece would get way, way more coverage, given those involved. And then the NYT picked it up and used it to, without stating it, scoff at all pro-conspiracy viewpoints.

Thompson is not a dummy. He knows that his work on this movie would get Huge Corporate Media coverage. He can ride into Education Forum with his posse all he wants and proclaim that he still believes in Conspiracy. THAT DOES NOT MATTER SO LONG AS THE ONLY THING THAT REACHES MILLIONS--RATHER THAN A FEW HUNDRED HERE-- IS HIS STATURE AS A BAD BOY NOW GONE GOOD, I.E. posing for a film or article which he knows damn well will only reach a wide audience if it plays to the ear of our Court Media.

Unless Thompson gets some pro-conspiracy points before the same wide audience fast.... I am growing kind of suspicious here. I'm sure, given his reputation, he does not care what I think. But ultimately what this case is about is neither a former Yale professor or some middle ages social studies teacher. It is the legitimation (or just delegitimation ) of an outdated political model and political language that is forced on 310 million citizens a year-- and at a media and schoolin cost of tens of billions of dollars-- which only serves to obscure the realities of power for ourselves and any future generations that can survive this bad faith blather about elections and checks and balances.

That is what's at stake. That is the high cost of Thompson's de facto mea culpa limelight dancing.

Mr. Hiedenheimer it seems sees a demon in every shadow.

I never got into it with Drago?

Tell me another.

Perhaps you did debate him over some of the finer points of your respective assassination theories; I'd have no fracking idea. But that's not what I was talking about, rather as my post made clear I was referring to DPFer's failures to respond to his bullyish behavior and your failure in particular to defend Don.

But since were on the topic please post a link to the supposed debate Drago lost with the other Deep Site administrators that lead to his voluntary exile

And BTW, I had no idea that Don had an autistic child.

Now you do, that and a niece with Down’s which puts Drago’s remarks in a whole new context.

THanks for telling everyone.

Huh? It’s not like it’s something to be ashamed of, the only reason I know is because he’s been quite open about it. You have no ‘standing’ to object.

When CD said that I thought he meant that Don bent over backwards to allow people with say, half baked ideas, to run their mouths.

Don seems to agree with my interpretation.

EDIT - Formating

I took another look at the DPF thread. I'd thought both Millea and Drago had called Don Jeffries 'Don "Special Olympics"' but only the latter used that epitaph, so my apologies to the former for indicating he had,

I guess none of them have the 'cojones' to stand up to Drago.

Uh, look, this is kind of embarrassing. Its one thing to criticize a forum. Its quite another to criticize them for the wrong reason.

This is twice now that the DPF has decided to stick to their guns in a matter of majority rules. The first time, the member who did not get her way actually took down the whole forum.

This time, when the majority would not go along with him, Drago decided to resign. He has not been there for weeks.

If you want to charge them with something, make it stick.

Has anyone here ever had to resign over the matter of the special status granted to someone like Gary Mack? Or the decision to let DVP back on the forum?

If so, I am not aware of it. But that is what happened there--twice.

So Jim can you point to any posts or threads where members of the DPF stood up too Drago? He repeatedly violated the forum's rules on etiquette and in the threads I've seen was never criticized for doing so. Speaking of which you were one of the people who too cowardly to defend Don, or do you think attacking him and calling him "Mr. Special Olympics" was appropriate?

He couldn't fit in here, he thinks Lancer is a disinfo. op. and he seemingly can't even fit in on the forum he started. He kept 'quitting' this forum in drama queen fashion then coming back I expect he'll skulk back the Deep Phertilizer Forum but the dude obviously has personality issues.

PS - What was the supposed vote Drago lost?

Cliff it's good that you did the honorable thing and defended Don, but you should have taken it further and condemned the Fertilizer Fourm's Fuhrer's vile words

Condemning vile words is above my pay grade, Len.

I mean, after all...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p25SdQEnhHI

Cliff LOL it's been been a while since I watched or even thought about that clip but I don't think even Rotten or Vicious (who wasn't in the band yet) ever would have sunk so low as to call the father of an autistic child "Mr. Special Olympics". I don't even GG would sunk to that level; yet the detestable douche Drago did - and fancies himself some sort erudite intellectual. You should have called him on it.

Did you really expect anything different? Their "rules" call for posts "...without name-calling or member abuse...". Unless, of course, you are one of the ruling elite. In that case its open season on anyone who disagrees with your point of view. They also call for "identical treatment" of members; once more, that only applies if you are not a member of the elite. I guess none of them have the 'cojones' to stand up to Drago.

I'd rather stand up to you, Evan. I think your work here sucks.

Len Colby is an entirely different matter. Honor among hc punk rock ball busters, you see.

Cliff it's good that you did the honorable thing and defended Don, but you should have taken it further and condemned the Fertilizer Fourm's Fuhrer's vile words

Len, you are quick on the trigger.

Is Williams calling Americans, "foreign fighers"? Why does he hate the U.S.?

http://www.southcoasttoday.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20130420/NEWS/304200341

UMD professor: 'I hope I didn't contribute' April 20, 2013

.......

In Williams' view, Chechnya has an undeserved reputation as a hatchery of terrorists, including al-Qaida and the Taliban.

"Foreign fighters did come in and radicalized people," Williams said. For some, "they transformed the form of war from a national one to a full-blown terrorist jihad."...

http://www.southcoasttoday.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20130419/NEWS/130419860&cid=sitesearch

UMD professor: 'I hope I didn't contribute'

April 19, 2013

Two years ago, UMass Dartmouth professor Dr. Brian Glyn Williams communicated by email with Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, then a 17-year-old student at Cambridge Rindge and Latin High School whose family fled the horrors of the Russian occupation in Chechnya.

Huh? What are you going on about Tom? There's no indication he was talking about Americans. I am unaware of any evidence significant numbers of, if any, American jihadis went to Chehnya can you point to any? Presumably the people he was referring to came from North Africa, the Middle East and Central Asia.

Boston Bombing Suspects: FBI, Homeland Security withheld Information from Local, State Police, Congressional hearing confirms

By Barry Grey

Global Research, May 11, 2013

World Socialist Web Site

http://www.globalresearch.ca/boston-bombing-suspects-fbi-homeland-security-withheld-information-from-local-state-police/5334671

The Boston police commissioner and a top Massachusetts Homeland Security official told Congress Thursday that the local and state police were never informed by the Federal Bureau of Investigation or the Department of Homeland Security of multiple warnings about Tamerlan Tsarnaev prior to the April 15 bombings at the Boston Marathon.

There were no 'warnings' the FBI was asked about the older brother. As far as is know as this point they only got one such request (the CIA got another). The FBI claims they discovered nothing suspicious about him and got no response for more info.

There are also reports that the Russian internal security service gave the FBI a case file on Tsarnaev in November of 2012, after Tsarnaev’s return from Russia, outlining multiple contacts between the ethnic Chechen US resident and known members of the Islamist underground in Dagestan, which borders Chechnya.

Really reports from whom?

On May 1, moreover, the British Daily Mail reported that Saudi Arabian officials sent a written report in 2012 to top US Homeland Security Department officials detailing their concerns about Tsarnaev and warning that he might be planning a terror attack.

That was based on the claims of an anonymous Saudi government source and supposedly confirmed by an anonymous USG one. The Saudis supposedly investigated him because he applied for a visa to visit Mecca but no other media outlets are reporting such a warning or that he applied for a visa. The Saudi embassy denied both claims.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2317493/Saudi-Arabian-ambassador-Washington-DENIES-nation-warned-United-States-Tamerlan-Tsarnaev-2012.html

In his testimony, Police Commissioner Davis said that an officer of US Customs and Border Protection, a unit of the Homeland Security Department, who served on the task force and had knowledge of Tamerlan Tsarnaev’s travels did not notify any of the four Boston police officers assigned to the group.

Citation!?

There is no innocent explanation for a decision by the FBI, the CIA and the Homeland Security Department to conceal from the state and local police, in advance of a major public event, the presence of area residents widely suspected of having terrorist connections. To even suggest that such a decision would be made by these agencies out of civil liberties concerns is preposterous

.

Really? I Google the author's name he is a mysterious figure who seems not to share any details about his experience and expertise, thus we can presume he has none law enforcement , terrorism, intel. etc. and failed to cite anyone with such a background who backs his assessment.

Pat 'bad' is insufficient to describe Drago's and Millea's comments, 'vile' is more apt and Don Jefferies is not just any member but a moderator. Much as I've long realized that Drago is a completely cretinous A-hole I was surprised to see he'd sink so low as to make a personal attack against someone based on the medical condition of one of their family members. It's only partially true that Drago and his crew “left this forum due to [their]...dislike for its members, attitudes and policies” there wrath was only directed at a few members principally me and to a lesser extent Craig and Evan and then the other Admins. and Mods. for not doing their bidding. Don was not a Mod. at the time and is one of a half dozen or so active members of both forums. He incurred their ire because he rightly held them to task for their intolerance of opposing POVs. This is but one of several threads on this forum concerning the going ons of the DPF and they cover the same topics. Certainly there is a great deal of crossover in the readership of both forums. Members and guests of this one have a vested interest in knowing the 'quality' of people there.

It is also worth noting that even though Cliff and Dawn stood up for Don and several other EF members commented on the thread no one criticized Drago or Millea.

I hope as a compromise you'll allow me to post a link to the the offending posts. https://deeppoliticsforum.com/forums/showthread.php?11216-Fetzer-gets-a-listing-in-Urban-Dictionary-Fetzering-is-a-term-for-talking-balls.&p=65326#post65326

Edited for clarity.