Myra Bronstein
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Posts posted by Myra Bronstein
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"According to Robert Bryce: "Vietnam made Bell Helicopters". ""
And LBJ made Bell Helicopters. Weren't they almost bankrupt before LBJ made them?
And, Hughies, too. Compliments of Hughes Aircraft Industries, Inc.Damn, Myra! I couldn't have said it better than you did. Bravo, girl!
Oh, Hughes. I'll have to look into that. Thanks Terry.
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Hmmmmmmmm?
OP-ED CONTRIBUTOR
Single Bullet, Single Gunman
By GERALD POSNER
A never-before-seen home movie showing President John F.
Kennedy's motorcade just before his assassination
definitively resolves one of the case's enduring
controversies.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/02/21/opinion/...l?th&emc=th
February 21, 2007
Op-Ed Contributor
Single Bullet, Single Gunman
By GERALD POSNER
THE ability to use advanced forensics and minuscule traces of DNA to
solve crimes, even cold cases decades old, has turned many Americans
into armchair sleuths seeking to “solve” the unexpected deaths of
people like Princess Diana and Anna Nicole Smith. But sometimes,
old-fashioned evidence is as useful in solving puzzles as anything
under a nuclear microscope.
...
Gerald Posner is the author of “Case Closed: Lee Harvey Oswald and the
Assassination of J.F.K.”
...
Note the framing in the opening paragraph:
"cold cases decades old, has turned many Americans into armchair sleuths seeking to “solve” the unexpected deaths of
people like Princess Diana and Anna Nicole Smith." So JFK assassination researchers are lumped in with readers of trashy tabloids obsessing on Anna Nicole Smith. And they sneer at researchers into Princess Diana's murcer while they're at it.
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Warm up your sneer Gerald.
"Mohamed al-Fayed brands British royals Diana's "murderers" By Anna Tomforde
dpa German Press Agency
Published: Friday March 2, 2007
By Anna Tomforde
London- Harrods-owner Mohamed al-Fayed Friday described
Britain's royal family as "gangsters and murderers" after winning a
major legal victory in his campaign for a public investigation into
the death of his late son, Dodi, with Princess Diana, in Paris in
August 1997.
In a move described as "sensational" by commentators, three High
Court judges in London ruled that an official British inquest into
the death of the couple should be heard by a jury of 12 men and women
chosen from the public.
They overturned an earlier decision by Judge Elizabeth Butler-
Sloss, the deputy royal coroner, that she should sit without a jury
during proceedings expected to start in May.
...
Al-Fayed, who owns the Harrods luxury department store and also
the Ritz Hotel in Paris, from where Dodi and Diana set out before
their fatal journey, has always maintained that the couple were
killed by British "state agents" because Diana was expecting a
"Muslim child" from his son.
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"Diana was the people's princess. The people must be allowed to
hear all the evidence and then, and only then, decide how she died,
why she died and who ordered her murder," said al-Fayed Friday.
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The decision is seen as a blow to the royal family who had hoped
that the conspiracy theories would die down following a British
police report that the crash was a "tragic accident."..."
http://rawstory.com/news/dpa/Mohamed_al_Fa...y_03022007.html
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Speaking of which, has the investigation of who/how killed Litvenenko progressed? I think not.... It seems to have disappeared from the news...like so many 'news' items when not new and not about nothing [star or starlette scandal, for example], but about control groups in powerful countries taking 'care of [their] business of control'.
Sure it's progressed:
"Expert in Russian poisoning case is shot
FBI joins investigation but officials think it's just local crime
Pete Williams
Justice correspondent
WASHINGTON - FBI agents say they are assisting police in suburban Washington who are investigating the shooting of a Russian expert — a man who spoke out on "Dateline NBC" last weekend and strongly suggested that remnants of the KGB were responsible for the bizarre poisoning death of Alexander Litvinenko.
The Russian expert, Paul Joyal, was shot Thursday night as he got out of his car in front of his house in Adelphi, Md. Investigators in Prince Georges County say a witness claims to have seen two men running away after the shooting. Joyal remains hospitalized with a gunshot wound to the midsection. Authorities have not said whether they've been able to talk to him.
Joyal is a long-time consultant on security and Russian affairs. From 1980 to 1989, he was director of security for the Senate Intelligence Committee.
On last weekend's "Dateline," he said of Litvenenko's death: "A message has been communicated to anyone who wants to speak out against the Kremlin: 'If you do, no matter who you are, where you are, we will find you and we will silence you — in the most horrible way possible.'"
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In an odd twist, another person who appeared on the "Dateline" broadcast died of a heart attack last month. Reporter Daniel McGrory of the Times of London, who has written about the Litvinenko case, died Feb. 20, before the "Dateline" segment was broadcast. He was 54.
His family said he "died suddenly at home."
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Kick. (Update flag didn't work.)
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Speaking of which, has the investigation of who/how killed Litvenenko progressed? I think not.... It seems to have disappeared from the news...like so many 'news' items when not new and not about nothing [star or starlette scandal, for example], but about control groups in powerful countries taking 'care of [their] business of control'.
Sure it's progressed:
"Expert in Russian poisoning case is shot
FBI joins investigation but officials think it's just local crime
Pete Williams
Justice correspondent
WASHINGTON - FBI agents say they are assisting police in suburban Washington who are investigating the shooting of a Russian expert — a man who spoke out on "Dateline NBC" last weekend and strongly suggested that remnants of the KGB were responsible for the bizarre poisoning death of Alexander Litvinenko.
The Russian expert, Paul Joyal, was shot Thursday night as he got out of his car in front of his house in Adelphi, Md. Investigators in Prince Georges County say a witness claims to have seen two men running away after the shooting. Joyal remains hospitalized with a gunshot wound to the midsection. Authorities have not said whether they've been able to talk to him.
Joyal is a long-time consultant on security and Russian affairs. From 1980 to 1989, he was director of security for the Senate Intelligence Committee.
On last weekend's "Dateline," he said of Litvenenko's death: "A message has been communicated to anyone who wants to speak out against the Kremlin: 'If you do, no matter who you are, where you are, we will find you and we will silence you — in the most horrible way possible.'"
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In an odd twist, another person who appeared on the "Dateline" broadcast died of a heart attack last month. Reporter Daniel McGrory of the Times of London, who has written about the Litvinenko case, died Feb. 20, before the "Dateline" segment was broadcast. He was 54.
His family said he "died suddenly at home."
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Arthur Schlesinger once commented on the American's people tendacy to resort to violent action (a subject recently discussed on the forum). He traced this back to a society that embraced slavery and the resulting impact on ideas about equality. He added that the American people also had to "face up to the schism between our national instincts for aggression and our national capacity for civility and idealism".
Oh yeah. In the US we're constantly programmed to believe this country was built on democratic ideals. In fact it was built on twin pillars of:
-Slavery. In spite of the Declaration of Independence claim that "All men are created equal." What a whopper of a lie. Guys in powdered wigs ranting about the horrors of taxation without representation and dumping tea into a harbor. Later generations owning slaves.
-Denying the riff-raff the right to pick their president by concocting the Electoral College. I can't describe this any better than Gore Vidal (I can't describe anything better than Gore Vidal):
"I happen to be something of a student of the American constitution --it was set up in order to avoid majority rule. The two things the founding fathers hated were majoritarian rule and monarchy. So they devised a republic in which only a very few white men of property could vote. Then, to make sure that we never had any democracy at work at the highest levels of governance, they created something called the electoral college, which can break any change that might upset them. We saw what happened in November 2000, when Albert Gore won the popular vote by 600,000, he actually won the electoral vote of Florida, but a lot of dismal things happened and denied him the election. So that's what happened there. So for us to talk about a democracy that we are going to translate into other lands is the height of hypocrisy and is simply foolish."
http://www.counterpunch.org/vidal03142003.html
-And as Gore says, the refusal to let anyone but white men vote. (Ok, I said "twin pillars" then listed three; so sue me.)
Was any country ever built on a bigger foundation of hypocrisy?
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Here's how I think the assassination may have happened:
Kennedy had an array of enemies. A president always does. Each faction of enemies was used in some way in the plot to kill him. That way, the dog continually chases its tail. Research never gets very far. Or, at least, moves very, very slowly.
The Mafia
Texas
Anti-Castro Cubans
The Military
The CIA
Researchers see someone involved from one of these groups (or others) and wrongly conclude that is who ordered the murder.
But, I think those that gave the order to kill JFK were insulated and removed themselves from the actual process of carrying outhis assassination. It's the old magician's trick of having the audience watch the right hand while the left performs the "magic".
Now, what was the most powerful element in the US in 1963? Who was the most powerful man of that element? Was it/he at odds with Kennedy? Over what? Would this powerful man/element have had the use and ties to Texas, The Mafia, Cubans, the Military? Intell?
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John McCloy and Allen Dulles, I think, were central to the plot. But there was a higher power at work.
Who did these two work for?
Good overview. I'll add that there were higher powerS at work, spanning the "military industrial" complex that President Eisenhower warned about after waking up from his eight-year Rip Van-Winkle nap to hand the leash of a rabid dog to President Kennedy (yeah, I know Ike was sick a lot), after the heir apparent, Nixon, blew it in spite of Prescott's string-pulling.
Industrial--First and foremost. At one level nascent war-profiteers/Johnson puppeteers Brown & Root/Halliburton and Bell Helicoptor. Also oil moguls HL Hunt & Sons and Clint Murchison and Sid Richardson (all from Texas). At a higher level bankers like Brown Bros Harriman (and JP Morgan--now JP Morgan Chase--still smarting over their failure to overthrow FDR?). At an even higher level the Rockefellers.
Legal--The first level of defense for the Industrial faction. McCloy, who I knew nothing about before this thread, was a Harvard (Ivy League CIA) lawyer for the ruling class, head of the World Bank (ahem, a predecessor to Wolfowitz...). He does seem to have a helluva pedigree--purebred fascist. Ah prairie-xxxx, I'll just say it; he was a Nazi.
Banking--And money laundering. Especially laundering. McCloy was president of the Rockefeller's Chase Manhattan Bank.
http://www.maebrussell.com/Mae%20Brussell%...K%20Assass.html
" McCloy had long been involved in the murky world of espionage, intrigue and Nazis. He spent the decade of the 1930s working out of Paris. Much of his time was spent on a law case stemming from German sabotage in World War I. His investigation took him to Berlin, where he shared a box with Hitler at the 1936 Olympics. He was in contact with Rudolph Hess before the Nazi leader made a mysterious flight to England in 1941....When JFK moved to lower the oil depletion allowance, he incurred the displeasure of John McCloy, whose clients' profits would be trimmed. Hoover, Dulles and McCloy did not belong to the Kennedy fan club. When the president was shot, Hoover controlled the field investigation, and Dulles and McCloy helped mold the final verdict of the Warren Commission."
Then there's Prescott Bush and his laundering activities for the Nazis via Union Bank.
Intelligence--The covert enforcement/assassination branch of the Industrial faction, including friends of Prescott like the treasonous Dulles Bros, and comprised of the NSA/CIA/individual military branches. The co-second level of defense, along with the Military.
Propaganda--CIA Mockingbirds in the media. Were there actual PR firms involved?
Military--The overt enforcement branch of the Industrial faction via Joint Chiefs (?) who were still fuming over the President's rejection of Operation Northwoods and dumping of Chairman Lemnitzer. The co-second level of defense, along with the CIA/Mafia.
Others in this thread are discussing the specific individuals possibly involved (like John "the Constitution is just a scrap of paper to me" McCloy). http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USAmccloyJ.htm
"As John D. Rockefeller Jr. told his personal lawyer, Thomas M. Debevoise, "McCloy knows so many people in government
circles... that he might be in the way to get information in various quarters about the matter without seeking it, or
revealing his hand."
Contractors--Hired or duped hit-men/muscle including mobsters and (as Stan noted, and Larry Hancock wrote about in "Someone Would Have Talked") misguided gullible (my terms, not Larry's) anti-Castro Cubans.
Congressional--The front-men for the Industrial fascists. Among them Lyndon Johnson who never would have given up his
Majority Leader position if he didn't know he would quickly advance beyond VP, and good ol' boy "Winkin'" Albert Thomas (both
from Texas).
Organizational 1/National-International--Council on Foreign Relations. "From 1954 to 1970, [McCloy] was chairman of the prestigious Council on Foreign Relations in New York, to be succeeded by David Rockefeller, who had worked closely with him at the Chase Bank. McCloy had a long association with the Rockefeller family, going back to his early Harvard days when he taught the young Rockefeller brothers how to sail. He was also a member of the Draper Committee, formed in 1958 by Eisenhower."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_J._McCloy
"The earliest origin of the Council stemmed from a working fellowship of distinguished scholars, tasked to brief President
Woodrow Wilson [who was supposedly the first president to extensively use propaganda, and was supposedly admired by Harry (Pendergast puppet/bomb-dropper/CIA creator/World Bank inventor/original Cold Warrier) Truman (the buck really does stop there)] about options for the postwar world when Germany was defeated. Through 1917-18, this academic band, a prominent member of whom was Wilson's closest adviser
Edward M. House, as well as Walter Lippmann, gathered discreetly at 155th Street and Broadway in New York City, to assemble the strategy for the postwar world. This band of scholars then travelled to the Paris Peace Conference, 1919...The Americans who subsequently returned from the conference became drawn to a discreet club of New York financiers and international lawyers who had organized previously in June 1918 and was headed by Elihu Root; this select group called itself the Council on Foreign Relations. They joined this group and the Council was formally established in New York on July 29, 1921, with 108 founding members, including Elihu Root as a leading member and John W. Davis, the personal attorney for J. P. Morgan, as its founding president. Other luminaries included John Foster Dulles, Herbert Lehman, Henry Stimson, Averell Harriman and the Rockefeller family's public relations expert, Ivy Lee.
The Council initially had strong connections to the Morgan interests, such as the lawyer, Paul Cravath, whose pre-eminent New York law firm (later named Cravath, Swaine & Moore) represented Morgan businesses; and a Morgan partner, Russell Leffingwell, later becoming its first chairman. Over time, however, the locus of power shifted inexorably to the Rockefeller family."
Organizational 2/Texas epicenter--Texas & the 8F klan. Texas was of course the nation-state that served as the ideal incubator for evil. "As the historian, Robert A. Caro has pointed out in Lyndon Johnson: The Path to Power: "Texans were elected on December 7, 1931, not only to the Speakership of the House but to the chairmanship of five of its most influential committees, Lyndon Johnson's first day in the Capitol was the day Texas came to power in it - a power that the state was to hold, with only the
briefest interruptions, for more than thirty years."
http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKgroup8F.htm
"The assassination of John F. Kennedy brought an end to this proposal to bring an end to the oil depletion allowance. The
Suite 8F Group also did very well out of the escalation of the Vietnam War. They formed a new company called RMK-BRJ to
obtain these contracts. This included Halliburton who took over Brown & Root in 1962. These contracts included building jet
runways, dredging channels for ships, hospitals, prisons, communications facilities, and building American bases from Da Nang
to Saigon. RMK-BRJ did 97% of the construction work in Vietnam. The other 3% went to local Vietnamese contractors. Between
1965 and 1972 Brown & Root (Halliburton) alone obtained revenues of $380 million from its work in Vietnam.
...
Another company associated with the Suite 8F Group also did well out of the Vietnam War. Bell Helicopter Corporation began
producing the UH-1. It could climb 2,000 feet per minute and could fly at 125 miles per hour for about three hours. It could
carry nine fully equipped soldiers and a crew of four. By 1969 Bell Helicopter Corporation was selling nearly $600 million
worth of helicopters to the United States Military. According to Robert Bryce: "Vietnam made Bell Helicopters". "
Alright, just a first stab at a first draft. Many more drafts needed.
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There have been rumors over the last few years, that the DOD
had drawn up plans to use Army troops to put down any uprised
following the assassination. The question is, were these troops already
in the air prior to the assassination? The code name given was "Operation
Big Lift" which I have on 16mm footage. According to the DOD, this
operation was to send US troops over to Germany.
johnw
I must be out of phase.
Was "Big Lift" (if true) meant to deal with possible uprising in Europe or in the US?
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I pretty much said it in the Topic fields.
Would the mods be open to accepting donations to help defray the cost of running this forum?
Ideally it would accept paypal, so it'd be easy to donate.
Thanks for the offer but as Andy points out it is not necessary yet. However, it might be needed if Les Albiston carries out his threat to sue the forum.
People are just queuing up to sue you John.
Well, thanks everyone for the input. I just wanted to propose it.
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I pretty much said it in the Topic fields.
Would the mods be open to accepting donations to help defray the cost of running this forum?
Ideally it would accept paypal, so it'd be easy to donate.
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Rich has announced that past images posted on JFKresearch over the years
will now be accessible through a new and ongoing feature open to all researchers.
Click on:
http://www.jfkresearch.com/page9.htm
You will find this a valuable research tool. It feature images that go back to
the beginning of Rich's forum.
John...this would be a good addition to your links page.
Jack
Thank you Jack. And thank you to Rich, who I don't actually know.
They now have a msg that the forum is active again. Does anyone know for sure if it's true? I never received a reply in the past when I tried to register.
Myra...are you were using the new forum address and not the old one? Click on:
http://www.jfkresearch.com/forum3/index.php
You should be able to read all posted topics. You will not be able to respond
to CERTAIN TOPICS unless you are a paid member. Rich's site is party supported
by an annual "donation" from researchers who desire full membership. Exemptions
are available for students and retirees upon valid request. If you have a problem
joining, let me know and I will inform Rich. Because of medical problems, Rich is
largely confined to a wheel chair nowadays, and running his website is his main
therapy.
Jack
Thank you so much for your help Jack....
I think you probably helped a lot.
I now have full member access. Brag.
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His lucid insights will be missed.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070301/ap_on_...3UwNPjfGN2s0NUE
Only recently I came across a newspaper account from 1966 in which Schlesinger called for a new investigation of the assassination. Richard Goodwin did as well. Both supported Bobby in 68. I suspect Talbot's book will get into Bobby's feelings about the Warren Commission and the assassination in general, and state that Bobby, under the influence of Schlesinger, Goodwin, and Mankiewicz, planned on re-investigating the case, if elected.
I'm seriously looking forward to Talbot's book. Between his creation of Salon, the best journalism site on the web, and his apparent dedication to truth about President Kennedy, he's making a mighty fine impression.
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Rich has announced that past images posted on JFKresearch over the years
will now be accessible through a new and ongoing feature open to all researchers.
Click on:
http://www.jfkresearch.com/page9.htm
You will find this a valuable research tool. It feature images that go back to
the beginning of Rich's forum.
John...this would be a good addition to your links page.
Jack
Thank you Jack. And thank you to Rich, who I don't actually know.
They now have a msg that the forum is active again. Does anyone know for sure if it's true? I never received a reply in the past when I tried to register.
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Stan
It is my contention that the conspirators had already made the decission to assassinate the President no later than June of 1963. I also believe that Taylor may have been one of the two primary decission makers in this event.
Deflecting quilt to the CIA would be, perhaps, a natural thing for the conspirators to attempt and may well have been part of the plan for the coverup. It is my contention that Oswald's attempt to contact "John Hurt," while in captivity for the assassination, forced the CIA to fall into line with the coup.
If Oswald's trip to the Soviet Union had in fact been a CIA counter intelligence operation, it would be impossible for the CIA to explain how one of there own (whose movements they were monitoring) assassinated the President and then attempted to contact an NSA employee while in custody.
Thoughts.....
Jim Root
It's good to consider alternative explanations so that I don't get tunnel vision, given my certainty that the CIA was in charge.
If nothing else I shouldn't downplay the role of military "intelligence" in the murder.
But, Jim, how do you reconcile your thoughts with the evidence that seems to point to the CIA like a flashing neon sign?
Like the fact that the mayor of Dallas (Earle?) was the brother of (Charles) Cabell--the Deputy Director of the CIA who was fired by the President. And the many photos of CIA thugs (or twins) in Dealey Plaza (and the Ambassador Hotel in 1968):
http://www.manuscriptservice.com/FFiDP/ (Hey, it moved.)
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This material supports my theory, not only in its general content
"what Bobby said" but also by the implications of the back channel.
In other words, Kruschev, the KGB and probably the US joint agencies
had prior knowledge of all this and circulated memos concerning
these security violations, lapses, breaches, what have you.
When Americans in the Cold War even communicated with Soviets,
the REACTION was often greater than the INITIAL ACTION.
_____________________
Great info in this thread. The truth is out there and is emerging.
Dawn
I was just about to post this exact sentiment.
Thanks Stan. I knew about the Krock article but not about either of the RFK blurbs you posted. Great work.
And now I have yet another book to read: One Hell of a Gamble.
The conflicting forecasts of CIA vs Military perps is confusing though. Could the explanation be as simple as the gradual emergence of knowledge about the enemy(ies) within, or as complex as misdirection from one of the two conflicting sources?
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http://www.nytimes.com/2007/02/28/washingt...IMYF3HYXWYMFHlg
"By DOUGLAS MARTIN
Published: February 28, 2007
Arthur M. Schlesinger Jr., the historian whose more than 20 books shaped discussions for two generations about America’s past, and who himself was a provocative, unabashedly liberal partisan, most notably in serving in the Kennedy White House, died last night in Manhattan. He was 89.
The cause was a heart attack, said Mr. Schlesinger’s son Stephen. He died at New York Downtown Hospital after being stricken in a restaurant.
Twice awarded the Pulitzer Prize and the National Book Award, Mr. Schlesinger exhaustively examined the administrations of two prominent presidents, Andrew Jackson and Franklin Delano Roosevelt, against a vast background of regional and economic rivalries. He strongly argued that strong individuals like Jackson and Roosevelt could bend history.
The notes he took for President John F. Kennedy to use in writing his own history, became, after the president’s assassination, grist for Mr. Schlesinger’s own “A Thousand Days: John F. Kennedy in the White House,” winner of both the Pulitzer and a National Book Award in 1966.
His 1978 book on the president’s brother, “Robert Kennedy and His Times,” lauded the subject as the most politically creative man of his time, but acknowledged that Robert had played a larger role in trying to overthrow Castro than the author had acknowledged in “A Thousand Days.”
Mr. Schlesinger worked on both brothers’ presidential campaigns, and some critics suggested he had trouble separating history from sentiment. Gore Vidal called “A Thousand Days” a political novel, and many noted that the book ignored the president’s sexual wanderings. Others were unhappy he told so much, particularly taking the unusual step of claiming that the president was unhappy with his secretary of state, Dean Rusk.
..."
Long article. Just a brief excerpt above.
It's NYTimes, so read it while it's free.
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Another new image taken prior to Dealey Plaza on sell at eBay.
Sweet
johnw
Um, care to share a link?
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Isn't this just a big waste of time?
Why not just start a real page on LHO, or Ruby and make it the authorative site on the internet?
Doesn't this web site have an bio encyclopedia of important people?
Why not update that to the max instead of jerking around with the Winacrapers?
There's a need to retype to digial the thousands of pages of WC/HSCA docs, for anyone who has a lot of spare time and nothing to research.
Not to disuade anyone from keeping those guys honest, apparently a daily exercise, I think there's a lot of better things to do.
BK
Well yeah, Spartacus is the authoritative site on JFK and more.
But the existence of a few good sites doesn't mean that we needn't fight internet propaganda.
Just like the existence of a few good books like "Someone Would Have Talked" and "Plausible Denial" doesn't mean we needn't fight propaganda (hi Bugliosi!) in the publishing world.
Wiki has a lot of traffic and is wrongly considered "authoritative" by the deluded demographic.
If they're gonna continue their right-wing ways we can at least try to change it and/or document it in this public forum if they refuse to be objective.
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wouldnt you know it, as soon as i changed the information on Lee Harvey Oswald , a day later the EXACT same drivel as before that was posted is now back up. Im going to write up a detailed analysis of LHO, Clay Shaw, Jim Garrison, The Warren Commission and whenever it is changed back to its original form i shall change it back.
An example of the eye that watchers over.
john
This is a great project John(s). Though I'm confused. John G. are you still looking for volunteers or are you doing the pages you listed on your own?
I'm eager to take a shot at this. I have had one experience trying to get the propaganda on Hugo Chavez changed, and as a result I admit that I'm skeptical that they'll let us dilute their propaganda. But we still gotta try.
Hm, perhaps we could keep building on this thread by posting the updates we submit, then the short and long term results. In addition to having copies of what we submit, as John S. advised, we'd have a journal of sorts. So for better or worse trends over time should become obvious.
Go to the JFK related articles and change it as you see fit for better accuracy/
I wonder if that's the best approach.
That could result in 20 people covering one topic and 0 covering another.
Also, if my incredibly brilliant journal idea is implemented (the phrase "cold day in hell" comes to mind) then it'd be harder to maintain with the swarm approach.
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wouldnt you know it, as soon as i changed the information on Lee Harvey Oswald , a day later the EXACT same drivel as before that was posted is now back up. Im going to write up a detailed analysis of LHO, Clay Shaw, Jim Garrison, The Warren Commission and whenever it is changed back to its original form i shall change it back.
An example of the eye that watchers over.
john
This is a great project John(s). Though I'm confused. John G. are you still looking for volunteers or are you doing the pages you listed on your own?
I'm eager to take a shot at this. I have had one experience trying to get the propaganda on Hugo Chavez changed, and as a result I admit that I'm skeptical that they'll let us dilute their propaganda. But we still gotta try.
Hm, perhaps we could keep building on this thread by posting the updates we submit, then the short and long term results. In addition to having copies of what we submit, as John S. advised, we'd have a journal of sorts. So for better or worse trends over time should become obvious.
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I just downloaded Progeny's Timeline Maker, though only the demo version. It, and others, are available at download.com for any interested. http://www.download.com/3120-20_4-0.html?t...ne&tag=srch
It is a simple enough process, all you have to do is add the event, its date, a source (as Ashton suggested on another thread), which timeline it came from and whatever perameters you wish. Once you write the date it will automatically sort it into its proper place. It can then be viewed as a proper chronology or in a timeline chart, which can serve to compare concurrent events.
You can place each event into categories e.g. Lee Harvey Oswald, and then sort them according to that topic.
I doubt that it is as sophisticated as the methods as employed by Ashton and whoever he is working with, it would nevertheless be an attainable goal. The entries required to make it worth while would be voluminous.
So there are a few in's and out's for those that wish to know.
All the best,
John
Thanks for that timeline URL John. I've got so much timeline material accumulated that it's getting out of control.
And I want to esp recommend one timeline that's already listed in the first post in this thread. But it's so excellent that it warrants another mention:
- Ira David Wood III – http://www.assassinationresearch.com/v2n1/chronol.pdf.
It's a keeper. Just excellent. It was a lotta lotta work and it shows.
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http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKhuntHL.htm[/url]
http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKbrading.htm
That is one of the few times that I've ever seen Jim Garrison fooled. He said, in On the Trail of the Assassins, that he thought Braden was placed in the plaza as a red herring, to fool people into wrongly believing oil money was in the mix. Gotta disagree with big Jim on this one.
HL Hunt and that hideous Lamar son and that other son Whatsisname had the President's blood all over them. Not sure about Murchison... but probably. (When Nixon referred to "The Texans" I think he meant Hunt and Murchison. Input on this point is welcome & appreciated.)
Myra, I've studied Jim Braden pretty closely, probably more than anybody else, and since he's still alive, I'm anxious to interview him if I can.
I not only don't see any evidence that he's a lacky for the Hunts, I don't believe he ever knew or met any of them.
While he was in the oil business, and was in Dallas, he didn't visit the Hunt offices with his pals, Morgan Brown, et al., but instead, checked in with the parole office in Dallas on the morning of the assassination.
Braden was certainly a player, he was perifial, and just got caught in the post-assassination drag net.
If you can show me how he's a lacky for the Hunts, I'd be open to a convincer.
BK
I'll see if I can find evidence BK. In fact that's an area of research I should be more focused on. Proving (or otherwise) such a direct link to the Hunt klan would be huge, IMO, since I care about (as we often say here) who paid for the bullets as opposed to who fired the--many many--bullets (from many many guns).
However, I have a hard time believing that a known criminal exiting the Dal-Tex building immediately after the assassination of our President was just in a building in which shots were fired by coincidence. So whether or not he was a Hunt lacky, I don't consider his presence in that locale to be peripheral. He just stopped by to find a phone he said? Oh puh-leeze. I really can't concur with you on that. He may well have been one of the shooters.
Well, back to the Hunt/Braden (Brading) link... I'm on the case.
Myra,
Jim Braden is not a shooter, never shot anyone in his life, never arrested for any violent crime ever, probably didn't even know how to shoot. Whoever shot JFK was a real pro. Braden was conman, embezzeler, oil wildcatter, womenizer, golfer and New Orleans resident in the summer of '63. He was not a shooter.
There may be a Hunt/Braden link other than via Morgan Brown. If so I'd like to see it.
I'd also like to know his address and phone number so I could give him a call and maybe stop by and chat before he kicks off.
I'd also like to know why Duncan MacRae thinks there's a resembalance between the photos he's posted and if he knows who the person is (people are)?
BK
Are you at all interested in addressing the issue of this, "perifial" [sic] player being at the scene of the crime BK?
Do you still contend he was peripheral?
When you state that he "just got caught in the post-assassination drag net," are you saying his presence in the plaza when the President was being murdered was coincidental?
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http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKhuntHL.htm[/url]
http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKbrading.htm
That is one of the few times that I've ever seen Jim Garrison fooled. He said, in On the Trail of the Assassins, that he thought Braden was placed in the plaza as a red herring, to fool people into wrongly believing oil money was in the mix. Gotta disagree with big Jim on this one.
HL Hunt and that hideous Lamar son and that other son Whatsisname had the President's blood all over them. Not sure about Murchison... but probably. (When Nixon referred to "The Texans" I think he meant Hunt and Murchison. Input on this point is welcome & appreciated.)
Myra, I've studied Jim Braden pretty closely, probably more than anybody else, and since he's still alive, I'm anxious to interview him if I can.
I not only don't see any evidence that he's a lacky for the Hunts, I don't believe he ever knew or met any of them.
While he was in the oil business, and was in Dallas, he didn't visit the Hunt offices with his pals, Morgan Brown, et al., but instead, checked in with the parole office in Dallas on the morning of the assassination.
Braden was certainly a player, he was perifial, and just got caught in the post-assassination drag net.
If you can show me how he's a lacky for the Hunts, I'd be open to a convincer.
BK
I'll see if I can find evidence BK. In fact that's an area of research I should be more focused on. Proving (or otherwise) such a direct link to the Hunt klan would be huge, IMO, since I care about (as we often say here) who paid for the bullets as opposed to who fired the--many many--bullets (from many many guns).
However, I have a hard time believing that a known criminal exiting the Dal-Tex building immediately after the assassination of our President was just in a building in which shots were fired by coincidence. So whether or not he was a Hunt lacky, I don't consider his presence in that locale to be peripheral. He just stopped by to find a phone he said? Oh puh-leeze. I really can't concur with you on that. He may well have been one of the shooters.
Well, back to the Hunt/Braden (Brading) link... I'm on the case.
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a last effort to market his name and make some money for his kids.
Did he ever get his kids straightened out about where he was on 11/22/63? He testified that he had trouble convincing them that he wasn't in Dallas, when he had testified earlier that the kids were with him that day. I imagine this only confused the kids more than ever.
Ron
As you know, Mark Lane's PLAUSIBLE DENIAL tells the story in detail.
Hunt claimed to sue the newspaper because the suggestion he was part of the Kennedy
assassination was hurtful to his children, who saw him in Washington on 11/22/63.......
but when put on the stand the kids said he was gone all weekend, so he had no alibi.......
I don't believe that Lane ever put Hunt's kids on the st
What won the case for Lane is that Hunt's defense was entirely based on Hunt's whereabouts on Nov 22, '63.
They managed to get some BS "alibi" from other CIA spooks that they saw him in DC that day, not in Dallas.
So Lane brilliantly decided to focus on proving Hunt was in Dallas the night of Nov 21.
He got a deposition from CIA asset Marita Lorenz placing Hunt (and Sturgis) in Dallas, handing out money or weapons or both to various thugs at some motel hours before the murder.
The jury found that there was sufficient proof that Hunt was in Dallas on Nov 21, '63. Therefore, the CIA was involved in President Kennedy's murder. We don't hear much about that in the media do we?
The jury forewoman Leslie Armstrong stated to reporters:
"Mr. Lane was asking us to do something very difficult. He was asking us to believe that John Kennedy had been killed by our own government. Yet when we examined the evidence closely, we were compelled to conclude that the CIA had indeed killed President Kennedy."
http://www.skepticfiles.org/socialis/jfklane.htm
(Oh, and I don't believe Hunt ever got his own kids to believe his lie about his Nov 22 whereabouts. I think it remained a big issue between them.)
Myra,
If my memory serves.
After Mark Lane questioned the alibi's given by Hunts Company buddies, Mark asked Hunt directly why he would not call the people who could give him a cast iron alibi. His children, who Mr Hunt said he had spent the afternoon with in the family home watching the the events of the day unfold on TV.
Chris Brown
That makes sense Chris. It would be a logical question for a lawyer to ask. And Lane seems like a damn good lawyer.
Do you recall what lie Hunt used to explain why his children weren't testifying for him? Were they too young at that point?
A Military Takeover Of The United States?
in JFK Assassination Debate
Posted
Well, Chicago and Tampa were selected too--supposedly.