Judyth Baker

RIGHTING THE WRONGS WRUNG FROM TRIVIALITIES BY MR. REITZES Dave Reitzes has made statements which he believes points out inconsistencies in my testimony and narrative. I have made replies to these statements. Some are repeated over and over again because of the repetitive nature of Reitzes presentation of inconsistencies? -most of which will be seen to be nonsense. If anyone thinks, after reading my replies, that Mr. Reitzes might have done well to have done a bit of research before posing these fugues of questions, I wholeheartedly agree, since most of his inconsistencies are based on a lack of research and insight rather than on any truly meaningful deviations from consistency, as will be shown, in ample detail, below. Hopefully, this will be the final word concerning taking anything Mr. Reitzes writes seriously. Judyth Vary Baker, written from Europe, October, 2004 RIGHTING THE WRONGS WRUNG FROM TRIVIALITIES BY MR. REITZES REITZES BEGINS: Judyth Vary Baker worked for the CIA on an anti-Castro assassination project, and she can prove it. (1) Judyth was never an employee or agent of the CIA, and never said she was.(2) STATEMENT: I was used by Dr. Alton Ochsner in his get-Castro project. Was I, thereby, working for the CIA? As an asset, I suppose, but unwittingly. I was aware of CIA interest in all the anti-Castro activities going on in New Orleans. The city was a hotbed of CIA activity, too, and to contend that Ochsner had no connections whatsoever with the CIA at this time, when he was making almost weekly trips to Washington, D.C., was unthinkable to me. How much was personal effort and how much sponsored by the CIA, I do not know, but the relationships between Ochsner and anti-Castro government efforts was real. Judyth was introduced to Lee Oswald one day in New Orleans. (3) It was due to a series of events involving her relationship with Dr. Mary Sherman that Judyth came to meet Oswald. (4) No one introduced Judyth and Oswald, and their meeting had nothing to do with Mary Sherman; Judyth and Oswald met purely by chance. (5) Or maybe not. (6) STATEMENT: I originally believed our meeting was accidental, but it might not have been, since Ochsner may have been concerned about my having arrived two weeks early, and the fact that I was a lone female in a rough town. Dr. Sherman was out of town, so I could not be helped by her. Since I resembled Marina, Lee might have been sent to meet me to help babysit me, for all I know. Or maybe not. Apparently Mr. Reitzes does not allow me to make any speculations. Why? Oswald worked for the CIA on an anti-Castro assassination project (and others),and Judyth can prove it. (7) Oswald may not have worked for the CIA after all. (8) STATEMENT: Lee told me he had been borrowed by the CIA from another agency, which he refused to name. He had volunteered to come to New Orleans to work on several undercover projects, but they were not assassination-of-Castro projects. His concerns were anti-Castro projects, especially identifying pro-Castroites and to establish firm pro-Castro credentials for himself. He was also supposed to help make a training film, being very interested in photography and having some experience in that field. He became involved in my anti-Castro associated activities, which focused on a get-Castro assassination plot, in order to spend more time with me. There is no doubt in my mind that Dr. Ochsner, the force behind the get-Castro project in New Orleans, had CIA connections. A photograph published in the Warren Commission Report shows Judyth standing next to Oswald. (9) CORRECTION: No, not standing next to Lee, but in the same general area as Lee - iF that person is me. The face is too blurry to be certain. The pavement sloped upward there, as I have proven with other photos, but I cannot prove this woman is me. Though have never been 100% certain the woman was me, I remember talking to the two girls shown in the footage under consideration. In any case, Lee simply happens to be nearby, and there is little, if any, interaction with the woman, beyond a smile in her direction as he approaches with flyers. I do not remember being filmed, but was warned that filming was taking place, and to leave at once, a warning which Lee gave to me. The fact is that Lee is coming closer to the woman in the footage under consideration, and it is possible that he was about to tell me to leave. The incident happened too many years ago for me to be more specific in these claims, as I have no proof that this woman is actually me, beyond my speculation that it may have been me, as I had two dresses similar or exactly the same as the dress worn by the lady in question, and have photos of one of those dresses showing its close similarity to the dress in the footage. There are no photographs depicting both Judyth and Oswald, and Judyth has never claimed otherwise. (10) STATEMENT: There are none now in existence. Judyth was free to carry on an affair with Oswald and work on the anti-Castro plot because the conspirators had arranged to get her husband, Robert Baker, a job that required his prolonged absence from home. (11) Robert Baker got a job that required his prolonged absence from home because he himself had requested such a position. The conspirators had nothing to do with his job. (12) Well, the conspirators MIGHT have had something to do with Robert Baker's job. (13) The conspirators kept Robert Baker away from home for prolonged periods, but only so long as he let them, which greatly upset Judyth. (14) STATEMENT: So far as I am aware, this was the best explanation for Robert's being hired by an oil company and being kept offshore so many weeks, mostly incommunicado. BUT - I recently read the back of a letter showing that Robert himself requested an out-of-town field work job, even though he knew I would be left alone in New Orleans if he accepted such a position. It was hard for me, for a long time, to believe Robert would deliberately request a job out of town as a newlywed, and I did try to make an excuse or two, that perhaps somebody such as Ochsner, who had friends in the oil industry such as Clint Murchison, arranged to keep Robert and me separated from each other. Dr. Ochsner definitely was upset that I was suddenly and unexpectedly married, and hoped I would get a divorce ASAP. So I did wonder at various times, until my recent review of the back of one of Robert's letters, if there had been some kind of planned attempt to separate us. Obviously, not! Mr. Reitzes does not give me the opportunity to speculate about this, but tries to make my concerns look inconsistent. Why does he do this? Judyth met Jack Ruby only once. (15) Judyth met Jack Ruby twice. (16) STATEMENT: I met Jack Ruby once, personally, for a significant period of time. I also saw Jack Ruby with Carlos Marcello and others, at a later date, at the 500 Club, and was in the same group as Jack Ruby while walking toward Clay Shaw's residence. However, there was no real interaction between Jack Ruby and me, so I do not count it as a true 'meeting.' Some people do count it as a 'meeting' because he did notice my presence, but I do not. David Atlee Phillips was one of Oswald's CIA handlers. (17) David Atlee Phillips may not have been one of Oswald's CIA handlers. (18) Oswald knew Phillips by name. (19) Oswald did not know Phillips by name. (20) STATEMENT: Lee Oswald heard the name ' Phillips' mentioned in the context of 'Bishop' during a meeting held on Reily premises. Lee told me when he returned to the car. I had heard the names at some point, but not in context with each other. .... ALL THE STATEMENTS (21-37) NUMBERED 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, AND 37 , are intended, I suppose, by Reitzes to show confusion, and indeed, they should show confusion, for Lee and I had no firm idea of the real name of Lee's handler. Is this some kind of crime? Oswald knew his handler as "Bishop." (21) Oswald did not know his handler as "Bishop." (22) "Bishop" was Phillips. (23) "Bishop" and Phillips may have been two different people. (24) Oswald said that Phillips was "Bishop." (25) Oswald never said that Phillips was "Bishop." (26) Oswald knew his handler as "Mr. B." (27) Oswald did not know his handler as "Mr. B." (28) "Mr. B" was Phillips. (29) "Mr. B" may not have been Phillips. (30) "Mr. B" may have been two different people, one of whom may have been Phillips. (31) "Mr. B" was also "Bishop." (32) "Mr. B" may not have been "Bishop." (33) Phillips was known as "Mr. Benson" or "Mr. Benton." (34) "Mr. Benson" or "Mr. Benton" may have been somebody else. (35) "Mr. B," "Mr. Bishop," and "Mr. Benson" or "Mr. Benton" were all the same person. (36) "Mr. B," "Mr. Bishop," and "Mr. Benson" or "Mr. Benton" may have been at least two different people. (37) Judyth (or possibly Oswald and Judyth both) overheard someone at the Reily company say that Phillips was "Bishop." (38) It was Oswald, not Judyth, who overheard someone at the Reily company say that Phillips was "Bishop"; Judyth was waiting in a car outside. (39) Judyth met Guy Banister just once. (40) Judyth met Guy Banister twice. (41) STATEMENT: I met Guy Banister on only one occasion, when I posed as Lee's wife and was introduced to him. I saw him later at some little distance from me on a second occasion where I know he saw me as well, in his building. Guy Banister was CIA. (42) Guy Banister was not CIA, and Judyth never said he was. (43) STATEMENT: Guy Banister had connections with the CIA. I have speculated, based on what I was told, that he was working in cooperation with the CIA and the FBI. Judyth was introduced to Clay Shaw on one occasion, saw him from a distance on another, and spoke with him once on the phone. Shaw paid for some of her hotel trysts with Oswald. (44) Judyth simply saw Clay Shaw on two occasions. (45) Judyth simply met Clay Shaw one time. (46) Judyth did not know Clay Shaw. (47) STATEMENT: I was introduced briefly to Clay Shaw once, and shook his hand. I later recognized him with others at The 500 Club, and Lee and I followed his group to his house, but did not enter there. Lee did know Clay Shaw. I do not consider this 'knowing' Clay Shaw. I was once introduced briefly to George W. Bush once, and shook his hand. I later recognized HIM at a Houston-area political meeting I covered as a reporter. That doesn't mean I know George W. Bush, even though we lived in the same city for almost two decades. Judyth knew Carlos Marcello, who affectionately referred to her as "That Little Thing." She and Oswald met with him personally, he picked up the tab for many of their dinners out, and it was due to his influence that she was never murdered by the conspirators who killed John F. Kennedy. (48) STATEMENT: I never 'knew' Carlos Marcello - in fact, I barely met him in a series of very brief encounters. Lee and I were confronted by Marcello and some of his friends and at least one lawyer while walking under the Colonnades at St. Louis Cathedral. Marcello was at first upset because I did not acknowledge his gesture of 'tipping' his face toward me as a polite gesture as we passed each other there. Then he laughed when he realized I hadn't recognized him at all. After he picked up our tab at The 500 Club once, every time we came in there after that, it was free. So were several other places we went to, after that. That's all I know. Judyth did not know Carlos Marcello, and she has never claimed that she did.(49) STATEMENT: Reitzes makes mountains out of thimblefuls. I met Marcello. Did I know him? Did you ever shake the hand of somebody famous? Did you know them personally? Oswald discussed Richard Case Nagell with Judyth in some detail, informing her he knew that Nagell, whom he referred to as one of his "doppelgangers," "had purposely gotten himself arrested for fear of being set up as a patsy." (50) Oswald may have never discussed Nagell with Judyth, and anyone who thinks Judyth has referred to Richard Case Nagell in her writings is only making an assumption. (51) STATEMENT: I only saw the name 'Nagell' and never heard the other part of the name. I assume Richard Case Nagell and 'Nagell' are the same person. Lee told me he shared information with this man and that both of them were in the same 'project' together. Other of my statements were made based on the name 'Hidell' which Lee mentioned in relation to Nagell as a name they shared in the project. I have made statements of speculation based on this basic knowledge. I also remember the word 'doppelganger' as used by Lee when describing his relationship with Nagell but that's about all I can remember. Lee knew that Nagell had been arrested. He probably told me this during one of our telephone conversations. Judyth's mentor was famed surgeon and humanitarian Dr. Alton Ochsner. For a time she worked for Ochsner. (52) Judyth never worked for Alton Ochsner and never claimed to. They had no formal relationship. (53) STATEMENT: I never worked DIRECTLY for Dr. Alton Ochsner. I have never claimed to. Dr. Ochsner mentored me in my cancer research educational progress between 1961 and 1963, as he had done for thousands of other medical students, though for very few pre-meds, and even fewer females. I was promised a summer internship with Dr. Mary Sherman, Ochsner's only female lab director, where he said I would feel more comfortable, and Dr. Ochsner did initially arrange those plans for me. He also promised to obtain an early admittance into medical school at Tulane for me (I was only a college sophomore and would thus skip two years) in the fall of 1963. Clay Shaw was closely involved in the anti-Castro plot with Ochsner and the others. (54) Clay Shaw was not closely involved in the anti-Castro plot with Ochsner and the others. (55) STATEMENT: I do not know the full extent of Clay Shaw's involvement in the Ochsner-directed plot, though he knew of it and condoned it and cooperated in some aspects, such as loaning the Cadillac, which he was himself required to drive in case of an accident, for the 'official car' look needed to enter the prisoner convoy coming from Angola. That he was involved to some degree is true. The plan was to inject Castro with deadly cancer cells and let him die a "natural" death from cancer. (56) The plan was to inject Castro with deadly cancer cells so it would APPEAR he died a natural death from cancer. (57) STATEMENT: The plan was to inject Castro with deadly cancer cells so it would APPEAR he died a natural death from cancer. Of course it would be described as a 'natural' death, as even today, uninformed people do not believe that death from cancer can be caused by specialized cancer injections. The plan was to kill Castro with a combination of cancer injections and X-ray radiation. (58) STATEMENT: Over-simplified, but basically, this was the plan. The plan was to kill Castro with a combination of cancer injections, X-ray radiation, and chemotherapy. (59) STATEMENT: Chemotherapy might have been initiated at some point by Castro's doctors. It would do little or no good, if the fast-acting cancer 'took' as expected. The serum in which the cancer cells were placed included a virus that could knock out the immune system, thus enhancing the strength of the already powerful cancer cells. This material - scraped from the kidneys of sick monkeys - was, in fact, the AIDS virus. (60) The serum in which the cancer cells were placed included a virus that could knock out the immune system, thus enhancing the strength of the already powerful cancer cells. This material - scraped from the kidneys of sick monkeys - was, in fact, Simian Monkey Virus 40 (SV-40), not the AIDS virus. (61) STATEMENT: Read the book. The matter is too complex to be explained by Mr. Reitzes, who is relying on a portion of an incomplete summary of the process written by somebody else. Judyth knows first-hand "what really happened" during Oswald's alleged trip to Clinton, Louisiana, because she was there. (62) STATEMENT: Lee Oswald and I together made a trip to and from Jackson and its nearby mental hospital within 72 hours AFTER Lee's trip to Clinton and then to Jackson's mental hospital in the company of Dave Ferrie, Clay Shaw, and a hospital aide. These were two distinct trips. Indeed, people have tried to conflate these two distinct trips into one, thereby providing 'arguments' that the testimonies of witnesses who saw Lee Oswald with a woman in an old, battered car AND the testimonies of groups of witnesses who saw Lee Oswald with Shaw and Dave Ferrie in a black Cadillac could not BOTH be correct. In fact, two distinct and separate trips WERE involved, and there is No conflict when all facts are accounted for. The errors in people's heads came via trying to make a single, three-day trip, a situation in which the highly busy Clay Shaw could not, of course, have participated. However, Shaw was able to take off part of ONE day. Please read my book for more information. Judyth knows only second-hand what happened in Clinton, because she wasn't there. (63) STATEMENT: Lee told me what happened during the trip to Clinton and from there to Jackson's mental hospital. Oswald, Dave Ferrie, and Clay Shaw were in Clinton, Louisiana, on (probably) August 23, 1963. (64) CORRECTION: This was my first estimated date, when asked to give a reasonable date-- and at first I just guessed. But there were problems with it, mainly because I remembered leaving very soon after that date for Florida, and August 23rd was simply too early to be the correct date. We are talking about a date from thirty-five years earlier that I was trying to recall. When I finally looked at various records in my possession, which I reviewed with Dr. Platzman, Irealized the date had to be at least a week later. When I finally looked up the date of the march on Washington, I then knew I was about a week off in my original estimated date. Oswald, Dave Ferrie, and Clay Shaw were in Clinton, Louisiana, on August 29, 1963. The date is easily determined because it was the same day Martin Luther King, Jr., led his famous march on Washington, D.C. (65) CORRECTION: When first trying to remember the date, I was trying to rely on letters and checks in my possession. The date was right after Martin Luther King's famous march, but I had forgotten the date of the march. Once I got that date, I was able to correct the earlier estimated date. Oswald, Dave Ferrie, and Clay Shaw were in Clinton, Louisiana, awaiting the arrival of a prisoner from Angola Penitentiary. The prisoner would be taken to the mental hospital in Jackson and serve as an unwitting "guinea pig" for deadly injections. (66) CORRECTION: The wait in Clinton was for a telephone call, not for a prisoner. The statement should read "Lee Oswald, Dave Ferrie, Clay Shaw, and a hospital employee were in Clinton, Louisiana, awaiting a telephone call. The call would inform them when and where to join a convoy bringing (supposedly) one prisoner with terminal cancer or other terminal illness from Angola Prison to the mental hospital in Jackson, there to serve as a witting, not unwitting, "guinea pig" for deadly injections." There was actually a whole convoy of "guinea pigs" coming from Angola.(67) STATEMENT: Ultimately, the number of prisoners actually used was unknown to us. We suspected more than one prisoner was involved because of the size of the convoy and the delay that occurred necessitating the long wait in Clinton. Judyth and Oswald had no idea any prisoners would be used as unwitting "guinea pigs," and therefore bore no responsibility for any prisoners who were murdered in this fashion. (68) STATEMENT: Originally, we were told that only one prisoner with a terminal cancer or other terminal illness would be used as a witting volunteer. Judyth and Oswald knew full well that prisoners would be used as unwitting "guinea pigs," and were heartsick over the plan. (69) CORRECTION: We learned, too late, that one or more prisoners being used for the testing were, in fact, not suffering from terminal cancer or another terminal disease, but, instead, had good health. This was sickening to us. I did write an objection, which caused Ochsner to cut me off from any further association with him for the rest of our lives. It also made it impossible for me to use him or any of his associates, who had been my supporters, as references. This meant the end of my plans for medical school. When Oswald applied for his Mexican tourist visa in 1963, he listed his religion as "Catholic," because Judyth and Oswald intended to later get married in Mexico as Catholics, with the aid of a corrupt priest. (70) STATEMENT: This was the true reason for Lee Oswald's decision to begin placing 'Catholic' on documents that would be viewed in Mexico, something he had never done before. In fact, Lee Oswald was an atheist or, more correctly, a strong agnostic. When Oswald applied for his Mexican tourist visa in 1963, he listed his religion as "Catholic," because, while he was an atheist, listing his religion as "atheist" "would have looked commie-suspicious"; so, as his friends Judyth Baker and David Ferrie were Catholics, he listed his religion as "Catholic." Simple as that. (71) CORRECTION: This was the reason Lee Oswald was prepared to give in case the question was raised by his handlers or others. Of course he wouldn't tell an outsider that he planned on marrying in Mexico. Oswald knew in advance about the assassination and, in an attempt to infiltrate and stop it, walked with eyes wide open into the "patsy" role. (72) STATEMENT: Lee Oswald knew in advance about the assassination plans because he had already successfully infiltrated the ring. He was aware of the danger, and knew that by continuing on his course, he might forfeit his life. He also believed he was already in too deep to back out, but he continued to make contingency plans for escape, if possible. Oswald did not know he was slated to be the "patsy." (73) CORRECTION: Lee did not think he would escape alive. He was uncertain if he was slated to be a patsy or was just one of several potential patsies. In fact, he was uncertain as to the actual location of the planned hit on Kennedy. He believed that several possible locations had been pre-selected. He personally believed the hit would probably be at the Trade Mart, but he also described several other possible locations. He did believe Kennedy would be killed either in Dallas or at LBJ's private airstrip. If Oswald escaped Dallas alive, he and Judyth had planned to meet in a fine hotel in Cancun, Mexico, and get married. (It was subsequently pointed out by David Lifton and Robert Chapman that Cancun was an uninhabited jungle in 1963; the resort city was conceived years later.) (74) Judyth NEVER said that she and Oswald planned to meet in a fine hotel in Cancun! This is a malicious fabrication by David Lifton.(75) Judyth NEVER said that she and Oswald planned to meet in a fine hotel in Cancun! This is a malicious fabrication by David Lifton and John McAdams. (76) Judyth NEVER said that she and Oswald planned to meet in a fine hotel in Cancun! This is a malicious fabrication by Dave Reitzes. (77) STATEMENT: I NEVER said that Lee and I planned to meet in a fine hotel in Cancun, and then get married. I have repeatedly corrected such mis-statements for several years now. Anyone who continues to say I said such a thing is in error. Judyth NEVER said that she and Oswald planned to meet in a fine hotel in Cancun! This was erroneously inserted into her manuscript by co-author Howard Platzman. (78) CORRECTION: The Cancun matter was an insertion by my literary agent that was missed by Dr.Platzman. He took the blame for allowing it to remain in the manuscript. But it was my fault, too. A section of dialogue that I wrote, and take responsibility for, includes several phrases that I do not, however, remember writing as they are now shown on the internet. Lee indeed said we would meet in a fine hotel, but his tone of voice was so full of irony I didn't know if he was joking. He never said we would meet in Cancun. Typos and errors will happen. That we would meet in an area NEAR present-day Cancun is what was always meant, and if I typed Cancun instead, God forgive me, as Reitzes won't, even though that section was clearly described as still in the process of being edited when it was sent a very few for comments. Judyth NEVER said that she and Oswald planned to meet in a fine hotel in Cancun! This was erroneously inserted into her manuscript by her former agent, Peter Cox. (79) COMMENT: This is correct. Okay, Judyth said it after all. (80) But she didn't MEAN it. She only meant Cancun as a rough geographical indicator of where the planned meeting-place actually had been. (81) CORRECTION: HOW does one describe a general area on a present-day map, near Cancun, without mentioning Cancun? I was asked to point out the approximate place where Lee and I planned to meet. I had described it originally merely as in Mexico. Asked for more detail, I described it as an extremely remote and wild area. My suitcase was packed with survival equipment! I described the area where I was going as a place I'd be afraid to go to, except I knew Lee would be there. Does that sound like a pleasure resort? What she meant was that she and Oswald planned to meet in a fine hotel in the rustic village of Kankun, Mexico. (82) CORRECTION: We planned to meet! The rest of this statement is a twisted version of my words, drawn out beyond reason or belief, for the sake of specious argument. Except maybe "fine hotel" was a joke on Oswald's part. (83) Yes, "fine hotel" was definitely a joke on Oswald's part. (84) CORRECTION: Since Lee often made wry jokes, I had no way of knowing if he was serious or not about our staying in a 'fine hotel.' It made absolutely no difference to me. Was it 'definitely' a joke? I don't know and never did. Nevertheless, she and Oswald might have ended up staying in a fine hotel just the same. (85) Judyth and Oswald actually planned to meet in Chichen Itza, Mexico -- 125 miles from present-day Cancun. (86) CORRECTION: We planned to meet NEAR Chichen Itza, not IN Chichen Itza. Judyth and Oswald actually planned to meet in Merida, Mexico - 200 miles from present-day Cancun. (87) CORRECTION: Lee never mentioned the name of this city as a meeting place. He spoke of Merida in other contexts. I decided this must have been the 'city' in the Yucatan where we hoped to marry - on my own, as he mentioned we would be flying from the city where we would marry on the Cayman islands. When, later, I learned that flights from Merida to the Cayman Islands were known to occur, I then assumed the city was Merida. Judyth and Oswald actually planned to meet in Belize, Mexico - 350 miles from present-day Cancun. (Note: There was no Belize in 1963; it was called British Honduras until years later.) (88) CORRECTION: At one point in our plans, we planned to meet near present-day Belize. I have no idea how to describe the location without using the word Belize. Do you? I have no what the location was called in 1963. It was the first place we were interested in while making our plans. We had guessed that this was the secret site where the film NIGHT OF THE IGUANA had been made, and thought there might be some vestige of civilization remaining behind after the film had been shot. The place had been described in the newspapers as spectacularly romantic. Later, we changed the meeting place nearer to where the ruins of Chichen Itza were located. Judyth and Oswald actually planned to meet in Puerto Vallarta, Mexico - well over a thousand miles from present-day Cancun. (89) CORRECTION: Lee and I changed our proposed meeting place several times as the situation developed. For example, the murder of Alexander Rorke, a pilot Lee trusted, changed the proposed meeting place. Our plans were not set in stone. Judyth and Oswald actually planned to marry in the Cayman Islands of the Caribbean; Cancun was just a stopover. (90) CORRECTION: Judyth and Lee planned to both divorce and then marry - in Mexico. Exploration of ancient Mayan ruins and a visit to a large city in the Yucatan were additional possible plans. After marriage, final destination was probably going to be the Cayman Islands. On November 22, 1963, Judyth and a number of her co-workers set up chairs and watched the assassination of John F. Kennedy on television. (91) CORRECTION: On November 22, Judyth observed her boss and several others bring in stools to watch the TV at noon. They exhibited what in her mind was undue interest, keeping the TV on past lunchtime, which was an hour ahead of Dallas time. Several chairs already in the lab were also used. Judyth didn't help set up anything. This is yet another misrepresentation. Judyth and her co-workers absolutely did not watch the assassination of John F. Kennedy on television. (92) STATEMENT: The assassination itself was never televised. The events of the day of the assassination happened to have been observed on TV by Judyth and others at PenChem. Removal of a phrase can change the meaning of a sentence. Oswald's friend George De Mohrenschildt knew about the assassination ahead of time, and had agreed to help take care of Oswald's wife and children afterwards. (93) CORRECTION: George DeMohrenschildt was asked by Lee to help Marina and his children in case something happened to him. George De Mohrenschildt had nothing to do with the assassination, and Judyth never said he did. (94) STATEMENT: I have only guessed at the extent of George's knowledge, since Lee said he had confided in him; I was asked my opinion and gave it. Judyth has proof that Oswald was innocent of John F. Kennedy's assassination; she presented it to filmmaker Nigel Turner and he filmed it for his documentary, The Men Who Killed Kennedy: The Love Affair. (95) CORRECTION: I, myself, provide witness that Lee Oswald was innocent of John F. Kennedy's assassination, since he expressed to me his potent grief and anger over the plot. I presented proof of having known Lee Oswald well enough that it was reasonable to assume that he might have confided these matters to me. In fact, he did so. Beyond her word, Judyth has no evidence regarding anything related to John F. Kennedy's assassination. (96) CORRECTION: read the book.

Part 2: John McAdams and Judyth Vary Baker Star Science Student Recruited into Deadly Conspiracy (John McAdams) McAdams subtly describes me as a ´star science student’ which I was in high school. In college, I was studying pre/med and my activities in that field were known only to my sponsoring doctors and Senator George Smathers. In other words, it leaves the impression that I was recruited into a ´Deadly Conspiracy´ while I was in high school. read the rest of this and decide for yourself: Judyth's saga begins when she was a student at Manatee High School in Bradenton, Florida. Among fellow students who remember her, opinion is about evenly split between remembering her as "intelligent" and remembering her as "weird," E-mail from Robert Johnson dated July 30, 2003. Johnson contacted several of her former classmates... (John McAdams) I had several concerned classmates call me saying that they had been contacted by somebody who asked them, "What do you think about this weird woman and her bizarre story" One classmate said she considered Mr. Johnson hostile when she said nice things about me. Did Mr. Johnson only give the people he interviewed two choices? (`weird´ and ‘intelligent’)...how many did he interview? Most of my former classmates who liked me and are still alive never heard from Mr. Johnson. A not too close friend, Martin Overstreet, told The Bradenton Herald in a Nov. 2003 interview that I was ´a very kind person.´ Buddy Grace, another classmate, wrote to say additional nice things. Bob Pope, yet another classmate, said, some kind comments, "while the rest of us were doing science fair projects, Judy was doing science.." Dave Deitrich, an older classmate interviewed by Ed Haslam in Bradenton, had only nice things to say, too, and remembered running into me in the radiation area of the physics and engineering buildings. THE TRUTH IS THAT I WAS FAIRLY POPULAR, AND HAD A LOT OF FRIENDS. ESPECIALLY, BOYFRIENDS! My boyfriends, and my cancer research project, took a lot of extra time. My guys would carry my books and lab materials over to the hospital for me, walking two miles with me those days I missed my ride because of a club meeting. While I was never class president, or one of the voted most popular, I missed being on the Most Popular list by just one vote (if I had voted for myself, I would have made the list!). The high school yearbook shows I was socially active and had a lot of friends. I was on the Prom Committee, for example, and was a National Honor Society Page, the secretary of the science club, and a former vice president of Societas Latina. I was staff artist for the high school newspaper and won an award for fund raising for my class. I was one of five actors in the Sophomore Play, and I had loads of fun with my friends, especially my boyfriends! she appears to have been an excellent science student who conducted "cancer research" with mice. (John McAdams) McAdams here places the words CANCER RESEARCH in quotes, as if this is not what HE would call it! But for all that, it was. I presented a paper on my work to the Westinghouse Science Talent Search and won a division prize representing the State of Florida. Drs. Howard Diehl, George Moore and Alton Ochsner personally inspected my cancer research work, which had been conducted under two doctors trained and licensed to handle radiation at Oak Ridge, as well as being under the auspices of half a dozen other doctors and a few retired military officers. I had additional encouragement from Walter Reed Institute’s own Chief Radiologist, Dr. David Jacobus. Now, I was sixteen when being guided by these doctors and scientists. Dr. Diehl - the Executive National Vice President of Research for the American Cancer Society - actually travelled to Manatee High School to personally assess the value of my work. He was so impressed that he recommended I should work in Dr. Moore’s own lab (Moore was the DIRECTOR of the entire Roswell Park Memorial Institute, one of the finest in the world, and the oldest cancer research facility in the US, in Buffalo). I was given housing, board, and a stipend at the level of a graduate student. I also received numerous full scholarships, and grants from the National Science Foundation, the National Cancer Institute, etc. I was assigned after my summer of cancer research training to do advanced cancer research on melanogenesis, under the guidance of scientists associated with Eli Lily and Roswell Park. I ended up doing two years of cancer research and associated work with radiation, blood component tagging with isotopes, cancerous human tissue cultures, etc. at both St. Francis College and at The University of Florida, where I worked under a special licensure. I presented a paper to the Indiana Biological Society on melanogenesis, with certification of my work by two nuns, who were scientists-doctors, who accompanied me. The paper was not published because I did not have a degree, but the presentation of the paper was to a full house. McAdams mentions none of this! She received a fair amount of recognition for her academic prowess (John McAdams) No, for my cancer research! I had very good grades but cancer research was what I received recognition for - for that, and for inventing an enhanced process for more efficiently claiming magnesium metal from seawater, for which I received an award at the International Science and Engineering Fair in Indianapolis. If you ever watch the film October Skies, you’ll know how fantastic it was for a sixteen year old girl (soon to be 17) to be invited to represent the State of Florida at that time. In fact, the Navy also awarded me six week cruise on a battleship-aircraft carrier... but withdrew it because I was a female! No female had ever won a top award in the Florida State Science Fair in the Physical Sciences Division at that time, who also qualified for the Navy Award in chemistry and physics. … attending national workshops for science students (John McAdams) I never attended a ´national workshop for science students. I attended an invitation-only cancer research summer of training that was open to outstanding biochemistry and radiobiology students sponsored by leading doctors in the country. These students ranged from high school to college graduates. There were some high school science teachers also involved, but the vast majority in the training sessions were college graduates. I worked side by side with them, with my own personal cancer research project in helping to develop a better medium to grow melanoma cancer. And I succeeded in creating a medium that advanced the methodology for growing tissue cultures of melanoma. I had to present a paper at Roswell Park on my research. The presentation was considered the best among all the National science Foundation awardees, of whom I was one. There were only 68 of us. And I worked in the Director´s own personal lab. Hardly a ´national workshop for science students’. I came form there able to grow any kind of cancer - with perfected skill - and was given the assignment to try to create ´the most deadly cancers.´ I have several newspaper articles reporting on this ongoing assignment in college for the next two years, with grants from the NSF and the NIH and the ACS. McAdams avoids ever mentioning my advanced training in cancer research. But her life took an important turn when she came to the attention of Dr. Canute Michaelson in 1958. (John McAdams) He has this out of sequence. By the time I was trained at Roswell Park and given the deadly cancer assignment as an ongoing project, with reports sent to Roswerll Park and/or The American Cancer Society´s own Dr. Diehl, and to Dr. Alton Ochsner, it was 1961. In 1958, I was a sophomore with a small private cancer research project on fish. Dr. Michaelson saw the project and made sure my high school got a new science building and equipment. He was connected to the CIA. He was also impressed with some other science students there, not just with me. Michaelson (supposedly a "CIA asset" engaged in bioweapons research) somehow targeted her for future intelligence use... See for example "Een Amerikaanse held" in De Groene Amsterdammer, June 21, 2003. (John McAdams) This is ridiculous! What Michaelson did was to introduce me to some military friends of Col. Philip V. Doyel, as well as encouraging my biology teacher, Mrs. McCartney, to allow me space to do research. Hardly sinister! Blackout curtains were ordered and installed so outstanding science students could work late evenings without being noticed. Doyle formed the Science Seminar at the suggestion of David Tracy and David Deitrich, who became friends of mine. They were geniuses. heck, we all tested out as geniuses on their IQ tests most of us were given, so we got this attention, mainly because SPUTNIK had gone up in 1957, and in 1958, scientists were going around hunting for talented young people to encourage them to become scientists. That was the extent of Michaelson´s involvement - he got me in touch with Oak Ridge scientists and Col. Doyle contacted some doctors trained at Oak Ridge, as well as a few local doctors and scientists involved with the brand new oncology department at Manatee Memorial Hospital. I would spend a lot of hours there. McAdams quotes from a Dutch interview where the Dutchman has to interpret my English story. He didn’t quite understand how Michaelson was involved. When I tried to correct McAdams about the real utility of my connection with Michaelson, which had to do with connecting me to Oak Ridge, but certainly with nothing sinister, he DID change the passage somewhat., Before this, McAdams stated that Michaelson lured me into a plot to kill Fidel Castro! Imagine that! In 1958, when Castro wasn’t yet in power, no less! McAdams, having linked me through Michaelson with the Fidel Castro plot, just had to keep embroidering this brief association, even after being corrected... so he now writes: She was thus drawn into the orbit of very sinister people and eventually into a plot that had the intention of killing Castro, but ended up killing JFK instead. (John McAdams) McAdams cleverly injects the words’ "very sinister people" so that readers will think I must be paranoid or something! You have already read that I was placed in contact with legitimate doctors and scientists, as well as gaining the attention and kind support of retired military officers, who helped rise money to build a brand new science building, thanks also to our high school principal, who coordinated that effort. Is that SINISTER? Only in McAdams’ version, not mine! The "interesting" time in her life was the summer of 1963, when she was in New Orleans. (John McAdams) McAdams fails to mention two years of college...by cramming into summer sessions as well.... where I continued to work in cancer research and related projects while auditing pre-med classes and generating grants for the University of Florida, which was at that time rapidly expanding its science departments. McAdams thus makes it seem I went straight from a science summer camp to New Orleans, insofar as training is concerned. he never mentions that I was assigned to try to create "the most deadly cancers." But I digress. Let’s see what additional tales McAdams decides to spin his own peculiar way: It was there that she began, she claims, a torrid sexual affair with Lee Harvey Oswald, in spite of having been recently married to Robert Baker, a student and future petroleum geologist who was working for an oil company. (John McAdams) In fact, in New Orleans, I met and fell in love with Lee Harvey Oswald, and after a period of considerable contemplation and thought, he and I commenced a love affair. Sex was far from the only reason we fell in love. I resembled Marina Oswald (McAdams does not mention this here) and both of us were unhappily married. I, in fact, was married ´on the fly’ to a guy who promptly vanished, taking a job out in the Gulf of Mexico deliberately, as his letter to potential employers asked that he be given FIELD WORK! I didn’t know this until recently, when I read the back of one of his letters, where his inquiry letter was printed, possibly accidentally, since Robert was a frugal man who used leftover paper to write his letters on. Lee and I never intended to cheat on our mates, but we couldn’t help ourselves. One thing McAdams fails to mention, as well: I had learned to speak and read some Russian, and had intensively studied Russian classical music and literature. Lee loved these things very much, and we had this in common right from the start. What brought Judyth and Lee together was a plot, centred in New Orleans, to produce a bio weapon for the purpose of killing Fidel Castro. (John McAdams) Not so. What brought us together was a mistake. I came two weeks earlier than I was supposed to, to New Orleans, having been offered another summer of research, this time under Dr. Mary Sherman in Ochsner´s Foundation Clinic. Both Ochsner and Sherman were out of town, but I was mistaken for the person who was going to be sent to help Dave Ferrie with the clandestine side of that project. Lee Osweald either ran into me accidentally, or, now that I have hindsight, Dave Ferrie was asked to check on me, by Ochsner, when I arrived early (it was a dangerous city and I was alone). Ferrie concluded I was the promised helper and told me elements of the project before Ochsner or Sherman could stop him. I had dated anti-Castroites and was from Florida, fresh from the Cuban Missile Crisis, and was perfectly willing to cooperate in such a project. Anything to eliminate the man I was told was the equivalent of Osama B. L. In the end, I became embroiled in the project. But the attraction Lee and I had for each other had nothing to do with any plot. In fact, Lee recruited me to help him keep his cover job intact at Reily. More details are in the book. It is complex, but McAdams manages to mess up everything in just a sentence or two. His oversimplification resembles, "And God created the heavens and the earth" to represent all of the history of the world. He woefully oversimplifies the matter. Then, of course, it is shocking and unbelievable. I can hardly recognize myself in McAdams’ version. The plotters got them both "cover" jobs at the Reily Coffee Company while they were carrying on an affair and trying to produce a "cocktail" to administer to Castro. (John McAdams) No. Error, once again. Lee had come to New Orleans to work on something entirely different, and the work I did at Reily had to do with keeping Lee´s job covered. The job was flexible enough that I could still work on the project at Dave Ferrie’s apartment, which was empty during the day. Materials and mice, etc., were hauled in and out by two Cuban teens under Ferrie´s control. My position was minimum wage because I did not work there fulltime, but it was on a salary. Near the end, I received some ´overtime’ due to Lee´s intervention, all of which is explained in the book in detail. McAdams says that we were "carrying on an affair" when the "plotters" got us the "cover jobs." His version is a mess. Lee was working for Guy Banister at this time. We were very attracted to each other but were not having an affair at this time. NOR WERE WE TRYING TO PRODUCE A ´COCKTAIL´TO ADMINISTER TO CASTRO. This ´cocktail’ is Dr. Platzman´s description in shorthand for a complex project. I was involved in accelerating the progress of the deadly cancer part of the project. Others were involved in other aspects. The final administering of the product would be in the hands of Cubans, not Americans. This would free the US of any blame. The "cocktail" would include both a virus designed to knock out Castro's immune system, and cancer cells that would infect him and cause his death. (John McAdams) Needless to say, the description given here is laughably inadequate. I must stop here. There is much, much more to say. But I do hope that here, we have a beginning in the matter of correcting the web pages, filled with error, that McAdams manages to have come up FIRST at Google if my name is plugged in for a search. Something has to be done to correct this. I am in the process of moving and will have to stop here, but please visit Black Op Radio and listen to the interview there to get more information. And if you can, find a copy of "The Love Affair" to get a better, if still over/condensed, picture of what was going on. I will try in a month or two to continue the exposure of the sorry piece of ´research. John McAdams has offered to ´explain’ my story. His method is to slip in words that prejudice the reader, to ignore or oversimplify my attainments, and to make sure that I sound unlikeable and without ethics. Fir example, he fails to mention that the reason I left St. Francis and was transferred to University of Florida was because my parents were upset when I decided to become a nun. McAdams mentions the developing relationship between Lee and me as a "torrid sexual affair" even though, mad in love as we were, we tried for some time to save our respective marriages. I hope that this partial review of McAdams´ website about me will give everyone a better perspective on the truth.

Part 1: John McAdams and Judyth Vary Baker This posting is a correction of the John McAdams’ web page on Judyth Vary Baker (September, 2004). http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/judyth.htm If Judyth Vary Baker is telling the truth, it will change the way we think about the Kennedy assassination. (John McAdams) He immediately places doubt in the mind of the reader. Nice start. Judyth offers an account that integrates much that has been written about the assassination into a more or less coherent whole and puts myriad facts about the assassination in an entirely new light. She has recently been in the Netherlands, getting some attention in the Dutch media, and has opened a museum dedicated to telling her story. (John McAdams) The subtle little word twists begin. Here, McAdams calls my account "a more or less coherent whole..." which again places the account into a state of doubt. The Museum was called the Lee Harvey Oswald Museum and was dedicated to telling Lee Harvey Oswald´s story, as every visitor quickly realized. Yes, there was a section on me, and a museum case full of materials that Lee and I had used and owned together. But 75% of the museum space was dedicated to Lee Harvey Oswald. She was the subject of "The Men Who Killed Kennedy" which aired in November, 2003 on the History Channel. (John McAdams) Nigel Turner produced a nine-segment series over a period of years called "The Men Who Killed Kennedy." TMWKK segments have been aired on The History Channel for over a decade. Segment Eight, newly released on the 40th anniversary of the assassination in November, 2003, focused on the love affair between me and Lee Harvey Oswald, with much new information released about Lee Oswald´s activities between April, 1963 and his murder on November 24, 1963. The documentary was suppressed soon after outcries from friends of the Lyndon B. Johnson family protested the contents of Segment Nine, "The Guilty Men." All three new TMWKK segments were pulled from the expected nine/year airing schedule. The History Channel announced that it sold the rights to unknown parties. A panel said Segment Nine was a disgrace to the memory of LBJ. Many believed the panel´s many errors reflected its hasty kangaroo court mentality. The censorship was unprecedented in US documentary film history. Thousand of copies of these films were destroyed and many thousands who tried to purchase the three segments got their money back. Since the History Channel even shows documentaries about Bigfoot, Nessie, and UFO´s, one wonders why "The Love Affair" was also included, since it was never mentioned by the panel. The History Channel made a public apology to the LBJ family for the contents of "The Guilty Men." In fact, there is a great deal of circumstantial evidence as well as witnesses who testified that LBJ knew Kennedy was going to die in Dallas. Many people have decided that the film actually hit too close to home. Her supporters have promised a book. (John McAdams) Another subtle twist. I, myself, have written two books. The first attempt to publish was a failure due to the mishandling of the literary agent and possibly due to threats of lawsuits which Mr. David Lifton promised to deliver to all the big publishers at that time. There was also a small, original series of writings which were originally going to be willed to my son upon my death. Originally, I was not going to speak out at all. Many times, I have regretted doing so, because of the harassment that followed. That is why I am currently living overseas, where, in fact, I have experienced no real harassment from anybody, and where my testimony has been well received. There WILL be a book published, if a fearless publisher can be found. She may turn into someone important on the JFK assassination scene. But is she to be believed? Key sources on the “Judyth” story include: – an essay sarcastically titled “My Boring Life,” a response to David Lifton’s claim that Judyth has fabricated her story to add some interest to a her boring life. – a biographical blurb written to her high school classmates and posted on the web page of Manatee High School. There were two versions of the blurb posted, one a bit “sanitized” after it apparently occurred to Judyth that her original version contained some things that are hard to swallow. Space constraints have forced her blurb off the current version of the high school alumni page. – an outline, titled “Deadly Alliance,” sent to publishers and researchers. Carefully formatted and polished, this is the “official” version of her story – at least it was when it was written. In this essay, “the Judyth account” or “Judyth’s account” refers to “Deadly Alliance.” – a draft of the final chapter of her book, titled “Before the Silence Came: Lee’s Last Telephone Calls.” – a rambling version of her story and a response to critics written in November 2003. – Yet another web page from Judyth, including several photos, and samples of Judyth’s artwork. (John McAdams) McAdams would have the reader believe these are key sources of my story. They are not. I will address the problems in the selection McAdams decided to use. ACTUAL Key sources include: (1) information on The Education Forum that is presented by those who actually know me and defend me (or, the information is straight from my mouth personally). (2) The documentary "The Love Affair" which was recorded by thousands of American viewers (The Dallas Public Library also has a copy) The documentary, minus commercials, is 44 minutes long (3) An interview made May 13, 2004 by Black Op Radio, which is archived and available to all (it is an hour and a half long) (4) Original emails (not stolen ones) and materials sent to trusted researchers which are being overseen by two long time investigators into my history (and sometimes they are still pretty rough with me, but I appreciate that!), namely, Martin Shackelford and Dr. Howard Platzman. There are other individuals who at this date have obtained significant portions of my testimony and have not, to my knowledge, altered it or misquoted it. Others pretended friendship, obtained materials, and have quoted out of context or even changed certain words. For example, I never wrote the phrase `fine hotel in Cancun. ´Never! But it is constantly quoted by the man who fabricated that phrase (Dave Reitzes). I sent Reitzes confidential material. he published all of it, even though some of it exposed information about my witnesses which I had promised to keep out of the public eye. But to the key sources, so-called, cited by McAdams. - an essay sarcastically titled "My Boring Life," a response to David Lifton's claim that Judyth has fabricated her story to add some interest to a her boring life. Mr. Lifton spoke to me in a single telephone conversation lasting about an hour and a half. He illegally taped that conversation. He soon broke his promise to keep our conversation confidential, perhaps because the biography of Lee Oswald he had been working on for over ten years was hopelessly inaccurate, since he missed our love affair altogether, even though I have witnesses and considerable supporting evidence (much is circumstantial evidence, but it´s good, nevertheless, because I have so much of it). Lifton seems to have decided to discredit me rather than go to the trouble of rewriting his book. Debra Conway helped him write a portion of this book and admits to the friendship and influence of David Lifton. Conway shared materials with Lifton that she promised to keep confidential "to the grave." Lifton, knowing nothing about my actually interesting and exciting life, proposed that I made up everything because I was simply a bored housewife with nothing else to do who decided to insert herself into history. As if I saved all the evidence I have all these years all by accident! I put out a list of the many interesting experiences I’ve had in life, from raising five brilliant children who all got their degrees on full scholarships (I raised four of them as a single parent), to my backpacking in just a week across Israel (with help of donkey, camel, and soldiers). I sell my paintings internationally, was a newspaper reporter, have explored Indian mounds and Viking graves (I have a degree in anthropology), and was a counsellor for battered women and the homeless. My original intention was to become a doctor, and I was also doing cancer research while still in my teens that gained national attention. A psychiatrist who heard the story of my life did not believe me! I had the evidence at hand, but he declined to look at any of it and thought I made a lot of it up. I did not. From my work helping to invent new uses for limolene (orange oil) products, to having studied Egyptian hieroglyphs, to having my name on a monument for civic service, to having known and loved Lee Harvey Oswald, it’s all true. Boring life? No way. A KEY source of information about me? I suppose, though it was just a post in response to the silly idea that my life was boring so I made up the love affair Lee and I had. - a biographical blurb written to her high school classmates and posted on the web page of Manatee High School. McAdams doesn´t call this "Key Source" anything but ´blurb’, so why does he list it at all? It was originally sent to my classmates because nobody but they ever looked at the high school site. I changed the information several times to update it, and because space there was limited, some things were also taken out to make room for updates. McAdams called this "changing the story." It was only meant for my friends. I have a newspaper article from 1961 showing that 50 high school friends planned and hosted a welcome home party for me just before I left for college. I had avoided reunions and wanted my friends to learn why ( I did not want my name to become public because of my love affair with Lee, and I knew if I went to a reunion, I might tell somebody about Lee, so I stayed away... I contacted my high school friends when I knew that Sixty Minutes might film me. Later, Nigel Turner filmed me instead, so I updated the entry. Etc. There were two versions of the blurb posted, one a bit "sanitized" after it apparently occurred to Judyth that her original version contained some things that are hard to swallow. Space constraints have forced her blurb off the current version of the high school alumni page. McAdams uses the word ´blurb’ to downgrade to the reader what I wrote. As I already said, because of space constraints, when I added new material, I deleted some of the old. McAdams, even as he mentions space constraints, accuses me of sanitizing what I wrote. A person without prejudice will see that nothing of major importance was removed from the ´blurb’. McAdams also errs in believing that two versions only were posted. There were actually four updates. He only shows the last update. By then, some original material was excluded to make room for new material. - an outline, titled "Deadly Alliance," sent to publishers and researchers. Only a few publishers ever saw the outline. And they NEVER saw the outline at this stage (half finished, mostly written by Dr. Platzman). McAdams somehow got a copy of this material intended for only a few, and at a stage where a few researchers were asked to look at it for ideas on how to better handle the information. In fact, although the format looked nice, coming from a Microsoft Word program, the outline was a work in progress. It had some glaring errors, but there were large parts that were very nice, indeed. This preliminary outline version is a shrimp compared to the final 34 page version when the outline was finished. This does not stop McAdams from calling this ´polished...´ Hmmmm! It seems that the high school stuff was mere ´blurb’ but this.... which was itself undergoing development, is called ´polished.´ WHO told McAdams this was a finished product? Nobody! Carefully formatted and polished, this is the "official" version of her story - at least it was when it was written. In this essay, "the Judyth account" or "Judyth's account" refers to "Deadly Alliance." But folks, "Deadly Alliance" was an attempt to put my original book as edited and fluffed out by an unscrupulous agent who did so much editing he tried to call himself a co-author, with additions and organization by Dr. Howard Platzman, based on extensive emails he had received. Needless to say, Deadly Alliance was a work in progress. In fact, there were a number of errors and attempts to integrate the story, coming from too many different points of view. All of this was because I wished to avoid writing about certain things and had sought the help of Dr. Platzman as a ´with author’, and of my agent, to add any footnotes or comments. Platzman did a good job, but he described me and Lee in ways that were just not ‘us’. As for the literary agent, he put in actual nonsense and in some cases, some inaccurate phrases and ideas, mostly because he knew almost nothing about the JFK assassination. The manuscript excerpts from which McAdams quotes, then, are from an unfinished work that was eventually discarded because there were too many errors and difficulties in reconciling what I knew with what got written. It was very painful and difficult to read the manuscript. I put it off for a long time. Finally, upon reading the version that went around, I realized that it would never be the book I had hoped for. I therefore went back to the original book and the written materials I’d compiled for my son in 1998, and from these, with some additions from the Deadly Alliance book, I did finish a book which was more accurate as to how Lee spoke and what we did. Many years had passed, and I had not any idea of what was important and what was not to write about. I do have a much better idea now. I saved a great deal of evidence, however, to back up everything I’ve written. Also, I would like to add that only minor details have sometimes been changed. For example, I NEVER said I would meet Lee at Cancun and we would stay in a fine hotel. Part of a dialogue I wrote got ´enhanced’ to identify ´Cancun’. For that error and many others, and for just plain greediness, I fired my literary agent. Later, I had to ask Dr. Platzman’s forgiveness, but after removing what the literary agent put on, the book was in shreds and a lot of Dr. Platzman’s materials had incorporated some of the fluff added by the agent. Another problem was trying to get the chronology correct. After all, many years had passed. For all these reasons, it should be clear that Deadly Alliance was not a finished product at any time. I might work down a page and not even get to the end, but send it off to Howard to see if he liked what I had fixed so far... what McAdams got his hands on he calls a finished product. It never was! - a draft of the final chapter of her book, titled "Before the Silence Came: Lee's Last Telephone Calls." - a draft of the final chapter of her book, titled "Before the Silence Came: Lee's Last Telephone Calls." It certainly was a draft, but elsewhere, McAdams quotes portions of it as if the final chapter had been set in carved stone! - a rambling version of her story and a response to critics written in November 2003. How nice of McAdams to once again inject into his discourse another negative connotation so that the reader will have a low opinion of whatever I write! - Yet another web page from Judyth, including several photos, and samples of Judyth's artwork. And McAdams took one of those photos without permission, a copyrighted photo, and published it on this attack website! It belongs to me, it is going to be in the book, but he appropriated it anyway. I have asked him twice to remove it from his website. He refuses to do so. What an ethical guy.

I am a witness. I knew Lee Harvey Oswald and met a number of his associates, including Guy banister, David W. Ferrie, Dr. Mary Sherman. I shook Clay Shaw's hand and was introduced to Carlos Marcello. I have living witnesses backing this up, and also saved evidence from 1963. I was trained to become a doctor specializing in cancer research, but my career was cut short due to my involvement with Lee. I was engaged in a project to try to assassinate Castro and once dated Castro's Minister of Finances son, Tony Lopez Fresquet. I was just a young girl, who resembled Marina Oswald and who fell in love with Lee. Those who know me personally know I am an honest person who has given up a lot to bring out the truth. You will notice that the people who attack me are, for the most part, abusive and often use mockery, sarcasm, and snide remarks. They do not offer hard evidence refuting my hard evidence. They have tried for almost five years now to discredit me, but have only succeeded in creating a mountain of abusive posts. On the other hand, some of the finest and most decent researchers that can be found support me. They interviewed me, met me, talked to me, met my witnesses in several cases. These people have often been tough with me. I have never let them down. I would not have spoken out had I not had sufficient evidence. I do. I was harassed in the U.S. to the extent that I had to move overseas. I love my country and want a true democracy. This cannot occur if the truth about November 22, 1963 - and the assembly of power that was created due to that event - is not revealed. Lee Oswald was an innocent man. Eliminating me by physical means or by character assassination is the only recourse some of these people have. But I'm still here, and I refuse to be intimidated, even though sometimes, of course, I do feel fear. I appreciate the opportunity to be able to speak up here from time to time without being viciously attacked. I am glad that students can access this forum. I taught for a total of seventeen years before losing my last teaching position due to the complaints of an FBI employee who stated she did not want her child taught by an evil person such as myself. With the help of God, I will live to see the exoneration of Lee Oswald. That's all I care about.

Dear John: I am very busy this week and will not be able to check replies to this thread for probably a week as I am moving to a new location. However, there are a multitude of files about the Ochsner-Murchison-Nixon-LBJ connection. Ochsner sent a letter to Pres. Gerald Ford praising him for pardoning Richard Nixon. Follow that trail backwards to 1963. The benevolent doc was into a lot of mischief. Co-founder of INCA, he always knew who Lee really was. he was terrified that Lee would TELL. He hastened to put oput the record PORTRAIT IN RED showing the ugly drawing his partner Ed Bitler made of Lee to make him look really bad, because the only photos they had were of Lee looking very nice in his suit. In a tiny nutshell: The Murchison connection to Ochsner is powerful and enduring. Ochsner went to El Charro where Hoover and the mob and Murchison and his buddies would meet. Murchison also paid for construction at the new Ochsner Clinic that was moved into in March, 1963. Murchison also gave Ochsner a RACE TRACK that Ochsner sold for half a million dollars. Ochsner's best friends were Murchison and his buddies. They also met at Koon Kreek Klub in Texas to play poker. Most of this information can easily be found in "Alton Ochsner, Surgeon of the South"which is the official Ochsner biography. An earlier printing of this book that had more information in it seems to have been confiscated, as a photo showing Mary Sherman - the only female of consequence on Ochsner's staff - has been removed. But I took a photocopy of that photo from an early printing of this book. Remember that Ochsner FLEW TO WASHINGOTN EVERY TEN DAYS during this time period to meet with the Surgeon General's CIA-sponsored committee. He also flew in once a week for years, and perhaps still in 1963, to Washington to meet witrh the Army's Surgeon General responsible for inspecting all airbases aorund the world for US. That may have come about because Ochsner and Chennault of Flying Tiger/CIA fame were close friends. Anna Chennault, and this is important, met with Ochsner after Ochsner met with Richard Nixon, and in strategizing for Nixon's election, Anna made sure the Peaxe Talk on Vietnam were scrapped. Look it up! It was her! Ochsner's wife suddenly died of the same kind of galloping lung cancer that we were working with, though she did not smoke, and Ochsner after some months married a friend of Richard Nixon, a wealthjy and independent lady whom Ochsner treated badly, but who kept the lid on him as he aged and might have let something slip. Of course, this is my interpretation. Nobody in that family doubts that she seems to have 'loved' him, but in fact, he does not seem to have loved her. When she couldn't get a visa to their honeymoon in Greece due to their quickie marriage, the lady called The White HGouse, asked for President Nixon, and immediately got her visa. Hope somebody will post this for me, at Education Forum. I have files on these people, and appreciate how well John Simkin is putting together the pieces. The connections between Ochsner and everyone else were possible because he was the genial surgeon who smiled a lot and who, though he wanted to kill Castro, otherwise seemed quite the nice fellow. I saw an entirely different side of this man, however. He screamed at me over the phone and told somebody I was 'expendable'and that Lee was éxpendable'too, after I objected to using prisoner volunteer(s) in the last stage of our work who did NOT have cancer, and they were unwtting. I had been told that only person suffering from uncurable cancer would be used. But they couldn't find anyone like that, and went ahead and used healthy men. This is why my cancer research and progress to becoming a doctor was cut off, because I wrote a note in protest, and Ochsner said because of making a paper trail, I was toast. I have a collection of information that includes private emails which I am sending to John Simkin that has copious background info on Ochsner. He can select some of this material to share with you, as he sees fit. Judyth

To all readers: I have watched with amazement the unfolding of a bizarre history: that of Mr. Robert Vernon,and his dealings with Mr. Willem Dankbaar. In many ways, I feel I have a unique perspective, because I knew nothing whatsoever about Mr. Vernon for a long time, and then suddenly was subjected to a rude experience concerning him, which forced me to actually look the man up and try to figure out who he was. Shortly after I came home from a hospital in Dallas, Texas, suffering from a brain concussion that left me with eye, neck and back problems and chronic headaches, with a doctor's order to rest (but I had to teach, or lose my job!), Mr. Vernon called me and announced that he expected me to travel to New Orleans to take a polygraph test IMMEDIATELY. He scarcely introduced himself, was busy yelling at other people from time to time while speaking to me, paying little attention to what I had to say to him. I did gather that, if I passed the test, he would be so kind as to film my testimony for a documentary he was making about James Files. He added that he was not really interested in me at all, and that he really had little faith in my story, but was calling anyway at the behest of Mr. Dankbaar, who had insisted that my story was worth something. Mr. Vernon said this in such a dismissive manner that I nearly hung up on him. It was obvious that Mr. Vernon felt it was a waste of his time to even take these few moments to speak to me. Mr. Vernon said he had agreed to take time out from his hectic schedule editing film already shot, which he said was taking 22 hours a day of his time, with only 2 hours of sleep a day, and therefore, I should not be a big baby and say I couldn't come simply because I had just got out of the hospital! I told him I would think it over, but that I would never submit to just one polygraph test: Sixty Minutes told me never to do so, as they had just done a special on polygraph test failures. In fact, my doctor told me that he would not allow me to travel to New Orleans. I called Mr. Vernon back, but he was unavailable. Shortly after that, he called me, and said he'd like to talk to me for a few minutes to check out my story. I spoke with him about twenty minutes, with a couple of interruptions, and then Mr. Vernon stopped me right when I explained that Lee and I used to ride the St. Charles streetcar. He began to quizz me about what I remembered about the route. I described it in one direction but told him I thought it turned around onto another street in the other direction, but had never ridden the streetcar that way-- only back to town, or from town back to this point where I first had a room (lived there only four days, and was ejected during a police raid on May 4 early am, 1963). Mr. Vernon suddenly declared that he did not believe I had EVER lived in New Orleans when I could not remember the name of an important street on the route, and where it went after passing my house (going AWAY from town--a direction I never did go!) -- this being a place where I had lived only a few days, moving later to Marengo St. after getting evicted (Lee helped me move, as Robert was out of town)... I just could NOT remember where the streetcar went! He thought that was impossible. I later sent him several emails trying to re-describe what I told him and trying to show him that some of what I remembered could have been easily forgotten by me. Mr. Vernon much later announced that he was certain I was a fraud because I could not describe the STREETS of New Orleans properly. He EXTENDED the streetcar route to STREETS in general. This was a grievous exaggeration. He NEVER saw any of my paycheck stubs, letters from my husband, W-2 form, streetcar tickets, and bank statements and checks for rent that prove I DID live there. It is true I easily get lost and nobody should use me for a guide ANYwhere! I once got lost at my own high school after some temporary buildings were erected there over the weekend, blocking my view of the whole campus. Yes, sadly, true. Mr. Vernon was angry when Mr. Dankbaar advised Zack Shelton to come interview me after Dankbaar got a good look, along with Jim Marrs, of a stack of notebooks full of evidence and files and photos and newspaper articles which I had collected mostly in 1963 or just before and after. Vernon announced to Shelton I was a fraud, based on his assessment that I had never lived in New Orleans, but Mr. Shelton decided to make the trip anyway, without telling Mr. Vernon. He had a mind of his own and was not going to blindly accept Mr. Vernon's assessment. That was an act of integrity. Though he was very busy with other events that weekend in Dallas, Mr. Shelton did take about two hours to look at the evidence --insufficient time to come to any conclusions about my testimony, as it is complex-- but sufficient time to learn that I could back up any statement I made with evidence. In short, Mr. Shelton did take significant time to review some of my evidence, asked good questions, and focused on what I had to tell him. He promised to spend more time later going over the materials. Since then, I have sent him some evidence files supporting my testimony. Mr. Vernon never spoke to me again. He was angry at Shelton when he leqrned that this former FBI man took time away from HIS film production to come see me. By now, I refused to be in Mr. Vernon's film under any circumstances. Because of Mr. Dankbaar's investigating me, however, I did allow an oral history to be filmed by Mr. Dankbaar's talented Gary Beebe, a very decent fellow. I do trust Mr. Dankbaar, who has treated me in a straightforward manner, with fair use of that oral history. Only later did I learn that the project Mr. Vernon was working on was NOT solely Mr. Vernon's film -- it turned out to be financed by Mr. Dankbaar to a great extent--- though Mr. Vernon represented, BOTH times he spoke to me, that the film was 100% his property and that if I consented to be filmed, my story would also belong to him, but would get full publicity and the attention of the world. I was less than interested. I have never wanted anything but the truth to get out. I finally did consent to allow Mr. Nigel Turner to film, and he took 38 hours of oral history and some on-scene shots as well. He also took 55 hours' worth of notes, and then went to witnesses to verify what I had said. I commend his care. I now believe he worried that if evidence and witnesses were shown in the film The Love Affair, that their statements might have become the property of The History Channel (only guessing), He did protect my evidence and witnesses, decding simply to allow me to speak up and tell what happened, from the perspective of the get-Castro project in which I was peripherally involved. I received nothing but lost wages for this, and it is all I ever wanted, just enough to make up for losing students I could not tutor while being filmed. Mr. Vernon, in contrast, never evidenced any due care before jumping to his conclusions. Therefore, I doubt he is telling the truth when he states Mr. Shelton is corrupt. Had he been describing himself, that would be a different matter. I am shocked and dismayed that Mr. Shelton should be so described after long and faithful service in the FBI, and after his careful and intelligent interview of myself. I do attest that he decided NOT to take Mr. Vernon's word that I was a hoax --which was based on Mr. Vernon's less than twenty-five minutes' total conversation with me, most of it occupied with trying to get me to come to New Orleans, etc. with Mr. Vernon concluding I had never lived there -- the ONLY person EVER to jump to such a conclusion based on the flimsiest of things-- my inability to correctly describe part of a streetcar route I rode almost forty years earlier! Mr. Vernon can go ahead and sue me if he thinks I've libeled him-- he has threatened to sue countless individuals -- but I assure you, Mr. Shelton DOES care about the case and DID try to treat me fairly. Mr. Vernon is not an investigator of merit. He has described himself as a worldwide entertainment purveyor. However, I find his pronouncements less than entertaining, and if there is anyone in media who takes Mr. Vernon seriously, they will regret having done so. I am sorry to have to speak out against anyone, and I apologize for writing such a long post. I do try not to post here too often, as I try not to bore anyone, but this time, I had to speak out. Sincerely, Judyth Vary Baker (knew and loved Lee Oswald) I attach an envelope showing my address while living in New Orleans in 1963.

Dear John, I kept getting an error...hope you will fix this..should be just one message, with letter attached...thanks, JVB

Tony, concerning that map, that seems to have vanished, interestingly enough, Lee had a map he said he made marking the locations of four payphones. I don't know if it was in hhis roominghouse area or downtown, though. It may be that at first they thought they could use this map to incriminate him, but when they found out that there were payphones involved, they got rid of the map, because that might have led to embarrassing telephone records to look into. Just a thought. I had a couple of maps myself with payphone locations to be used in a special rotation so I knew where and when to be to get a phone call from Lee. ====Judyth===

To all: some people accept without question certain statements, such as, Lee could not have watched I LED THREE LIVES in Fot. Worth. Lee was, in fatc, watching I LED THREE LIVES when he was living in New York (actual report to me). I believe his brother visited him there-- Robert Oswald--and while it is true that Lee liked to indulge in fantasies when he was young, so do other bright young people who have a fascination with adventure stories and so on. There are answers I will offer, if the heat goes to a blaze again trying to 'prove' THERE ARE TWO OSWALDS... I noticed a nice photo collection, and comments that these had to be two different people, when in fact, I have a collection of photos of myself showing similar variations. Plus, Lee's chin is darkened and made to look square in photos taken after his arrest. I've blown some of these up -- and you can see a 'smirk'enhanced on the most ugly of Lee's arrest photos. Where he looks very sad, blown up, you can clearly see the chin has been made into a square. You can tell, using forensic methods, that these are pictures of the same man (except one which I doubt provenance for anyway) -- interpupillary measurements, measurement of lip to nose, etc., etc. AQ young man changes a lot between fifteen and twenty four facuially. It's even worse when photos have been doctored, apparently to match the backyard photos. His arrest photo of Nov. 22 doesn;t sow the same chin. Look carefully at the New Orleans photos. There also fingerprints were taken that match the fingerprints taken in Dallas. Yet the faces look different, especially the chins. The tampering of Lee included, IMHO, also his photos, and unless you have a first generation photo, forget it. Having said all this, would like comments about the following, which is brought in from JFK LANCER: (sincerely, JVB) One of the first attacks on LEE Oswald's childhood character came from an unempected source--HIS OLDER BROTHER ROBERT OSWALD. Robert co-authored a book, LEE, in which he wrote that his brother was living in a fantasy world at age 12.... "All of us had our dreams and fantasies, but Lee's always lingered a little longer. The center of Lee's fantasy world shifted from radio to television when Mother bought a television set in 1948. When it was new, all of us spent far too much time watching variety shows, dramas, and old movies. Lee, particularly, was fascinated. One of his favorite programs was I LED THREE LIVES, the story of Herbert Philbrick, the FBI informant who posed as a Communist spy. In the early 1950's, LEE watched that show every week without fail. When I left home to join the Marines, he was still watching the reruns." Robert's testimony to the Warren Commission, interviews, statments to reporters, and his book, "LEE", clearly gave the impression that his dead "brother" was living in a fantasy world at the age of 12. Robert's willingness to readily share family "secrets" with the public seemed somewhat out of character, so I (John Armstrong) decided to check the accuracy of Robert's statements. I knew that Robert Oswald joined the Marines and left for San Diego on July 15, 1952 and was curious when the television program I LED THREE LIVES first aired on television. At the local library I found a book entitled THE COMPLETE DIRECTORY TO PRIME TIME NETWORK AND CABLE TV SHOWS 1946-PRESENT. According to this book, I LED THREE LIVES was first relased in September, 1953---a year and two months after Robert Oswald left Fort Worth and joined the Marines. There were 117 episodes and the original show ran thru mid 1956. Re-runs were aired years later, but only after the series ended in mid-1956. Lee Oswald could NOT possibly have watched I LED THREE LIVES in the summer of 1952, nor could he have watched re-runs which did not start until mid-1956. When Robert Oswald left home to join the Marines on July 15, 1952, LEE could not possibly have watched I LED THREE LIVES, and there are no other indication that he was living in a "fantasy world". These facts indicate that Robert invented this story in an attempt to malign his "dead" brother, and for what purpose? Robert, by cleverly combining fact and fiction, helped tocreate a false picture that his dead "brother" had serious psychological problems which originated in his youth. Robert's testimony was used by the Warren Commission to concluded that Lee Harvey Oswald was a mal-adjusted youth who was capable of assassinating the President.

Dear John-- when ____ ________ was still alive, and I think sorry she could not do more, she gave me two files that were originals. She had copied them at the National Archives and subsituted the copies for the opriginals that she took. Before they got better surveillance at the archives, she told me a number of documents were simply stolen. She had a friend who told her that eight secretaries were re-writing documents after November 22nd, and that many of the documents that are slated for release two decades from now or so will be fakes. However, she also said that since new evidence has leaked out anyway, the fakery of these documents will obvious. Fior this reason, a lot of them will simply be destroyed. So few of us will be around that I doubt there will be power to protest. By then, JFK's memory will be so totally trashed that people will think he had it coming to him, making the sacrifices and efforts of literally thousands of those who care of little worth, except that it was the right thing to do, and a mark of their integrity. I learned from the Mormon Documents scandal that sophisticated methods now exist to create 'old''original'documents. This fake document creator sold outrageous stuff to the Mormon Church that was purchased in order not to embarrass the church. These documents included The White Salamander Letter thyat certainly fooled me. In that letter, Martin Harris, one of the original three leaders of Mormonism along with Oliver Cowdery and Josephy Smith, declared he saw an angel connected with the golden plates of the Book of Mormon turn into a white salamander before his eyes. Reptiles and amphibians at that time were supposed to represent satanic elements, and the Mormon Presidency purchased the White Salamander Letter for an undiclosed amount, but rumor weas it was at the six figure level. Sime time after that, there was an explosion, a car bombing, and eventually the hoaxster, who was slightly injured when this bomb went off, conmfessed that the White Salamander Letter and several mothers the church out of fear and concern purchased from him were fakes. He had obtained paper from old books of the time period, rejuvenated ink from old bottles from the same time period, and used a vaccuum frame to make the ink sink down into the old paper just as it woulkd have done with the effect ofbgravity after so many years. What got him caught was that the spackle pattern of the inks was the same on several documents, and so the ink recipe was excatly the same--an impossibility in real life. If he had varied his inks, the man would never have been caught, because the writing, etc. was authentic looking to the tune of six figures. Move forward two decades to highly sophisticated computers, old paper and old ink, and I'm afraid in another few years it will be impossible to discern a fake from real if the hoaxster is working for the government. We are at the brink of the Memory Hole, where yesterday can be rewritten and the 'documents'will be there to prove it. Because witnesses are dying and taking their secrets to the grave, I am concerned that history will soon be rewritable, and we will not have the resources to uncover the truth in the general public. One reason I decided to speak out was in fact because so many were refusing to do so. You have no idea how many witnesses knew about Lee and me and have refused to be photographed, taped or filmed. One was from the Department of Defense, and he just didn't have the guts to go on the record, though he told me plenty. I would say that there should be a cut-off after which time extraordinary measures will have to be taken to prove that a document is genuine, because of the technology involved. I have seen with my own eyes stolen documents that were replaced with copies. Nobody knows how many documents got sanitized. We already know how many are blacked out and remain blacked out forty years later, a scandalous situation. All I can do is urge everyone to remember that the government at this point is not asked to provide a record of provenance. They can say such and such was found in a box numbered such and such. Because only a general description existed of the document, anything can be substituted. the deluge of released documents after the film JFK came out gave us a valuable windfall. Look at the George Joannides stuff. Wow. The scorn and contempt with which I have been treated by John McAdams and his friends at his website recently has included being called a lying psycopath a few times. Name calling is going on because they can't attack the evidence. They try to claim I don't have evidence, but many have seen it, and for a lonmg time, they could have received copies of it, too. Right before my eyes I have seen my own statements twisted beyond recognition and then repeated over and over as the 'true' account. My attempts to correct their misstatements are called changing my story! This is happening to me in real time. and despite my protests and the protests of others. 16,000 posts have been generated attacking my story over a period of four years, with the same objections repeated over and over, the answers ignored, and name calling continuing. While some people write and curse me because of what they have read on that site, more thoughtful people recognize a full-blown vendetta. As soon as I have finished my book --I'm working on end-notes now-- I hoppe to be able to provide updated information to this forum, where I have been treated decently. I thank all of you who care about the truth. Kennedy's assassination -- and by whom-- is important today because the foundation at that time was laid for the power structure we have today running the government. please forgive typos, I write looking at the keyboard due to vision problems. I do hope I've expressed some concerns and ideas concerning documents. Provenance must be known. For so much material that can be presented, that seems hardly likely. We are on the brink of being unable to discern a fake from the real thing in the matter of documents, technologically speaking. Therefore, the extant documents are the most important ones, and in another decade, I would hesitate to accept any earth-shaking revelation based on documents 'discovered' at that time. Sincerely, Judyth Vary Baker

For example, Phillips would have been aware that the Oswald impostor would have been captured on film in Mexico City. Therefore, why did they select someone who clearly did not look like Oswald. The setting up of Oswald seems a very amateur operation. Phillips might have been aware of what was going on, but I cannot believe that he played a major role. Dear John: regarding the above quote that you made... Phillips was in Washingotn when the surveillance photos were taken and when the tapes were made, etc. It's possible he was unaware of a mislabeling or other problem that came up. It's possible he let others handle this so he would never be blamed, conveniently being elsewhere during the critical days Lee was in Mexico City. Lee was supposed to meet "Mr. B" there, but he failed to show and Lee was told HE WAS IN WASHINGTON, D.C. Sounds like the same man to me. Phillips was also in New Orleans in 1962 working with INCA to get funds raised, and coming up with the idea for TRUTH TAPES. That was Phillips' baby. Furthermore, Phillips was in the training film seen by Tananbaum of the HSCA as well as by myself... though I did not see Phillips in that film, only Lee and some Cubans on their bellies shooting, etc. But Phillips was in town at least once, as "Mr. Benson"or "Mr. Benton."I can't remember which anymore. Phillips family, BTW, lived in Fort Worth, Texas, only a half hour drive from Dallas. He swore for years he did not bother to drive over from Fort Worth to see JFK come into town, when every CIA bigwig would be there if possible... and all the right connectiuons... Phillips was a rising star who became the head of ALL the operations later. Even so, mistakes can happen. Phillips allowed Lee to be seen. Lee reported some additional details of this meeting to me. It was I who apprised people that SHAWN Phillips KNEW about Dave Phillips' deathbed confession to James. I passed the word around and eventually Shawn, in New York, was just about forced to concede this, since I had already obtained these facts from Luis Urrea, Shawn Phillips' friend - a man who now derides me and pretends we were never friends. That is the price you pay for uncovering the truth. You make enemies, and lose friends. Phillips was smart enough to make himself look conveniently dumb when necessary. No harm was done by sending the 'wrong' photo. It bought them time to destroy the real thing, if it ever existed. However, Lee told me that he did see Duran, and her name is in his address book. Best, Judyth Vary Baker sorry about typos... eye problems.... appreciate your patience... and this is why I am not posting much or reading much....

Dan, I look forward to seeing your response. ==Judyth===

Well, Allan, everything you say certainly makes sense. We need to hear from Dan on these issues. I do hope he will speak uop and clarify things from his point of view. I am a person who views with compassion because I have myself been unconscionably attacked. In our own exchanges, you have given me a fair opportunity to present my viewpoint. Knowing that, it is puzzling to me how there can be such disparity in this matter. I do believe Dan Marvin's account that he was approached. I did see a photo that was sent around. I also did see that drawing at some time before it was shown on the Canadian produced film. Since being bashed on the head twice, my short term memory is unfortunately lacking in precision. My long-term memories (pre-1979 or so) are all apparently intact, thank God. I went through important psychiatric examinations after those traumas whyich I'd never been able to pay for, but were covered by insurance. In a way a blessing, as I took the MMPI II and came out as normal as can be. My IQ was intact, highest they had ever tested in their facility. I scorched through a test book nobody had completed in the time limit and asked for more, etc. It was learned I was not prone to fantasize, make up stories, etc. All that was great because it has muzzled my critics, that I''m an honest and non-pathological personality. But dear God, my memory for recent events! It's awful! I had trouble, for example, recognizing Nigel Turner's chief photographer when he arrived and did not want to let him in--after seeing him the previous day. I could not, for some time, recognize my sdurroundings if I walked more than a block away. Now I no longer have those problems, but it has taken a lot of hard work to regain a modicum of former function in the short-term memory department. But those experiences taught me a valuable lesson: it is easy to lose memory, and not recognize it is happening. As people get older, they may scramble earlier memories. In short, this may not be Dan's fault, as I of all people am painfully aware that sometimes new ionformation may not sink in. Whatever the reason, we need to hear from Dan point by point on these matters. I know he is up to his eyebrows with a lawsuit. I know Dan as an honorable man. Age can change things. Whatever, we need to get to the bottom of this. I do believe that Dan WILL respond. I can imagine your consternation if you had this experience. One other thing you said also deeply concerned me, that Dan taped people without their knowledge. I ACCIDENTALLY taped somebody once, when I put my tape recorder down into my purse upside down, it pushed it on. And lo, I thereby DO have just ONE recording made without knowledge of the person. Foprtunately, it happened in Texas, where only one of two people involved in the recording need to know (which of course is nasty). But otherwise, I always told people I was recording and often was told to put it away. So that does concern me and we need to hear from Dan about that as well, because that is once more a serious and troubling declaration that you have made. I am weary after speaking last night on Black Op radio. The streaming radio program will be available to anyonme who wishes to hear it in their archives. It will be the ONLY radio program I'll ever give from now on, to the best of my knowledge. There is a program in Bl;ack Op's archives I haven't accessed there that has Dan Marvin as featured speaker. I urge all of us to hear it and compare with the issues being raised. The truth must come before all else. It supercedes personal feelings. It has to. I regret that I will not be able to continue this thread. My time is severely limited, not only because of my book, but also because I'm writing my dissertation on John Gay's The Beggar's Opera through the centuries. I have eye problems and can only work on these things for so long and can no longer literally see. Then I have many, many typos. So this will have to be the end of my comments here, with the great hope that Dan Marvin will respond when he feels comfortable to address these issues. I continue toi retain affection and respect for this good man and am entirely puzzled at the disparities in your two accounts. We could use a good timeline here, from when this issue was first raised on The Men Who Killed Kennedy documentary and what was said there, to where the disparities began. I do NOT accept EVERYTHING the áuthorities'offer, however. I am still concerned about the footprint, which seems to me to be either sloppy crime scene work, or a piece of ignored evidence. Either way, the footprint should not have been ignored and dismissed as it has been. It should have been vigorously looked into. It vwas not. That means, to me, that the investigation had flaws. This further means I cannot acccept blindly everything coming from the investigation seocnd-hand, would like to see these documents posted so all of us can see just how thorough this investigation was. I ask that they be posted here instead of gojng to your weebsite because there is always the chance that over time your website will vanish, whereas the archives of this forum presumably will not. It was very irritating to have someone, for example, cite A.J. weberman's site--which then went down for what, two years? It is up again, but the old addresses do not work now. The same could happen to your website. So please, Allan, bring over the salient documents to this forum, so that we can see them and keep them in the thread as accessible exhiobits to which we can refer at once. It's important, and I hope you'll respond to this suggestion for the sake of everyone who needs this information. As for me, I will pop in when my eyes are in good condition to read what happens here between you and Dan. And John, thanks for the opportunity to have this information become available to all. Sincerely, Judyth Vary Baker please forgive typos....!

I've worked many jobs, and 90 days is the standard in Texas (lived there 19 years), as I recall, for training. At 90 days they decide whether to keep you or let you go. Lee was let go, according to testimony, for not doing a good job according to them, though they used him plenty for overtime, which doesn't make sense. If you look at his detailed time cards, you can see where he had 'training' in the beginning-- because he puts down hours but no specific activities. Later, he is very specific. Go to: Warren Commission Hearings, Volume XXIII Page 535 of 975 525 526 527 528 529 530 531 532 533 534 535 536 537 538 539 540 541 542 543 544 ...and on and on and on! to see how many kinds of jobs he does. He is not in training now. He's putting out a high volume of work minute by minute. Mary Ferrell's chronology says that Lee gave notice he was leaving: QUOTE ON "March 26, 1963 (Tuesday) - President Stovall of Jaggars-Chiles-Stovall says that he gives Oswald notice. (WC Vol 22, p. 161; WC Vol 24, p. 872) Superintendent Graef of Jaggars-Chiles-Stovall says that Oswald is given notice in April. (WC Vol 10, p. 171)" QUOTE OFF Question: Can he receive unemployment compensation if he gives notivce that he is leaving? Was Lee still in training? Only 'skilled' people worked overtime...see the statistics and comments in Ferrell's chronology here: QUOTE ON Discussion of Oswald's termination of employment at JCS: (WC Vol 19, pp. 192, 208; WC Vol 10, p. 171; Dallas Morning News, 12/3/63, p. I-17) Oswald quits voluntarily: 1. Oswald's last paycheck from JCS for $34.48 is mailed to him. He cashes it on April 12. Normally, an employee would be paid in full on the day of leaving if he has been discharged by the company. 2. Oswald worked from 8:00 a.m. til 5:30 p.m. on the last Saturday of his employment. With the pay-week ending on Wednesday, work on Saturday might not put the week's total past 40 hours, but Saturday work is considered 'overtime' work. Where overtime hours are changed into 'straight-time' hours at the rate of 1.5 'straight-time' hours for each overtime hour, Oswald's average weekly employment at JCS shows: October 1962 40 hours per week November 1962 56 " " " December 1962 52 " " " January 1963 54 " " " February 1963 49 " " " March 1963 57 " " " Oswald's weekly time for the months of March and April 1963: Week ending 3/06/63 47 hours " " 3/13/63 57 " " " 3/20/63 60 " " " 3/27/63 63 " " " 4/03/63 62 " " " 4/10/63 26 " (three days only) The frequency that Oswald worked more than the normal 8 hours in one day and the total hours exceeding 40 per week are given below: As pointed out above, Saturday work is usually considered as 'overtime' work. The record of Oswald's Saturday work at JCS is as follows: Month Saturdays Saturdays that Total hours of Oswald worked Saturday work Oct. 12-31, 1962 3 0 0 November 1962 4 4 31 hrs. 15 mins. December 1962 5 3 25 hrs. 0 mins. January 1963 4 2 18 hrs. 15 mins. February 1963 4 1 8 hrs. 15 mins. March 1963 5 4 35 hrs. 15 mins. April 1-6, 1963 1 1 9 hrs. 0 mins. 26 15 3. JCS President Stovall says that Oswald was prompt and not an absentee. (WC Vol 10, p. 173) 4. JCS employee Ofstein says that only skilled men were used on overtime work. (Ofstein thinks that Oswald worked on any one Saturday.) (WC Vol 10, p. 204) QUOTE OFF I wish I had more time, Dixie. I'm glad you're looking these matters up. I do not see justification for Lee receiving compensation for his J-C-S job when his employers said he had to be skilled to be working Saturdays. That's not on training. And Lee gave notice that he was quitting. How is it that he gets unemployment compensation for voluntarily quitting his job? Again, what they say before the Commission is sometimes tainted. I see this record and of course, what Lee told me. Thanks, I can't write any more, this is it. My eyes have problems.....causes me to miss things... sincerely, Judyth

Thanks, Allan. Now we need to hear from Dan. Best, Judyth

Dear Allan, Thanks for clarifying these things. I was unaware that Dan Marvin was given that information (that Pitzer was right-handed) and that you also have a tape recording of it. That means: 1) Dan needs to confirm that he was told this fact by Pitzer's wife on this website to make this matter clear to all of us. He has to tell us why the Canadian film shown in Russia seems to say the opposite. I have corresponded with Dan and found him consistent and sincere, so I expect him to answer in kind. 2) I never had any intention whatsoever of insulting you. I was surprised that you would think I was insulting you. Why would I do that? 3) We need direct quotes and citations, because these are very serious charges you are bringing against a decorated war hero. You need to put these statements into quotes so their precise content is able to be analyzed by all. I suggest: For example, you say Mrs. Pitzer said her husband was right handed. Was this to you as well as to Dan Marvin? PLEASE give us the quote from your tape recording, with context (showing how the material was elicited, such as did YOU directly ask, "Was your husband left handed or right handed, Mrs. Pitzer?"). Or was it Dan who asked? We really need to know. We need the direct quote, the date, and who witnessed this statement. Is Mrs. Pitzer aware that she was tape recorded saying this statement? It's not much to ask, and I believe it is fair to ask for (a) direct quote(s), since you have the tape recording. And/or Dan has it. Then we can see for ourselves exactly what was said, and the context. Your information is important to the case and I take it seriously. Many thanks, Judyth Vary Baker

Well, Dixie, of course your statements are reasonable. We only have to go as far as Marina Oswald's sworn testimony, however, to show that lying can occur. She was under terrible pressure and I do not fault her. We have others who complained that their testimony was altered, such as Mary Moorman. I am not saying she was telling the truth, but she was not the only one to complain. One of Lee's supervisors at Reily said that Lee would sit in a daze and just stare and smoke during work breaks. That was in an FBI report. Lee never smoked in his life. I gave the words of George DeMohrenschildt showing Lee was interested in photography and in maps while working at J-C-S to back up my statement that Lee told me he did work on maps at J-C-S. I again challenge you to carefully look at the fact that Lee was paid after he quit (they said under oath, I believe, that he was fired). But if fired, I believe he could not have received unemployment compensation. Yet he certainly did. Somebody at J-C-S either lied, or they illegally decided to pay Lee unemployment compensation anyway. THAT is a direct conflict, Dixie. THAT is why I say, I think we have hedging going on, sworn testimony or not. I wish I had more time, but it's all gone. I am grateful for all who care about the truth and getting to the bottom of these things. As a witness, I only relate what I was told and what I know happened, but it really helps to have known what happened, or at least what Lee told me. The perspective is much clearer than when you are going through all that mass of testimonies and documents. Best Regards, judyth

While I cannot comment on the Pitzer case directly, I would like Allan to please address the questions raised by Mr. Dankbaar instead of refusing to because of his dislike for Mr. Dankbaar. I would like to add that I highly respect Allan Eaglesham and consider him trying to do his honest best. He has done his level best to get to the bottom of the Pitzer case. Even if Pitzer committed suicide, this doesn;t mean he might not have been harrassed by somebiody into doing so, since he had a bright future when this event occurred. If Pitzer committed suicide, but Dan Marvin says he was approached to kill him, that does not mean Pitzer did not commit suicide. However, the reasons for the suicide must be explored. He might have been driven to it. And the suicide might have been staged. I do not like the fact that there is a footpriont on top of a piece of paper left on the floor. A crime scene is respected: there is cause, therefore, to believe the paper was stepped on before the crime scene was discovered. As to handedness, there was also concern raised about Lee Oswald's being left-handed or right -handed. I would like to see an actual statement from Pitzer's wife that she, a living person, writes herself, because we have a good friend of Pitzer saying he was left-handed, and the wife only reported second-hand as saying he was right-handed. We need the direct report. It is very important. As to the integrity of Dan, in my personal correspondence with him, he has seemed the soul of honor. He freely admits when he has made an error, even online in the newsgroups, he will admit when he's done so. Since he is an elderly man now, I think that needs to be taken into account: a person can say something in error and apologize for it later and should not thereby be considered necessarily a xxxx. I would also like to see examples of how Dan is supposed to have changed his story, since the gentleman he mentions has something to lose by admitting he, too, may have been approached. MANY witnesses deny ever being involved. I offer tjis review from amazon.com about Dan's book EXPENDABLE ELITE. Dan is being sued for writing it. You'd think the events described by Dan Marvin never happened, to read the complaints coming in from Special Forces. But read this: Truth by all Means!!!!!, February 29, 2004 Reviewer: Nam Phuong Nguyen from Los Angeles This review is in response the people who think they know better without having any true knowledge at all. This book is, without even the littlest of doubt, truthful to the core. I personally know Major Phoi, the Vietnamese SF officer and a very competent and religious man, who is included in the book and by no means do I discredit what LTC Marvin has written about this topic. Instead of what some other people might say, this is a wonderful book, not only outlining the realities of our government but also gives proper homage to the South Vietnamese soldiers who fought for right and freedom. Thank you for reading and God Bless, Cdt Nguyen USC ROTC

Mr. STOVALL. Well, except while I was in the Navy and I worked summers while I was going to college. Mr. JENNER. Where did you attend the university, by the way? Mr. STOVALL. I went to Texas Tech and SMU. I attended SMU at night and worked in the day. Mr. JENNER. What does your company do? Mr. STOVALL. We are in the typographic services. We serve advertising agencies, advertising departments, and the graphic arts industry as a middle supplier for type services. We also produce newspaper mats for duplication throughout the United States. Mr. JENNER. Do you do any work for any federal agency? Mr. STOVALL. Yes, sir. Mr. JENNER. Is it secret or confidential work or classified work of any kind? Mr. STOVALL. On occasion we do. Most of it is not, but we do on occasion. We are cleared through the Navy Bureau Materiel here, although I believe it now has been incorporated under the Department of Defense as a single unit. Mr. JENNER. Without disclosing any secrets in that connection or classifications, what is the nature of that work? Mr. STOVALL Generally speaking, the nature of the work is charting and 168 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- mapping, and actually all we do is set words, letters, and figures. We have no correlation of what they refer to. Mr. JENNER. It's charting of coastal areas, sea bottoms, and some land areas or what? Mr. STOVALL Yes; and some foreign areas, too. Mr. JENNER. That is, other than continental United States? Mr. STOVALL. Yes; right. Mr. JENNER. Was any of this work done in the department or area to which Lee Oswald had access while he was employed by your company? Mr. STOVALL. Not in the department at all. Whatever secret work we might have been performing, we do it with the persons who had been cleared by the regular procedures and they are the only eyes who view this. Mr. JENNER. So, anything that is classified is done only by employees of yours who have been cleared by an appropriate Federal agency? Mr. STOVALL. Yes, sir. Mr. JENNER. And then, I gather that as far as Lee Harvey Oswald is concerned, he had no part in it nor access to any of this work? Mr. STOVALL. This is correct. Mr. JENNER. And that your company is at pains to see that no one other than those who are cleared have access to it? Mr. STOVALL. That is correct. Mr. JENNER. And that was true while he was working for you? Mr. STOVALL. Yes. In fact, at such times as we have any secret work going, even at the point of being rude, we see that no one has access to any of this material. I won't say--rude but we strictly enforce it. Mr. JENNER. Well, you make it pretty firm, which is right? Mr. STOVALL Right. Mr. JENNER. Do you do any lithography work? Mr. STOVALL. No. Mr. JENNER. Do you do any printing of advertisements, papers, newspapers, periodicals? Mr. STOVALL. No. Mr. JENNER. You set type, of course? Mr. STOVALL. We set type. The only printing we do is a proving process, and that should we do an ad, let's say some of the Savings Bond Committee and ship one hundred mats, we would also ship one hundred proofs. Mr. JENNER. You pull off proofs but your presses are proof presses, and that's all? Mr. STOVALL. Right; we have no printing presses in this regard. Mr. JENNER. I take it you do a lot of camera work? Mr. STOVALL. Considerable; yes. Mr. JENNER. But it is commercial camera work? Mr. STOVALL. Right; it isn't even photography. It is only the part of reducing and enlarging printed material that we set in our type shop. It has to be resized and we also make screen veloxes. Mr. JENNER. Explain for the record what that is. Mr. STOVALL. A velox is a photographic print that has been screened by a dot press to separate the tone values in order that a camera can shoot them in black and white or in any group of colors, but it breaks it down into minute units that a camera will recognize. Mr. JENNER. That's like half tones for newspaper printing? Mr. STOVALL. Right. Mr. JENNER. Do you do any plate work other than the mats? Mr. STOVALL. No. Mr. JENNER. Is the term "microdot printing" or lithographing familiar to you? Mr. STOVALL. Lithography is--microdot printing is not. Mr. JENNER. And you don't do any work of that nature and character? Mr. STOVALL. No. Mr. JENNER. Other than the preparation of or use of dot work as you have already described it? Mr. STOVALL. Yes. In the above, Mr. Stovall, of Jaggars-Chiles-Stovall, is denying Lee had any access to any work they were doing for the Department of Defense. This reminds me of the denials that everybody else at this time made. When the question is asked, do they do any printing of advertisements, etc., the key word is printing...they made mats for ads that were used all over the Uniteed States. Lee would cut a red cellophane material called zip-a-tone and vblock off areas where a local newspaper might place a local name for an ad going into the newspaper. He also applied zip-a-tone features such as shading and designs here and there, then the mat was created. I know what he did because later I, myself, would do artwork at Steck-Vaughn publishing. As for making microdots, I have no idea whether Lee did this for a government agency or for himself. I only know that he made them. Lee's personal address book also has the word MICRODOT right under the name and address of Jaggars-Chiles-Stovall, guess that's just a coincidence. I doubt seriously that Mr. Stovall, whose company made money from the government's contracts with them, would have admitted that Lee Oswald was doing any kind of classified work for them. As for maps, he said they were putting names, etc. on them. Lee loved maps and was highly interested in them. He did tell me he worked on maps at J-C-S and I repeat, I doubt J-C-S would harm their standing by admitting that. Lee worked with cameras that took sophisticated photos on big frame boxes that could enlarge or reduce considerably anything placed on them. The resulting mats were printed in thousands of newspapers, etc. Of course he was proud of such work. What we CAN prove is that George DeMohrenschildt (I AM A PATSY! I AM A PATSY!) had the following to say about Lee's work at J-C-S, which he called 'Taggert's' as he had the phonetic version of the name: (begin quote) Lee finally found a job at Taggart's Reproduction Company through the Texas Employment Agency without help from anyone. It was a good job for him as he had been interested in photography for a long time. I guessed that he took a course at the Marine Corps. Anyway he brought a good camera from the Soviet Union and took excellent pictures. Later he showed me excellent enlargements he made himself. These were in black and white he was not advanced enough to develop and enlarge color photographs. But Lee's job did not pay well and, as he began to trust me more, he accepted an introduction to a successful businessman-banker, Sam Ballen, who owned, among other companies, a large reproduction outfit for maps, electric logs, and records. It was not a successful meeting; Lee and my friend did not like each other. To the businessman Lee was a radical and a maverick., and Lee considered Sam an ordinary bourgeois with no redeeming features. Actually, both were interesting people; they just did not appeal to each other."(end quote) Here Lee's interest in working with maps in reproduction is made clear. I do not think Lee lied to me when he said that eventually he was allowed to work on J-C-S's maps, however they might wish to deny it. At the very least, he would have expressed interest in working on their maps. Lee Oswald worked very frequently on Saturdays doing overtime work. At that time, he told me he was often the only person there. He had been given a key to allow himself into and out of the building. The circumstances of his being 'fired' are very peculiar. The claim was made that the man who made meticulous notes of his work, available to look at in the Warren Commission exhibits, and who obviously worked very hard, and was given extensive addiitional Saturday work-- the man did not miss a day of work and was working fifty and sicty hour weeks-- suddenl;y i9s deemed not doing a good job and is let go. In reality, he was let go to start his Pro-Castro project. Soon after being let go, Lee briefly demonstrated in a Pro-Castro dry-run on a busy intersection in Dallas, with a VIVA CASTRO! placard around his neck. Must have just thrilled Marina. I do not know about the Walker incident. He never told me. Had I known about it, I would have asked. But I had never heard about it. It was a Dallas event that occurred before I met him in New Orleans: it never crossed my mind, when I heard Walker's name, that Lee might have been involved in that event where a young witness over at the adjacent Mormon church said two people got into two separate cars and drove off. The Pro-Castro bit was the first of many Pro-Castro stances Lee would put on. During his stay at J-C-S, Lee memorized the maps of Cuba. I wonder how he did that. Maybe Mr. Stovall just didn't wish to describe the real Lee Oswald. He had a lot of reasons not to. ===Judyth====

I can help here. lee had a job he loved at Jaggars-Chiles-Stovall....many of the ads they printed there were due to Lee's meticulous work in photocopying portions, putting them together to make new ads, some layout work as well, mostly photographing ads and making sure they looked good by adding typed lines, blowing up photos, blowing down photos, etc. He also made microdots. He also helped create and produce maps. This was in Texas, before going to New Orleans and then back to Texas. Lee loved photography and often put down that he was a 'photographer' on job applications. He had some nice cameras. that's what is so absurd about his supposedly owning the Imperial Reflex camera in 1963. It was a lousy camera that leaked light and didn't have a very good lens. All the while, Lee had a Minox, and another fine camera, one with an extra set of high quality lenses. The Imperial Reflex, btw, was 're-found' in the Paines'garage in early 1964 when people began to wonder where the camera was that made those damning backyard photos. On another note, since I posed as Marina in New Orleans, you will not find any photos Lee made of Marina in New Orleans, or thereafter. He did not want us compared via any photos. You will not find any photos of Lee with Marina, either, at any time after he met me. He avoided that so that there would be no comparisons. I was the same height, weight, etc. as Marina. Same blue eyes, same hairstyle. Individuals have seen photo composites. One photo opf Marina taken in 1963 just before Lee left, and another taken by Time-Life on November 23--I have matching photos that are of me. Good enough to pass as Marina--same hairstyles, as well. I do not know how to post them here. Perhaps Martin or someone else could post such. ==Judyth===

Hi, Terry! Good to see you here! ==Judyth===

Dear John, and all who might have read the above: 1) I really do get worn out trying to argue with people as in the bove. 2) (i) This lady does NOT accept the word of a researcher who knew, intimately, Marina Oswald, concerning her affair with Robert: Mary Ferrell. I reported what Ferrell told me, in the presence of a corroborating witness. (ii) she does not accept the word of Thomas Mallon, as he reported it, also with a corroborating witness, Patricia Johnson McMillan, and an un-named source. When I offer that the only alternative, then, is that she is saying that we are all lying, she makes it seem that I am name calling. I am not. (3) She says I have changed my story. What she has read are twisted versions of my story which I tried to correct. When I tried to correct these twisted versions, yes, I was accused of changing my story. Did she offer examples of my changed story? No. She made an accusation I take very seriously. (4) She has had the opportunity, for years, to contact me. The email address was in plain view for three years. I never heard from her. (5) Marina Oswald has chosen not to respond to all my attempts to contact her. That is not my fault. (6) When my book comes out, will Bernice see 'no' evidence in it, either? Since she does not accept my word concerning Marina's affair, she does not accept Mallon's, she does not accept McMillan's support of Mallon, she does not accept Reynold's support of me, she apparently rejects witness testimony. Since in many cases I will only be able to offer the testimonies of witnesses to back up what I say in the book, will she reject those as inadequate? I have living witnesses to back up what I say. If she rejects their word, what is one to do? (7) I NEVER recommended that people read Mallon's book. I cited Mallon. The lady insinuates that I have done a disservice in mentioning Mallon's book to unwary readers. She asked me for support of my statement. I gave it. Then she attacked me for mentioning this book. Was I only allowed to cite from books that this lady likes? (7) AM I merely gossiping? The lady said my statement had nothing to do with the assassination. Is that true? The matter is important: was Robert Oswald compromised? The camera was found immediately after the affair came to light, according to Mary Ferrell. Since two people can corroborate what Mary said, I felt it was important to ask ourselves if Robert Oswald was compromised. Is THAT how he came to 'find' the Imperial Reflex camera? WHY wasn't the camera placed with all the other camera equipment, etc. found on November 22-23? The corruption of the Dallas police in changing testimonies, not keeping track of chains of possession of evidence, and in 'losing'--- and then conveniently 'finding' --- evidence stinks to high heaven. The exchange above is very typical of what happened in the newsgroup. No matter what I might have offered as proof, it was never enough. Thank you for the opportuunity to speak here. I hope others will weigh in with their opinions about whether or not I had a good reason to bring up this matter and also if it was reasonable for me to say that Robert Oswald and Marina had a brief affair. BTW, nobody has ever argued with Mary Ferrell's information about Marina Oswald. She was an expert on Marina. As for me, I knew where she worked, everything, but did not impose myself on her when I lived in Dallas. I asked to see her: she refused. I did what I could to try to contact her. She always turned me or my friends down. She is not the helpless woman being maligned as suggested above. She has had many opportunities to speak out. Imagine how frightened I am -- and I am--to bring out the book and name names. For some people, there will NEVER be enough evidence. And in America, specious lawsuits are a plague. I do not look forward to getting the book published. It will mean only more misery. I will do it only because it is the right thing to do. I apologize for this long post. I HAVE written again because she rejected a reasonable amount of evidence and also said I changed my story. That had to be addressed. Ask yourself-- WHO, in the above exchange, offered REAL INFORMATION, such as on the camera? What did the other person offer? Nothing but opinions that she doesa not like what I said. She also said I changed my story -- an insult to my integrity. She offered no proof. She rejected my citation of Mallon -- why? She doesn't like his book. Well, that's not a good enough reason. Where is her objectivity? She offered opinions, not evidence. I'm very used to that from those who attack me. But readers here need to be made aware that the accusation I changed my story is not taken lightly by me. If she tries to back it up, I'll prove it's not true. ADDING DETAILS to a story, by the way, is not CHANGING it. For example, nobody asked me if Lee was right-handed or left handed before Robert groden wrote and asked me. So it wasn't in the two earlier versions of the book, either. Now I have added that information. That is not changing the story. That is adding information people want to know. Thank you. Judyth

ADEQUATE SCRUTINY UNBIASED OPINION ---------------------------- ADEQUATE SCRUTINY BIASED OPINION INADEQUATE SCRUTINY UNBIASED OPINION INADEQUATE SCRUTINY BIASED OPINION OF COURSE THE FIRST CHOICE IS IDEAL, AND IS SURPRISINGLY RARE. JUDYTH