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A challenge for my detractors


Len Colby
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My critics frequently claim that “most”, “almost all”, “over 90%” of my posts breach the spirit if not the letter of forum rules mandating civil behavior. They say that I frequently “goad”, “insult” etc those I disagree with. Despite there being an 8 page thread dedicated to show this was the case only 2 easily refuted examples were cited. Despite two threads being locked over this topic and John saying he approved of those locks my detractors keep bring up these unsubstantiated charges on other threads.

I challenge them to back their claims:

- Take a representative sample of my posts, the easiest way would be to take a specific page from my post history or the 1st/last 10 – 12 posts on one of those pages

- Show that I was unduly “uncivil” in a disproportionate number of them. Cases where I was responding in kind to others don’t count.

So as to not start yet another version of previously locked threads I will only reply to posts that meet the criteria spelled out above. I’m sure that by going over my (or just about any member’s) entire body of posts one could find several examples where I was (they were) unkind and had thrown the 1st stone.

Len

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Bravo, Peter.

But more than enough said.

Everyone: If you bite, these characters win.

Every second you spend responding to this sort of distraction-as-egomania is a second spent in support of the other side. Can't you see the game here? PURSUE ME, NOT THE TRUTH!

I am not suggesting that perfidy and stupidity should remain unredressed. But our responses must be characterized by proportionality and dignity.

And more than a soupçon of contempt.

Do not address these people directly; rather, address their masters.

Expose their game.

REPEAT: Expose their game.

Offer not the slightest semblance of collegiality to those whose efforts to engage us are designed not to support the searches for truth and justice, but rather to hinder them.

Is this post, ironically, emblematic of precisely what I argue must NOT be written?

No.

It is a call to arms.

Now, if we're ready, let's move on to serious matters.

Charles

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The planet IMO is nearing its end, environmentally, politically, militarily, with lies too burdensom to survive. As they said back in the '70s - one is either a part of the solution, of part of the problem. Choose one. I am not going to keep up a dialogue....but go on my own way........best to you, but kindly join attempts to save Gaia from destruction at the hands of the only evil empire [with any meaningful power] extant...that being the USA. Perhaps it is just a difference of 'style'....or maybe more.

JFK was killed by the Oligarchy that rules America. So was RKF, MLK, Malcolm-X, they ran Watergate and overthrew over 100 countries, killed millions. This must end. If you understand he Jewish Holacaust, you should also understand this one now aimed at almost the entire planet, centered in the USA. Sometimes people have so little common ground, and they can not communicate. May you find your way to truth. Peace. Over and out.

Peter ... Your words are not only overwhelmingly tragic but IMO unfortunately true , and some of the most profound I have ever read on any discussion forum .

You have my admiration for ending this unnecessary online feud between you and Len ... Hopefully we will all learn from this and move on to discuss the various issues here , displaying more kindness and respect towards the members we disagree with .

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Guest David Guyatt
Bravo, Peter.

But more than enough said.

Everyone: If you bite, these characters win.

Every second you spend responding to this sort of distraction-as-egomania is a second spent in support of the other side. Can't you see the game here? PURSUE ME, NOT THE TRUTH!

I am not suggesting that perfidy and stupidity should remain unredressed. But our responses must be characterized by proportionality and dignity.

And more than a soupçon of contempt.

Do not address these people directly; rather, address their masters.

Expose their game.

REPEAT: Expose their game.

Offer not the slightest semblance of collegiality to those whose efforts to engage us are designed not to support the searches for truth and justice, but rather to hinder them.

Is this post, ironically, emblematic of precisely what I argue must NOT be written?

No.

It is a call to arms.

Now, if we're ready, let's move on to serious matters.

Charles

Yup...

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Awesome, you guys start threads attacking him, but when he tries to defend himself, you call it a distraction tactic. Bravo indeed.

Kevin .... The war is over with and hopefully we will all learn from this .. . Or does that maybe not go along with your particular agenda here ? ... It would seem that aside from spreading pro-Apollo disinformation , your main objective here might be trolling for an argument .

This isn't the UM "phunk" .... The members here are not only more intelligent , but not quite as inclined to play the type of dim witted , mob mentality mind games, which you all seem to enjoy so much on that forum .

It's very noble of you to come to Len's defense , but I do believe the main players in this ridiculous drama have already left the discussion .

You apparently need to learn the same lesson that Len does .... This forum is NOT all about you and your determination to goad , and thus anger , those you disagree with .

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Awesome, you guys start threads attacking him, but when he tries to defend himself, you call it a distraction tactic. Bravo indeed.

Kevin .... The war is over with and hopefully we will all learn from this .. . Or does that maybe not go along with your particular agenda here ? ... It would seem that aside from spreading pro-Apollo disinformation , your main objective here might be trolling for an argument .

This isn't the UM "phunk" .... The members here are not only more intelligent , but not quite as inclined to play the type of dim witted , mob mentality mind games, which you all seem to enjoy so much on that forum .

It's very noble of you to come to Len's defense , but I do believe the main players in this ridiculous drama have already left the discussion .

You apparently need to learn the same lesson that Len does .... This forum is NOT all about you and your determination to goad , and thus anger , those you disagree with .

Duane, I have no intention to goad, you're just projecting. You are the one goading, when you say things like "dim witted , mob mentality mind games", accuse me of spreading disinformation and trolling.

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Awesome, you guys start threads attacking him, but when he tries to defend himself, you call it a distraction tactic. Bravo indeed.

Kevin .... The war is over with and hopefully we will all learn from this .. . Or does that maybe not go along with your particular agenda here ? ... It would seem that aside from spreading pro-Apollo disinformation , your main objective here might be trolling for an argument .

This isn't the UM "phunk" .... The members here are not only more intelligent , but not quite as inclined to play the type of dim witted , mob mentality mind games, which you all seem to enjoy so much on that forum .

It's very noble of you to come to Len's defense , but I do believe the main players in this ridiculous drama have already left the discussion .

You apparently need to learn the same lesson that Len does .... This forum is NOT all about you and your determination to goad , and thus anger , those you disagree with .

Duane, I have no intention to goad, you're just projecting. You are the one goading, when you say things like "dim witted , mob mentality mind games", accuse me of spreading disinformation and trolling.

AH .... "projecting" !! .... That would be one of the trigger words of goading , would it not ? ... Along with " hand waving" , "strawman" , "logical falicy " , etc. etc . etc.

Try not to be so predictable ... I now know what you're going to post before you even post it ....I wasn't goading you , but only showing you the truth of how you all conduct yourselves on the UM forum ... Don't be so "SENSITIVE" ! LOL

I am trying to show you how ridiculous you're acting in light of Peter's and Charles' comments about going off topic, by making this a personal war when it shouldn't be .

Now maybe we can stick to the subjects being discussed ... Or do you feel the need to argue some more about nothing ? ;)

Edited by Duane Daman
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Projecting would be you attributing your own qualities to others.

Strawman arguments, logical fallicies, etc. Those are legitimate complaints against poor debating tactics. Rather than just assume people who say those things are attacking you, you should go look up what they mean and see why they are saying those things.

I was on topic by the way, this thread is not about anything other than you guys attacking Len. You are the one going off topic by making it about me.

I'm sure this is exactly what Len expected. So far, no one has posted an example of him being uncivil.

PS. I'm done with this thread, I don't want another pointless debate with Duane.

Edited by Kevin M. West
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I was on topic by the way, this thread is not about anything other than you guys attacking Len. You are the one going off topic by making it about me.

Well , I guess you weren't finished arguing about nothing .... You're the one that made this all about you by saying .. " Awesome, you guys start threads attacking him, but when he tries to defend himself, you call it a distraction tactic. Bravo indeed."

I'm sure this is exactly what Len expected.

I'm sure this is exactly what Len wanted ... More dischord .

PS. I'm done with this thread, I don't want another pointless debate with Duane.

Then why did you jump into this one ? ... At least be truthful when posting such nonsense ... All people have to do it to scroll back to your previous comments to see what your motives were .

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Since as I expected none of my detractors were willing to back their claims about me I suggest that this thread be locked.

I wish to commend Charles though for being upfront with his position that he is opposed to the free exchange of ideas and thinks I’m “the enemy” (as he called me on another thread) because of what I say and not how I say it.

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You always seem to miss the point ... I personally never thought it was what you say that's the problem , but rather the way you say it .

I can't speak for what Charles believes about you , but I do agree with him that this type of discussion is pointless and a complete waste of time .

So I agree with you that this thread should be locked , as it should have never been started to begin with .

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