JFK Grand Jury

[Dawn Meredith]

The last chance of a real investigation ended when Congressman Gonzales resigned from the HSCA after acting somewhat erratically. I would never want to sound paranoid and accuse CIA of drugging him but we were at war with the Communists and a crippling blow to the Agency might have tipped the balance in favor of the Soviets, or it might not have.

Hi A.J.,

The Case of Congressman Gonzales is certainly one for the MK/ULTRA files, though of course the powers that be used him to get Richard Sprague, the first chief counsel of the House Select Committee on Assassinations (HSCA), who we hope to be the lead prosecutor (with Bob Tannenbaum) for the Mock Grand Jury.

Gonzalas was the second chairman of the HSCA. The first (Tom Downing? of Virginia) was convinced of conspiracy by a private screening of the Zap film, but after getting the Committee going, retired, leaving it to Gonzalas, the Texas Congressman who should have ex-cused himself for being a material witness - he recovered John Connally's clothes and destroyed them as evidence.

When Richard Sprague, the Philadelphia prosecutor who had already successfully prosecuted a political assassination (Lablonski UMW) was appointed chief counsel of the HSCA - the most powerful position after Chairman, he began formal homicide investigations into the murders of JFK and MLK. This, of course, was not going to play out, and the power struggle on the Hill resulted in Gonzalas losing the chairmanship and Sprague being sent back to Philly. Replacing him, G.R. Blakey, began to write a report.

Now we'd like to see what Sprgue could do with a grand jury.

Hi Bill:

Are you saying Sprage is willing to do this? (Provided he's appointed, of course. IF that is even how this would proceed. Normally it's the DA who convens a Grand Jury, so I do not know the procedure here). That would be fantastic!! He was our best hope during HSCA and when he was driven from his position by the horrible news stories in the Op Mickingbird- (CIA-controlled)- press it was all downhill after that. Attorney -"The- Mob- did- it" Robert Blakey was...ah.. not a good person to replace the inimitable Sprague. (For those unfamiliar with all of this history, I highly recommend former HSCA investigator Gaeton Fonzi's book "The Last Investigation" ).

We desperately need a Grand Jury investigation. While some of the conspirators are still alive (and thus indictable).

Dawn

[Dawn Meredith]

We desperately need a Grand Jury investigation. While some of the conspirators are still alive (and thus indictable).

I would urge all to take stock of the fact that there once was a real and honest and thwarted attempt at a prosecution of some of those involved in the Assassination - Garrison's prosecution. He was on the mark, if lacking much of the newer information we now have and hindered by CIA-run attempts to thwart success in his prosecution. If you have not yet, read Mellen's A Farewell to Justice - great book on Garrison and the state of the 'case' against those who killed JFK.

Peter,

I could not agree with you more Re the Garrison investigation and Joan Mellen's book re his investigation.

That said I had some serious problems with that portion of her book where she was so taken in by Murgado, saying that the Kennedys were trying to kill Castro. (Especially given that it was Gerry Hemming who put her onto Murgado).

I find it inconceivable that, while in the midst of what has now been proven- to me at least- JFK and Castro were to have normalized relations, and in fact were to meet "after a brief trip to Dallas", that bros -Kennedy were also trying to assassinate Castro.

I also had a difficult time accepting the notion that it was Bobby Kennedy who sent (CIA man!!) Walter Sheridan to New Orleans to destroy Garrison's investigation.

I loved her book so far as bringing us up to the present on the work that Garrison had done, and continued to do til he died in '92. But the above two points ruined the book for me. Several other researchers are equally disappointed by these particular portions of her book: notably Vince Salandria, Lisa Pease, Jim DiEugenio, Steve Jones, Jim Douglas- just to name the ones with whom I have had this discussion.

I wish she'd re-write her book, fix the terrible footnote problem, and reconsider the "evidence" for her above-referenced "theories".

Dawn

[Duke Lane]

Hi Duke, Did anything come of your meeting? I wrote a letter to Dallas D.A. Hill in 2003 asking him to re-open this case. I received no reply. (Big surprise).

Just disappointment that someone could mouth the words of "Oswald did it ... easily," and then admit they couldn't back it up because they'd "never made a personal study of it." It was like, "Okay, you work here now, the topic comes up, here's what you say ..." and shore 'nuff, out poured the words. A more honest "they'd never even think about it" would have been more appreciated.

[Dawn Meredith]

. Anyone trying to re-open an investigation had better look at what Garrison did and stand on his shoulders with the new information we now have. I'd like to see in DC someday [dream on...] a Garrison Justice Building.

I could not agree more. Garrison had the case slved, but was blocked at every turn. Davy's book, then Mellen's prove this with the new evidence, that vindicated the Judge.

What a nice thought: Garrison Justice building.

Dawn

[Dawn Meredith]

Hi Bill etc

I just now realized there are two threads on the call for a Grand Jury.

Just making this one "current".

Bill, I have some questions/thoughts, will email you)

Dawn

[Terry Mauro]

The last chance of a real investigation ended when Congressman Gonzales resigned from the HSCA after acting somewhat erratically. I would never want to sound paranoid and accuse CIA of drugging him but we were at war with the Communists and a crippling blow to the Agency might have tipped the balance in favor of the Soviets, or it might not have.

Hi A.J.,

The Case of Congressman Gonzales is certainly one for the MK/ULTRA files, though of course the powers that be used him to get Richard Sprague, the first chief counsel of the House Select Committee on Assassinations (HSCA), who we hope to be the lead prosecutor (with Bob Tannenbaum) for the Mock Grand Jury.

Gonzalas was the second chairman of the HSCA. The first (Tom Downing? of Virginia) was convinced of conspiracy by a private screening of the Zap film, but after getting the Committee going, retired, leaving it to Gonzalas, the Texas Congressman who should have ex-cused himself for being a material witness - he recovered John Connally's clothes and destroyed them as evidence.

When Richard Sprague, the Philadelphia prosecutor who had already successfully prosecuted a political assassination (Lablonski UMW) was appointed chief counsel of the HSCA - the most powerful position after Chairman, he began formal homicide investigations into the murders of JFK and MLK. This, of course, was not going to play out, and the power struggle on the Hill resulted in Gonzalas losing the chairmanship and Sprague being sent back to Philly. Replacing him, G.R. Blakey, began to write a report.

Now we'd like to see what Sprgue could do with a grand jury.

Hi Bill:

Are you saying Sprage is willing to do this? (Provided he's appointed, of course. IF that is even how this would proceed. Normally it's the DA who convens a Grand Jury, so I do not know the procedure here). That would be fantastic!! He was our best hope during HSCA and when he was driven from his position by the horrible news stories in the Op Mickingbird- (CIA-controlled)- press it was all downhill after that. Attorney -"The- Mob- did- it" Robert Blakey was...ah.. not a good person to replace the inimitable Sprague. (For those unfamiliar with all of this history, I highly recommend former HSCA investigator Gaeton Fonzi's book "The Last Investigation" ).

We desperately need a Grand Jury investigation. While some of the conspirators are still alive (and thus indictable).

Dawn

********************************************************

"He was our best hope during HSCA and when he was driven from his position by the horrible news stories in the Op Mockingbird- (CIA-controlled)- press it was all downhill after that. Attorney -"The- Mob- did- it" Robert Blakey was...ah.. not a good person to replace the inimitable Sprague."

Especially after Blakey appointed Georges Johannides [head of DRE out of JM/WAVE] to the committee. Talk about letting the fox into the henhouse. A major gaff on the part of Blakey's whether intentional, or not.

[William Kelly]

I have started a new Grand Jury Thread under JFK Assassination Seminars in the Controversial Issues in History section.

The first post is an introduction to and basic background on what a grand jury is and how it functions.

This November will be introducing the first grand jury petition request that a Special Federal Grand Jury be convened in the North Texas Federal Court in Dallas to determine if there is enough evidence to indicte anyone for federal crimes related to the assassination of President Kennedy.

Bill Kelly

[William Kelly]

I have started a new Grand Jury Thread under JFK Assassination Seminars in the Controversial Issues in History section.

The first post is an introduction to and basic background on what a grand jury is and how it functions.

This November will be introducing the first grand jury petition request that a Special Federal Grand Jury be convened in the North Texas Federal Court in Dallas to determine if there is enough evidence to indicte anyone for federal crimes related to the assassination of President Kennedy.

Bill Kelly

I just wanted to bring this thread back to life as I have been getting emails requesting info on the JFK Grand Jury Project and will have an update soon.

BK

[Tim Gratz]

Bill wrote:

This November will be introducing the first grand jury petition request that a Special Federal Grand Jury be convened in the North Texas Federal Court in Dallas to determine if there is enough evidence to indicte anyone for federal crimes related to the assassination of President Kennedy.

Bill, unless you know something you haven't told us, the answer to that question is obviously no and at least IMO no U.S. attorney is going to convene a grand jury when there is nothing there. ("There is no there there", as the saying goes.)

Dawn or her husband, both of whom practice criminal law in Texas, can correct me if I am wrong about this.

[William Kelly]

Bill wrote:

This November will be introducing the first grand jury petition request that a Special Federal Grand Jury be convened in the North Texas Federal Court in Dallas to determine if there is enough evidence to indicte anyone for federal crimes related to the assassination of President Kennedy.

Bill, unless you know something you haven't told us, the answer to that question is obviously no and at least IMO no U.S. attorney is going to convene a grand jury when there is nothing there. ("There is no there there", as the saying goes.)

Dawn or her husband, both of whom practice criminal law in Texas, can correct me if I am wrong about this.

Tim,

That "No" is your opinion without having seen the evidence that would be presented to a grand jury.

I think the answer to that question rests with the grand jury, not you, or Dawn.

BK

[Tim Gratz]

Bill, true or false:

You have evidence pointing to someone who could be charged with conspiracy to deprive JFK of his civil rights, to justify convening a grand jury, evidence that has not been publicy disclosed?

All I am saying is no U.S. attorney is going to convene a grand jury on some open-ended fishing expedition and to date I have seen no evidence pointing to anyone who is not already in hell.

[William Kelly]

Bill, true or false:

You have evidence pointing to someone who could be charged with conspiracy to deprive JFK of his civil rights, to justify convening a grand jury, evidence that has not been publicy disclosed?

All I am saying is no U.S. attorney is going to convene a grand jury on some open-ended fishing expedition and to date I have seen no evidence pointing to anyone who is not already in hell.

Tim, That was the first question I asked Susan Brenner, and her response was that you don't have to have a suspect to convene a grand jury, all you need is a crime.

And now don't you be worrying yourself about what evidence will be presented, as that, as you know, is a secret.

BK

[Tim Gratz]

But in order to have a crime of conspiracy to deprive someone of his civil rights I assume you must have evidence of a conspiracy, Bill.

[Tim Gratz]

From the

". . .[T]he federal grand jury's function is to determine whether a person shall be tried for a serious federal crime alleghed to have been committed in the district in which it sits."

. . .

"The major portion of the grand jury's work is concerned with evidence brought to its attention by an attorney for the government. . . This is necessary because the grand jury has no investigative staff, and legal assiatance will be necessary in the event an indictment is voted."

From:

Handbook For Federal Grand Jurors issued by the U.S. Judicial Conference.

Bill, you are evading my question.

A grand jury is NOT a body to investigate a crime. That is the function of a POLICE FORCE. A federal prosecutor will convene a grand jury if he or she believes there is sufficient evidence to try someone for a crime. Unless you have such evidence to show a federal prosecutor, you ain't goin' no place.

It seems you want a federal prosecutor to convene a grand jury simply to investigate the case. I could be wrong, but I don't think that is the way things work at all.

[Tim Gratz]

Bill, you wrote in Post #21:

WHILE I DON'T THINK IT IS NECESSARY TO TARGET ANY SPECIFIC SUSPECTS, THE WITNESSES WHO TESTIFY WILL LEAD TO THE SUSPECTS - THOSE WHO ARE SUBJECTS THAT BECOME TARGETS MUST BE ADVISED THAT THEY ARE TARGETS.

This is where I think you are wrong.

I also think you need to show the crime was committed in the jurisdiction where the grand jury is to meet. Now I could be wrong about this but if for instance E. Howard Hunt (I'll take him since he is dead) sat down in his CIA office in Langley, Va with LHO (well, assume LHO did it just for the sake of argument) and conspired to kill JFK, arguably the conspiracy occured in VA even though the crime was committed in Texas.

So you are going to tell a US attorney, "I think there was a conspiracy to kill JFK but I do not know who the conspirators were but why don't you convene a grand jury to investigate the case, find out who the conspirators were and indict them?" Is that really what you are telling us?

Is there ANY evidence whatsoever to accuse any LIVING PERSON of conspiring to kill JFK?