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First Shot(CE399)---Last Time


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Although previously provided, it would appear that a new grouping of members have not had the opportunity to scoff at the facts.

Therefore, before putting my marbles away and playing some other game, for the last time hopefully, here are the facts as relates to the first shot fired in the assassination of JFK.

Be reminded that I am neither more qualified than, or know more about the assassination than did certain members of the WC as well as the FBI and US Secret Service.

And, in that regards, the day after the WC completed their "staged"/aka phony assassination re-enactment, members of this group remained behind and were observed cutting and removing the limbs from the top of the live oak tree which is located directly in front of the TSDB/directly under the sixth floor window.

With that tidbit of knowledge, one can thereafter place the WC & it's true mission into it's proper perspective.

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Although previously provided, it would appear that a new grouping of members have not had the opportunity to scoff at the facts.

Therefore, before putting my marbles away and playing some other game, for the last time hopefully, here are the facts as relates to the first shot fired in the assassination of JFK.

Be reminded that I am neither more qualified than, or know more about the assassination than did certain members of the WC as well as the FBI and US Secret Service.

And, in that regards, the day after the WC completed their "staged"/aka phony assassination re-enactment, members of this group remained behind and were observed cutting and removing the limbs from the top of the live oak tree which is located directly in front of the TSDB/directly under the sixth floor window.

With that tidbit of knowledge, one can thereafter place the WC & it's true mission into it's proper perspective.

The gremlins kept the attachment on the first go around!

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http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.ph...88811entry88811

Post #1

"A red-brown to black area of skin surrounds the wound, forming what is called an abrasion collar. It was caused by the bullet's scraping the margins of the skin on penetration and is characteristic of a gunshot wound of entrance. The abrasion collar is larger at the lower margin of the wound, evidence that the bullet's trajectory at the instant of penetration was slightly upward in relation to the body."

- 07HSCA175 describing President KENNEDY's, theorized, not-completely-probed, neck and back wounds

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That one does not understand the evidence at hand does not negate the potential validity of the evidence.

It merely means that one does not understand the evidence.

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Although the HSCA Medical Panel evaluation of the back entrance wound of JFK appears to carry validity in regards to the slightly "upward" angle of impact of the bullet/projectile, it is another of those items which unfortunately was gleaned by review of photographic evidence.

Based on the known evidence and evaluation, it would appear to be factual, even if it does tend to confuse one as to exactly how a bullet which was purportedly fired on a downward angle of approximately 18-degrees downward, could strike in an upwards attitude.

Of course, this also tends to add further confusion to the subject matter when it is taken into consideration that the autopsy surgeons reported a downward angle of penetration into the back of JFK of approximately 45-degrees to 60-degrees downward.

Which again, merely because one does not understand the significance of the evidence, does not negate the validity of it.

In fact, the downward angle of entry of the projectile into the back of JFK is totally consistant with all of the other evidence which in totality supports that CE 399 struck JFK in a base-first attitude.

And thereafter, the rotational inertia of the end-over-end tumbling of the bullet caused it to drive itself down into the back of JFK on an angle which by far exceeded the actual downward angle of fire.

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While awaiting space in which to continue with the "cartoon" drawings, a review of a few simple facts may be in order:

1. The back entrance wound of JFK measured 4mm in vertical dimension and 7mm in horizontal dimension.

2. The deformed base of CE399 measured 4mm X 7mm in size.

3. The back entry wound of JFK, had it been a normal entrance on a downward angle of approximately 18-degrees downward, should have had an entrance wound which was elongated vertically. It DID NOT!. The horizontal width was the wider.

4. The entry wound through the coat and shirt of JFK were "punch" type entries which removed/carried away considerable amounts of the fabric.

5. A normal 6.5mm entrance through clothing, in virtually all circumstances, removes virtually none of the fabric. This is due to the spinning effect of the pointed nose of the projectile in which it basically pushes the fabric aside.

6. The entry wound into the back of JFK was a "punch-type" wound, and was, as stated by Dr. Boswell, "atypical". The wound had what was described as relatively clean-cut edges and the dimensions matched exactly the size of the base of CE399.

7. A normal 6.5mm entrance wound is extremely small, and does not create "clean-cut" edges", as not unlike the entry through cloth, the rounded nose of the bullet pushes the skin aside.

8. The back entry wound of JFK had considerable fabric from his coat and shirt carried down into the wound of entry by the entering bullet/projectile.

9. This forensic fact goes against all normal forensic/ballistic evidence in which the entry of a normally entering bullet DOES NOT carry such fabric down into the wound of entry.

10. The "punch-type" wound of entry into the back of JFK is virtually exactly identical to a wound of entry created by a "flat-nosed" bullet which, not unlike an everyday paper punch, punches out large areas of the fabric of clothing, creates a punch-type hole in which the dimensions exactly match the size of the punch, and thereafter carry debri down into the wound/hole.

The wound in the back of JFK is, for all practical purposes, absolutely identical with a wound as created by a flat-nosed/wadcutter Carcano bullet.

And, since CE399 has only one "flat" end, the multiple choice question at least has a 50/50 chance of guessing the correct answer as to which end of the bullet struck JFK in the back.

Photo's to come:

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Although the HSCA Medical Panel evaluation of the back entrance wound of JFK appears to carry validity in regards to the slightly "upward" angle of impact of the bullet/projectile, it is another of those items which unfortunately was gleaned by review of photographic evidence.

Based on the known evidence and evaluation, it would appear to be factual, even if it does tend to confuse one as to exactly how a bullet which was purportedly fired on a downward angle of approximately 18-degrees downward, could strike in an upwards attitude.

Of course, this also tends to add further confusion to the subject matter when it is taken into consideration that the autopsy surgeons reported a downward angle of penetration into the back of JFK of approximately 45-degrees to 60-degrees downward.

Which again, merely because one does not understand the significance of the evidence, does not negate the validity of it.

In fact, the downward angle of entry of the projectile into the back of JFK is totally consistant with all of the other evidence which in totality supports that CE 399 struck JFK in a base-first attitude.

And thereafter, the rotational inertia of the end-over-end tumbling of the bullet caused it to drive itself down into the back of JFK on an angle which by far exceeded the actual downward angle of fire.

It would appear that a "redo" is in order.

If one accepts that three surgeons know the difference between a downward entry into the back of JFK of approximately 45-degrees to 60-degrees downward, after having stuck a probe into the wound, as opposed to the actual downward firing angle of approximately 18-degrees down, then one has another of the "enigma's" of the physical/forensic/ballistic evidence.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mr. SPECTER - Could you state for the record an approximation of the angle of decline?

Commander HUMES - Mathematics is not my forte. Approximately 45 degrees from the horizontal.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Colonel Finck:

A: This shows that the wound of entry in the back of the neck is higher than the wound of exit in the front of the neck.

Q: Did you calculate what the angle was in degrees?

A: This can't be made with great precision because of variables.

Q: Did you calculate it, Colonel, was the question?

A: I remember a figure which was somewhere in the records within 45 degrees.

Q: Within 45 degrees?

6] "Dr. Humes said that no major blood vessels

[7] were struck by the bullet passing through the

[8] President's neck. Regarding his assertion in

[9] the Warren Commission testimony that the

[10] bullets entered at a 45 to 60 degree angle, Dr.

[11] Humes said it was a guesstimate."

Perhaps, when one understands the rotational end over end inertia of a tumbling bullet in flight, then the 45-degree to 60-degree downward angle of entry into the back of JFK takes on a completely different meaning, as well as not seeming so absurd.

Edited by Thomas H. Purvis
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Although the HSCA Medical Panel evaluation of the back entrance wound of JFK appears to carry validity in regards to the slightly "upward" angle of impact of the bullet/projectile, it is another of those items which unfortunately was gleaned by review of photographic evidence.

Based on the known evidence and evaluation, it would appear to be factual, even if it does tend to confuse one as to exactly how a bullet which was purportedly fired on a downward angle of approximately 18-degrees downward, could strike in an upwards attitude.

Of course, this also tends to add further confusion to the subject matter when it is taken into consideration that the autopsy surgeons reported a downward angle of penetration into the back of JFK of approximately 45-degrees to 60-degrees downward.

Which again, merely because one does not understand the significance of the evidence, does not negate the validity of it.

In fact, the downward angle of entry of the projectile into the back of JFK is totally consistant with all of the other evidence which in totality supports that CE 399 struck JFK in a base-first attitude.

And thereafter, the rotational inertia of the end-over-end tumbling of the bullet caused it to drive itself down into the back of JFK on an angle which by far exceeded the actual downward angle of fire.

It would appear that a "redo" is in order.

If one accepts that three surgeons know the difference between a downward entry into the back of JFK of approximately 45-degrees to 60-degrees downward, after having stuck a probe into the wound, as opposed to the actual downward firing angle of approximately 18-degrees down, then one has another of the "enigma's" of the physical/forensic/ballistic evidence.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mr. SPECTER - Could you state for the record an approximation of the angle of decline?

Commander HUMES - Mathematics is not my forte. Approximately 45 degrees from the horizontal.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Colonel Finck:

A: This shows that the wound of entry in the back of the neck is higher than the wound of exit in the front of the neck.

Q: Did you calculate what the angle was in degrees?

A: This can't be made with great precision because of variables.

Q: Did you calculate it, Colonel, was the question?

A: I remember a figure which was somewhere in the records within 45 degrees.

Q: Within 45 degrees?

6] "Dr. Humes said that no major blood vessels

[7] were struck by the bullet passing through the

[8] President's neck. Regarding his assertion in

[9] the Warren Commission testimony that the

[10] bullets entered at a 45 to 60 degree angle, Dr.

[11] Humes said it was a guesstimate."

Perhaps, when one understands the rotational end over end inertia of a tumbling bullet in flight, then the 45-degree to 60-degree downward angle of entry into the back of JFK takes on a completely different meaning, as well as not seeming so absurd.

Perhaps one can squeeze in this information as well.

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Although previously provided, it would appear that a new grouping of members have not had the opportunity to scoff at the facts.

Therefore, before putting my marbles away and playing some other game, for the last time hopefully, here are the facts as relates to the first shot fired in the assassination of JFK.

Be reminded that I am neither more qualified than, or know more about the assassination than did certain members of the WC as well as the FBI and US Secret Service.

And, in that regards, the day after the WC completed their "staged"/aka phony assassination re-enactment, members of this group remained behind and were observed cutting and removing the limbs from the top of the live oak tree which is located directly in front of the TSDB/directly under the sixth floor window.

With that tidbit of knowledge, one can thereafter place the WC & it's true mission into it's proper perspective.

Hi Tom:

I have been following this thread and am impressed with your analysis. I have one quick question for you: Can you give me a source/reference for your statement that "the day after the WC completed their "staged"/aka phony assassination re-enactment, members of this group remained behind and were observed cutting and removing limbs from the top of the live oak tree etc..."?

Regards,

Gary Murr

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Although previously provided, it would appear that a new grouping of members have not had the opportunity to scoff at the facts.

Therefore, before putting my marbles away and playing some other game, for the last time hopefully, here are the facts as relates to the first shot fired in the assassination of JFK.

Be reminded that I am neither more qualified than, or know more about the assassination than did certain members of the WC as well as the FBI and US Secret Service.

And, in that regards, the day after the WC completed their "staged"/aka phony assassination re-enactment, members of this group remained behind and were observed cutting and removing the limbs from the top of the live oak tree which is located directly in front of the TSDB/directly under the sixth floor window.

With that tidbit of knowledge, one can thereafter place the WC & it's true mission into it's proper perspective.

Hi Tom:

I have been following this thread and am impressed with your analysis. I have one quick question for you: Can you give me a source/reference for your statement that "the day after the WC completed their "staged"/aka phony assassination re-enactment, members of this group remained behind and were observed cutting and removing limbs from the top of the live oak tree etc..."?

Regards,

Gary Murr

Gary;

Since I was too dumb to take notes and must rely on memory, it came about during either my first or second visit to the home of Mr. Robert West, the Surveyor.

I do believe that it was the second visit as we had developed a somewhat close association by then.

Mr. West was suffering an ankle injury and was pretty much staying at home, so I went to Dallas (I was working out of Ft. Stockton, TX for 4 1/2 years) and paid another visit.

Due to the open manner in which Mr. West completely criticized the WC and was stating how they did not know what they were doing, etc; etc;, I became thoroughtly convinced that Mr. West played no part in any of the intentional obfuscations as done by the WC during their re-enactment and survey work.

Therefore, I progressively began to explain to Mr. West what much of this obfuscation was about.

In fact, when I was discussing the "Adjusted Position" etc;, it was Mr. West who pointed out to me that he had seen the position which Shaneyfelt had taken in the sixth floor window, and although I too had observed the photo, it merely did not register at the time.

Mr. West stated to the effect: "No one could have accurately fired that rifle from the way that they had it jacked up at the window".

With this, I explained to Mr. West the full reasons, which were to obtain line-of-sight which completely eliminated the tree limbs due to the fact that the first shot fired had in fact struck one of the limbs.

With this, Mr. West literally broke out laughing, of which I did not understand why initially.

Then, he informed me that the day after the WC had compelted their work, he left his office, which was on Houston St. , and walked over to Dealy Plaza/Elm St. in order to obtain a few final measurements which were required in order to complete the new WC Survey Plat.

When he got up close to the TSDB he observed members of the WC re-enactment group in a "bucket lift" truck and they were raised up into the top of the Live Oak tree which was located directly under the sixth floor window.

They were cutting, removing, and keeping all of the limbs from the top of the tree.

With my revelation as to the bullet striking the tree limbs, Mr. West then fully recognized what much of the "circle jerk" he and his survey personnel had been put through was all about, and we both had a lot of laughs about all that the WC went through in order to confuse the issue.

And, although Mr. West had originally charged me for the copying work of all of the survey plats and his survey notes, as well as "consultation time", he never again presented any charges for the additional times that I visited him and we openly shared all that either of us knew at the time in regards to the assassination.

So! The answer is: From one of the most honorable men that it will ever be my pleasure to have met. Mr. Robert West of Dallas, TX.

Tom

P.S. The Attorney General of the US as well as the FBI were informed of this revelation back in September of 1994 while Mr. West was still living.

He only passed away a few years ago, and it was this revelation which caused me to begin to reveal much of what I know in regards to the assassination as well as share the survey information which Mr. West was kind enough to provide to me as well as answer my questions about.

P.P.S. For those who are new, I will provide the entire questionaire at the end of this show.

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Although previously provided, it would appear that a new grouping of members have not had the opportunity to scoff at the facts.

Therefore, before putting my marbles away and playing some other game, for the last time hopefully, here are the facts as relates to the first shot fired in the assassination of JFK.

Be reminded that I am neither more qualified than, or know more about the assassination than did certain members of the WC as well as the FBI and US Secret Service.

And, in that regards, the day after the WC completed their "staged"/aka phony assassination re-enactment, members of this group remained behind and were observed cutting and removing the limbs from the top of the live oak tree which is located directly in front of the TSDB/directly under the sixth floor window.

With that tidbit of knowledge, one can thereafter place the WC & it's true mission into it's proper perspective.

Hi Tom:

I have been following this thread and am impressed with your analysis. I have one quick question for you: Can you give me a source/reference for your statement that "the day after the WC completed their "staged"/aka phony assassination re-enactment, members of this group remained behind and were observed cutting and removing limbs from the top of the live oak tree etc..."?

Regards,

Gary Murr

Gary;

Since I was too dumb to take notes and must rely on memory, it came about during either my first or second visit to the home of Mr. Robert West, the Surveyor.

I do believe that it was the second visit as we had developed a somewhat close association by then.

Mr. West was suffering an ankle injury and was pretty much staying at home, so I went to Dallas (I was working out of Ft. Stockton, TX for 4 1/2 years) and paid another visit.

Due to the open manner in which Mr. West completely criticized the WC and was stating how they did not know what they were doing, etc; etc;, I became thoroughtly convinced that Mr. West played no part in any of the intentional obfuscations as done by the WC during their re-enactment and survey work.

Therefore, I progressively began to explain to Mr. West what much of this obfuscation was about.

In fact, when I was discussing the "Adjusted Position" etc;, it was Mr. West who pointed out to me that he had seen the position which Shaneyfelt had taken in the sixth floor window, and although I too had observed the photo, it merely did not register at the time.

Mr. West stated to the effect: "No one could have accurately fired that rifle from the way that they had it jacked up at the window".

With this, I explained to Mr. West the full reasons, which were to obtain line-of-sight which completely eliminated the tree limbs due to the fact that the first shot fired had in fact struck one of the limbs.

With this, Mr. West literally broke out laughing, of which I did not understand why initially.

Then, he informed me that the day after the WC had compelted their work, he left his office, which was on Houston St. , and walked over to Dealy Plaza/Elm St. in order to obtain a few final measurements which were required in order to complete the new WC Survey Plat.

When he got up close to the TSDB he observed members of the WC re-enactment group in a "bucket lift" truck and they were raised up into the top of the Live Oak tree which was located directly under the sixth floor window.

They were cutting, removing, and keeping all of the limbs from the top of the tree.

With my revelation as to the bullet striking the tree limbs, Mr. West then fully recognized what much of the "circle jerk" he and his survey personnel had been put through was all about, and we both had a lot of laughs about all that the WC went through in order to confuse the issue.

And, although Mr. West had originally charged me for the copying work of all of the survey plats and his survey notes, as well as "consultation time", he never again presented any charges for the additional times that I visited him and we openly shared all that either of us knew at the time in regards to the assassination.

So! The answer is: From one of the most honorable men that it will ever be my pleasure to have met. Mr. Robert West of Dallas, TX.

Tom

P.S. The Attorney General of the US as well as the FBI were informed of this revelation back in September of 1994 while Mr. West was still living.

He only passed away a few years ago, and it was this revelation which caused me to begin to reveal much of what I know in regards to the assassination as well as share the survey information which Mr. West was kind enough to provide to me as well as answer my questions about.

P.P.S. For those who are new, I will provide the entire questionaire at the end of this show.

May as well provide the "backup" data on Mr. West being the one!

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Although previously provided, it would appear that a new grouping of members have not had the opportunity to scoff at the facts.

Therefore, before putting my marbles away and playing some other game, for the last time hopefully, here are the facts as relates to the first shot fired in the assassination of JFK.

Be reminded that I am neither more qualified than, or know more about the assassination than did certain members of the WC as well as the FBI and US Secret Service.

And, in that regards, the day after the WC completed their "staged"/aka phony assassination re-enactment, members of this group remained behind and were observed cutting and removing the limbs from the top of the live oak tree which is located directly in front of the TSDB/directly under the sixth floor window.

With that tidbit of knowledge, one can thereafter place the WC & it's true mission into it's proper perspective.

Hi Tom:

I have been following this thread and am impressed with your analysis. I have one quick question for you: Can you give me a source/reference for your statement that "the day after the WC completed their "staged"/aka phony assassination re-enactment, members of this group remained behind and were observed cutting and removing limbs from the top of the live oak tree etc..."?

Regards,

Gary Murr

Gary;

Since I was too dumb to take notes and must rely on memory, it came about during either my first or second visit to the home of Mr. Robert West, the Surveyor.

I do believe that it was the second visit as we had developed a somewhat close association by then.

Mr. West was suffering an ankle injury and was pretty much staying at home, so I went to Dallas (I was working out of Ft. Stockton, TX for 4 1/2 years) and paid another visit.

Due to the open manner in which Mr. West completely criticized the WC and was stating how they did not know what they were doing, etc; etc;, I became thoroughtly convinced that Mr. West played no part in any of the intentional obfuscations as done by the WC during their re-enactment and survey work.

Therefore, I progressively began to explain to Mr. West what much of this obfuscation was about.

In fact, when I was discussing the "Adjusted Position" etc;, it was Mr. West who pointed out to me that he had seen the position which Shaneyfelt had taken in the sixth floor window, and although I too had observed the photo, it merely did not register at the time.

Mr. West stated to the effect: "No one could have accurately fired that rifle from the way that they had it jacked up at the window".

With this, I explained to Mr. West the full reasons, which were to obtain line-of-sight which completely eliminated the tree limbs due to the fact that the first shot fired had in fact struck one of the limbs.

With this, Mr. West literally broke out laughing, of which I did not understand why initially.

Then, he informed me that the day after the WC had compelted their work, he left his office, which was on Houston St. , and walked over to Dealy Plaza/Elm St. in order to obtain a few final measurements which were required in order to complete the new WC Survey Plat.

When he got up close to the TSDB he observed members of the WC re-enactment group in a "bucket lift" truck and they were raised up into the top of the Live Oak tree which was located directly under the sixth floor window.

They were cutting, removing, and keeping all of the limbs from the top of the tree.

With my revelation as to the bullet striking the tree limbs, Mr. West then fully recognized what much of the "circle jerk" he and his survey personnel had been put through was all about, and we both had a lot of laughs about all that the WC went through in order to confuse the issue.

And, although Mr. West had originally charged me for the copying work of all of the survey plats and his survey notes, as well as "consultation time", he never again presented any charges for the additional times that I visited him and we openly shared all that either of us knew at the time in regards to the assassination.

So! The answer is: From one of the most honorable men that it will ever be my pleasure to have met. Mr. Robert West of Dallas, TX.

Tom

P.S. The Attorney General of the US as well as the FBI were informed of this revelation back in September of 1994 while Mr. West was still living.

He only passed away a few years ago, and it was this revelation which caused me to begin to reveal much of what I know in regards to the assassination as well as share the survey information which Mr. West was kind enough to provide to me as well as answer my questions about.

P.P.S. For those who are new, I will provide the entire questionaire at the end of this show.

Tom:

Many thanks for your informative response. I, like you, am convinced that Robert West did not intentionally attempt to purposefully aid the Warren Commission staff "reconstruction" charade carried out in Dealey Plaza over the weekend of May 23-24, 1964. I have an entire chapter on this in my forthcoming book. I have to assume because of your personal contact with Mr. West that he perhaps told you of his efforts to be paid for the work he did for the Commission on this same weekend? This entire runaround fiasco is supported by documentation, exchanges between Robert West and initially the FBI; thereafter similar treatment at the hands of the Warren Commission, and in particular, J. Lee Rankin.

FWIW

Gary

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Although previously provided, it would appear that a new grouping of members have not had the opportunity to scoff at the facts.

Therefore, before putting my marbles away and playing some other game, for the last time hopefully, here are the facts as relates to the first shot fired in the assassination of JFK.

Be reminded that I am neither more qualified than, or know more about the assassination than did certain members of the WC as well as the FBI and US Secret Service.

And, in that regards, the day after the WC completed their "staged"/aka phony assassination re-enactment, members of this group remained behind and were observed cutting and removing the limbs from the top of the live oak tree which is located directly in front of the TSDB/directly under the sixth floor window.

With that tidbit of knowledge, one can thereafter place the WC & it's true mission into it's proper perspective.

Hi Tom:

I have been following this thread and am impressed with your analysis. I have one quick question for you: Can you give me a source/reference for your statement that "the day after the WC completed their "staged"/aka phony assassination re-enactment, members of this group remained behind and were observed cutting and removing limbs from the top of the live oak tree etc..."?

Regards,

Gary Murr

Gary;

Since I was too dumb to take notes and must rely on memory, it came about during either my first or second visit to the home of Mr. Robert West, the Surveyor.

I do believe that it was the second visit as we had developed a somewhat close association by then.

Mr. West was suffering an ankle injury and was pretty much staying at home, so I went to Dallas (I was working out of Ft. Stockton, TX for 4 1/2 years) and paid another visit.

Due to the open manner in which Mr. West completely criticized the WC and was stating how they did not know what they were doing, etc; etc;, I became thoroughtly convinced that Mr. West played no part in any of the intentional obfuscations as done by the WC during their re-enactment and survey work.

Therefore, I progressively began to explain to Mr. West what much of this obfuscation was about.

In fact, when I was discussing the "Adjusted Position" etc;, it was Mr. West who pointed out to me that he had seen the position which Shaneyfelt had taken in the sixth floor window, and although I too had observed the photo, it merely did not register at the time.

Mr. West stated to the effect: "No one could have accurately fired that rifle from the way that they had it jacked up at the window".

With this, I explained to Mr. West the full reasons, which were to obtain line-of-sight which completely eliminated the tree limbs due to the fact that the first shot fired had in fact struck one of the limbs.

With this, Mr. West literally broke out laughing, of which I did not understand why initially.

Then, he informed me that the day after the WC had compelted their work, he left his office, which was on Houston St. , and walked over to Dealy Plaza/Elm St. in order to obtain a few final measurements which were required in order to complete the new WC Survey Plat.

When he got up close to the TSDB he observed members of the WC re-enactment group in a "bucket lift" truck and they were raised up into the top of the Live Oak tree which was located directly under the sixth floor window.

They were cutting, removing, and keeping all of the limbs from the top of the tree.

With my revelation as to the bullet striking the tree limbs, Mr. West then fully recognized what much of the "circle jerk" he and his survey personnel had been put through was all about, and we both had a lot of laughs about all that the WC went through in order to confuse the issue.

And, although Mr. West had originally charged me for the copying work of all of the survey plats and his survey notes, as well as "consultation time", he never again presented any charges for the additional times that I visited him and we openly shared all that either of us knew at the time in regards to the assassination.

So! The answer is: From one of the most honorable men that it will ever be my pleasure to have met. Mr. Robert West of Dallas, TX.

Tom

P.S. The Attorney General of the US as well as the FBI were informed of this revelation back in September of 1994 while Mr. West was still living.

He only passed away a few years ago, and it was this revelation which caused me to begin to reveal much of what I know in regards to the assassination as well as share the survey information which Mr. West was kind enough to provide to me as well as answer my questions about.

P.P.S. For those who are new, I will provide the entire questionaire at the end of this show.

Tom:

Many thanks for your informative response. I, like you, am convinced that Robert West did not intentionally attempt to purposefully aid the Warren Commission staff "reconstruction" charade carried out in Dealey Plaza over the weekend of May 23-24, 1964. I have an entire chapter on this in my forthcoming book. I have to assume because of your personal contact with Mr. West that he perhaps told you of his efforts to be paid for the work he did for the Commission on this same weekend? This entire runaround fiasco is supported by documentation, exchanges between Robert West and initially the FBI; thereafter similar treatment at the hands of the Warren Commission, and in particular, J. Lee Rankin.

FWIW

Gary

Yes, Mr. West briefly discussed the failure to get paid.

However, you no doubt would be more interested in the fact that he originally did not get a copy of the WC Survey Plat.

This plat was picked up by a representative from the WC immediately when it was completed, with a promise to have a copy made and sent back.

Thereafer, Mr. West could not get anyone from the WC to provide him with a copy, and this went on for an extended period of time.

Finally, he wrote letters in which he stated that due to the State Laws of Texas which required him to maintain on file a copy of ALL survey work, that in event that the WC would not provide him with a copy of the WC Survey Plat, that he would have to file court actions, if for no other reasons other than to protect himself.

When it became obvious that this was going to become a public matter, the WC suddenly provided a copy of the survey plat.

We almost never got access to this document.

Lastly, one can rest assured that Mr. West played no part in the WC re-enactment fiasco.

He told me many things which have/had never been made public, and with this gave me the information needed to look closely at all of this work on the part of the WC.

As example, few are aware that the WC "ran through" and filmed the re-enactment so many times that the Cadillac re-enactment car ran hot and they had to shut down for a while.

Few are aware that they let almost all of the air out of the front tires and filled the rear tires to the maximum in an attempt to Jack up the back and lower the front of the car in order that the SBT alignment from the sixth floor windown through JFK and into JBC would work.

Even I was not aware of the different cameras which they had set up adjacent to Z's position, on the concrete platform, and on the steps, until Mr. West informed me of it.

His discussions on how they positioned the limo at times brought many laughs. Some of the WC personnel were on the Z-position directing, and they actually had members of the re-enactment group pushing the car a matter of a few inches at at time then taking the photo's.

In some instances they would push the car an inch or two too far and would then have to move around to the front and push it back an inch or so.

None of which would have been known were it not for the honesty of Mr. West.

Overall, he appeared to have a "bad taste" in his mouth about his dealings with this bunch, and when I started explaining what many of the items were in regards to, then he caught on immediately as to the "why" that his chain was being yanked around.

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Since the issue of the clothing worn by JFk has been about talked to death, I see little to be gained in a repeat of this subject matter.

To the Back Wound:

Although previously posted, here again are some comparison photo's.

1. JFK's "punch-type" back wound entry which had relatively clean-cut edges and was classified as "atypical" by Dr. Boswell, and of which the dimensions matched exactly the dimensions of the deformed base to CE 399.

2. What a normal entrance wound (straight on) of a 6.5mm Carcano bullet looks like.

3. A wound created with a wadcutter/flatnosed Carcano bullet.

I would state that the first time that I ever observed a photo of the back wound of JFK that I also immediately knew that this was not a typical wound of entry as created by a small to medium caliber bullet.

And, having experience with wadcutter bullets in target practice of course helps one in recognition of what bullet types create similar wounds.

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