Shanet Clark
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Posts posted by Shanet Clark
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I have always wondered why we cannot see the skull material
which was blown back over the rear hood - and which Jackie then lunged for ......
Since this piece of debris was shot back toward the TBSD, I believe
that the large bone fragment was removed from the Z-film because it was such clear evidence
of a forward shooter ...............
Why on earth would you think that debris traveling at nearly the same speed of the bullet would be seen on a blurry film running at only 18fps.
Bill Miller
It was traveling slow enough for Jackie to track it and capture it .........
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I have always wondered why we cannot see the skull material
which was blown back over the rear hood - and which Jackie then lunged for ......
Since this piece of debris was shot back toward the TBSD, I believe
that the large bone fragment was removed from the Z-film because it was such clear evidence
of a forward shooter ...............
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A. It does look like a temporary screen on a rod.
B. The angle is such that it would not be visible in the tramps photo.
C. So - Why was a small angled screen in place the afternoon of the assassination?
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I realise this has little to do with the assassination of Kennedy, (and members are more interested in other things) , but nevertheless...
a shot from the left(not Castro)
Good work on this model John -
and I think you are right about the
seatsprings and acceleration playing a large part in the motion.....
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My guess is that he's describing the explosion in Z313, right in front of Jackie's face, and not a different film.
Ron...WHY GUESS? Read page 463 and following in TGZFH. I know
at least four persons who HAVE SEEN THE OTHER FILM.
Why speculate?
Jack
Yes, it appears that a number of people saw a ZAPRUDER film
markedly different from the one we are familiar with .......
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Made it... 56.3k!!!
This is ridiculous, physically impossible and would be laughed out of court.
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Mark,
The last hurrah bookshop specialises in the political assassinations of the 60's and has a few gems in there, some very hard to get books.
Besides Last Hurrah try:
ebay - you'll need to be patient and persitent, and the selection is best in November. But just about everything appears sooner to later. I've gotten some pretty good deals on ebay: Sylvia Meagher, Josiah Thompson and Penn Jones for example. But I've also seen these same books go for a lot more than I paid.
abebooks.com - for all used books. It's not unusual to find a dealer who'll sell a JFK book for less than what you'd have to pay on ebay, especially if the dealer is NOT a JFK specialist.
Roger
Ebay has a lot of evidentiary CD ROMS, photos, LIFE magazines and even unreleased Dallas photos.
For Amazon you should research authors names you are interested and seach by name, example:
Marrs, Groden, Mark Lane, Jay Epstein, Prouty, etc..........
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This is all quite bizarre.
What is the full frame, what are we looking at?
I already stated what I see . Please expand/paraphrase 'bizarre' . What do you mean ? Do you see/do you not see what I described?
I see nothing of evidentiary value ............
You 're playing words games in both your posts. We are not in a court of law. Do you or do you not see what I described. It's a limited response question .. a simple YES/NO is all that it takes. If you still want to play'Here we go round the mulberry bush one more time', so be it. However, I'll not be wasting my time in responding further. You opened the dialogue, and you can close it pleasantly or unpleasantly, but the question still stands. .... Yes/No .
Uhh.................no...........?
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This is all quite bizarre.
What is the full frame, what are we looking at?
I already stated what I see . Please expand/paraphrase 'bizarre' . What do you mean ? Do you see/do you not see what I described?
I see nothing of evidentiary value ............
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Thankyou Ron,I appreciate your input.As you can see,I have not been a member here for very long,and there is not very much information that I myself can contribute to this forum that has not already been addressed or discussed.I asked this question because,I have not seen it discussed on here before.I just thought that since FBI agents Sibert & O`Neil had mentioned that there "appeared to be surgery of the head area" that I would bring it up.
Once again I appreciate your input.
It would be a plausible tracheotomy (and only a tracheotomy)
if it were not obvious that the President had been hit by a forward shot and
clutched at his throat throughout the whole ambush .........
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This is all quite bizarre.
What is the full frame, what are we looking at?
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Mubarak's Son Met Secretly With Cheney
By SALAH NASRAWI
Associated Press Writer
The son of Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak, who is widely seen as his father's heir-apparent, met secretly last week with top White House officials, including Vice President Dick Cheney, Al-Jazeera reported Monday.
The talks came amid increasing criticism from the Bush administration of the Mubarak government for its crackdown on the political opposition, and Mubarak's comments that he does not take orders from Washington.
Egypt did not report Gamal Mubarak's trip to Washington, and its disclosure by the Arab satellite channel came as Cairo's state-owned newspapers criticized the Bush administration for interfering in Egypt's internal affairs.
Neither Egyptian authorities nor the White House responded to requests for comment.
A reporter for the Qatar-based Al-Jazeera said she saw Gamal Mubarak entering into the White House on Friday with Nabil Fahmi, Egypt's ambassador. She said both men refused to respond to her questions.
A day earlier, the State Department said it was deeply concerned about reports that Egyptian authorities arrested and repressed demonstrators protesting alleged election fraud.
The Bush administration has said reform in the Mideast is a top policy concern and has focused on Egypt, a key ally. But many in the region have speculated Washington is backing off pressure on Cairo and other government, after the big election gain by the fundamentalist Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt and the overwhelming Hamas victory in the Palestinian territories.
On Monday the state-owned Rose El Youssef newspaper quoted Mubarak as saying that his government is being criticized because he does not accept direction from Washington.
That is 'because we don't listen (to them) and do not bow to anything which does not match with our interests' he said.
Since he assumed power in 1981, Mubarak had made annual trips to Washington in the spring for talks with government and congressional leaders, but he has not done so for the past two years.
Al-Jazeera said Gamal Mubarak also met during his visit to Washington last week with National Security Adviser Stephen Hadley and Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice.
Gamal Mubarak's last visit to the White House was shortly before the United States launched its 2003 war on Iraq to topple Saddam Hussein. Arab media suggested at the time that Cheney convinced him to persuade his father to mute his opposition to the war.
Many believe Mubarak has been grooming his 42-year-old son as his heir, a prospect sharply denounced by opposition parties. Both Mubarak and Gamal have denied such intentions.
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Roselli was probably in Dealey Plaza -
but not because of what Files said, but because of Tosh Plumlee's affadavit........
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Having decided not to buy the book for 26 bucks at Borders, I am not in a position to defend Fuhrman's theory. But I do believe he shows the bullet deflecting upwards in the body and off the tie. In other words, he acknowledges that the back wound is lower than the throat wound. While he spends some time on the ballistics evidence, he basically ignores the medical evidence. I'm not sure if he even picks an entrance for the head wound.
We are talking about the guy who said "N****R" so many times on tape that the jury ignored
his evidence of murder in the OJ Simpson trial.........his "celebrity" is based on racist notoriety and
his wisdom is less than nil..........
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I found this article usefull in suplementing what the corporate articles said about the spy program. Very intereting. Im sure no Democrat will try to play the prosecutor, against Bush, so we will be left with two parties playing defense lawyer. The last time a democrat said anything critical about the our new monarchy he was savagely attacked-- by members of his own party rampagining in an effort to show how "moderate" they were.
http://www.guerrillanews.com/articles/2276...ies_Who_Shag_Us
Definitely worth a read ...........
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Perhaps Groden has some idea where to find the brain of W.
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David W. Mantik, M.D., Ph.D.
(Editor's Note: This is an expanded and revised version of a presentation for "Solving the Great American Murder Mystery" Symposium, which was held at Duquesne University 20-23 November 2003. The speaker, who is the leading student of the death of JFK in the world today, has elaborated on the formal paper that he submitted for its appearance in this journal, while preserving the sequence of figures and photographs. The formal paper appears following the informal version as an appendix.)
http://assassinationresearch.com/v2n2/pittsburgh.pdf
(Link to Mantik's excellent paper on the autopsy films)
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CIA Official's Home, Office Searched
By KATHERINE SHRADER
Associated Press
WASHINGTON (AP) -- Law enforcement officials executed search warrants Friday on the house and office of CIA's outgoing executive director as part of an investigation into corruption involving agency contracts, the FBI said.
The CIA's third ranking official, Kyle "Dusty" Foggo, has been under investigation by the FBI, IRS, Defense Criminal Investigative Service, the CIA's inspector general and the U.S. attorney's office in San Diego, said FBI spokeswoman April Langwell in San Diego.
Under a sealed warrant, officials searched Foggo's Virginia home and his office at the CIA's Langley, Va., campus, Langwell said. She could provide no other details.
The FBI and other agencies have been investigating whether Foggo improperly intervened in the award of contracts to a San Diego businessman and personal friend, Brent Wilkes, who has been implicated in a congressional bribery scandal.
In a statement, CIA spokeswoman Jennifer Millerwise Dyck also confirmed the searches of his home and office on Friday morning.
"The agency is cooperating fully with the Department of Justice and the FBI," she said. "Agency leaders outside of the (inspector general's office) were informed just prior to the execution of the search warrants, in keeping with standard law enforcement procedures."
This week, Foggo announced his retirement from the agency after 25 years serving around the world. His decision came three days after CIA Director Porter Goss also announced he would be stepping down from the agency.
Dyck said the Foggo investigation has "absolutely nothing, zero" to do with Goss' resignation.
In a statement on Foggo's behalf last week, the CIA said he denied any improprieties. "Mr. Foggo maintains that government contracts for which he was responsible were properly awarded and administered," the agency said.
Wilkes has been described in court papers as an unindicted co-conspirator in a plot to bribe then-Rep. Randy "Duke" Cunningham, a California Republican who is now serving time in a federal prison for taking $2.4 million from government contractors.
FBI agents also have been investigating whether Wilkes provided Cunningham with prostitutes, limousines and hotel suites.
Foggo has acknowledged participating in the poker parties at the hotel rooms, but he has said there was nothing untoward about that. "If he attended occasional card games with friends over the years, Mr. Foggo insists they were that and nothing more," the CIA statement said.
Foggo's associates have said he received the Intelligence Commendation Medal for supporting the war on terror in 2002. Before becoming the agency's No. 3 leader in 2004, he was the chief of base at a classified facility that supports the war on terror.
As executive director, Foggo had the powerful position of overseeing the day-to-day operations of the CIA.
One FBI agent told reporters from Copley News Service, who were at Foggo's residence, that Foggo was not at home in his quiet suburban neighborhood near CIA headquarters and had not been detained. The agents refused to answer other questions about the raid.
A neighbor told Copley that the agents arrived about 8 a.m. EDT. A white Chevrolet van was backed up to the carport of the split-level brick home and, at one point, a man wearing latex gloves emerged from the house and went around back.
YOUR TAX DOLLARS AT WORK
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ATT-NSA FAQ
* What is EFF's Lawsuit Against AT&T About?
* What is the Lawsuit Seeking?
* If the NSA Did The Illegal Wiretapping And Data-Mining, Why Are You Suing AT&T?
* Why has EFF brought a class action?
* Is the fight against warrantless spying on ordinary Americans a partisan issue?
* What is the NSA Domestic Spying Program?
* What is the National Security Agency?
* Is Secretly Wiretapping U.S. Citizens Without Legal Process Prohibited by the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act?
* What is the U.S. Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISC)?
* What Standard Must Be Met Under the Domestic Spying Program?
* Does the domestic spying program produce better results than FISA?
* Who Decides Whether the "Reasonable Basis" Test is Met to Conduct Domestic Spying?
* What's AT&T's Role in the Program?
* Is the Domestic Spying Program Larger than Described?
* Are Ordinary American's Communications Exposed by AT&T Collaboration?
* Who exactly is the case against?
* Why is the Case Against Both AT&Ts?
* If the lawsuit succeeds will the government still be able to surveil terrorists?
* What is Daytona?
* What is Hawkeye?
* What is Aurora?
* How Many Calls Go Through AT&T?
* How Many Customers Did AT&T Have?
* How Big is the New AT&T Inc.?
* Why Are the First and Fourth Amendments at Issue for AT&T?
* What Can I do To Help?
What is EFF's Lawsuit Against AT&T About?
EFF filed a class-action lawsuit against AT&T, accusing the telecom giant of violating the law and the privacy of its customers by collaborating with the National Security Agency (NSA) in its massive and illegal domestic spying program to wiretap and data-mine Americans' communications.
What is the Lawsuit Seeking?
EFF, on behalf of a nationwide class of AT&T customers, is suing to stop this illegal conduct and hold AT&T responsible for its illegal collaboration in the government's domestic spying program, which has violated the law and damaged the fundamental freedoms of the American public. The lawsuit request an injunction and damages under the statute. The laws provide that the victims can receive damages of at least $21,000 for each affected person.
If the NSA Did The Illegal Wiretapping And Data-Mining, Why Are You Suing AT&T?
Because AT&T violated the law, and the rights of its customers, by allowing and assisting with the illegal wiretapping and data-mining. The government's spying program on ordinary Americans would not be possible without AT&T collaborating in violating your privacy. AT&T should have been standing up for you and your privacy. In this country we follow the law, we don't just follow orders.
Why has EFF brought a class action?
We believe that all AT&T customers have had their privacy violated by AT&T's actions. And importantly, bringing the case as a class action the only sure way to make sure AT&T is prohibited from continuing these illegal actions. A class action ensures that an injunction against AT&T would apply throughout the country, not simply in the district in which the lawsuit was filed. Finally, we hope that the risk of serious statutory damages ($1,000 per subscriber under the ECPA and up to $10,000 per subscriber under the Telecom Act) will provide sufficient incentives for AT&T and the other telcos to push back on the feds with respect to this illegal program and in the future.
Is the fight against warrantless spying on ordinary Americans a partisan issue?
No. EFF is a non-partisan organization and has consistently opposed illegal surveillance efforts regardless of which party held the presidency. Indeed, the opposition to the domestic surveillance program has come from not just Democrats, but also leading conservatives. As David Keene, chairman of the American Conservative Union said, "This is not a partisan issue; it is an issue of safeguarding the fundamental freedoms of all Americans so that future administrations do not interpret our laws in ways that pose constitutional concerns."
Other leading conservatives who have spoken out on the domestic surveillance include:
* Former U.S. Rep. Bob Barr;
* Grover Norquist, president of Americans for Tax Reform;
* Paul Weyrich, chairman and CEO of the Free Congress Foundation; and
* Alan Gottlieb, founder of the Second Amendment Foundation.
What is the NSA Domestic Spying Program?
Sometime in 2001, the president authorized the NSA to intercept telephone and Internet communications of Americans inside the United States, without the authorization of any law or court. Under the program, the NSA is intercepting and analyzing millions of ordinary Americans' communications, with the help of the country's largest phone and Internet companies. The president has stated that he authorized the domestic spying in 2001, that he has reauthorized the program more than 30 times since its inception, and intends to continue doing so.
What is the National Security Agency?
The National Security Agency is a United States government intelligence agency that is responsible for the collection and analysis of foreign communications. According to the NSA site, it "coordinates, directs, and performs highly specialized activities to protect U.S. government information systems and produce foreign signals intelligence information."
* Official NSA website
* The National Security Archive's "The National Security Agency Declassified"
* Wikipedia entry on the NSA
Is Secretly Wiretapping U.S. Citizens Without Legal Process Prohibited by the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act?
Yes. The Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, 50 U.S.C. § 1801 et seq., (FISA) provides the exclusive statutory framework for the use of electronic surveillance in the context of foreign intelligence gathering. It prohibits surveillance in the United States of communications to or from a person in the United States, unless authorized by statute. With limited exceptions, this means that the U.S. Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISC) must authorize such surveillance.
What is the U.S. Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISC)?
The FISC is a special court set up by FISA that meets in secret to decide whether to authorize electronic surveillance in the context of foreign intelligence gathering. Only the government is allowed to appear before this court.
What Standard Must Be Met Under the Domestic Spying Program?
"Reasonable basis." According to U.S. Attorney General Gonzales, the standard is "a reasonable basis to conclude that one party to the communication is a member of al Qaeda, affiliated with al Qaeda, or a member of an organization affiliated with al Qaeda, or working in support of al Qaeda." This is a lower standard that the "probable cause" required under FISA.
Does the domestic spying program produce better results than FISA?
No. Recent reports have shown that the data from this wholesale surveillance did little more than commit FBI resources to follow up leads, "virtually all of [which], current and former officials say, led to dead ends or innocent Americans."
"We'd chase a number, find it's a school teacher with no indication they've ever been involved in international terrorism - case closed," said one former FBI official, who was aware of the program and the data it generated for the bureau. "After you get a thousand numbers and not one is turning up anything, you get some frustration."
Lowell Bergman, et al, Spy Agency Data After Sept. 11 Led F.B.I. to Dead Ends, NY Times, Jan. 17, 2005.
Wasting counter-terrorism resources on innocent school teachers makes America no safer and less free.
Who Decides Whether the "Reasonable Basis" Test is Met to Conduct Domestic Spying?
NSA shift supervisors. According to U.S. Attorney General Gonzales, the "judgment is made by the operational work force at the National Security Agency using the information available to them at the time, and the standard that they apply -- and it's a two-person standard that must be signed off by a shift supervisor..." Under FISA, the federal FISC judges decide if the standard is met. Only five times out of over 19,000 applications have the FISC judges refused to allow the surveillance under the higher "probable cause" standard required by FISA.
What's AT&T's Role in the Program?
EFF alleges that under the NSA domestic spying program, major telecommunications companies-and AT&T specifically-gave the NSA direct access to their vast databases of communications records, including information about whom their customers have phoned or emailed with in the past. EFF alleges that AT&T, in addition to allowing the NSA direct access to the phone and Internet communications passing over its network, and gave the government unfettered access to its over 300 terabyte "Daytona" database of caller information -- one of the largest databases in the world.
Is the Domestic Spying Program Larger than Described?
Yes. When the government attempts to describe limits to the domestic spying program, note how carefully those comments are limited to "the NSA activities described by the President." This does not foreclose the possibility that there are more activities than described by the President, and numerous news reports have described a far wider program, which surveils the communications of ordinary Americans. This case is about AT&T's collaboration with the entire domestic spying program.
Are Ordinary American's Communications Exposed by AT&T Collaboration?
Yes. The lawsuit alleges that AT&T's has provided the government with unfettered access to the communications records of ordinary Americans whose communications go through the AT&T network. Some individuals may be singled out for further investigation and more extensive wiretapping, but this case is not about specific targeted information that a court has ordered AT&T to produce, but rather wholesale access all communications records in the AT&T database and the information transiting AT&T's compromised switches.
Who exactly is the case against?
Both AT&T Inc. and AT&T Corp. AT&T Inc. is the new name of SBC Communications, which acquired AT&T Corp. in November 2005. At closing, a wholly owned subsidiary of SBC merged with and into AT&T Corp., and thus AT&T Corp. became a wholly owned subsidiary of SBC. SBC adopted AT&T, Inc. as its name following completion of its acquisition of AT&T Corp.
Why is the Case Against Both AT&Ts?
While the case focuses on the acts of AT&T Corp. (pre-merger), AT&T Inc. has begun a transition process designed to integrate the former SBC's telecommunications network with AT&T Corp.'s network, ultimately leading into unified networks. The lawsuit alleges that the facilities and technologies of the former SBC are being or will imminently be used to transmit the communications of AT&T Corp. customers, and will continue the violation of the privacy of its customers.
If the lawsuit succeeds will the government still be able to surveil terrorists?
Yes. Wiretaps on terrorists are allowed under the law, and this lawsuit is not challenging the wiretap laws.
We have sued AT&T for breaking those laws—the telecommunications giant gave the government access to its communications switches and its huge databases of information on millions of ordinary Americans.
These are AT&T customers who have not even been accused of affiliations with terrorists.
Americans can be both safe and free: if the government truly believes it has cause to wiretap a suspect, it can order AT&T to provide information under FISA—for up to 72 hours before going to the court. But AT&T has no business providing direct access to the communications of millions of ordinary Americans, without the checks and balances of Congress or the courts.
What is Daytona?
Daytona is a database management technology originally developed and maintained by the AT&T Laboratories division of AT&T, and is used by AT&T to manage multiple databases. Daytona was designed to handle very large databases and is used to manage "Hawkeye," AT&T's call detail record (CDR) database. Daytona is also used to manage AT&T's huge network-security database, known as "Aurora." As of September 2005, all of the CDR data managed by Daytona, when uncompressed, totaled more than 312 terabytes.
What is Hawkeye?
Hawkeye is AT&T's call detail record (CDR) database, which contains records of nearly every telephone communication carried over its domestic network since approximately 2001, records that include the originating and terminating phone numbers and the time and length for each call.
What is Aurora?
Aurora is a network-security database that had been used to store Internet traffic data since approximately 2003. The Aurora database contains huge amounts of data acquired by firewalls, routers, honeypots and other devices on AT&T's global IP (Internet Protocol) network and other networks connected to AT&T's network.
How Many Calls Go Through AT&T?
By the end of 2004, on an average business day, AT&T Corp.'s network handled over 300 million voice calls as well as over 4,000 terabytes (million megabytes) of data. To understand the scale of this flow of information, it is approximately 200 times the amount of data contained in all the books in the Library of Congress.
How Many Customers Did AT&T Have?
By the end of 2004, AT&T Corp. provided long distance service (including both stand-alone and bundled) to approximately 24.6 million residential customers, dropping from approximately 34.4 million customers at the end of 2003. Before the acquisition, AT&T Corp.'s bundled local and long distance service was available in 46 states, covering more than 73 million households.
How Big is the New AT&T Inc.?
The new AT&T Inc. constitutes the largest telecommunications provider in the United States and one of the largest in the world. AT&T Inc. is the largest U.S. provider of both local and long distance services, serving millions of customers nationwide. AT&T Inc.'s international voice service carries more than 18 billion minutes per year, reaching 240 countries, linking 400 carriers and offering remote access via 19,500 points of presence in 149 countries around the globe. A point of presence is a facility where a long-distance carrier connects to a local telephone network.
Why Are the First and Fourth Amendments at Issue for AT&T?
Because AT&T is acting as the government's agent in the government's violation of the Bill of Rights. Accordingly, the lawsuit makes Constitutional claims in addition to alleging that AT&T violated the wiretap and telecommunications laws.
What Can I do To Help?
Lawsuits take a tremendous amount of time, energy, and financial resources. The only way non-profits such as EFF can afford to pursue them are through the kind and generous donations of individuals such as you. If you believe in what we are fighting for, please consider donating to support our efforts.
(((eff.org)))
A graphic illustration of our civil rights under the current administration:
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Maybe the film was overexposed because they used
a DIM BULB ...............
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Butterfield was Air Force.
He totally energized the Sam Ervin
Senate Watergate investigation when he announced the existence of the taping
system in the Nixon Oval Office.........
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APNEWS
Bush Doesn't Confirm NSA Data Collection
May 11, 1:29 PM (ET)
By LAURIE KELLMAN
WASHINGTON (AP) - President Bush did not confirm or deny a newspaper report Thursday that the National Security Agency was collecting records of tens of millions of ordinary Americans' phone calls.
"Our intelligence activities strictly target al-Qaida and their known affiliates," Bush said. "We're not mining or trolling through the personal lives of millions of innocent Americans."
USA Today, based on anonymous sources it said had direct knowledge of the arrangement, reported that AT&T Corp., Verizon Communications Inc. (VZ), and BellSouth Corp. (BLS) began turning over records of Americans' phone calls to the NSA shortly after the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.
Bush said any domestic intelligence-gathering measures he's approved are "lawful," and he says "appropriate" members of Congress have been briefed.
The disclosure could complicate Bush's bid to win confirmation of former NSA director Gen. Michael Hayden as CIA director.
Congressional Republicans and Democrats demanded answers from the Bush administration Thursday about a government spy agency secretly collecting records of ordinary Americans' phone calls to build a database of every call made within the country.
The top-ranking Democrat on the Senate Judiciary Committee said he was shocked by the revelation about the NSA.
"It is our government, it's not one party's government. It's America's government. Those entrusted with great power have a duty to answer to Americans what they are doing," Sen. Patrick Leahy of Vermont.
The Republican chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, Sen. Arlen Specter of Pennsylvania, said he would call the phone companies to appear before the panel in pursuit of what had transpired.
"We're really flying blind on the subject and that's not a good way to approach the Fourth Amendment and the constitutional issues involving privacy," Specter said of domestic surveillance in general.
The companies said Thursday that they are protecting customers' privacy but have an obligation to assist law enforcement and government agencies in ensuring the nation's security. "We prize the trust our customers place in us. If and when AT&T is asked to help, we do so strictly within the law and under the most stringent conditions," the company said in a statement, echoed by the others.
Bush said that U.S. intelligence targets terrorists and that the government does not listen to domestic telephone calls without court approval and that Congress has been briefed on intelligence programs.
He vowed to do everything in his power to fight terror and "we will do so within the laws of our country."
On Capitol Hill, several lawmakers expressed incredulity about the program, with some Republicans questioning the rationale and legal underpinning and several Democrats railing about the lack of congressional oversight.
"I don't know enough about the details except that I am willing to find out because I'm not sure why it would be necessary to keep and have that kind of information," said House Majority Leader John Boehner, R-Ohio.
Republican Sen. Lindsey Graham, R-S.C., told Fox News Channel: "The idea of collecting millions or thousands of phone numbers, how does that fit into following the enemy?"
Sen. Dick Durbin, D-Ill., said bringing the telephone companies before the Judiciary Committee is an important step.
"We need more. We need to take this seriously, more seriously than some other matters that might come before the committee because our privacy as American citizens is at stake," Durbin said.
Sen. Jeff Sessions, R-Ala., argued that the program "is not a warrantless wiretapping of the American people. I don't think this action is nearly as troublesome as being made out here, because they are not tapping our phones."
The program does not involve listening to or taping the calls. Instead it documents who talks to whom in personal and business calls, whether local or long distance, by tracking which numbers are called, the newspaper said.
The NSA and the Office of National Intelligence Director did not immediately respond to requests for comment.
NSA spokesman Don Weber said in an e-mailed statement that given the nature of the agency's work, it would be "irresponsible to comment on actual or alleged operations issues." He added, "the NSA takes its legal responsibilities seriously and operates within the law."
NSA is the same spy agency that conducts the controversial domestic eavesdropping program that had been acknowledged earlier by Bush. The president said last year that he authorized the NSA to listen, without warrants, to international phone calls involving Americans suspected of terrorist links.
The report came as Hayden - Bush's choice to take over leadership of the CIA - had been scheduled to visit lawmakers on Capitol Hill Thursday. However, the meetings with Republican Sens. Rick Santorum of Pennsylvania and Lisa Murkowski of Alaska were postponed at the request of the White House, said congressional aides in the two Senate offices.
The White House offered no reason for the postponement to the lawmakers. Other meetings with lawmakers were still planned.
Hayden already faced criticism because of the NSA's secret domestic eavesdropping program. As head of the NSA from March 1999 to April 2005, Hayden also would have overseen the call-tracking program.
Sen. Dianne Feinstein, D-Calif., who has spoken favorably of the nomination, said the latest revelation "is also going to present a growing impediment to the confirmation of Gen. Hayden."
The NSA wants the database of domestic call records to look for any patterns that might suggest terrorist activity, USA Today said.
Don Weber, a senior spokesman for the NSA, told the paper that the agency operates within the law, but would not comment further on its operations.
One big telecommunications company, Qwest, has refused to turn over records to the program, the newspaper said, because of privacy and legal concerns.
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Associated Press Writers Katherine Shrader and Elizabeth White in Washington and AP Business Writer Barbara Ortutay in New York contributed to this report.
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The Mary Poppins Movie reference in the name of alterations being possible in 1963/64:
John Costella writes, "Film experts believe that a real film of the assassination was quickly altered on the evening of the assassination, using machines that could create Hollywood-style special effects (like Mary Poppins, created in 1964)."
David Healy also references the Mary Poppins movie in the name of possible alteration of the Zapruder film when he said, "Obviously (or perhaps not, to Durnavich and Wimp), any special effects editor will match up features from frame to frame to present the illusion of reality. Surely this was more than possible in 1963: the techniques were used primarily for motion pictures, after all! Could you imagine “Mary Poppins” losing the illusion of reality because a piece of grass jumped all over the place from frame to frame?"
While these gentlemen like to cite the illusions created in the Mary Poppins movie, they either have only viewed the film in its normal running time, thus they were satisfied and didn't care to investigate any further, or they had actually looked at stills from the movie and withheld the fact that the optical printing work by Disney in 1963/64 could be detected by even the most inexperienced laymen. I want to once again request that the people who claim how these men have gotten it right ... to actually look at what these individuals have said Vs. the actual Mary Poppins movie evidence that they referenced because what was said is not supported by what actually is witnessed on that film. (see the examples below)
Bill Miller
Oh, now I am convinced ........
The metal shed...there or not?
in JFK Assassination Debate
Posted
So I give up Bill ........
you are always right and I am always wrong .......
sorry for participating
in your world .......