Cliff Varnell

After Oswald was captured, Harriman/Bundy pulled a plug on the Castro-did-it

scenario to preserve relations with the Russians, and Cuba was "lost."

The Cuban angle was spiked along time before that!

Paul

Here's where we diverge. Had Oswald been gunned down as (I'd speculate)

planned -- Mickey and Minnie would be knocking back virgin Cuba Libres

at the Havana Disneyland, as we speak...

I'm curious what significance is found in Bowron's WC mis-statements.

When was Jackie Kennedy, Will Greer, and Roy Kellerman NOT with the

body after the arrival at Parkland?

I think it's clear from her later disclaimer that Bowron did not see any

other wound when she was standing on the other side of the car.

It appears she was under the impression Specter was asking her if she saw

any other wound at that exact moment -- and the answer was, "No, sir."

Here is how she testified under oath on 24 March 1964:

SPECTER: How many holes did you see?

BOWRON: I just saw one large hole [referring to hole in head].

SPECTER: ...Did you notice any other wound on the President's body?

BOWRON: No, sir.

SPECTER: ...Did you ever see his [John F. Kennedy's] neck prior to the time you removed the trach tube?

BOWRON: No, sir.

Good point, Michael. She mis-spoke, clearly.

Here's what Henchliffe had to say about the visibility of the throat wound, from

her WC testimony:

(quote on)

Mr. SPECTER. Was the wound on the front of the neck surrounded by any blood?

Miss HENCHLIFFE. No, sir.

Mr. Specter. Was there any blood at all in that area?

Miss HENCHLIFFE. No, sir.

(quote off)

I find it hard to believe that Bowron did not see the throat wound.

I find it easier to buy the notion that she mis-stated out of nervousness,

since on every other point her testimony seems corroborated.

Well well well. All that time the CIA was supporting the Fidelistas Mr. George Bush

of the CIA had a mobile oil drilling platform 54 miles off the coast of Cuba. He could

run maintainence crews on and off that platform to the Florida mainland without

going thru US customs inspection.

Now this I like!

I knew you would...

By the by, I thought parts of Tarpley's Synthetic Terror: Made In USA (Progressive Press, 205) the best things I've read in years.

Paul

Here's a key point that I don't think Tarpley fully connected. From the Unauthorized Bush:

(quote on, emphasis added)

The raison d'être of the massive capability commanded by Theodore Shackley was

now Operation Mongoose, a program for sabotage raids and assassinations to be

conducted on Cuban territory, with a special effort to eliminate Fidel Castro personally.

In order to run these operations from US territory, flagrant and extensive violation of

federal and state laws was the order of the day. Documents regarding the incorporation

of businesses were falsified. Income tax returns were faked. FAA regulations were

violated by planes taking off for Cuba or for forward bases in the Bahamas and elsewhere.

Explosives moved across highways that were full of civilian traffic. The Munitions Act, the

Neutrality Act, the customs and immigrations laws were routinely flaunted. Above

all, the drug laws were massively violated as the gallant anti-communist fighters filled

their planes and boats with illegal narcotics to be smuggled back into the US when

they returned from their missions. By 1963, the drug-running activities of the covert

operatives were beginning to attract attention. JM/WAVE, in sum, accelerated the

slide of south Florida towards the status of drug and murder capital of the United States

it achieved during the 1980's, when it became as notorious as Chicago during Prohibition.

(quote off)

This is the most likely answer to the question: Why was Kennedy shot?

Harriman/Bush et al wanted to take advantage of the smuggling operations from

Havana, then to the drilling platforms, then to the mainland -- all nice and clean

and unobserved.

H.L. Hunt and the other Texan oil men were up to the same thing, I'd speculate.

Harriman wanted to woo Castro into the fold; Hunt wanted him assassinated

or overthrown.

If Oswald had been gunned down Friday afternoon, Harriman would have gone

along with the Castro-did-it scenario.

After Oswald was captured, Harriman/Bundy pulled a plug on the Castro-did-it

scenario to preserve relations with the Russians, and Cuba was "lost."

How very odd. If she just did not see it because of the gaping head wound would be one thing, but to later say she saw a throat wound is indeed curious. Why would she lie? And which time is she lying? Conventional wisdom holds that the more truthful memory is the one closer in time to the event.

Dawn

Hi Dawn,

While Diana Bowron certainly mis-spoke in her WC testimony, I think

when put into context it is apparent she mis-understood Specter's

question.

First, let's keep in mind she was all of 22 years old, in-country only four

months.

From Harrison Livingstone's KILLING THE TRUTH pg. 184, Bowron wrote:

(quote on)

When I arrived in Minor Medicine [after prepping the body for the casket], I found

the patients had been removed elsewhere, and the department had been taken

over by the Vice President and his staff. They were getting ready to leave when

I got there, as they passed me. I heard the Vice President say to his wife,

"Make a note of what everyone says and does."

(quote off)

Did LBJ actually assign his wife to make a note of what everyone said and did?

Obviously not.

Why would Lyndon Baines Johnson say such a thing right in front of one of the

most important witnesses in the case?

For intimidating effect, I'd speculate.

Did this obvious intimidation tactic work with Ms. Bowron?

KTT, pg 197:

(quote on)

With regard to Arlen Specter's questioning of her, which seems to give

an erroneous impression as to how many wounds she saw, she says:

"My answer, 'I just saw one large hole,' was in response to a series of

questions about what I saw and did in the car and the condition of his

head. As I understand it at the time Specter was taking things

sequentially and one large hole in the back of the head was what I

first saw in the back of the car. He never asked me about any other

wounds, and by the time we got to the end of the interview, I was

probably so nervous I put the back wound out of my mind."

(quote off)

Let's put the above into the context of her WC testimony:

(quote on)

Mr. SPECTER - And what, in a general way, did you observe with respect to

President Kennedy's condition?

Miss BOWRON - He was very pale, he was lying across Mrs. Kennedy's knee and

there seemed to be blood everywhere. When I went around to the other side of

the car I saw the condition of his head.

Mr. SPECTER - You saw the condition of his what?

Miss BOWRON - The back of his head.

Mr. SPECTER - And what was that condition?

Miss BOWRON - Well, it was very bad---you know.

Mr. SPECTER - How many holes did you see?

Miss BOWRON - I just saw one large hole.

Mr. SPECTER - Did you see a small bullet hole beneath that one large hole?

Miss BOWRON - No, sir.

Mr. SPECTER - Did you notice any other wound on the President's body?

Miss BOWRON - No, sir.

(quote off)

I think it's clear from her later disclaimer that Bowron did not see any

other wound when she was standing on the other side of the car.

It appears she was under the impression Specter was asking her if she saw

any other wound at that exact moment -- and the answer was, "No, sir."

Cross posted from the "Throat Wound" thread:

Arlen Specter and the Warren Commission very thoroughly omitted any careful timeline or chain of custody of the President of the United States from the time the limosine arrived at Parkland Hospital until Dr. Carrico arrived in Trauma Room 1 where Kennedy had been taken.

Arlen Specter and the WC were given with the job of covering up an obvious

conspiracy, so this ought not surprise.

It shouldn't be that difficult to establish such a time-line, since we're only looking

at a few minutes.

Nurse Henchliffe testified that Dr. Carrico did not arrive in Trauma Room 1 until some indeterminate, if brief, amount of time after she helped roll the stretcher into Trauma Room 1.

From Henchliffe's WC testimony:

(quote on, emphasis added)

Mr. SPECTER. And who else was present at the time you first saw [JFK] when

he had just come into the emergency area?

Miss HENCHLIFFE. Let me see, I think Dr. Carrico was there--he was there very

shortly after--afterwards.

Mr. SPECTER. He was there when you arrived? Or arrived shortly after you did?

Miss HENCHLIFFE. Well, actually I went in ahead of the cart with him and I was

the first one in with him, and just in a minute, or seconds, Dr. Carrico came in.

(quote off)

"In a minute, or seconds..."

Nurse Henchliffe left Trauma Room 1 to go to the blood bank in the hospital for blood.

Arlen Specter and the Warren Commission very thoroughly omitted any testimony

concerning who removed John F. Kennedy's tie and opened his shirt, and when.

From the WC testimony of Dr. Charles Carrico:

(quote on, emphasis added)

Mr. SPECTER - Would you continue to describe your observations of the President?

Dr. CARRICO - His-- the President's color--I don't believe I said--he was an ashen,

bluish, grey, cyanotic, he was making no spontaneous movements, I mean, no

voluntary movements at all. We opened his shirt and coat and tie and observed

a small wound in the anterior lower third of the neck, listened very briefly, heard

a few cardiac beats, felt the President's back, and detected no large or sucking

chest wounds, and then proceeded to the examination of his head.

(quote off)

From the WC testimony of Nurse Diana Bowron:

(quote on, emphasis added)

Mr. SPECTER - And who was in the trauma room when you arrived there?

Miss BOWRON - Dr. Carrico.

Mr. SPECTER - Where did Dr. Carrico join you?

Miss BOWRON - At the---I couldn't really tell you exactly, but it was inside major

surgery. Miss Henchliffe, the other nurse who is assigned to major surgery, was

in the trauma room already setting the I.V.'s---the intravenous bottles up.

Mr. SPECTER - And were there any other nurses present at that time when the

President arrived in the trauma area?

Miss BOWRON - I don't think so, sir.

Mr. SPECTER - Were there any doctors present besides Dr. Carrico?

Miss BOWRON - I didn't notice anybody---there may have been.

Mr. SPECTER - What action did you observe Dr. Carrico take, if any?

Miss BOWRON - We tried to start an I.V. cutdown and I don't know whether it

was his left or his right leg, and Miss Henchliffe and I cut off his clothing

and then after that everybody just arrived at once and it was more or less

everybody sort of helping everybody else. We opened the chest tube trays and

the venesectron trays.

(quote off)

The omissions of Arlen Specter and the Warren Commission concerning these

crucial moments make the Grand Canyon look like a gopher hole.

Ashton Gray

Which is nothing compared to the holes in your theory, Ashton.

At what point did Jackie Kennedy, Will Greer, and Roy Kellerman leave

the body unattended so "Joe" and Di could diddle with the dead Prez?

Charles Carrico, WC:

(quote on)

Mr. SPECTER - Who was the first doctor to reach President Kennedy on his arrival

at Parkland Hospital?

Dr. CARRICO - I was.

Mr. SPECTER - And who else was with President Kennedy on his arrival, as best

you can recollect it?

Dr. CARRICO - Mrs. Kennedy was there, and there were some men in the room,

who I assumed were Secret Service men; I don't know.

(quote on)

And what did the Secret Service report?

From his original written report, Roy Kellerman:

(quote on)

When we got to the hospital I called to the agents to get two stretchers. The special

agents of the follow-up car with the police ran into the hospital, obtained two stretchers

on wheels. We placed the Governor on the first one at which time I noticed he was

conscious and I spoke to him saying, "Governor, everything is going to be all right."

His eyes were wide open and he nodded his head in agreement. Just before we

removed the President, SA Hill took off his coat, placed it over the President's head

and chest and we placed him on the stretcher. Both were taken into separate

emergency rooms. The hospital staff appeared quickly and went immediately to

work. I accompanied the President to the emergency room.

(quote off)

From Will Greer's original Secret Service report:

(quote on, emphasis added)

I drove as fast as I could to the hospital and helped to get the President

into the emergency room. I guarded the emergency room door until the

doctors and nurses had completed their duty.

(quote off)

Let's return to Ms. Bowron's unduly maligned WC testimony, where she

describes what she did at the limo:

(quote on, emphasis added)

Miss BOWRON - I helped to lift his head and Mrs. Kennedy pushed me away and

lifted his head herself onto the cart and so I went around back to the cart and

walked off with it. We ran on with it to the trauma room and she ran beside us.

(quote off)

It would appear that Jackie, Kellerman, and Greer were with the body from the time

the limo arrived to when the Parkland staff took over in the ER.

Does this indict Jackie?

Did she pull out a pillbox hat pin and shiv the guy in the throat on the drive to Parkland?

Arlen Specter and the Warren Commission very thoroughly omitted any careful timeline or chain of custody of the President of the United States from the time the limosine arrived at Parkland Hospital until Dr. Carrico arrived in Trauma Room 1 where Kennedy had been taken.

Arlen Specter and the WC were given with the job of covering up an obvious

conspiracy, so this ought not surprise.

It shouldn't be that difficult to establish such a time-line, since we're only looking

at a few minutes.

Nurse Henchliffe testified that Dr. Carrico did not arrive in Trauma Room 1 until some indeterminate, if brief, amount of time after she helped roll the stretcher into Trauma Room 1.

From Henchliffe's WC testimony:

(quote on, emphasis added)

Mr. SPECTER. And who else was present at the time you first saw [JFK] when

he had just come into the emergency area?

Miss HENCHLIFFE. Let me see, I think Dr. Carrico was there--he was there very

shortly after--afterwards.

Mr. SPECTER. He was there when you arrived? Or arrived shortly after you did?

Miss HENCHLIFFE. Well, actually I went in ahead of the cart with him and I was

the first one in with him, and just in a minute, or seconds, Dr. Carrico came in.

(quote off)

"In a minute, or seconds..."

Nurse Henchliffe left Trauma Room 1 to go to the blood bank in the hospital for blood.

Arlen Specter and the Warren Commission very thoroughly omitted any testimony

concerning who removed John F. Kennedy's tie and opened his shirt, and when.

From the WC testimony of Dr. Charles Carrico:

(quote on, emphasis added)

Mr. SPECTER - Would you continue to describe your observations of the President?

Dr. CARRICO - His-- the President's color--I don't believe I said--he was an ashen,

bluish, grey, cyanotic, he was making no spontaneous movements, I mean, no

voluntary movements at all. We opened his shirt and coat and tie and observed

a small wound in the anterior lower third of the neck, listened very briefly, heard

a few cardiac beats, felt the President's back, and detected no large or sucking

chest wounds, and then proceeded to the examination of his head.

(quote off)

From the WC testimony of Nurse Diana Bowron:

(quote on, emphasis added)

Mr. SPECTER - And who was in the trauma room when you arrived there?

Miss BOWRON - Dr. Carrico.

Mr. SPECTER - Where did Dr. Carrico join you?

Miss BOWRON - At the---I couldn't really tell you exactly, but it was inside major

surgery. Miss Henchliffe, the other nurse who is assigned to major surgery, was

in the trauma room already setting the I.V.'s---the intravenous bottles up.

Mr. SPECTER - And were there any other nurses present at that time when the

President arrived in the trauma area?

Miss BOWRON - I don't think so, sir.

Mr. SPECTER - Were there any doctors present besides Dr. Carrico?

Miss BOWRON - I didn't notice anybody---there may have been.

Mr. SPECTER - What action did you observe Dr. Carrico take, if any?

Miss BOWRON - We tried to start an I.V. cutdown and I don't know whether it

was his left or his right leg, and Miss Henchliffe and I cut off his clothing

and then after that everybody just arrived at once and it was more or less

everybody sort of helping everybody else. We opened the chest tube trays and

the venesectron trays.

(quote off)

The omissions of Arlen Specter and the Warren Commission concerning these

crucial moments make the Grand Canyon look like a gopher hole.

Ashton Gray

Which is nothing compared to the holes in your theory, Ashton.

At what point did Jackie Kennedy, Will Greer, and Roy Kellerman leave

the body unattended so "Joe" and Di could diddle with the dead Prez?

Charles Carrico, WC:

(quote on)

Mr. SPECTER - Who was the first doctor to reach President Kennedy on his arrival

at Parkland Hospital?

Dr. CARRICO - I was.

Mr. SPECTER - And who else was with President Kennedy on his arrival, as best

you can recollect it?

Dr. CARRICO - Mrs. Kennedy was there, and there were some men in the room,

who I assumed were Secret Service men; I don't know.

(quote off)

And what did the Secret Service report?

From his original written report, Roy Kellerman:

(quote on)

When we got to the hospital I called to the agents to get two stretchers. The special

agents of the follow-up car with the police ran into the hospital, obtained two stretchers

on wheels. We placed the Governor on the first one at which time I noticed he was

conscious and I spoke to him saying, "Governor, everything is going to be all right."

His eyes were wide open and he nodded his head in agreement. Just before we

removed the President, SA Hill took off his coat, placed it over the President's head

and chest and we placed him on the stretcher. Both were taken into separate

emergency rooms. The hospital staff appeared quickly and went immediately to

work. I accompanied the President to the emergency room.

(quote off)

From Will Greer's original Secret Service report:

(quote on, emphasis added)

I drove as fast as I could to the hospital and helped to get the President

into the emergency room. I guarded the emergency room door until the

doctors and nurses had completed their duty.

(quote off)

Let's return to Ms. Bowron's unduly maligned WC testimony, where she

describes what she did at the limo:

(quote on, emphasis added)

Miss BOWRON - I helped to lift his head and Mrs. Kennedy pushed me away and

lifted his head herself onto the cart and so I went around back to the cart and

walked off with it. We ran on with it to the trauma room and she ran beside us.

(quote off)

It would appear that Jackie, Kellerman, and Greer were with the body from the time

the limo arrived to when the Parkland staff took over in the ER.

Does this indict Jackie?

Did she pull out a pillbox hat pin and shiv the guy in the throat on the drive to Parkland?

Anyone else here from the "Old School" in which one was expected to gain "First Person" information and knowledge for their research to carry any validity?

Old School?

I'm all about the Old School.

Sylvia Meagher, ACCESSORIES AFTER THE FACT, pg 150

(quote on)

Is it true that the doctors present during the treatment of the President at

Parkland Hospital did not form an opinion about the nature of this wound?

According to their written reports of the same day, it is not true. Dr.

Charles Carrico described a "small penetrating wound" of anterior neck

in lower third. (CE 392) Dr. Ronald C. Jones referred to "a small hole in

anterior midline of neck thought to be a bullet entrance wound...air was

bubbling through the neck wound" (Jones, Ronald, Exhibit 1)

Dr. Malcolm O. Perry, Dr. Charles Baxter, and Dr. William Kemp Clark did

not suggest in their written reports whether the wound was produced by the

entrance or the exit of a bullet.

(quote off)

In addition to the two contemporaneous written reports, we have the following

witness statements.

Nurse Margaret Henchliffe WC testimony:

(quote on)

[A] little hole in the middle of his neck...About as big as the end of my little

finger...An entrance bullet hole -- it looked to me like...I have never seen an

exit bullet hole -- I don't remember seeing one like that;...it was just a small

wound and wasn't jagged like most of the exit bullet wounds that I have seen.

(quote off)

Nurse Diana Bowron to author Harrison Livingstone, KILLING THE TRUTH, pg 188:

(quote on)

HL: And, so did you see the wound in the throat before? When he was in the car?

DB: Yes.

HL: Okay. And what did that look like?

DB: Well, that looked like an entry wound.

(quote off)

Dr. Charles Crenshaw, CONSPIRACY OF SILENCE, pg 79:

(quote on)

I also identified a small opening about the diameter of a pencil at the

midline of his throat to be an entry bullet hole. There was no doubt in

my mind about that wound.

(quote off)

Dr. Gene Akin's WC testimony:

(quote on)

Mr. SPECTER - What was the dimension of the punctate wound, without regards to

the tracheotomy which was being started?

Dr. AKIN - It looked--it was as you said, it was a puncture wound. It was roughly

circular, about, I would judge, 1.5 cm. in diameter.

(quote off)

Dr. Charles Baxter's WC testimony:

(quote on)

Mr. Specter - Were the characteristics of the wound on the neck sufficient to enable

you to form an opinion with reasonable medical certainty as to what was the cause

of the hole?

Dr. Baxter - Well, the wound was, I think, compatible with a gunshot wound. It did

not appear to be a jagged wound such as one would expect with a very high velocity

rifle bullet. We could not determine, or did not determine at that time whether this

represented an entry or an exit wound. Judging from the caliber of the rifle that we

later found or become acquainted with, this would more resemble a wound of entry.

(quote off)

Dr. Malcolm Perry's 11/22/63 televised press conference:

(quote on)

There was an entrance wound in the neck…It appeared to be coming at him…The

wound appeared to be an entrance wound in the front of the throat; yes, that is

correct.

(quote off)

At no time have I said, hinted, or even suggested that if a puncture wound in the throat was created by a person or persons unknown after John F. Kennedy's arrival at Parkland Hospital, then any such puncture wound was "nonlethal."

Of course you didn't. I did. I cited the extant medical evidence.

Soon, I'll be posting those wound descriptions you have made false claims about.

This straw man was introduced into this thread by someone whose tireless energy and industry at attempting to beat this down using any means and to continue to sell the bullet wound to the throat story is marvelous.

The nature of the throat wound is crucial to understanding the assassination, imo.

If that idea threatens you, get another hobby, perhaps.

Ashton, you apparently have a sense of entitlement about this topic, as if it is

yours to explore without challenge. I regard the throat wound as important, and

your effort to distort the record on the throat wound will get push back from me

every time.

Foretold -- forewarned.

I also at no time have said, hinted, or even suggested that a puncture wound alone was the sole purpose of any such puncture wound.

Just for the record.

Ashton Gray

Since you're making all this up on the fly, I'm sure you'll get around to trying to

fit the extant evidence to your pet theory -- although you promised your last word

on the subject, I'm sure it isn't.

I'm going to say this once:

I made a concerted and good-faith effort to find photos that would depict JFK's adam's apple at rest, the way it is in the post-mortem photo—not bobbing in mid-speech—and a good-faith effort to duplicate the way his collar and tie rode in realistic relationship to the length of his neck.

But you've made an unsupported assumption, Ashton, to the effect that JFK's

posture in the autopsy more accurately approximated JFK's posture in the

limo than the Fort Worth photo.

What do the motorcade photos show?

I really could care less about the number of specious and disingenuous snide allegations made against me in attempts to smear and discredit me. I yawn. I've put the visual evidence into the record in the best way available to me, and to the best of my good-faith abilities.

Do you give a good faith rebuttal? Do you calmly discuss other photos?

Here is that evidence again, just as presented originally.

Submitted for your consideration, here are two photos of John F. Kennedy at Love Field in Dallas, Texas on the morning of 22 November 1963, the day he was murdered. Note the ride of his shirt collar and tie:

Indeed, note in the photo on the left there was a fold of skin between JFK's

adams apple and the tie-knot.

In the Fort Worth photo he held his head up, stretching the neck folds, and the

fold seen at the base of his adams apple is the upper margin of this same fold

of skin, between the adams apple and the tie-knot.

Now, here's a shot of JFK seated in the motorcade. The fold of skin on the left

side of his neck angles down to form the fold of skin below the adams apple but

above the tie-knot.

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/MCade.htm

JFK was shot in that exposed location -- above the tie knot but below the adams

apple -- from the Black Dog Man position at Z197, imo.

Paul Rigby:

With Castro and his motley band safely restored to Cuban soil in December 1956, CIA money soon flooded in. Between “October or November 1957 and the middle of 1958, the CIA delivered no less than fifty thousand dollars to a half-dozen or more key members of the 26th July Movement in Santiago.” The funds were “handled by Robert D. Wiecha, a CIA case officer …who served in Santiago from September 1957 to June 1959.” In mid-October 1958, a senior figure within the 26th July Movement wrote to Castro detailing the extent of the CIA support in the US Embassy in Havana, and quality of the information that support gave: “I have been in contact with people close to the embassy. These contacts have told me that people who are on our side – but who do not appear to – have had conversations with the ambassador himself. I think this is the best possible, since we are kept up-to-date about everything happening there and of all the possible U.S. plans…”

The Unauthorized Biography, by Webster G. Tarpley and Anton Chaitkin, Chpt 8.

http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm

(quote on, emphasis added)

Bush and the Liedtkes [J. Hugh and William] had been very lucky with the Jameson field

[Zapata's main Texas field], but they could hardly expect such results to be repeated

indefinitely. In addition, they were now ['57 -'59] posting losses, and the value of Zapata

stock had gone into a decline. Bush and the Liedtke brothers now concluded that the

epoch in which large oil fields could be discovered within the continental United States

was now over. Mammoth new oil fields, they believed, could only be found offshore,

located under hundreds of feet of water on the continental shelves, or in shallow seas

like the Gulf of Mexico and the Caribbean. By a happy coincidence, in 1954 the US federal

government was just beginning to auction the mineral rights for these offshore areas.

With father Prescott Bush directing his potent Brown Brothers, Harriman/Skull and Bones

network from the US Senate while regularly hob-nobbing with President Eisenhower on the

golf links, George Bush could be confident of receiving special privileged treatment when it

came to these mineral rights. Bush and his partners therefore judged the moment ripe for

launching a for-hire drilling company, Zapata Offshore, a Delaware corporation that would

offer its services to the companies making up the Seven Sisters international oil cartel in

drilling underwater wells...

...The first asset of Zapata Offshore was the SCORPION, a $ 3.5 million deep-sea drilling

rig that was financed by $1.5 million from the initial stock sale plus another $2 million

from bonds marketed with the help of Uncle Herbie [Walker]. The SCORPION was the

first three-legged self-elevating mobile drilling barge, and it was built by R. G. LeTourneau,

Inc., of Vicksburg, Mississippi. The platform weighed some 9 million pounds and measured

180 by 150 feet, and the three legs were 140 feet long when fully extended. The rig was

floated into the desired drilling position before the legs were extended, and the main body

was then pushed up above the waves by electric motors. The SCORPION was delivered

early in 1956, and was commissioned at Galveston in March, 1956, and was put to work

at exploratory drilling in the Gulf of Mexico during the rest of the year...

...As for the SCORPION, during part of 1957 it was under contract to the

Bahama-California Oil Company, drilling between Florida and Cuba. It was

then leased by Gulf Oil and Standard Oil of California, on whose behalf it started

drilling during 1958 at a position on the Cay Sal Bank, 131 miles south of Miami,

Florida, and just 54 miles north of Isabela, Cuba. Cuba was an interesting place

just then; the US-backed insurgency of Fidel Castro was rapidly undermining the

older US-imposed regime of Fulgencio Batista. That meant that SCORPIO was

located at a hot corner.

(quote off)

Well well well. All that time the CIA was supporting the Fidelistas Mr. George Bush

of the CIA had a mobile oil drilling platform 54 miles off the coast of Cuba. He could

run maintainence crews on and off that platform to the Florida mainland without

going thru US customs inspection.

Bush's Zapata Off-Shore didn't do all that much oil exploration, but "Uncle Herbie"

Walker kept pouring money into it.

Speculation: they were running guns and drugs with the Fidelistas.

In the fall of 1963 W. Averell Harriman wanted rapproachment with Fidel.

It looked like the best way to take advantage of the opportunity of having a

business partner in Havana for the smuggling operations on these oil platforms.

I'd speculate the HL Hunt disagreed, and he distrusted Harriman. I suspect

little George Bush went native and sided with Hunt.

It was all about those mineral rights in the Caribbean, and the opportunity

to combine the oil industry with the illicit trade in guns and drugs.

A co-operative government in Havana meant billions and billions

of smuggling dollars. Harriman thought he had Castro under control,

but Bush's boys scared Castro right into the Soviet arms.

Just as his boy screwed up over Iraq, I'd speculate that George HW screwed

up over Cuba.

I have a difficult time believing that the entire Parkland ER staff was in on the conspiracy

I hope so. That would be more ludicrous than the idea he could have been shot in the indicated location without the projectile going through the shirt, tie, or both.

Ashton, your suited cadaver shows JFK's tie knot at the bottom of his adams apple.

This photo from Fort Worth Eleven Twenty Two shows that there was some distance

between the adams apple and the shirt collar, right where the throat wound was observed.

What I've posited as a possibility could have been accomplished by one or two people.

Why did this medical-hit squad nick the right side of JFK's trachea, bruise the tip of his right

lung, and then cause a hairline fracture at the tip of his right T1 transverse process?

They wheeled the guy in with a big part of his head blown off and they "finished him off"

by inflicting utterly non-fatal, perhaps insignificant wounds -- wounds which indicate a

shot from the front and thus conspiracy?

Why?

Are you asking us to buy this on faith, dear Ashton?

I remember reading recently that one of the autopsy technicians (John Stringer?) told the ARRB that a missing X-ray showed a trail of metallic fragments in the throat/neck.

Bingo!

Key evidence in the case, I'm 95% certain.

The metallic fragments were most dense at the point of deepest penetration,

enough to cause a tiny fracture of the right tip of the T1 transverse process.

What kind of ordance leaves a metallic trail but no bullet?

From CIA SPECIAL WEAPONS AND EQUIPMENT, by H. Keith Melton

(foreword by Richard Helms, 1965), pg 22:

DART GUN

The dart gun is a single-shot pistol firing a .03-caliber, mass stabilized

projectile...made of iron particles and the tranquilizer M-99

formed together with a blood/water soluble bonding agent... If left in the

body, the dart dissolves and becomes unidentifiable on X-ray.

An adjustable shoulder stock is available as an accessory (must be

obtained seperately) for operations requiring ranges up to 100 feet.

Because the round that struck JFK in the throat was at least 10 times larger

than the one cited in this reference book, the iron bonding particles showed

up on x-ray.

The larger blood soluble technology was pioneered by Charles Senseney,

who developed a dog-silencer for the us Army and the CIA. Senseny

testified before the Church Committee in the Senate in 1976, as did

William Casey and Richard Helms, verifying the existence of a small

caliber blood soluble round that paralyzed the target within 2 seconds.

Casey testified that this was experimented with upon humans.

http://www.aarclibrary.org/publib/church/r..._6_Senseney.pdf

I find it a reasonable conclusion (95%) that Mitch WerBell adapted this technology to

a sound suppressed firearm, which was fired from the Black Dog Man position circa

Z197.

I find it difficult to believe that Greer would have been employed to kill JFK. Nor is it likely that Groden is a paid CIA disinformation agent. Last time I saw him he did not seem to be very affluent. Once the CIA gets involved in paying people to provide disinformation, you either have to keep paying them or you have to make arrangements for them to disappear.

I would have thought that William Cooper is more likely to be a disinformation agent than Groden.

I think Cooper is nutty.

I saw this video-taped speech he gave where he cited the Novermber, 22, 1307 hit

the Pope put on Jacque DeMolay, suggesting the 11/22/63 hit on Kennedy was a

Masonic revenge killing (I have no opinion on that point), and then Cooper intoned

with great import -- "Subtract 1307 from 1963 and what do you get? 6...6...6!

Think about it!"

When you subtract 1307 from 1963 you get 656.

Submitted for your consideration, here are two photos of John F. Kennedy at Love Field in Dallas, Texas on the morning of 22 November 1963, the day he was murdered. Note the ride of his shirt collar and tie:

In the animation below, the photo of the tracheotomy (sometimes "tracheostomy") opening—which destroyed all the evidence of a reported throat wound—is overlaid with the same shirt and tie from the black-and-white photo above. The clothing has been adjusted to overlay it on the reclining body in the best approximation of the photos above that could be attained. The suit jacket has been made black only because the play of shadows on the jacket in the above image made the overlay confusing to the eye, and the jacket is largely irrelevant to what is being demonstrated:

It is impossible that any projectile fired from a gun could have penetrated John F. Kennedy's throat at the location indicated by the tracheotomy opening, either going or coming, without having penetrated the shirt, the tie, or both.

Neither happened.

"When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."

—Sir Arthur Conan Doyle

Ashton Gray

Is it possible Ashton Gray could have picked worse photos to judge the location of

JFK's adams apple?

The wound was below the adams apple right above the knot of the tie.

JFK did NOT wear his shirt collar right at the level of his adams apple, as per

the Gospel of Ashton Gray

Hey Ashton, great images and theory. Considering they could have done a better job with a chainsaw, going by the pictures we have all seen, its obvious it was done to hide something.

I haven't reached to formal or comprehensive theory.

to make all the evidence fit the conclusion, like this exercise dressing a dead

man.

I've eliminated what clearly, to me, is the impossible in the matter of the reported throat wound, and only speculated about the few possibilities that are left.

Ashton

Ah, it must be great to have a pet theory that arbitrarily indicts people for treason

and murder because what they say doesn't fit the theory.

How fun!

I wrote:

That's how the American ruling elite manifests its "reach" -- with the military

and intel services.

Exactly! They already had their eyes on the next, more lucrative prize, in the form of SEA aka Laos/VietNam/Cambodia where the REAL money could be made for their Brown and Root [future Halliburton], Bechtel, Mandeville accounts, etc. et.al.

A lot of people were making real money in Cuba. The oil companies had drilling

platforms 40 miles off the Cuban coast. "Maintanence runs" between the platforms

and the Florida mainland were not subject to customs checks.

How much easier the illicit drug and gun running interests would have had it if there'd

only been a friendly gov't in Havana and not the US Navy running a blockade...

G.uns O.il D.rugs. At the center of the Kennedy assassination -- a nexus located

in Texas.

It's extremely curious to me

Really. Personally, I couldn't care less why people arrive at the conclusions they do.

I think this is a venue of fact based argument, so such personal speculation appears

counter-productive.

that purported proponents of a conspiracy in the murder of John F. Kennedy are yet adament about excluding any and all personnel present at Parkland Hospital, whether employed by the hospital or otherwise, at and around the time that Kennedy was taken there.

It there were, in fact, a conspiracy, and if the planned site for a shooting was Dealey Plaza (with a possible back-up plan at the Trade Mart), then these must have been very confident conspirators indeed if they had no insurance installed at the very hospital where the President would be taken in the event of such a premeditated shooting.

Ashton Gray

Since you put it that way, we have the basis for a discussion.

JFK came into Parkland with a good part of his brains blown out.

If the staff at Parkland had been prepped to finish the dude off, why

did they nick the right side of the trachea, bruise the tip of the lung,

and produce a tiny fracture of the T1 transverse process?

I mean, the guy is laying there with his brains out and they "finished

him off" with a nick and a bruise and a hairline fracture?

No, the throat wound tells a different story.

Small caliber. Did not exit. Left a field of metallic debris at its

point of deepest penetration.

JFK acted paralyzed in the limo -- simplest explanation -- because he WAS

paralyzed.

All consistent with a Mitch WerBell adaptation of Charles Senseney's

blood soluble paralytic technology.

http://www.aarclibrary.org/publib/church/r..._6_Senseney.pdf

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKwerbell.htm

And that is why the plotters felt confident they'd get the job done in Dealey.

If the small throat wound was not a bullet wound, but a wound administered by person or persons unknown at Parkland Hospital between the time John F. Kennedy was removed from the limo and the time that Malcolm Perry destroyed all evidence forever, then all the endless miles of argument over whether it was an entrance or an exit wound made by a bullet or other projectile fired from a gun are are the circular tracks of a hopelessly infinite discussion that goes perfectly nowhere, ever, but merry-go-rounds endlessly in the same place.

This would derived solely to the benefit of any co-conspirators, and any disinformation agents assigned to keep that exact controversy in suspension and foment infinitely.

Ashton Gray

Wow. There are disinformation agents assigned to keep the controversy in suspension.

Nice way to forstall debate, eh, Ashton? A pre-emptive smear?

Are we to take the above upon faith since, according to the Gospel of Ashton Gray,

Diana Bowron, Margret Henchcliffe, and Charles Carrico -- the first people to treat

JFK in the ER -- must have been perps? Otherwise Ashton wouldn't have a pet theory

to pimp?

Any support for your allegations, Ashton?

duped

Cliff Varnell:

Paul, we can debate the "significance" of the Operation Northwoods documents

all day long, but it isn't going to change the fact that these EXIST.

Paul Rigby:

Cliff, never said they didn't.

CV:

It is a fact that the Joint Chiefs in March of 1962 signed off on false-flag/ginned-intel plots against Castro.

It is a fact that in August of 1964 the US military used the false-flag/ginned-intel

Gulf of Tonkin Incident to ramp up US involvement in Vietnam.

PR:

Again, with regard to your first paragraph-statement, I've never said they didn't. But note your second para - it's Vietnam that gets attacked, not Cuba! How come?

Because the patsy, carefully sheep-dipped as a Castro agent in league

with the KGB, was captured alive on Eleven Twenty Two.

For the sheep-dipping to hold he had to be gunned down. On this

point the plot ultimately failed.

Are we really to believe that the CIA could successfully sheep-dip Oswald in Russia, but couldn't lay an uncomplicated, if bogus, trail from Oswald to Castro?

New Orleans Chapter of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee.

FPCC leafletting in public August '63.

"Leon Oswald" visit to Sylvia Odio.

The Pedro Charles letters.

Oswald's visits to the Cuban Embassy in Mexico City under the

watchful eye of David Phillips.

The Yates FBI report: Oswald look-a-like picked up hitch-hiking with suspicious

package in hand -- talked of both the Carosel Club and killing JFK.

(SWHT, Hancock, pgs 222-226.)

The Gilberto Alvarado Story: Oswald hired to kill JFK by red-headed

black Cuban, pimped right after the assassination by Phillips et al MEXI.

(ibid, pgs 220-1).

(ibid, Hancock, pg 13):

(quote on)

Immediately following the assassination, FBI and CIA informant Richard Cain

(an associate of Sam Giancana and participant in the very early Roselli organized

attempts against Castro) began aggressively reporting that Lee Oswald had been

associated with a FPCC group in Chicago that had held secret meetings in the

spring of 1963 planning the assassination of President Kennedy...

...Following the assassination, John Martino and Frank Fiorini/Sturgis of Miami,

and Carlos Bringuier of New Orleans, all began telling the same story about Oswald

visiting Cuba and being a personal tool of Fidel Castro. Strangely enough, on the

afternoon of November 22 after Oswald's arrest, J. Edgar Hoover also related that

the FBI had monitored Oswald on visits to Cuba.

Hoover wrote in a 4:01pm EST memo on November 22: "Oswald...went to Cuba

on several occasions but would not tell us what he went to Cuba for." Hoover

repeated this information again an hour later in a memo of 5:15pm EST...

(quote off)

If J. Edgar Hoover had announced on the evening of Friday, November 22

1963 that an agent of Fidel Castro had shot President Kennedy the US would

have been on the march.

As Larry Hancock notes, all of the above would have worked if the patsy

had shown up dead -- but the patsy alive made the sheep-dipping untenable.

Yet this is precisely what happened, with Oswald undertaking a series of contradictory steps and poses that rendered "the Castro dunnit" scenario untenable. Angleton couldn't do better in New Orleans than he could in Minsk?

I don't follow you, here. The only "contradictory step" Oswald took was *not* get shot.

Other than that, Angleton/Phillips had him all set up to point to Castro, but only

upon early demise.

CV:

It is a fact that Neo-Con foreign policy is often based on ginned-intel, witness

the current war in Iraq.

PR:

Absolutely - but not just Neo-Con. Hasn't this mostly been the case?

CV: The US doesn't always run false flag ops...It appears to be the favored

foreign policy gambit of super-hawk militarists.

CV:

Given the documentary and historical evidence of these false-flag/ginned-intel

plots and operations, how on Earth can anyone heap "ridicule and scorn" on the

notion that just such a false flag attack on Kennedy was possible?

I haven't poured anything remotely resembling "ridicule and scorn" on the notion

Ashton has, as you yourself noted, and you indicated you agreed.

I'm glad to see that you do not agree with Ashton's off-hand dismissal of

such possibilities, as it turns out.

I sought to put a reasoned case that a) the CIA installed Castro, and did so for eminently rational, if thoroughly deplorable, reasons. My point being that this was a long-term, political programme that was not to be terminated within a couple of years of initiation. But the veneer of deep-seated hostility had to be preserved, even as successive would-be coups/assassination attempts were cocked-up and thwarted. Deliberately, in my view.

I'll sum up by holding the Monroe Doctrine as sacrosant in the eyes of the

American ruling elite. Concentrated European influence 90 miles off the

American shore has been a thorn in the side of US pride for 48 years now.

CV:

I don't see where you show any proof that the anti-Castro forces

were any less committed to the overthrow of Castro merely because

other factions in the American ruling elite desired a different result.

PR:

No, not least because I wouldn't attempt anything so half-baked. I accept, mostly

without reservation, the enduring determination of most, if not all, of the anti-Castro

Cubans, to chuck out Castro. Trouble is, a) they were never the ones with the real

power; and I rather suspect that a significant number of anti-Castro Cubans share

my disbelief at the genuine resolve of the CIA et al to effect such a change.

Here is a list of the guys -- call 'em the Dirty Dozen -- who had an "enduring

determination" to overthrow Castro:

Gen. Edward Lansdale

David Atlee Phillips

David Sanchez Morales

Allen Dulles

H. L. Hunt

Sam Giancana

George H. W. Bush

Gen. Curtis LeMay

Gen. Lyman Lemnitzer

J. Edgar Hoover

Richard Helms

James Jesus Angleton

Now, are you going to tell me these guys didn't have power?

Paul Rigby:

The CIA had a variety of purposes in mind for revolutionary Cuba. A key intention was to use Cuba as the launch pad and pretext for a series of “revolutionary” movements throughout Latin America that would in turn “compel” CIA intervention in the unfortunate countries concerned.

control over in the late 50's and early 60's?

The CIA could always fund local rebel groups if they wanted to establish a pre-text for

greater intervention in a country's affairs-- why would they turn this function over to

Fidel Castro?

The Caribbean, Central and Latin America would thus be remade in the desired US image, the region’s reformist and nationalist governments alike destroyed in favour of murderous militarised oligarchies and US finance.

And such wasn't the case BEFORE the fall of Batista?

Tell that to a quarter million dead Guatamalans...

Castro’s government was to arrest previously supportive CIA men engaged in precisely such activity – in this early instance, against the government of Nicaragua – no later than April 1959. Sihanouk offered a typically shrewd Asian encapsulation: “All the efforts of the CIA were aimed at implanting an armed political opposition inside the country so that we would have to beg for American arms to keep order…”

Apples and oranges! Big difference between SE Asia and Latin America. The US had the

Monroe Doctrine working for about 140 years in Latin America, and they didn't need a

Communist take-over of very valuable real estate in order to enforce regional hegemony.

I think you've made a fundamental mis-reading of American history in this instance, Paul,

with all due respect.

When it comes to the affairs of Asia, the US has long sought bogeymen, granted

(Mao, Ho, Saddam, Osama).

But that strategy wasn't necessary in the Western Hemisphere. Not enough to give

up the jewel of the Caribbean!

The US didn't leverage Fidel to go after Allende, after all.

F. W. Sourwine: Mr. Smith, the pending question before you read your statement was: What agencies of the US Government had a hand in bringing pressure to overthrow the Batista government, and how did they do it?

Earl E. Smith: Well, the agencies, certain influential people, influential sources in the State Department, lower down echelons in the CIA. I would say representatives of the majority of the US Government agencies which have anything to do with the Embassy...

The State Department reference reads W. Averell Harriman, imo.

Lower echelons of the CIA...That's one to ponder...

Was there a "monolithic" CIA policy toward Batista?

Larry Hancock's SOMEONE WOULD HAVE TALKED, pg 125:

[David Sanchez] Morales is discussed in Chapter 4 of [John] Marino's book,

I WAS CASTRO'S PRISONER, where Martino gives a very detailed analysis of

the behavior of the US Embassy staff in Havana during the period that Castro

came to power, up to the point where he declared himself a Communist. He

describes Ambassador Smith as giving unwarranted and undue encouragement

to the revolutionaries and makes other negative remarks about the Embassy

CIA staff. Martino also names Earl Williamson as CIA and describes his activities,

stating that Williamson was "quietly withdrawn from Havana and replaced by Morales".

He then describes Morales' opposition to Castro and his unsuccessful attempts

to move Washington to act against Castro. This sort of detail, published when

Morales was acting as Operations Chief at JM/WAVE and the secret war was at

it's height, is certainly not sanctioned by CIA policies. It seems clear that Martino's

book was neither CIA propaganda or vetted by CIA.

I think the Yankee/Cowboy dichotomy applies to this instance, the divisions

within the CIA over Castro policy in Havana in 1958.

Please note that I am not careless in my application of the Y/C dichotomy.

Ashton accuses me of "soft pedaling" it, but I prefer to think of it as simply

being intellectually honest.

Cliff Varnell:

So Operation Mongoose, Operation Northwoods, and that huge JM/WAVE station

were all figments of the imagination?

It is inconvenient to your pet theory that this anti-Castro effort existed, therefore

it did not exist?

Because a plot fails, that precludes any possibility of such a plot?

Plots only exist when they succeed, is that what you and Ashton are pushing?

Paul Rigby:

All figments of the imagination? Nope, just never implemented because real power had other plans.

What was "never implemented"?

JM/WAVE was not the largest CIA station in 1963?

Ed Lansdale wasn't put in charge of Operation Mongoose in 1961?

Those programs were implemented, but without success. The Joint Chiefs didn't

regard the extant anti-Castro efforts likely to achieve success.

James Bamford's BODY OF SECRETS pg 87, Chairman

of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Lyman Lemnitzer wrote in

a memorandum to Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara,

April 10, 1962: (emphasis added)

The Joint Chiefs of Staff believe that the Cuban problem

must be solved in the NEAR FUTURE...Further, they see no

prospect of early success in overthrowing the present

communist regime either as a result of internal uprising

or external political, economic or psychological pressures.

Accordingly they believe that military intervention by the

United States will be REQUIRED to overthrow the present

communist regime...The Joint Chiefs of Staff believe that

the United States can undertake military intervention in

Cuba WITHOUT RISK OF GENERAL WAR. They also

believe that the intervention can be accomplished rapidly

enough to minimize communist opportunities for solicitation

of U.N. action.

The Cuban market was simply traded for control of the rest of the region.

Economic significance of Argentina, Brazil et al v. Cuba?

the Monroe Doctrine.

The US MIC did not need a "boogey man" to keep the Western Hemisphere in line

in 1958, the year of greatest US support for Fidel.

Just ask Arbenz, '54...

Hugo Chavez now fulfils the role of ostensible regional bogeyman, and US plots against him will almost certainly fail precisely as the elaborate paper exercises did in the case of Castro. The dirty secret in contemporary Venezuela's case is that Chavez is working for the economic integration of the region, an integration long earnestly desired by big capital in Washington and New York, but unachievable under overt US command. Hence Chavez's survival. The Guardian recently ran an unusually good piece arguing just this.

I don't buy the notion that the US ruling class had a monolithic interest in maintaining

Fidel Castro as a bogeyman.

Mr. George Bush of the CIA owned oil exploration rigs off the coast of Florida.

In the '80's, Mr. George Bush of the CIA was the Vice President, and also the

Action Officer for the Nicaraguan Contra supply network. The Contra supply

network smuggled guns and drugs.

I can't say for sure that Mr. George Bush of the CIA was smuggling drugs

onto his drilling facilities (and then having the drugs boated ashore with no

customs check) in 1963, but given his later career in Contra drug smuggling

it is a reasonable speculation.

So, wouldn't it have been easier and more profitable for Mr. George Bush

of the CIA to have had a friendly government right next to his oil rigs instead

of a US Naval blockade?

I think Santo Trafficante had a very powerful preppy ally in all his deeds...

Neither Yankee nor Cowboy (or Yankee gone Cowboy), Mr. George Bush of the CIA

had more to gain personally from a Castro overthrow than just about anybody, I'd

reckon.

One final point: I ain't pushing anything with Mr Gray. On the subject of the medical evidence, I'm essentially on your side. Ashton and I will doubtless cross swords on that topic in due course. I meant what I said: I thought the exchanges between you and Ashton on the subject of Cuba were, and are, vitally important. And I thought Ashton bang on the money here.

Stay sober and virtuous,

Paul

Be well, good sir!

Here's Z335:

Please note that Jackie appears to be looking at her husband's

face. Her hand went right to the spot at the right-rear where the

wound has been described. Please note the curvature of her forearm,

wrist, and hand at the right back of JFK's head.

Here's Z337:

Please note that Jackie managed to lift her elbow off the seat and straighten her

arm/wrist/hand without pushing JFK's head forward.

That indicates to me that her finger-tips were going into the wound.

She described what we see in these frames thusly in her WC testimony, in a

passage the WC deleted:

Jackie K:

"I was trying to hold his hair on. But from the front there was nothing. I

suppose there must have been, but from the back you could see, you know,

you were trying to hold his hair on, and his skull on."

The witness testimony and photographic record agree, with the exception

of two (2) faked autopsy photos and the mysterious 6.5mm x-ray frag.

According to your scenario, there wasn't one witness with his wits about himself in

Dealey Plaza, Parkland and Bethesda -- or they were all liars.

Witness bashing is de rigueur among Parlor Gamers.