Jim Glover

Wow, I didn't know about all these back doors... amazing how much has been ignored and forgotten and this was from 64. thanks eyour wecome jim, yes the fire dept took in search ights up to the 6th floor, all they had were single bulbs hanging from the ceiling at that time...also you might be interested in this info, there were 4 separate doors exiting the tsbd ...take care...b The Other Witnesses By George and Patricia Nash The New Leader, 12 October 1964, pages 6–9 <P class=yiv832301038yiv1869975492MsoNormal> <P class=yiv832301038yiv1869975492MsoNormal> The Report mentions that “the front door” and “the rear door” of the Depository were guarded from about six minutes after the shooting. What it omits, however, is that there were four separate “rear doors,” all of which were open and only one of which was guarded. There are two loading platforms, a customer’s door and a rail entry. No one guarding any of these doors could see any of the others. This conceivably might be relevant to a question of whether Oswald acted alone. As Shelley told us, “Any one of a thousand different people could have entered or left the building and nobody would have known it.” http://www.kenrahn.com/jfk/history/wc_period/reactions_to_warren_report/support_from_center/The_other_witnesses--Nashes.html

Bernice, Amazing how fast the Warren Commission immediately left the revelation of Phony SS men at the scene like it never happened. If there needs to be a smoking gun, the Warren Commission is one. Thanks

Thanks Bernice... interesting photo of the Fire Dept... Looks like some folks cut the power and pushed the fire alarm to help the cause of the coup. I forgot where I read recently that a witness also did see a couple men leave the back and there were civilians with phony Secret Service IDs as well.

Yes John, I never thought of that... a "basement". A real investigation would have found out who cut the power and where it was done.... I wonder if the power box was in the basement. I also think that a "civilian" hangin out near the rear when all the action was on the grassy knoll and railroad yard told to be a guard could also have been a lookout for the 2 men seen on the 6th floor.

Thanks Bernice I just read the account of officer Mooney who said the power to the Book Depository building was cut off before the elevator hit the 2nd floor. They also had to order search lights to see in the dark. This was right after he told a "civilian" to not let anyone in or out of the back door shipping dock.

Bernice, I tried to read it but I don't have permission and passwords but from what shows in your message, the complete line from the song Crucifixion is: "beneath the greatest love is a hurricane of hate, and God help the critic of the dawn".

Well Phil did say "Domestic", but he made sure to let me know that Hoover and the FBI were bad guys in this. Shortly after that the FBI (they said they were) came over asked about Phil... that was scary and to protect Phil I didn't mention a plot to kill President Kennedy to the FBI. But they could have told him anything to get Phil interested in finding out more. (setting us up like Oswald) Like workin with the Fair Play for Cuba Committee to find out more about the plot. My hunch is that it may have had something to do with the Air Force (DIA?) because he told me in 74 that he was working with an up and coming young general after I told him that some men came over to my apt in NYC and told me that Kissinger was paying him. But between 63 and 74 they played with us a lot because we knew too much and we were a risk to the coup being exposed. I was told once by a friend in high school before JFK, that the FBI told him they don't know what to do with me because I knew too many people... Well, they knew I knew Bush and it got me in trouble before I met Phil at the rooming house at Ohio State. Phil was angry and he disliked Kissenger and that is when he told me about the young Air Force general. I did not say this but Phil probably realized at that point the the Air Force general could be getting money approved from Kissinger. This was right after I talked with AJ Weberman at another apartment who picked me up at the airport, Phil was impressing me with Autopsy photos, a photo of General Walkers House and we smoked a couple of his real Cuban Cigars (he said they were) which of course he would not tell me how he got um. So Domestic Shomestic... whatever they told him was something for their own purposes at the time and the time could have been confusing even for the Military and Intell community. There was a Domestic Contacts Division too.... Maybe even a Domestic Division as DD in, was it Oswalds address book?

I did not know that and thanks for showing that, Bill. Phil would be the last person in the world to forget about JFK. He knew too much and gave as many hints as he thought he could get away with but he and I both knew that we could be killed like others were. Oswald also knew more than he could say because they threatened to kill his family according to his lover, Judith Baker. They also threatened her too, of course. Her story for me clears up the whole Oswald mystery. I can now imagine Oswald being told to not be seen anywhere outside during the hit where he could be phtographed and was why he was eating lunch in the lunch room during the shooting.

I did not know that and thanks for showing that, Bill. Phil would be the last person in the world to forget about JFK. He knew too much and gave as many hints as he thought he could get away with but he and I both knew that we could be killed like others were. Oswald also knew more than he could say because they threatened to kill his family according to his lover, Judith Baker. They also threatened her too, of course. Her story for me clears up the whole Oswald mystery. I can now imagine Oswald being told to not be seen anywhere outside during the hit where he could be phtographed and was why he was eating lunch in the lunch room during the shooting.

I did not know much about Senator Dodd. Did you know that Phil was working with the FPCC when he told me he was workin with National Security to find out about the plot to kill JFK? The FBI were the bad guys he told me and when I asked him "who in National security, the CIA?" he said something about "Kinda" but I remember the word "domestic". Last night, I read in Weberman's book that the assassins were in the "Domestic Operations Division". I wonder if their records are still around ...Probably destroyed long ago. Yes Phil has more clues in his songs... he told me in LA, after talking with Weberman ( it was him that picked me up at the airport) that his Billy Sol Estes song was a clue too and he wrote it before Dallas... I was even singin it in Florida on or near an Island in the Keys (Stock Island) only a few days before Dallas and I found a few years ago this was an arms smuggling point for the CIA guys. Did you know that Oswald told his lover that they were gonna kill JFK and he could not stop it because they would kill his family? He also told her to remember the name "Billy Sol" because that was the clue to the plot. Maybe I will come to Dallas again, if I won't get shot. I finally found the eye witness, Oswalds lover who came from Bradenton about 40 miles from where I live now and her story is the only one I have heard that makes sense and fits with everything I witnessed and was told. Check out the love affair videos http://hubpages.com/hub/John_F_Kennedy_Assassination_What_Really_Happened

Great song, Bill. I still get requests for Draft Dodger Rag and singing about it sure helped me resist the war with humor.

You seem to be covering up for Bush or was that a joke? I was told Kennedy would be killed, and while Phil Ochs was in Dealey, I was abducted and forced onto a shadow Hollywood Hootenanny tour Bus near Huntsville Texas. After a while in the late afternoon, we were told to close the window shades and not look out. We were at a small airport and David Ferrie got on after much moving around outside and sat down in front of me and asked "How's the trip"? He wanted to know why British Intelligence was asking about me... and soon he pointed to a man getting on the bus and asked me if I knew him. I didn't tell Ferrie that it was the man who wanted me to spy on my family in the early 50's in Willowick Ohio.. He would watch us play football in the Park and little Bush was too young to play with us bigger kids. I would not be Bush's spy and complained to my Grandma who called somebody important and we got in trouble, I even complained to my teachers at school... I found out we were labeled as "stooges" for the CPUSA and Fair game for this stuff. So Back on the Shadow Bus, Bush was sitting next to Hoover. I did not know it at the time but the Air Force was in the air ready to bomb Russia because Oswald, a US operative went on a mission to Russia as a phony Defector. So I imagine Hoover and Bush did not want to end the world, just cover up what they knew about the Coup. Dallas cops were also on the bus with the taller Oswald look alike in custody. After Bush and Hoover and others departed the Bus, I thought I would be killed... but I kept quiet knowing that what I witnessed would be important but I had to put the pieces together. I don't know what Bush knew exactly but he certainly was in the "loop" and the cover-up and his lying about every killing he was involved in was worse than the hired hit-men. You still haven't answered my question about Phil Ochs who you say got you interested in your research about JFK. You seem to be covering up some important stuff and how would you know about Bush's Loop in Texas and beyond... or were you trying to be clever? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Today this edit is sunday Dec. 30th, 2012 AJ’s reply to me was he wanted my address, I gave it to him but he seems to be hiding about the Phil Ochs Question. Also I learned from Judyth Baker that the guy who pointed out Bush to me on the bus was not the David Ferrie that Judyth knew and may have been an LA Cop and he had lots of freckles and the David Ferrie that Judyth knew had none. My Ferrie was in disguise.

Alan, You may not have seen my question on a recent thread about Oswald's address book where you mentioned "Odum" and "John Train". I asked: "Posted 19 June 2010 - 04:22 AM AJ, Did you not know that our friend Phil Ochs who went to Dealey as an observer, had the name for his other side, the side that had to kill Phil Ochs, was "John Train"? I wonder why you never talk about Phil. The man who picked me up at the airport in LA on my way to see Phil in 74 to get ready for the Midnight Special Show, was short and talked about the Hollywood connection and showed me a photo of a man driving a station wagon that picked up Oswald or his look a like. He had a long nose and in the photo, looking back out the drivers side window looked like he was using Man Tan because when I saw him on one of the shadow buses, just before he got off in Dallas with a group, one of whom told me JFK was going to be killed, he did not look like he had Man Tan on his face. Maybe he wanted to look Black in Dealey.... this friend of Phil's told me the drivers name was Odom or Odum and connected with the FBI. Are you the man who talked to me in LA about what I knew and about Phil?" ------------- You look like him so again would you please answer me, are you the man who talked to me in LA?

Good one Bill, A few years ago, I was looking at all the utubes of film during and after on the Grassy Knoll and I saw a man in a long brown coat with a long bulge on his left side he was looking and moving toward Elm and he did have a fedora hat, I think the brim was a little wider than the picture above but ...maybe I can find it again or maybe someone else can find it.... it was really strange for a large overcoat worn on that sunny afternoon. I thought it was from that day and there have been gatherings there since... I sure thought it was a real one from Nov 22, 63 though. If there was a secret FBI test on JFK's security that day, as I was told by an agent on Sunday on on the way back to California, there could have been FBI or other men working on the test operation that would pose as Secret Service to give the fake test part of the operation a genuine look...with false Secret Service agents.

AJ, Did you not know that our friend Phil Ochs who went to Dealey as an observer, had the name for his other side, the side that had to kill Phil Ochs, was "John Train"? I wonder why you never talk about Phil. The man who picked me up at the airport in LA on my way to see Phil in 74 to get ready for the Midnight Special Show, was short and talked about the Hollywood connection and showed me a photo of a man driving a station wagon that picked up Oswald or his look a like. He had a long nose and in the photo, looking back out the drivers side window looked like he was using Man Tan because when I saw him on one of the shadow buses, just before he got off in Dallas with a group, one of whom told me JFK was going to be killed, he did not look like he had Man Tan on his face. Maybe he wanted to look Black in Dealey.... this friend of Phil's told me the drivers name was Odom or Odum and connected with the FBI. Are you the man who talked to me in LA about what I knew and about Phil?

Yes, I saw his video he probably has a lot of them still up. Someone sent me a rare tape of Phil's set in Chicago. I was there also with Bob Gibson and Arlo. We joined him on a song or two. I probably have the tape stashed away somewhere but it would take me a while to dig it up and I don't want to do that now but it was at the Quiet Knight in Chicago where we were shootin pool in the back room after the first set with Phil and me playing Arlo and Bob Gibson.... I started in on Phil about sayin somethin about JFK and we talked a bit and he said to just stick around for his second set.... He said some general stuff, He may have told the story about goin to England and I was let down that he didn't get into anything heavy, but it wasn't until I listened to that tape a few years ago that I realized that was the only version of "One Way ticket home" where he does not sing about or name Elvis but "The golden Idol is the King and I was at his crowning", and it hit me that was Crucifixion from his view in Dallas and was his way of giving me a clue to his story in song so as to be safe. He even hints in Crucifixion "You know I predicted it, I knew he had to fall... how did it happen I hope his suffering was small, tell me every detail I've got to know it all and do you have a picture of the pain?". "Dance Dance Dance, teach us to be true" ....

Yes Bill, I never met Steve Sidoni and he emailed me about Phil Ochs who was a new subject for him a few years ago after he said his friend told him to look into Phil. I sent him the Dealey photos of Phil and lots of my story info and then he did his own story and found the History Channel segment from "The Men Who Killed Kennedy" I got the still frames from. I got mad because he goes way off on side conspiracies that where too much even for me, like when he told me that Phil was sending him messages and that he was psychic... anyway his latest video was that bin laden and Obama are the same person... and he was not kidding. He complains that the Feds are harassing him and following him, FBI, Black choppers and all but I had to tell him that they might be now as he seems to go way out there. I tried to get him to think about his credibility, but he must really believe all of what he says... and most folks must think what I say is way out there too. He is a good writer and his girlfriend somehow found the only photo of the Hollywood Hootenanny tour I have seen and it shows a few of us singers playing somewhere probably a college in the South with Gypsy Boots...without the Hairy Hoots in that photo. I wonder what you and others think of this video on the doctoring of the Zapruder film? http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/385.html

****************************************************** Phil also told about how he wrote Crucifixion about JFK WHILE HE WAS IN ENGLAND AND TALKED WITH SOME FOLKS WHO TOLD HIM THAT IT WAS AN ANCIENT SACRIFICIAL RITUAL TO KILL THE BEST! Which reminds me of where I read many years ago how the Dallas police found a religious pamphlet next to the Snipers nest that said something about the redemption of Jesus and other weird stuff.Jim Maybe Gary Mack could tell me. Was there any religious/occult material found near the "Sniper's Nest," as stated above? Kathy Hi Kathy, I would like to add that I read after I posted this above, the Religious leaflet was a "Jesus Saves" message and I think found by the chicken bones... weather the 5th or 5th floor I am not sure. Another thing about Phil's song "One way ticket home" is he sings about goin to the Theater and then on the plane and he can't wait to get home and watch TV and call friends on the phone. After some research of the Warren files a couple years ago I found that one of the witnesses in the theater saw a man who acted strange or scared when Oswald was being arrested, And I thought Man, maybe someone told Phil to go to the Texas Theater too. That was also where the usher Butch Burrows told me in 93 he saw them taken a taller Oswald look- a- like out the side door. a Dallas cop also stated in the Warren files as I recall that two Dallas Cops he knew went into the Theater but did not come out with the squad that had Lee Oswald arrested. This Blew my mind because at that time, I was kind of abducted and forced onto a 2nd shadow Hollywood Hootenanny Tour bus near Huntsville and later at a small airport is where the two Dallas cops with the 2nd Oswald in their custody got on with lots of suits and more mean looking characters including David Ferrie who asked me if I knew The man who was getting on at one point.. at the airport or just afterwards... it was George Bush SR. sitting next to Hoover. I recognized Bush from when he was with his son little George in Willowick Ohio when he was just gettin started in the oil Biz and I found out Dresser was the Family connected oil tool company he was connected to in Cleveland. That was around 53 or 54. The CIA (pre CIA in those days) were playing Spy games with my family I believe before I was Born. I found out from my uncle Ben that Dads first job as a life guard was at the big rich Country Club in North Columbus Ohio...and I found the founder of the club and Golf Course was Sam Bush, Prescott Bush's Father. I don't think I told Ferrie that I knew Bush... We both would be Dead I am sure. That day JFK got shot, I thought I would be next... a scary night and I would have done anything for a one way ticket home myself...but they knew I knew and where to find me so I just kept very quiet so I could make it home. I wonder if anyone could research if Tommy Gambino knew Phil Ochs. I read all about how Jimmy Hoffa, Carlos Marcello and Trafficante wanted JFK dead, but they couldn't have engineered what I witnessed and they sure couldn't cover it up. They did know before the hit that LBJ would get rid of Bobby and all their phones were tapped and even their lawyer Frank Ragano was being spied on. My suspicion is that one power never mentioned was the Mob's Banker, Meyer Lansky, and his mob had to have ties to Mossad. The hit not only saved the jobs of LBJ, Hoover but boosted the future of Bush and with JFK gone, Israel got what it wanted, the Bomb.

Jim, you don't by any chance mean Ed Sanders of the Fugs, do you? Ed's book on Manson was far superior to Bugliosi's. He actually did some deep investigative work - unlike Bugliosi who merely presented what he needed to present as a prosecutor... that is, a conviction didn't require deep background work. I bet Ed could write a better book on the assassination, too. sorry so late in responding ... sure it was ED from the Fugs. Speakin of Manson I picked him up hitch hiking in Topanga canyon on my way home... he was with 2 girls and he talked about bein in prison a lot and how the Beach Boys were helping him in the music biz.... I am glad I got home after I dropped them off somewhere on Topanga road... where that was I forget. I think it was around that time folks were scared about murders in the area and the rumor was it was "Bigfoot" killing people, but I never believed in the Big Foot legend.

Yes, I read the pages over 300 many years ago. Of course Half of it was blacked out. Woody Guthrie, Bob Dylan and Phil's names were mentioned in the beginning as I recall. The Director didn't like Folk Singers or anyone on the left and with CIA counter/intell they were looking for "moles" including anyone under Commie influence and that could be the Washington Post or JFK. Jim

I always wondered why after the Assassination, on a shadow bus from Texas back to LA, when I asked an agent sitting in front of me on Sunday the 24th "who shot Kennedy?" and he said they had a meeting with Hoover and it was a test on Kennedy's security that went wrong... when I asked him what agency he was with he said "NASA". I figured he has got to be kidding ....Then in Garrison's book he talks about some of Oswalds friends in New Orleans got Jobs with NASA. Then latley I hear the JFK offered cooperation with Russia on aspects of the space program and I also heard that NASA has its own security agency. Could this have somethin to do with the 4 or falling Leaves? From http://www.questia.com/googleScholar.qst?docId=5001392321 "indeed, in one particularly important respect, the president's cooperative policy was virtually a mirror image of his competitive one: its culmination was a proposal for a lunar landing. On September 20, 1963, in a speech before the United Nations (UN) General Assembly, Kennedy invited the USSR to join the United States in developing a joint expedition to the moon, the same mission he had justified two years earlier primarily on the basis of American-Soviet rivalry. As might be expected, this proposal was met with incredulity, if not alarm, by a number of U.S. officials, including many members of Congress. The president would spend what were to be the last two months of his life trying--not altogether successfully--to reconcile what many saw as a blatant contradiction in his policies."

Obama is already covering up something as petty as his chief of staff's phone conversations with Governor What' His Name of Illinois. Before he even takes office he's proving himself to be your typical stonewall-it establishment politician. (Is he afraid he might lose the election? Oh, wait, that's over, I guess it's time now to worry about reelection in 2012.) If Obama does anything about the JFK cover-up, it will be to keep the cover-up going. ________________________________________________ Ron Ecker for President! OK but I will continue the fight with or without you. As I just wrote. THOUGHTS ON THE SO-CALLED "WAR OF IDEAS" http://www.commondreams.org/view/2008/12/21 Frisbie Einstein December 22nd, 2008 3:41 am According to Adolph Hitler, a simple message delivered repeatedly will be believed eventually. I think the message of "all our problems are someone else's fault" has a strong basic appeal. I could be that the more false this message is, the stronger its appeal. This is the Big Lie. The Big Lie is back in the USA. Everything is the fault of the liberals, especially Bill Clinton. The current financial crisis is the fault of Bill Clinton. The Big Lie. How could anyone believe that, you say? Go to the beginning of this post and read it again. Another lie is that the US can only do good. Any bad things are mistakes and exceptions. Even many liberals believe that. ----------- Jim Glover December 22nd, 2008 9:58 am Yes, And my simple test, to judge if Obama keeps the same mind set that has ruined our future is if he allows his administration to keep up the old propaganda terms of War on this and War on that because "war of or on Ideas" glorifies WAR. When I sang outside the prison in Tampa a few years ago with fellow demonstrators fighting for freedom where we were demonstrating for the release of Sami Al Arian, I knew we were winning when I heard Rumsfield say the Day before.. "We are losing the propaganda War". The Good fight is not a "War" and that is why we will win!

Ron and Mark, Maybe you are right about Obama, but I will not give up anyway till I am gone.

Hello Pamela, Recently I have been emailing Gary Mack again at the 6th floor museum. We seem to have many disagreements and there are many important questions he can't answer but at least he has agreed with me to call for the opening of all the still secret files on the JFK case. I asked him about the "target Car" program that I saw. And I don't think it is fair to pull a stunt like that without also seeing the blood splatter from a shot from the knoll, and East of the bridge where witnesses including Jean Hill saw something, police immediately radioed to search that area. Also the storm drain. And since one of the 3 empty shells found had a dent on the mouth it was not in shape to even fire meaning that those shells could only fire 2 shots at the most... which explains why an agent told me on Sunday on a shadow tour bus back to LA from Texas that there was a meeting with Hoover and they decided it was not the Cubans but that a test on Kennedy's security went bad... a cover story at the time before Oswald was silenced and this agent might have even believed it and a decoy in the sixth floor window, since 2 men were up there probably fired 2 shots that missed on purpose as a test and left a dented shell to prove it was a test if it did go badly like it did. Anyway before we think we know all the answers and I certainly don't we need to call on president Obama to release all the files because the whole world will not trust him if he keeps the cover-up. When I asked Gary Mack why they did not test the same thing for a shot coming from an open Dal/Tex window his explanation was that Weisberg had already talked to people up there and they said nothing happened.... as if after the FBI was intimidating witnesses and Johnson gave the instructions to find Oswald the lone shooter, any employee would want to stick their neck out and still keep their job. Also the bullet or bullets probably 2 that hit JFK's head were exploding bullets or bullet that left many tiny fragments in JFK's scull on the ex-rays that lit up like stars in the night which would be impossible with a standard metal jacket bullet like the magic bullet. A shooter set back in a window in the Dal/Tex with a silencer and or a loud radio in line with the sixth floor book building window would keep any shots from being heard anyway and since Oswald was a patsy that would be arranged easily.... now the Blood splatter beside the motorcycle cops also hit the windshield of the follow up car. All the medical evidence contradicts the magic bullet theory including the fact that the wound in JFK's back did not exit at all according to the testimony of FBI Sibert and O'neal who watched the autopsy. Maybe Files is right but that program "Target Car" was a stunt that left out a million contradictions and it also claims that most of the blood splatter went to the front but I have not seen any evidence of that yet just them saying so. Yes the coverup is still on with more stunts in place of opening all the hidden files and a new investigation of the cover-up. The more I see of the coverup the more I want to keep goin.