Terry Mauro

Please don't feed the trolls. Ashton Well, good line Ashton. But what exactly are you saying? 1) You were responding to a rhetorical question asked to me, simply for effect, by a person who knows well that I don't respond to his asinine trolling at all. 2) If I ever want to say you are "a CIA apologist," you won't have to ask anybody else whether I did or not. Trust me. 3) You were asking the resident CIA apologist, who by his rhetorical question, of course, was making the case that he is not. On that subject, here is just one quote of note (and you can do any more research on this point yourself if you choose): It just warms my heart. How about yours? Ashton Oh, sorry Ashton. I read too much into the context. Thanks for clarifying. >"Having recently read McCloy's HSCA testimony, along with much of the Executive Session testimony, >I must admit I now believe that McCloy and Dulles were both committed patriots trying to do a good job." "It just warms my heart. How about yours? Ashton" Oh... Oh dear. Oh good lord. Ok, so back to Eisenhower, I feel that he may not have been above taking a few favors, like those John described (and needless to say Johnson was a lying thug), and letting the spooks go way too far. But he didn't grasp the true scope and depths of the evil he was dealing with in terms of Nixon, Dulles brothers, CIA, Prescott Bush, etc. And the U-2 episode was the eye-opener, but it was too late. Anyone agree, disagree? ********************************************************** "But he didn't grasp the true scope and depths of the evil he was dealing with in terms of Nixon, Dulles brothers, CIA, Prescott Bush, etc. And the U-2 episode was the eye-opener, but it was too late." But, he apparently did in his final State Of The Union Address, where he warned America and the in-coming Kennedy administration of the Military Industrial Complex. His presidential veto had largely been ignored and overruled by the Chiefs of Staff, and after turning the keys of the White House over to Kennedy, in so many words, advised him to watch his back with regard to the Bay of Pigs operation. This is from the book of William Manchester's, "One Brief Shining Moment." Eisenhower was a West Point career military man, like MacArthur, and the American people trusted him and needed him to be their leader in the decade following WW II. The 50's have often been touted as the most prosperous for the U.S. industrially, with that proverbial "chicken in every pot" everyone longed for during the Great Depression years of the 1930's. Well, that almost became a reality for everyone. FDR's New Deal no doubt helped pave the path for the stability and certainly for the burgeoning middle-class that blossomed during the halcyon days of the 50's and early 60's.

This forum is also about connecting dots Richard. The dots go back at least to 1933-FDR's presidency, when nazi Prescott Bush (father of one of JFK's murderers), and his American Liberty League, tried to murder FDR and wage a military coup (thwarted by Marine General Smedley D. Butler--genuine 'mercan hero) to oust the US government. The Bushes have been waging war on elected presidents, committing treason, and stealing elections ever since. There is not one presidency since FDR's that has not been contaminated by the Bush Crime Family and the Dulles brother's CIA. The events of Nov 22, 1963--when they finally succeeded in a coup--created the situation we are currently in wherein yet another Bush is having their fascist way with the world. I personally am much more interested in the big picture than in which cowardly thug hid behind a...bush...to wack President Kennedy (what you presumably consider "sticking to the point"). I want to know who was in the ruling class was that hired the shooters. Nov 22, 1963 did not happen in a vacuum. This is a huge consipiracy and cover-up spanning decades. If you dont or wont see that I wonder what you'd get out of this forum. *************************************************************** "This forum is also about connecting dots Richard. The dots go back at least to 1933-FDR's presidency, when nazi Prescott Bush (father of one of JFK's murderers), and his American Liberty League, tried to murder FDR and wage a military coup (thwarted by Marine General Smedley D. Butler--genuine 'mercan hero) to oust the US government. The Bushes have been waging war on elected presidents, committing treason, and stealing elections ever since. There is not one presidency since FDR's that has not been contaminated by the Bush Crime Family and the Dulles brother's CIA. The events of Nov 22, 1963--when they finally succeeded in a coup--created the situation we are currently in wherein yet another Bush is having their fascist way with the world. I personally am much more interested in the big picture than in which cowardly thug hid behind a...bush...to wack President Kennedy (what you presumably consider "sticking to the point"). I want to know who was in the ruling class was that hired the shooters. Nov 22, 1963 did not happen in a vacuum. This is a huge consipiracy and cover-up spanning decades. If you dont or wont see that I wonder what you'd get out of this forum." YESSSS!!! And, that's an "atta boy," for you, Myra!

For starters, you should consider reading some books on the subject... For starters, I'd recommend "Breach of Trust" by Gerald McKnight. This will help give perspective on what the Warren Commission was really chartered to do. I'll give you a hint, though. It wasn't to "solve the case." But now, some questions for you: There have been two government "investigations" into the JFK. One said LHO acted alone, a second one indicated that LHO was involved, but there was substantial evidence of conspiracy. Which one got it right? Both? Neither? Like I said,show me the proof. Secondly, if you've got it all figured out, why are you here? The Warren Report has stood the test of time! I didn't figure it out,the CIA,FBI,Dallas police,and the Warren Commission figured it out. ******************************************************* "My posts are ridiculous!" Yes they are, numbnuts. "The Warren Report has stood the test of time! I didn't figure it out,the CIA,FBI,Dallas police,and the Warren Commission figured it out." It's a xxxxx-call Alert and another CLYDE AWARD

*************************************************************** Maybe, this news is the forecast of what's to come: the dismantling of McCloy's oil lobby debacle FOCUS | Democrats Aim to Repeal Tax Breaks for Big Oil http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/111906X.shtml House Democrats are targeting billions of dollars in oil company tax breaks for quick repeal next year. Incoming House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, in an outline of priorities over the first 100 hours of the next Congress in January, promises to begin a move toward greater energy independence "by rolling back the multibillion dollar subsidies for Big Oil."

Thanks for the info, Bill. Personally, I don't see a damned syllable anywhere in the Constitution—or on back of it, for that matter—that grants anyone an authority on any grounds to withhold the fact of existence of any document, anywhere, at any time, produced by a paid and accountable servant of the citizens of the United States. The entire relationship of citizens to public servants has been completely inverted since at least 1913, and I for one am of the opinion that it's about time it got turned right-side-up again. First step, I guess, would be to get them stop sucking at the public teat long enough to answer a question. Ashton Correction, not National Register - Federal Register. I was going to post an example of an ARRB announcement on releases and postponements, but we were attacked and I take the assault personally. Here's the example, and note particularly those docs with held in 1998 that were slated for release between then and 2006. We have to list those docs, request them again, and ensure they are in fact available as they should be. Since the ARRB and the NARA seem to be disinclined about furnishing any lists of with held docs, the index of the daily Federal Register must be reviewed for inclusions of all ARRB notices. Anybody got some spare time? BK xxxxx Federal Register: September 30, 1998 (Volume 63, Number 189)] [Notices] [Page 52236-52237] From the Federal Register Online via GPO Access [wais.access.gpo.gov] [DOCID:fr30se98-40] ======================================================================= ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ASSASSINATION RECORDS REVIEW BOARD Formal Determinations, Additional Releases and Corrections AGENCY: Assassination Records Review Board. ACTION: Notice. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- SUMMARY: The Assassination Records Review Board (Review Board) met in closed meetings on September 9, 1998 and September 14, 1998, and made formal determinations on the release of records under the President John F. Kennedy Assassination Records Collection Act of 1992 (JFK Act). By issuing this notice, the Review Board complies with the section of the JFK Act that requires the Review Board to publish the results of its decisions in the Federal Register within 14 days of the date of the decision. FOR FURTHER INFORMATION CONTACT: Peter Voth, Assassination Records Review Board, Second Floor, Washington, DC 20530, (202) 724-0088, fax (202) 724-0457. The public may obtain an electronic copy of the complete document-by-document determinations by contacting <Eileen__Sullivan@jfk-arrb.gov>. SUPPLEMENTARY INFORMATION: This notice complies with the requirements of the President John F. Kennedy Assassination Records Collection Act of 1992, 44 U.S.C. 2107.9©(4)(A) (1992). On September 9, 1998, the Review Board made formal determinations on records it reviewed under the JFK Act. Notice of Formal Determinations 20 Church Committee Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 6 CIA Documents: Postponed in Part until 05/2001 391 CIA Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 7 DOJ Documents: Open in Full 1 DOJ Document: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 679 FBI Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 29 JCS Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 1 JFK Library Document: Postponed in Full until 10/2017 1 LBJ Library Document: Postponed in Full until 10/2017 1 NARA Document: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 1 Office of the Secretary of Defense Document: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 1 Pike Committee Document: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 2 US ARMY (Califano) Documents: Open in Full 1 US ARMY (Califano) Document: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 228 US ARMY (IRR) Documents: Open in Full 166 US ARMY (IRR) Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 The Review Board also determined that the following records are not believed relevant to the JFK assassination: CIA Document 104-10079-10281 LBJ Library Documents 177-10001-10277 177-10001-10279 177-10001-10280 US ARMY (IRR) Documents 194-10010-10376 194-10012-10001 194-10012-10002 194-10012-10003 194-10012-10004 194-10012-10005 194-10012-10006 194-10012-10007 194-10012-10009 194-10012-10010 194-10012-10011 194-10012-10040 194-10012-10137 194-10012-10138 194-10012-10139 Notice of Other Releases After consultation with appropriate Federal agencies, the Review Board announces that documents from the following agencies are now being opened in full: 12 Church Committee documents; 7 JCS documents; 3 JFK Library documents; 1 LBJ Library document; 2 NSA documents; 203 U.S. Army (IRR) documents. On September 14, 1998, the Review Board made formal determinations on records it reviewed under the JFK Act. Notice of Formal Determinations 16 CIA Documents: Postponed in Part until 05/2001 16 CIA Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/1999 246 CIA Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 9 DOJ Documents: Open in Full 8 DOJ Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 224 FBI Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 1 HSCA Document: Open in Full 1 HSCA Document: Postponed in Part until 05/2001 3 HSCA Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/1999 2 HSCA Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2003 15 HSCA Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 105 NSA Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 18 PFIAB Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 3 US ARMY (IRR) Documents: Open in Full 139 US ARMY (IRR) Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 Notice of Other Releases After consultation with appropriate Federal agencies, the Review Board announces that documents from the following agencies are now being opened in full: 2 Church Committee documents; 39 U.S. Army (IRR) documents. Notice of Corrections On August 6, 1998 the Review Board made formal determinations that were published in the August 24, 1998 Federal Register (FR 98-22482, 63 FR 12345). The following documents were declared to be not believed relevant to the Kennedy Assassination: US ARMY (IRR) Documents: 194-10001-10323 194-10001-10415 194-10001-10417 194-10001-10421 On August 25, 1998 the Review Board made formal determinations that were published in the September 15, 1998 Federal Register (FR 98-24741, 63 FR 12345). For that Notice, please make the following corrections: Previously Published Notice of Other Releases 105 Church Committee documents. [[Page 52237]] Corrected Data Notice of Other Releases 104 Church Committee documents. Dated: September 22, 1998. Laura A. Denk, Executive Director. [FR Doc. 98-26086 Filed 9-29-98; 8:45 am] BILLING CODE 6118-01-P ************************************************************ Notice of Formal Determinations 20 Church Committee Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 6 CIA Documents: Postponed in Part until 05/2001 391 CIA Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 7 DOJ Documents: Open in Full 1 DOJ Document: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 679 FBI Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 29 JCS Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 1 JFK Library Document: Postponed in Full until 10/2017 1 LBJ Library Document: Postponed in Full until 10/2017 1 NARA Document: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 1 Office of the Secretary of Defense Document: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 1 Pike Committee Document: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 2 US ARMY (Califano) Documents: Open in Full 1 US ARMY (Califano) Document: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 228 US ARMY (IRR) Documents: Open in Full 166 US ARMY (IRR) Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 ____________________________________________________ Notice of Formal Determinations 16 CIA Documents: Postponed in Part until 05/2001 16 CIA Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/1999 246 CIA Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 9 DOJ Documents: Open in Full 8 DOJ Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 224 FBI Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 1 HSCA Document: Open in Full 1 HSCA Document: Postponed in Part until 05/2001 3 HSCA Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/1999 2 HSCA Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2003 15 HSCA Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 105 NSA Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 18 PFIAB Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 3 US ARMY (IRR) Documents: Open in Full 139 US ARMY (IRR) Documents: Postponed in Part until 10/2017 Bill, can you tell me if you know why the year 2017 is significant to the release of these docs, if at all? Besides that, it's my understanding that the information Jackie Kennedy stated she would allow to be put in the public record, fifty years after JFK's death, which would've put that at around the year 2013, has been postponed to the year 2038. I'll be 93 years old, if I live that long. What good can possibly come of it, if we're all dead and buried by that time?

I'm quoting myself here only because I inadvertently omitted an important point: Archbishop Colby's overwhelming divine inspiration for CIA confessionals came only, of course, after his cult-bretheren, Richard Helms and Sidney Gottlieb, had destroyed the evidence of all the sins they really wanted hidden, and then almost immediately had gone up in the Rapture. (Wait: no, Helms had been given a cushy ambassadorship on the other side of the world, and Gottlieb had "retired" with a fat pension right after they destroyed the CIA records at the end of 1972-beginning of 1973. Well, okay: they'd gone up in the Rapture.) I can't think of any more propitious moment for a sudden inspiration of "let's all hold hands and confess." "Kumbaya, my Lord. Kumbaya." (Okay, put down the iron: I'll stop singing.) Ashton Once again, you're citing made-up facts to suit your own bizarre scenario. It fits into your own little world-view that Colby ordered the creation of the family jewels, so you state it as a fact, even though the admitted facts by ALL involved is that Schlesinger, a Nixon loyalist, ordered the creation of the family jewels, so that he (and Nixon, obviously) could know what the CIA had been up to during the Kennedy and Johnson years. Based on everything we KNOW about Nixon, it seems likely he was looking for leverage on the CIA--after all, they refused to bail him out of Watergate and may have even (according to Colson's theory) orchestrated it. Was it a coincidence then that the family jewels remained safe until Nixon's downfall, and that they then were leaked to the press, and that this led to subsequent investigations? Was it a coincidence then that Helms was revealed as a perjurer, as a result of these leaks, and as a result of Colby's testimony? And isn't it ironic that the lies Helms told were lies designed to protect NIXON, of all people, and that the media paid as much attention to Helms' lying as they did to Nixon and Kissinger's acts against Allende? Isn't it likely that Nixon was behind the creation and exposure of the jewels, including MKULTRA? Or do you see Nixon hobbling off to San Clemente, with no thoughts of revenge? ************************************************************** "Schlesinger, a Nixon loyalist, ordered the creation of the family jewels, so that he (and Nixon, obviously) could know what the CIA had been up to during the Kennedy and Johnson years. Based on everything we KNOW about Nixon, it seems likely he was looking for leverage on the CIA--after all, they refused to bail him out of Watergate and may have even (according to Colson's theory) orchestrated it." Nixon [a Quaker], as well as any other common citizen, lacking in aristocratic, elite bloodlines or connections, was a witting stooge in his paranoid attempt to keep tabs on the CIA. He was a witting puppet to the regime that orchestrated his election for their supreme opportunitistic agendas [with reference to Watergate, as well as the subsequent disposal of Allende, to name a few]. The same scenario with Reagan [an actor], another stooge, albeit unwitting, whose "Great Communicator" handle was created by the same aristocratic elitist establishment for the expressed purpose of deluding the dumb citizenry into believing that the hostages were being set free, and the Berlin Wall was coming down because some old doddering cowboy "image" was talking "tough" to these "rotten commie bastards." Nixon's fatal mistake was in believing [idealistically] that he could possibly "outwit" the CIA at their own game, thus justifying any underhanded maneuvers he may have had to employ as an excuse for having to fight "fire with fire." He ended up being assassinated in the characteristic sense of the word. Reagan ended up literally "asleep at the wheel" as it became more apparent at who was really running the office [Donald Regan, Casper Weingarten, George Schultz, and Howard Baker]. I considered Reagan's Vice President, lacking in intelligence, though admittedly, not to the extent of his son, G.W., and actually of no great consequence compared to the other "players" in Reagan's administration. And, G.H.W. and G.W. pale in comparison to Prescott. So, there you have it. If your granddad, or your great-granddad cannot be counted among the American blue-bloods, you're nothing more than a utilitarian object or tool, to be used in the scheme of things catering to the whims of the upper 5 to 10 percentile. And, you can bring up all the little details, the dirty laundry, and what have you, but in the end, the facts remain the same. The "winners" aka Eastern Establishment [Yale, Wall Street, Morgan-Chase] always win, the "losers" aka plebes [LBJ, Nixon, Carter, Clinton, Gore] always end up losing. Ain't it great to be alive? Happy Thanksgiving Week.

Ashton P.S. Forgive the smiley abuse. I cannot convey how long and loudly I laughed, but I think I scared the neighbor's cat. ***************************************************** "P.S. Forgive the smiley abuse. I cannot convey how long and loudly I laughed, but I think I scared the neighbor's cat." That statement left me in stitches. Thanks for reminding me to catch up before I head to Austin.

The ultimate Iran-y, of course, was that Reagan ordered the invasion of Grenada to cover his retreat from Lebanon. I'd been skeptical that the move into Grenada was so calculated until reading Maggie Thatcher's memoirs. She claimed that Reagan invaded Grenada, a British protectorate, without even discussing it with her, and that the U.S. invasion was unnecessary. ************************************************************ "The ultimate Iran-y, of course, was that Reagan ordered the invasion of Grenada to cover his retreat from Lebanon." I was absolutely appalled when that ridiculous fiasco was going down! They carried on as if it were Pearl Harbor or something, those damned arm chair warriors! How embarrassing to have to claim to be an American after witnessing that total display of ineptitude. Grenada was about as threatening to the sovereignty of the United States as Jamaica, or Bermuda, or Nassau and the Bahamas, for chrissakes! Is that all the Reagan/Regan regime could muster up was to go and invade a resort town? Or, maybe the "Resorts International" front was somehow at risk, or in danger of losing most of its clientel from the in-coming spring-break cruise lines, what with the bad PR being aired on the newswires and all? What a bunch of worthless yahoos! ___________________________ Ha. There was a priceless New Yorker cartoon that showed an overblown General, presumably at home with spouse, in full uniform with a gazillion medals, holding a drink and posturing. His wife says to him: "you're insufferable after a 'big win.' Anyway, I realize that a heard melody is sweeter. But the Greneda thing was done to obfuscate matters involving the execution of some Castro associates, including someone named Maurice Bishop (no relation). Two birds, one stone; as usual. Thank you, Michael. I guess I really get pissed off by things that inadvertently equate me [as an American citizen] with asinine gov. strategies deployed in my name [as an American citizen], and with my tax dollars. Especially, when these strategies appear to me [as an American citizen] to be a complete exercise in banality, a comedy of errors, and a total embarrassment due to the waste of resources which could have been put to better use on projects here at home. ______________________ "Once again, Terry masters the art of understatement. I do admire her passion in every one of her posts. " ________________________ What the heck...I'd probably admire her passion without the posts (you can tell it's a Friday). JG ******************************************************** "But the Greneda thing was done to obfuscate matters involving the execution of some Castro associates, including someone named Maurice Bishop (no relation). Two birds, one stone; as usual." Yeah, there they go with those damned "cut-outs" of theirs, again. Smoke and mirrors. Now you see 'em, now you don't. Masters of deception, as well as the masters of invention of "identity theft," as the term has been coined. There always seems to be a "double" popping up somewhere for the seemingly expressed purpose of "You can't put the blame on Mame, here." We've got 2 John Hulls [F. or L., take your pick], we've got 2 Maurice Bishops [well, how convenient!], and let's see, now who else can I think of... Just thought I throw this in for posterity. I believe the last verse is apropo: You Can't Always Get What You Want Lyrics by Rolling Stones [verse] I saw her today at a reception A glass of wine in her hand I knew she would meet her connection At her feet was her footloose man [chorus] No, you can't always get what you want You can't always get what you want You can't always get what you want And if you try sometime you find You get what you need Yeah, baby [verse] And I went down to the demonstration To get my fair share of abuse Singing, "We're gonna vent our frustration If we don't we're gonna blow a 50-amp fuse" Sing it to me now... [chorus] You can't always get what you want You can't always get what you want You can't always get what you want But if you try sometimes well you just might find You get what you need Oh baby, yeah, yeah! [verse] I went down to the Chelsea drugstore To get your prescription filled I was standing in line with Mr. Jimmy And man, did he look pretty ill We decided that we would have a soda My favorite flavor, cherry red I sung my song to Mr. Jimmy Yeah, and he said one word to me, and that was "dead" I said to him [chorus] You can't always get what you want, no! You can't always get what you want (tell ya baby) You can't always get what you want (no) But if you try sometimes you just might find You get what you need Oh yes! Truly. You get what you need--yeah, baby! [verse] I saw her today at the reception In her glass was a bleeding man She was practiced at the art of deception Well I could tell by her blood-stained hands [chorus] You can't always get what you want You can't always get what you want You can't always get what you want But if you try sometimes you just might find You just might find You get what you need [repeat chorus]

********************************************************** "they are proponents of "spyware"." Thanks for the warning. Like I really have the time to check it out, to begin with. Well, just thought I'd cruise by after re-newing my Norton subscription, always due in November. And, then on to finish gathering up my things for packing for my trip to Austin. Hey, Dawnie. I see you're up early this A.M. Let me just cruise another couple of threads, then I'm outta here.

****************************************************** Here's an update. Tonight, while driving home, the advertisement is aired again on FM. This time they've upgraded their pitch and changed the name from, a career in the Central Intelligence Agency, to a career in the "Clandestine Intelligence Association. An Agency." Same url cia.gov, though. I'd google it, but I haven't had the time or inclination to do so, as yet. Maybe this weekend. There's got to be a hitch.

I'm starting to think that MacArthur had good reason to be pissed: "The best book, in my opinion, to explode this myth is The Decision to Use the Bomb by Gar Alperovitz, because it not only explains the real reasons the bombs were dropped, but also gives a detailed history of how and why the myth was created that this slaughter of innocent civilians was justified, and therefore morally acceptable. ... Another startling fact about the military connection to the dropping of the bomb is the lack of knowledge on the part of General MacArthur about the existence of the bomb and whether it was to be dropped. Alperovitz states "MacArthur knew nothing about advance planning for the atomic bomb’s use until almost the last minute. Nor was he personally in the chain of command in this connection; the order came straight from Washington. Indeed, the War Department waited until five days before the bombing of Hiroshima even to notify MacArthur – the commanding general of the U.S. Army Forces in the Pacific – of the existence of the atomic bomb." --The Hiroshima Myth by John V. Denson, http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig2/denson7.html **************************************************************** "Another startling fact about the military connection to the dropping of the bomb is the lack of knowledge on the part of General MacArthur about the existence of the bomb and whether it was to be dropped. Alperovitz states "MacArthur knew nothing about advance planning for the atomic bomb’s use until almost the last minute. Nor was he personally in the chain of command in this connection; the order came straight from Washington. Indeed, the War Department waited until five days before the bombing of Hiroshima even to notify MacArthur – the commanding general of the U.S. Army Forces in the Pacific – of the existence of the atomic bomb." --The Hiroshima Myth by John V. Denson," I'm just speculating here, but considering that MacArthur was a career warrior, possibly a 20th Century "Caesar," if you will, due to his affinity for strategic acumen. Therefore, I would venture to guess that the War Department was less than forthcoming with MacArthur regarding their plans for Hiroshima and Nagasaki because they knew MacArther would accuse them of wholesale slaughter for attacking the civilian quarter. In all probability he would have accused them of cowardice for not fighting fairly, hand to hand, and made his objections known well ahead of time, which more than likely might have thwarted the plans.

************************************************************* "Anyone else think Truman one of the worst presidents, ever?" My Dad, rest his soul. He was a Democrat before [as he used to complain] FDR pulled MacArthur from the Asian theatre just as he was positioning to take North Korea under the U.S. flag. After that egregious error [in my Dad's opinion] in strategic military/political maneuvering, he voted Republican, right or wrong. Although, he did agree with some of Kennedy's policies and often referred to him as a "conservative liberal," or a "conservative democrat," which seemed like a contradiction in terms to me, at the time. I was 15 to 18 years of age, during Kennedy's term in office. "he: Started the Cold War (which is the tie in to President Kennedy), hatched the CIA, and oversaw the creation of the World Bank." I was under the impression that it was Winston Churchill who helped create the climate of the "Cold War" by terming the Russian occupied territories as "The Iron Curtain." Remember, Russia had been part of the Allied Forces helping to liberate Europe from German occupation. The spoils of war were divided up by the conquering forces on both sides of the battle lines. "Was Truman just clueless or was he well meaning but deluded?" Probably a little of both. Stepping in behind four terms of FDR's office would seem to be a daunting exercise for anyone to be presented with, let alone be left to implement its policies, both domestic and foreign.

************************************************************ "Why don't you send them a resume. Can you imagine? Scary thought...." I'd rather send my resume to Castro before I'd ever send anything to those assholes, and their damned "Company."

I was just wondering if any other folks out there across the vast wasteland of the continental U.S. of A. have heard a commercial on their radio stations being aired by the C.I.A. in a similar vein as The Army and Marine Corp visuals being shown on commercial TV. They're geared along those same lines, encouraging people to join the C.I.A. for a career in "intelligence," as if it were some trade school trying to pass itself off for a college. i.e. I.T.T. or DeVry. They tell you to log on to cia.gov if you're looking for a career with the U.S. government. Since when has the C.I.A. started to recruit from the blue-collar droves? I thought that's what they sent G. Gordon Liddy out on the Ivy League circuit for? To recruit from the supposedly brightest of the elites. The only time I can remember EVER seeing an advertisement for recruitment was back in 1989, in the classified section of the LA Times, and that was a really small ad which required a B.S. degree, if I remember correctly. The only reason I can think of might be to beef up The Homeland Security Force, or might it be to use these "new" recruits as "expendible" moles?

Once again, Terry masters the art of understatement. I do admire her passion in every one of her posts. **************************************************** Thank you, Michael. I guess I really get pissed off by things that inadvertently equate me [as an American citizen] with asinine gov. strategies deployed in my name [as an American citizen], and with my tax dollars. Especially, when these strategies appear to me [as an American citizen] to be a complete exercise in banality, a comedy of errors, and a total embarrassment due to the waste of resources which could have been put to better use on projects here at home.

And how you gonna turn off this generations possible rebels? easy, diagnosis, ADHD, cure? Ritalin,over two million US schoolkids are now talking this poison (side effects, depression, suicide, aggressive behaviour inability to consentrate) one girl was prescribed after being asked "Do you find yourself daydreaming" any teenager who answered no to that question needs help. Lets call it unmanufacturing dissent ******************************************************* Yeah, and as they used to say back then, "Right on!" Myra and Stephen. But, Myra hit it "Right on!" earlier up in her post with reference to The Tavistock Institute, out of the U.K. Remember the movie "A Clockwork Orange?" The sequence where Malcolm MacDowell was sent to be "de-programmed" for his evil, murderous ways? Come to find out it was filmed in those hallowed halls, as well. So, it's my opinion that institutes of elitist, higher-learning, etc., and blah, blah, blah, seem to invest alot of time and energy into "shaping," "molding," "creating," the exact replicates of what they believe to be the "status quo" necessary to run "their" show, which they feel truly belongs to "them" because of all the "money" they've invested into "shaping," "molding," "creating," the laws of the "land," "world," aka "global," economy to suit "their" needs. Not to mention that most of the "money" they believe they've "invested" is actually derived from the trillions of tax dollars they've manage to bilk [via tax-diverted loopholes] from the "plebes" or subjects who make up the majority in this world, and who'll never be able to afford to set foot in one of their institutes of higher learning. Thus, ensuring that the wealth of the world continue to be controlled and in the hands of that "chosen" five or ten percentile. Well, how do they manage to get away with that? Very easily, by controlling as much information being distributed as they possibly can, be it via schoolbooks, education, the media aparatus, and most insidiously [as my friend Stephen has pointed out] by drugs. All employing the psycho-technology researched in their hallowed [there's that word, again] ivy halls, such as Harvard, MIT, and Tavistock which I'm certain is just as aligned with the Oxford-Cambridge community as its American counterparts are aligned with the NIH, and vice-versa. Oh, and one more thing. If you believe that those scholarships awarded to some of the "smarter" plebes don't come with any strings attached? Be aware that those "gifted" children are the first to be snatched up by those hallowed, ivy halls, long before they ever get a chance to graduate from high-school. They're selected via the yearly monitoring of their SAT scores, K1-12. Hi Ho! Hi Ho! It's off to work this "plebe" will go... Hey, Ter how are you, tell you how its going down, come the revolution lets make all the little piggies take their own poison, see how they like the trip.....Just call me Dr Feelgood *************************************************************8 When I was working in San Francisco in 1966, I met this guy from England [Danny], who was traveling through CA on a visa via Mexico. We hung out together, and one night we went back to his "flat," where he showed me his graduate papers from Cambridge University in the U.K., or G.B. as it was referred to back then. He said he was working for a guy, with a name that sounded like, "Oslete" [those British accents always throw me]. He then proceeded to show me these ampules of pale blue liquid, about eight or ten of them, that he kept in this case lined with black velvet that had these little elastic bands to hold them in place. His kept his Cambridge diploma, or document, and papers in the pocket behind this false bottom or panel, that held the ampules securely cushioned. He left San Francisco on, or around the 18th of September. Through reading The Chronicle, I came to find out that September 18th, 1966 was the day a law was being enacted to outlaw the sale and distribution of "acid" [lysergic acid diethylamide] in the Bay Area. Later on, when I went back to NY, I saw the correct spelling of Owsley's name and realized the implications of what I had witnessed that summer evening in San Francisco.

******************************************************* "Yes, MIT and Harvard are within walking distance from each other." I'm not readily equating Harvard Law School with what goes on in their university's clinical research departments, Hon. I'm merely relating what is common knowledge with regard to the "psy-ops" programs that go on under the umbrella of "research and development." Heaven knows how well JFK, and RFK learned their lessons at Harvard Law, as well as yourself, Dawnie. Talk to you tonight, after work. Ter

And how you gonna turn off this generations possible rebels? easy, diagnosis, ADHD, cure? Ritalin,over two million US schoolkids are now talking this poison (side effects, depression, suicide, aggressive behaviour inability to consentrate) one girl was prescribed after being asked "Do you find yourself daydreaming" any teenager who answered no to that question needs help. Lets call it unmanufacturing dissent ******************************************************* Yeah, and as they used to say back then, "Right on!" Myra and Stephen. But, Myra hit it "Right on!" earlier up in her post with reference to The Tavistock Institute, out of the U.K. Remember the movie "A Clockwork Orange?" The sequence where Malcolm MacDowell was sent to be "de-programmed" for his evil, murderous ways? Come to find out it was filmed in those hallowed halls, as well. So, it's my opinion that institutes of elitist, higher-learning, etc., and blah, blah, blah, seem to invest alot of time and energy into "shaping," "molding," "creating," the exact replicates of what they believe to be the "status quo" necessary to run "their" show, which they feel truly belongs to "them" because of all the "money" they've invested into "shaping," "molding," "creating," the laws of the "land," "world," aka "global," economy to suit "their" needs. Not to mention that most of the "money" they believe they've "invested" is actually derived from the trillions of tax dollars they've manage to bilk [via tax-diverted loopholes] from the "plebes" or subjects who make up the majority in this world, and who'll never be able to afford to set foot in one of their institutes of higher learning. Thus, ensuring that the wealth of the world continue to be controlled and in the hands of that "chosen" five or ten percentile. Well, how do they manage to get away with that? Very easily, by controlling as much information being distributed as they possibly can, be it via schoolbooks, education, the media aparatus, and most insidiously [as my friend Stephen has pointed out] by drugs. All employing the psycho-technology researched in their hallowed [there's that word, again] ivy halls, such as Harvard, MIT, and Tavistock which I'm certain is just as aligned with the Oxford-Cambridge community as its American counterparts are aligned with the NIH, and vice-versa. Oh, and one more thing. If you believe that those scholarships awarded to some of the "smarter" plebes don't come with any strings attached? Be aware that those "gifted" children are the first to be snatched up by those hallowed, ivy halls, long before they ever get a chance to graduate from high-school. They're selected via the yearly monitoring of their SAT scores, K1-12. Hi Ho! Hi Ho! It's off to work this "plebe" will go...

Sorry, duplicate post. Deleted by TM

************************************************************ "The CIA Meets MIT Several decades ago, the CIA decided to establish an office in Cambridge near the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. They rented out a space in Technology Square, in the same building as the Laboratory for Computer Science, and set themselves up as the Charles I. Andersen Music Company. Now, MIT students are no idiots, and it took them all of five minutes to figure out just what kind of music company would set up offices in Tech Square. MIT students, especially hackers, are well-known for their sense of humor, and this was just too choice a target to pass up. http://everything2.com/index.pl?node_id=11...p;lastnode_id=0 "Web editor's note: Max F. Millikan was an economics professor at Massachusetts Institute of Technology during the 1950s. From 1951-52 he took a leave of absence to serve as assistant CIA director. Upon returning he became director of MIT's Center for International Studies, which was funded by the CIA and Ford Foundation." http://www.cia-on-campus.org/mit.edu/max.html "MIT alumni formerly in the American public service include Secretary of Defense Les Aspin (Ph.D XIV '66), former Director of the CIA John M. Deutch (Ph.D V '66),"... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massachusetts...e_of_Technology Well, look at it from this P.O.V., my friend. Harvard University, with the labs that spawned the likes of Ken Kesey, Tim Leary, and their "Kool-Aide Acid Test" experiments. Oh, and let's not forget Ted "The Unibomber" Kozinsky, another product of what might be expected to "accidently" merge into the mainstream of American life from those "ivy halls," as well? They're not too far away from one another. Harvard and MIT, I mean. Like a couple of miles away. They're both situated right on the Charles River, with MIT on one side wedged parallel between Memorial Drive and Vassar Street, and Harvard on the other side, a little further up the river where it bends alongside Soldier's Field Road, rounding the campus on three sides. Just a thought. http://www.mapquest.com/maps/map.adp?searc...p;zipcode=#west

I don't dispute that Ford was a Hoover ally, and that he reported the Commission's activities to the FBI (Russell did as well). I merely dispute that Ford knew the back wound was on the back and not at the base of the neck, as depicted in the Rydberg drawings. I've looked and I've found nothing to indicate Ford knew any better. Specter, on the other hand, knew better. If anyone gets the chance to interview ole Arlen they need to ask him about this. They need to show him the back wound photo and ask him if the wound in the photo supports the single bullet theory, then show him the re-enactment photos and ask if a bullet entering the chalk mark from the sniper's nest would logically go on to hit Connally in the armpit, then watch him squirm. In short, while Ford MAY have been misrepresenting evidence to sell the SBT, Specter was undoubtedly doing this. One shouldn't focus on Ford without looking into Specter. If anyone has any evidence indicating that Ford knew the wound was on the back, and that the Rydberg drawings were incorrect, please let me know. *************************************************************** "I merely dispute that Ford knew the back wound was on the back and not at the base of the neck, as depicted in the Rydberg drawings. I've looked and I've found nothing to indicate Ford knew any better. Specter, on the other hand, knew better." By the Rydberg drawings, are you referring to those crudely drawn sketches that appeared in the New York Times newspaper in June 1964, when the WCR was released? If these are the same drawings I saw back then, it was these specific sketches that led me to believe we were being lied to. What caused me to get that impression was the way this entry wound was supposed to have exited Kennedy's throat just below the cricoid cartilage and just above the suprasternal notch. To the eyes of a 19 year old with half a semester of medical technology at the time, it seemed outrageous for this commission to expect people to believe that this bullet entered the body from a six story window on a downsloping trajectory, exit from the throat in the area I just mentioned, without leaving so much as a huge hole in its wake. And, think about it for a minute. Even if the bullet had entered this supposed spot higher up nearer the neck, it would've exited lower in the chest area, knicking the right side of the sternum before leaving a large hole upon exiting. But, the worst part was to suggest that it seemingly changed its path after going through JFK, proceed to hit Connally, presumably to exit his right armpit, and then continue down to hit him in his thigh. I mean, it wasn't like this was coming from a Barrett .50, and even if it was, it should've gone right on through to the floorboards instead taking all the twists and turns being attributed to it. Then, the reporter attempted to embellish the improbability of what actually happened by making reference to the "possible ricocheting of the projectile off one of JFK's ribs." Bullets don't ricochet off ribs, they shatter them! My point is, if a nineteen year old could discern the implausibility of what this appointed commission was attempting to pass off as the "truth" regarding the murder of their president? Then, how could a mature, supposedly "learned" man such as Ford, have been so blind or so inept, as to not have caught what any college student studying Physics 101 so readily picked up on? After all, these sketches were being circulated in all the newspapers at the time, ad nauseum. He should have been able to see for himself how ridiculous the assumption was, that he'd just signed off on.

The ultimate Iran-y, of course, was that Reagan ordered the invasion of Grenada to cover his retreat from Lebanon. I'd been skeptical that the move into Grenada was so calculated until reading Maggie Thatcher's memoirs. She claimed that Reagan invaded Grenada, a British protectorate, without even discussing it with her, and that the U.S. invasion was unnecessary. ************************************************************ "The ultimate Iran-y, of course, was that Reagan ordered the invasion of Grenada to cover his retreat from Lebanon." I was absolutely appalled when that ridiculous fiasco was going down! They carried on as if it were Pearl Harbor or something, those damned arm chair warriors! How embarrassing to have to claim to be an American after witnessing that total display of ineptitude. Grenada was about as threatening to the sovereignty of the United States as Jamaica, or Bermuda, or Nassau and the Bahamas, for chrissakes! Is that all the Reagan/Regan regime could muster up was to go and invade a resort town? Or, maybe the "Resorts International" front was somehow at risk, or in danger of losing most of its clientel from the in-coming spring-break cruise lines, what with the bad PR being aired on the newswires and all? What a bunch of worthless yahoos!

************************************************************* "Was this a change that occured in the aftermath of the assassination? Or were the Dems disinterested in being a true opposition party before 1963?" Let's not forget the "Dixiecrats" and what they stood for. They comprised most of the Southern vote before the Civil Rights Bill was ever enacted, and it sure pissed them off after it was written into law. I believe the actual "change" was cemented into the majority of the sheeples' minds during the Ron Reagan/Don Regan regime, hence the "1 Party - 2 Branches" system that's been in existence for the last quarter of a century. When you think about it, there really hasn't been anything consistently resembling a bi-partisan "balance" of government nor choice, offered to the citizenry for most of the Twentieth Century. As Ashton pointed out, in the year 1913, a Democratic regime under the auspices of Woodrow Wilson, allowed a cartel of private bankers to dictate what path "they" chose for this government to follow. The old "Money talks, bullxxxx walks." power aparatus. Franklin D. Roosevelt tried to turn that around following the 1927 economic debacle, and it all seemed "right" and "honorable" for the U.S. to be drawn into another War to save the world and deliver it from tyranny. But, they never tell you about Prescott Bush, or his dealings with Germany's banking system in 1933, even though he was fully aware of the scapegoat mentality being assigned to a group of "non-aryan" people, or the subsequent atrocities about to be committed upon them. No, they don't mention that in any history books the American students might be required to read. Hence, another branch or facet of "Operation Mockingbird" put into effect circa 1947, as Nathaniel so accurately pointed out. The American people have been dumbed down and goaded into believing they are "free" to make their own choices in whom they prefer to run the show for them. Unfortunately, the success of their lower I.Q.'s, as compared with the rest of the "free" world's, and their inability to think critically and logically enough to have made the right choices with regard to their government's domestic and foreign policies during the last century, is testimony to how successful these cartels have been in shaping public opinion to suit their own private interests. Private interests that will not, and never will have, the interests of its citizens at heart. Oh, you may have some leaders, a smattering maybe here and there, like a Roosevelt, or a Kennedy, who truly understood and even had empathy for, the plight of the working-class citizen, but they were too far and few between, while the fascist element seems to have always been lurking behind the scenes on Wall Street. If the recent election results indicate that the American people have finally smelled the coffee, and tried to take charge of their government, it's come a little too late. Kind of like closing the barn door after the horses got away, 93 years ago, 43 years ago, and 23 years ago. You can't allow your herds to be decimated time and time again, and still expect to have anything, resembling substantial horsepower, left to run the farm.

************************************************************** Bill, why have you deleted all of your posts? Dawn's been looking for the one where you asked her about what her friend knew, the post from 10/23/06, the number of which escapes me right now, and that I no longer have a way of retrieving. I alerted her of it last week. She'd been busy with court, and then her birthday on the 24th, so by the time she got a chance to look for it, it had been buried in the thread. So, when I asked her if she'd ever gotten back to you on Friday, she asked me to find the post and e-mail it to her. Yesterday I searched throughout the page where I thought it had been, only to find that all of your posts had been deleted. Why?

After viewing this movie by Aaron Russo, tell me: "Now Who Killed The Kennedys? I said after all, it was you and me." http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4...98%20&hl=en America Freedom to Fascism Authorized version Avg: 5 star rating 3953 ratings 232,757 views » 232,757 views 14,550 yesterday rank 90 (-16) « All Your Freedoms LLC 1 hr 49 min 28 sec - Oct 20, 2006 www.freedomtofascism.com Browse: taxes, new world order, freedom, irs, federal reserve, rfid, money, fascism, constitution, america, aaron russo, 911, terror, tax, nwo, « Browse: taxes, new world order, freedom, more »