6 hours ago, Pat Speer said:

Hugh Aynesworth's behavior as a witness is also problematic. His early statements didn't precisely fit the Oswald-did-it scenario, so he tweaked it over the years. This is not surprising. I studied the statements of all the witnesses over the years and the statements of those suspecting conspiracy most always slid in that direction, and the statements of those believing Oswald did it most always slid in that direction. But it cuts into his credibility as a reporter. 

Hugh Aynesworth (March-May 1964 account written for the Dallas Morning News, published in the 2013 book JFK Assassination: The Reporters' Notes.) "I stopped at the corner of Houston and Main. As I looked toward the Texas School Book Depository Building--never dreaming that this would become a legend, only interested in the Hertz clock it held high atop its roof--I spotted a man, I thought, named Maurice Harrell, an assistant district Attorney. I thought I'd walk over and say hello. He was standing out from the crowd at Elm and Houston. By the time I got there, he was gone, moved to another vantage point. Harrell told me later he was standing a block away at the time and that it probably wasn't him I saw. So, by at least a dozen strange quirks of fate, I found myself only a stone's throw away from where a crazed gunman fired three shots really heard 'round the world...A huge Negro woman in a pink dress was all eyes as the first car of the caravan came around the corner. Her screech of 'Here they is' prompted a scramble for position--though the crowds here were sparse compared to those farther uptown or even a block away at Main and Houston Streets...I recall a woman to my left who cried "Isn't she beautiful?" as she got a glimpse of Jackie Kennedy. A murmur of voices spread and said other complimentary things about the first lady, about her "beautiful" dress, her "radiance," and her smile...A motorcycle officer rode by and he strained to look through the crowd as the crowd strained to see past him...Then came the first shot. I looked instinctively at one of the motorcycles to see if it was an exhaust. A woman near screamed. I saw a face look into mine briefly with a lost look, much as mine must have been. Then another shot. This was a shot I knew. I recall darting my eyes to the President's open limousine, now slipping down Elm St. to the viaduct. The president jerked his head. I could not tell if he were looking to see what the noise was, but I recall thinking he was only jerking his head to wave at the people on the other side of the glassy (sic--he almost certainly meant "grassy") slope. His hair seemed to jump up. Later I understood why. Some of the vehicles in the caravan seemed to come to almost a complete stop. Others crept along. I could not tell who was in charge. Then a third shot, clearer now, for I somehow almost expected it. "He's up there," shouted a sickly white-faced woman as she pointed to the overpass. "Over there," sang out another, pointing to the grassy knoll that lines the sides of the parade route."...I found tears in my own eyes, perhaps from excitement--certainly not from understanding, for I still didn't know which way to run, or even, if I should run. The caravan suddenly roared into action, and sped off down and out of sight, en route to Parkland Hospital...Within seconds--it must have been hours in my thoughts--it was pretty well determined that the man who did the shooting was inside the Depository Building." (Article on Aynsworth by Nora Ephron, published in the February 1976 issue of Esquire Magazine) "He was standing catty-corner to the School Book Depository Building when he heard three shots. 'I thought the first one was a motorcycle backfiring,' he says, but by the time I heard the second, I knew what it was." (Profile of Aynesworth in the March 1976 Texas Monthly) "Aynesworth was standing in front of the County Records Building, across the street from the School Book Depository, when the motorcade came down Elm. The President waved. Nellie Connally leaned forward, said something. Then a shot, the President clutched at his throat, the agonizingly slow motion of the car, another shot, then another, and the President's head exploded. In an instant, the President's car was gone, speeding under the triple underpass." (11-20-83 article in the Washington Post) "Near the intersection of Houston and Elm, I chatted with an assistant district attorney I had known for several years...As the presidential car drove by, Gov. Connally and his wife, Nellie, radiated pride. They too had been anxious about Kennedy’s visit, but it appeared that, so far, everything was going beautifully. Both Connally and Kennedy seemed to notice the huge woman waving frantically with one arm, the small child dangling from the other. (Nellie Connally later testified that she had just said, “Well, Mr. President, you can’t say there aren’t some people in Dallas who love you!”) The rest of the motorcade passed by. I could see Sen. Ralph Yarborough sitting to the left of Vice President Johnson and Lady Bird. He had a frozen smile on his face, but he didn’t really look like he was having much fun. Then it hit. A pop, like the backfire of a police motor-cycle. A nearby cop was tensed. A few seconds later, there was a second pop, then a third. Gunfire! “Hey! Hey!” a big man in a cowboy hat shouted, as though he could stop whatever was happening by being assertive. Two or three cops stopped short, then ran in different directions. A motorcycle policeman veered to his right. People started yelling and running. The woman in the pink dress turned, clutched her stomach and threw up on the street...It’s hard to recall the next few minutes. I remember running over to the front of the Depository building and listening to people there tell how they had seen the president shot. I looked at the triple overpass and saw three or four people running along the tracks. That’s where the shots must have come from, I thought." (9-5-93 article in the Dallas Morning News) "Veteran author and newsman Hugh Aynesworth stood in the middle of Elm Street and 'could have hit Oswald with a rock' on that day. He also heard only three shots ring out." (11-21-93 article in the San Antonio News-Express) "'I thought the first shot was a motorcycle backfiring. Actually, if I'd looked up, I could have seen who fired. It was only a few seconds until the second shot, and then I knew. "I looked at the underpass first, because I could see some people starting to run in that direction.' Aynesworth said he then realized the shots had been fired from a window high up in the Texas School Book Depository building. 'My attention was first toward the people who were running and by the time I looked around, he had pulled the gun in after the third shot and gone.'"

(11-21-93 Reporters Remember Conference, as quoted in Reporting the Kennedy Assassination) “I went over to the area around Elm and Houston Streets and was there when the three shots rang out. Three definite shots. Total chaos. I still have trouble putting it all together, how it happened.” (11-22-93 article in the Washington Times) "What I witnessed in the horrible few seconds as he was shot changed my life... I heard what I at first thought was the backfire of one of the police motorcycles veering left as it moved past the Texas School Book Depository... What I had heard were three rifle shots. "Chaos" is not too strong to describe what happened in the next moments. My lawyer friends took off in different directions. I saw two policemen running with guns drawn. Off to my right I saw a public relations man I knew, standing with hands on hips, a perplexed look on his face. Pure agony lined the face of a large black woman holding a child... It must have been a minute or so before I saw two women pointing at a window high in the book depository building." (No More Silence, published 1998, p.21-40) “There was no particular reason why I went to Elm Street other than the crowds were larger along Main Street, two or three deep, and I wanted to get a clearer view. Locating myself in the middle of the street a little toward the curb, had I looked up to my right I could have seen Oswald up there... The first shot I wasn’t sure was a shot. I thought it might have been a backfire from one of the motorcycles since there were several in the vicinity. When you hear one, you listen more closely, and when I heard a second and third very clearly, there was no doubt in my mind that they were shots and that they were from a rifle… Immediately, people started jumping and running and some were throwing their kids down.” (JFK: Breaking the News, 2003) “when I saw a couple of familiar assistant district attorneys standing in front of the jail building near the corner of Houston and Elm, I walked over to join them…I was standing with my lawyer friends maybe 10 feet from the curb. As we watched the big blue Continental glide by—I vividly remember Governor Connally’s grin—a huge black woman nearby burst into shouts… At 12:30 we heard the first loud pop. At first I assumed a nearby police motorcycle backfired.…(Secret Service Agent Roy) Kellerman turned in his seat just as two more shots were fired…” (Interview in film Oswald's Ghost, 2007) "As he goes by, two or three seconds later I hear a pop. I think it's a motorcycle backfire because a motorcycle had just gone by. But then, suddenly, a second or two later another and then another. Three shots." (4-28-11 article by Jim Schutze in the Dallas Observer) "You hear shots ring out, and you don't count how many seconds there are between them." (5-2-12 article on News-Register online.com, reporting on a 4-2-12 appearance by Aynesworth at North Lake College) "'It was amazing, the happiness and the feeling of good will that was in the crowd,' recalled Aynesworth. 'Then all of a sudden BOOM! One shot, but I thought it was backfire from a motorcycle. Then a second and then a third. I then realized it was shots from a rifle. We didn’t know where the fire was coming from or if we’d be next. People were throwing their children to the ground and taking cover. Everyone was scared,' he said." (3-27-13 appearance at the Irving Central Library, video found online) "They made that left turn to go out to the Trade Mart. And then suddenly three shots. Boom Boom Boom." (He says these booms in quick order over about 2 seconds.) "Nobody knew where they came from...You couldn't tell where the shots were coming from." (Interview on BBC Radio program on the 50th anniversary of the assassination, first broadcast 9-1-13) "I, like Mrs. Newman, thought the first shot was a motorcycle backfire, because one had just gone by. And the second shot, I could hear the whine of a rifle. Immediately, everybody was throwing their children down, regurgitating, screaming, crying, running. I didn't know what to do." (November 22, 1963: Witness to History, published 9-3-13) "At 12:30, we heard the first loud pop! At first I assumed a nearby police motorcycle had backfired...Roy Kellerman in the front seat of the presidential limousine heard the pop! And turned just as two more shots were fired." (11-1-13 article by Nigel Richardson in The Telegraph) "When the first shot rang out, he thought it was a motorcycle backfiring – there were plenty of police motorcycles around that day. 'But the second and third shots were very clearly the whine of rifle shots,' he remembers." (Appearance on the Reelz Channel program Killing JFK: 50 Questions Answered, first broadcast 11-5-13) "As the Kennedys went by us, they were happy. They were waving. They were grinning. Then all of a sudden I hear what I think is a motorcycle backfire. And then a couple of seconds later, a shot, and then another shot. Now I'm not a shooter, but I can tell the whine of a rifle. And then it was total chaos." (11-20-13 article by Susan Donaldson James on ABCNEW.Go.com) "I heard what I thought was a motorcycle backfiring, but it wasn't. It was a shot and then two other shots. It was chaos." (11-22-13 Reuters article found in the Chicago Tribune) "Then I heard what I thought was a motorcycle backfiring, only it wasn't - it was the first shot and then in a few seconds, another shot and a third." (11-22-13 appearance on NPR radio program Morning Edition) (On the aftermath of the shooting) "Well, I looked directly in front of me, across Houston Street; and I saw a man jumping up and down, and pointing up to the sixth-floor window up there. I didn't know what he'd known or what he'd seen or anything else, but I knew I had to get to him and find out. And as it turned out, he was the only real eyewitness that saw Oswald in that window."

(Description of the last two shots by Aynesworth in a 2015 Dallas Morning News interactive feature entitled John F. Kennedy Portraits: History Lived) "...Two or three seconds later a second and a third. And I was sure that those two were rifle shots. I didn’t know what to do. I didn’t have a pencil or paper and nothing with me to write on. I knew I had to start interviewing people. People were just in pandemonium, it was just, they were throwing their kids down and covering them, they were screaming, they were crying, but no one knew where to run, ‘cause we didn’t know where the shots were coming from. We didn’t know how many people were shooting. We didn’t know what was going on." (2-17-16 Living History interview with The Sixth Floor Museum) "They moved on down, and five or six seconds later, I heard what I thought was a motorcycle backfire. That wasn't too bothersome. But then later two other distinguishable shots, and I could tell they were rifle shots. And it was chaos...Nobody knew where the shots were coming from." (Interview on the Historyextra website, published 11-21-18) "I went to the corner of Elm and Houston Street, right in front of the Book Depository. It was so exciting. It had been raining that morning but at about 11am the sun came out, and it was a beautiful November day. The crowd was excited. It was something you read about but you never quite get to witness. I stopped and was only there for a few minutes when the motorcade went by me. Seconds later I heard what I thought was a motorcycle backfiring, but it was the first shot. There were three shots. The place went wild. People were throwing their children down, screaming, crying, throwing up. Nobody knew what to do. We did not know who was shooting, or how many shooters there were. I probably would have run, but I did not know where to run to. My reporter instinct kicked in. I saw a man across from me pointing to the sixth floor window, saying “he’s up there.” The man had a hard hat under his arm. I ran to him to talk to him, but he was scared when he found out I was a reporter. In the end two policemen had to force me away." (Interview on the Vic Feazell podcast, broadcast 9-21-20) "I saw a couple lawyers that I knew and I sorta followed them over to Elm Street. That's where I stood--the center of Elm Street...The Kennedys had just passed me--it was about four cars later--and I heard the shots. I wasn't sure if the first one wasn't a car backfiring. And then two others. And I knew they were shots...And I saw this man pointing up to the window--he was right across the street. So I ran to him. And he was the one that described Oswald...He described him perfectly." Analysis: Aynesworth, a career reporter, is not a very credible source of information. He originally claimed he was at Houston and Elm at the time of the shooting, then suggested he was out in front of the jail, a half a block away, then returned to saying he was at Houston and Elm, and then, finally, that he was in the middle of Elm. In 1964, he said he walked towards Elm in search of an assistant district attorney, but did not find him. By 1983, however, he claimed he was chatting with him as the motorcade passed. In 1964, he said that right after the shots two women yelled out that the shots came from places in front of the limo. By 1993, however, he'd taken to claiming two women pointed to the depository building just after the shots. And this slide apparently continued, for, by 2013, these women had morphed into Howard Brennan. Still, Aynesworth said just enough to indicate that the single-assassin theory he’s been standing behind all these years is not exactly solid. His grouping together of the last two shots suggests the last two shots were bunched together. Even more intriguing, his earliest statement indicates that the second shot was the head shot. First shot hit 190-224. Last two shots bunched together, with the last shot after the head shot.

Nice compilation. 

Aynesworth's earliest recollections also suggest the first shot was different in pitch and volume than the succeeding shots, which is what many (most?) witnesses said. 

I can't think of a reason for that, except that different weapons at different locations were the source of the audible gunshots.

There may also have been inaudible gunshots, or shots that were nearly simultaneous, but heard as one shot by witnesses. 

This post has 216 views. It provides a link to a very important interview with a lawyer involved in the JFK Records Act.

James DiEugenio has provided a link to a very important article regarding the JFK Records Act. 

And two commenters have taken umbrage at this post. That is less than 1% of viewers. 

1 hour ago, James DiEugenio said:

I know Mark quite well, as he is a co author of The JFK Assassination Chokeholds.

He has been writing on the subject of the JFK Records Act under both Trump and Biden for years at K and K.

It is not true that what Biden did is the same thing as what Trump did.  What Trump did was pretty bad.  But, as both Mark and Andrew Eiler have proven, Biden went beyond what Trump had done. Biden actually unilaterally changed the law, he tore asunder an act of congress.  Both Andrew and Mark think this is  illegal and are going to pursue the determination rulings the ARRB made in order to try and prove it.  If Final Determinations were made on the rest of the documents, as Tunheim says they were, then there is a case to be made.  

BTW, the idea that somehow the 2024 election will be decided on EF is, I think, a bit of an exaggeration.  Can we put the partisan cudgels and anti Trump mania aside and listen to what Mark is saying?  There might be ten people in America who know as much as this guy does about the JFK Act.

JD-

Well said. 

Personally, I hope Trump retires, and soon. 

But my politics (which are independent, and becoming more jaded with every passing year) have nothing to do with this.

Dang it, I want the JFK Records to be released. It is the law, it is right, it is what should happen. 

I can think of no legitimate reason, after 60 years, for suppressing the JFK Records.

If there is no legitimate reason for suppressing the records...then what is the reason? 

2 hours ago, Denny Zartman said:

It's telling you titled your thread the "Biden JFK records snuff job" instead of the more accurate "Trump & Biden JFK records snuff jobs." Your pro-Trump, anti-Biden bias is obvious again. It's boring. A Ben Cole Biden Snuff Job thread is as predictable as the weather.

You keep posting these threads over and over again. It leads me to conclude that you believe you're going to affect the presidential election via this forum. Or you get a thrill from hearing liberals criticize Biden for any reason.

You can try and try to whip up as much resentment against Biden as you can, and I can't stop you... but you know, I know, and everyone out there knows Donald J. Trump isn't going to do a single damn thing different. On that part, no one is fooled. Trump already had his chance to release JFK records, and it was Snuff Job City.

Can you please take this to Facebook or X or another political forum? Or at least to the current events section of this forum? Please? I think it's stickied at the top of the main page. If people are interested in this, they can read or listen to it over there, and then you and they can discuss it to your heart's content. I'm truly sorry if you don't want to take it to the current events section because of the lack of readers and commenters over there as regards this subject, but maybe that in itself should tell you something. It feels like one of your primary goals here lately is trying to force folks to resent Joe Biden by brute repetition. I appreciate your effort and you're certainly giving it your all, but at this point imho you're undermining your message, not reinforcing it.

If you truly want to help defeat Biden in 2024, why not donate money to the GOP or join your local Republican organization and volunteer your time? If you can't do it in person, you could help organize meetings online via Zoom. You could hand-write letters to voters in swing states, or you could go recruit more volunteers online to get people rides to the polls, or help register new voters. What I'm trying to say is that there are any number of other, more productive things you could do that would make much more of an actual, concrete difference in the outcome of the 2024 election than posting the same, repetitive anti-Biden threads here on this particular forum.

Thanks! 👋

DZ-

I am not a Trump supporter. I am an RFK2 supporter at the moment, though I have not actually donated to a political campaign, probably since the 1990s. 

Mark Adamcyzk is an authority of the JFK Records Act, and what the Biden Administration has done. He is involved in litigation in the matter. you might want to listen to his take on the matter. For you and others, I have provided a link. 

As an EF-JFK'er, I feel an obligation to "keep the flame alive" regarding the JFK Records Act. In general, when I see a fresh news story or blog post, or podcast regarding the JFK Records Act, I re-post here. 

Others may be interested, if not you. It certainly seems like a germane topic to me, for the EF-JFKA.

I am surprised you take umbrage.

For me, what the Biden Administration has done to the JFK Records Act is not a partisan issue. Biden has instituted a mechanism to permanently prevent documents from being disclosed. Trump only proposed an extension. That was bad enough, and I criticize Trump for that. Indeed, I have little faith Trump will open the records up, should he be re-elected. 

I contend members of the EF-JFKA should be interested at the Biden Administration's actions regarding the JFK Records Act, and kept abreast of events.  

You can place me on ignore. EF-JFKA has a mechanism for that. 

9 hours ago, Michael Griffith said:

I think most rational, educated people, especially those who know anything about Israel's early history, would agree that "Israel's possible involvement" is an absurd, fringe, far-fetched proposition that is well beyond the bounds of respectable discussion. 

Michael Griffith: I disagree with you on some issues, but I notice you always argue from the viewpoint that "American should do the right thing." 

And I agree with you that Nazism, communism (as practiced in nation-states) and anti-Semitic bile are reprehensible. 

The ridiculous tale that Israelis murdered JFK...well, maybe the Mormon mafia did too. A combo job. I posted here recently a treatment on how Utah Sen. Bennett and the Mormon mafia, acting through Tosh Plumlee, did the deed. BTW, Bennett was hip-deep in Watergate, interestingly enough. And running a PR front for the CIA that had hired E. Howard Hunt. 

This photo below explains much of the anti-Semitic excrement that make the rounds in the Mideast today. And even in the US. 

"The Führer stated that Germany would not intervene in internal Arab matters and that the only German “goal at that time would be the annihilation of Jewry living in Arab space under the protection of British power.”

Well, that is the sanitized version of what Hitler said, to the welcoming ears of Arabs. 

Keep fighting for what you believe is right Michael Griffith. I do not think the US should have gotten entangled in Vietnam...but the commies showed their true colors when they massacred thousands of people in the old imperial capital of Hue.

Typical event in Hue: 

"Pham Van Tuong, a part-time janitor for the Huế government information office who made it on the Vietcong list of "reactionaries" for working there, was hiding with his family as it hunted for him. When he was found with his 3-year-old daughter, 5-year-old son and two nephews, the Vietcong immediately gunned them all down, leaving their bodies on the street for the rest of the family to see."

It is insanity when certain segments on the US political spectrum valorize the communists, the Nazis, or Putin, or Hamas. 

https://www.spreaker.com/episode/bonus-episode-the-jfk-records-act-the-recent-document-release-and-the-medias-response--57753245

I never heard of this podcaster before, but evidently he has been following the JFKA.

This may be an interview conducted earlier, and re-podcasted on "Spreaker," on 1/11/24, whatever Spreaker is.  

In any event, worth noting. 

"In the first ever interview episode of the podcast, we talk to attorney, Mark Adamcyzk, an expert on the JFK Records Act. We cover the background of the JFK Records Act, what it did, the ARRB, the Trump and Biden releases, as well as the media's response to the recent round of releases, including Jefferson Morley's claim about a still classified document linking Oswald directly to the CIA, Morning Joe historian Michael Beschloss's take, and, Tucker Carlson's claim to have spoken to an insider regarding the still classified records."

---30---

6 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

You are correct, Russell brought that point up.

He says something like, the guy gets two dead on hits at a moving target, and then he misses the whole car completely?

He has a hard tie with that one.  Plus the Magic Bullet.  Plus Connally.

But what this interview shows is that Cooper was as violently opposed to the official story as Russell.  And he literally calls out Specter.

So this whole idea that the WC was unanimous was an illusion that was papered over for PR purposes.

We have been fighting what was really a smoke and mirrors mirage.  That the majority of its own authors did not by.

Sickenening that this has to come out so late.

But thank to Morris it is out there.

JD-

Yes. It is is odd that some shots missed by such a wide margin on 11/22. 

My guess is those were shot by someone intending to miss. Otherwise, how to explain such off-the-mark results? 

In my experience it is best to ignore some commenters. EF-JFKA allows you to put the noisome on ignore, meaning their posts are not visible.  

For example, I have one individual, known as "The Great Posterior Orifice of EF-JFKA," on ignore. 

40 minutes ago, James DiEugenio said:

Yes, the Commission was really a minority report.

And that fact was covered up by ditching the Russell, Cooper, Boggs objection and Ford concealing what he really thought of it.

This is one reason that I always thought that Lifton's idea about them being fooled by the body being altered was always hard to swallow.

They were not fooled by it at all.  In fact, Wolff even says that Cooper thought that Specter's magic Bullet theory was fake.

I think there is a good story that I have not seen done. 

Credible witnesses said they saw bullet strikes on the asphalt and curbs on 11/22, and there was also the Tague shot. Maybe also a shot struck the cement casing for manhole off the Elm St. There may others...I am not sure anyone has toted these up. 

These were shots that missed the entire limo, some by a very wide margin. What gives? 

What is the point in these very wide misses? How could anyone who could hit a moving target (at least) twice, and nearly perfectly, then miss by 10 yards? Richard Russell asked this question about the Tague shot. 

My speculation is these were intentional misses. One or two parties were shooting at JFK for real, but others were shooting to miss. 

Has this idea been flashed out anywhere that you know of? 

4 minutes ago, James DiEugenio said:

I forgot to post this.

Here is a link to that important interview.  

https://blackopradio.com/archives2024.html

Thanks for the post. 

Evidently, a majority of the WC really didn't sign on to the findings.

This would be mirrored later by HSCA counsel Robert Blakely, who, in addition to concluding that the JFKA likely resulted from a conspiracy, later would go further and indicate he thought Cuban exiles were involved. And that the CIA misled him.  

Was there a reason for the Biden Administration snuff job on the JFK Records? What would that reason be? 

6 minutes ago, Nick Bartetzko said:

Huh? Not one shred of evidence? Ok, then cumulatively, I’ll list what I feel is “suspicious “…..

The Tague curb strike and his injury, the reports by a motorcyclist and 5-6 witnesses of a bullet striking the street, witnesses reporting a puff of smoke and movement behind the picket fence, Malcolm Summers encounter with trench coat man at the picket fence, a witness report of a bullet(s) striking the grass, the smell of gun powder at street level, the Harper fragment in the street and a bone fragment in the follow up secret service car, blood splatter on the motorcycle cops to the rear of the limo, Doug Horne’s work on NPIC and Hawkeyeworks and the two different briefing boards, no nitrate residue on Oswald’s cheek, the crimped bullet casing on the 6th floor, the huge discrepancies between the wounds as described at Parkland vs Bethesda, missing X-rays and photographs from the autopsy, the burnt original autopsy, a Bethesda eyewitness describing a right temple wound…. I think I’ll stop as I’m sure you have plausible explanations for everything that I’ve listed…

To paraphrase a famous line out of a well known 50s sitcom… “you got some    ‘splainin’ to do”…. 

NB-

Oh, I entirely agree with you that more than three shots were fired on 11/22. 

In fact, I think it obvious Connally is struck about Z-295 and JFK at Z-313. At 18 frames a second, do the math.

I conclude that the JFKA was not perped by a lone gunman armed with a single-shot bolt-action rifle. 

Naming names after that...well, I suspect the Miami Station of the CIA and that milieu...but proof is hard to. come by. 

Interesting to ponder: The fact that many shots not only missed...but missed the entire limo, often widely off the mark...suggests one or two shooters were shooting intending to miss. 

That is, the JFKA was originally planned as a false flag op, a deliberately unsuccessful JFKA, to provoke an invasion or serious take down of Cuba.

But somewhere along the line, the false flag op was piggy-backed on by real assassins. 

That is my speculation. Note that I call it speculation, rather than a fact. 

10 minutes ago, James DiEugenio said:

There had to be some kind of coordination in the actual Dealey Plaza murder.  I talked to a Special Forces Army guy, John McCarthy, once.  He was in on some of these types of operations.  He said to me that it was clearly an L shaped ambush, which he was familiar with. In that type of operation you have two shooters from the bottom of the--in this case inverted L--which would be Houston, and one from the top, the GK.  Its pretty much inescapable with three professionals once you get to the agreed upon kill zone.  This is why Craig Roberts, a former sniper said: one man, no way.  Brian Edwards, who was on a SWAT team said the same,  for one guy, very difficult.

All I am saying is that seems like a disparate bunch to employ as a hit team.  Not saying it is impossible, but I would say kind of unlikely.

If Willoughby was an organizer, that would be Dick R I think.

My picks for the top would have been different.  And if Morley was in on this how could they avoid Angleton?

 

Verily. 

Plots involving dozens of witting pre-JFKA players are...well, they stretch credulity.

Sadly, there is a double-standard in parts of the JFKA research community. 

The standard for LHO is every high, and every bit of evidence against him examined in minute detail. In many ways, that is how it should be, when anyone is accused of murder. There should be robust "defense counsel."

Then, when other "bad guys"  are accused of participating in the JFKA, the bar is dropped to the floor (or underground), depending on the pre-conceived notions or biases (sometimes rank bigotry) of the accusers. People who are neighbors, or sit on the same boards of a company, or ever did a business deal with one another, become convicted assassins. 

Rob Reiner seems like a nice guy, and probably means well. 

After listening to his podcast...I don't feel any closer to really knowing what really happened on 11/22/63. 

4 hours ago, James DiEugenio said:

I have sent this story to Andrew and Mark, I want them to get in contact with this guy for an interview.

This should be an election issue.  

How else to get those documents out? 

All I can say is search Google News every couple of weeks, for "JFK Records Act." Then contact the author or news organization. 

20 minutes ago, Cory Santos said:

I was told they monitor online forums for great minds.   

For the right money, I am available! 

2 minutes ago, Denny Zartman said:

If at first he doesn't succeed, Ben tries and tries again.

It's not a campaign issue. People vote their pocketbooks, and if elected Trump will do exactly what he did for four years when it comes to the JFK records: SNUFF JOB.

DZ-

In fact, I have said it is unlikely (unfortunately) that the JFK Records Act will not become a '24 campaign issue. It should, but...

NBC News and BNN say the Biden Administration treatment of the JFK Records Act might become a campaign issue. They say it, not me. 

You have stated your opinion on Trump. That is fine. I accept your opinion. 

What about RFK2? Do you believe he will open up the JFK Records? 

I lay 6-to1 odds he will. What say you? 

PS Try for a civil, collegial tone in your comments. 

23 minutes ago, James DiEugenio said:

We have two very insightful authors as contributors to the JFK Assassination Chokeholds on this subject.

Andrew Eiler and Mark Adamczyk have written about what has happened to the JFK Act at length and in depth.

I am really trying to get them more exposure on the topic.

If what Biden did is allowed to stand, I do not think we will ever see the last of the documents.

Let alone that SI message to Joannides in the summer of 1963.

 

JD-

Like most everybody else, I am a nobody with no influence anywhere. 

I will send a few e-mails around to possibly interested publications. Like taking a spit at the moon. 

When WaPo says "Democracy Dies in Darkness" one wonders if that is a warning...or a brag. 

Why not excerpt or summarize Andrew Eiler and Mark Adamczyk for a post in EF-JFKA?

Evidently, even within the EF-JFKA community, there is a mis-understanding of what the Biden Administration has done.

Renewed Debate Over JFK Assassination Records Enters 2024 Presidential Election

By: Wojciech Zylm

Published: January 1, 2024 at 12:33 pm EST

 

 

A renewed focus on the 60th anniversary of President John F. Kennedy’s assassination has reignited the debate surrounding the 4,700 documents related to the case that remain partially or heavily redacted. The persisting skepticism about the official narrative—that Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone—has only been bolstered by a poll conducted by the Mary Ferrell Foundation, revealing a mere 38% of Americans share this belief.

Political Promises and Public Skepticism

The argument over the release of these documents has become a significant talking point in the 2024 presidential election. Independent candidate Robert F. Kennedy Jr., JFK’s nephew, and former President Donald Trump have both expressed disbelief in the official narrative. Trump has even pledged to declassify all related documents if he returns to office.

 

Delays in Declassification

The President John F. Kennedy Assassination Records Collection Act of 1992 mandated all records be released by 2017 unless they posed harm to national interests. However, full disclosure has been delayed multiple times, causing the Mary Ferrell Foundation to sue President Joe Biden and the National Archives for non-compliance with the act. They argue that these delays obstruct transparency and trust in the government.

Revelations and Controversies

Some previously redacted documents have revealed intriguing information, such as CIA surveillance on Oswald before the assassination. A memoir by former Secret Service agent Paul Landis has further stirred the pot, with claims of a found bullet adding to the controversy.

The issue of classified documents extends beyond JFK. The ongoing declassification review of 9/11 documents and proposals to declassify other significant historical documents have been brought to the fore. These proposals use the JFK Records Act as a model, demonstrating the broad implications of this ongoing and heated debate.

---30---

https://bnnbreaking.com/politics/renewed-debate-over-jfk-assassination-records-enters-2024-presidential-election/

BNN was founded by Gurbaksh Singh Chahal, who is self-described as "an Indian-American internet entrepreneur." 

 

5 hours ago, Larry Hancock said:

Paul,  there are other interviews by Burkley that are not quite so structured but certainly even in this one his wording is that he did not view any legal strictures that would have required not taking Jackie and the body back to DC and he expressed the desire not not to put Jackie though anything further. 

This is the sort of thing that encourages me to cease commenting here,  there is just such a strong drive to find mystery and evildoing in every detail that its become a drain.  Its about time I left everyone to their own directions..

 -- signing off,  Larry

 

 

 

Ulterior sinister motives, clandestine murk, secretive sabotage. 

However, more important than one's belabored partisan take on this....

Is this even likely, that the JFK Records Act will become an '24 campaign issue? 

Voters (outside of a couple thousand JFKA researchers-buffs) care about the Biden Administration snuff job on the JFK Records Act? 

Why is NBC venturing this topic--JFK Records Act--as a potential '24 campaign issue? Season doldrums? 

I would like the JFK Records Act to be highlighted as an issue...but I doubt it. 

21 minutes ago, Sandy Larsen said:

 

 

And his followers think he'd do any differently if elected again?

Well, yes, I'm sure they do.

 

Verily.

I would bet on RFK2, give you six to one odds. 

Trump? Maybe one-to-four odds.

Biden? Bet the house he will never open up the JFK Records. 

7 minutes ago, Gene Kelly said:

The 1967 oeral interview for the JFK Librarry also has this comment by Burkley:

When the President was on the Air Force One returning to Washington, Mrs. Kennedy, as has been noted, sat in the rear of the plane, next to the coffin bearing the President’s remains. During the flight I contacted her, and stated that an autopsy would be necessary, and that I was perfectly willing to arrange to have it done at any place that she felt it should be done. She said, “Well, it doesn’t have to be done.” I said, “Yes, it is mandatory that we have an autopsy. I can do it at the Army hospital at Walter Reed or at the Navy hospital at Bethesda, or any civilian hospital that you would designate.” However, I felt that it should be a military hospital, in that he had been President of the United States and was, therefore, the Commander in Chief of the Military. After some consideration she stated that she would like to have the President taken to Bethesda. This was arranged by telephone from the plane, and it was accomplished. 

Burkley accompanied the President in the ambulance going to Bethesda, and also accompanied him to the area where the autopsy was performed. He later stated that:

"I supervised the autopsy and kept in constant contact with Mrs. Kennedy and the members of her party who were on the seventeenth floor in the suite at that level. I made trips back and forth. I delivered to her personally the ring from the President’s finger and talked to her on a number of occasions. I also directed that the X-rays be taken for future reference and had complete knowledge of everything that was done. The records are also in possession of members of the family.

There were photographs taken at various stages, and they are also in the possession of the family. And the only regret I have that I did not ask to have a photograph taken when he had been restored to his near normal appearance. And I may mention here that he was very lifelike in his appearance and there would have been no question of his having been viewed." 

In JFK Revisited, Jim DiEugenio points out that:

1. Sibert and O'Neill state that the autopsy report was false. The back wound was not where the Commission said it was, and there was a hole in the rear of JFK's head. (and Arlen Specter kept their testimony out of the record).
2. George Burkley agreed with the placement of that back wound-twice. Once in the official death certificate and once on the face sheet, though his name is erased from the latter (Specter kept him out of the record also).
3. In his 1967 oral interview for the JFK Library, Burkley’s conclusion in regard to the cause of death was the bullet wound which "involved the skull":

The discussion as to whether a previous bullet also enters into it, but as far as the cause of death, the immediate cause was unquestionably the bullet which shattered the brain and the calvarium.

When asked whether he agreed with the Warren Report on the number of bullets that entered the President’s body, he famously stated: "I would not care to be quoted on that”.

Gene

 

add on:

AGENCY: HSCA
ORIGINATOR: HSCA
FROM: RICHARD SPRAGUE
TO: FILE

MEMORANDUM

March 18, 1977

TO : FILE

FROM : RICHARD A. SPRAGUE

William F. Illig, an attorney from Erie, Pa., contacted me in Philadelphia this
date, advising me that he represents Dr. George G. Burkley, Vice Admiral, U.S.
Navy retired, who had been the personal physician for presidents Kennedy and
Johnson.

Mr. Illig stated that he had a luncheon meeting with his client, Dr. Burkley,
this date to take up some tax matters. Dr. Burkley advised him that although he,
Burkley, had signed the death certificate of President Kennedy in Dallas, he had
never been interviewed and that he has information in the Kennedy assassination
indicating that others besides Oswald must have participated.

Illig advised me that his client is a very quiet, unassuming person, not wanting
any publicity whatsoever, but he, Illig, was calling me with his client's
consent and that his client would talk to me in Washington.

3 hours ago, Gerry Down said:

Thanks for that link.

I wonder what were the names of the other CIA officers in the Dallas field office.

He is always mentioned in the singular. I mean, after all, this was Dallas, a medium-sized city in the 1960s, far from any coastline. One might wonder why the CIA had anyone in Dallas at all. 

40 minutes ago, Gerry Down said:

It's a good find Vince but I don't think it's as significant as one might at first think.

The CIA had a field office in Dallas. Is it really that unusual that upon hearing there had been an assassination attempt some CIA officer from that office went to Parkland to get info on the situation in order to inform HQ of what was going on? 

James Powell did something similar. He briefly interviewed a few people in Dealey Plaza in order to find out for his superiors, army intelligence, what was going on.

If there was some type of conspiracy or invasion of the U.S. about to take place, the CIA and army intelligence would want some info on it as quickly as possible.

https://www.archives.gov/files/research/jfk/releases/104-10124-10247.pdf

This is the CIA version of J. Walton Moore, the Dallas CIA guy. 

I do not know where was Moore on 11/22. Does anyone? 

3 hours ago, Vince Palamara said:

Being a federal law enforcement agent, Andy Berger recognizing a CIA agent's ID and duly noting this in an official report speaks volumes.

This is huge- asset, officer or agent...aren't we splitting hairs here?

Well...not sure. 

For some reason, an actual CIA officer strikes me as more serious than one of several thousand assets (or even more) the CIA had in the US at the time (due to the Cuba situation). Assets were a dime a dozen.